Liquidsteel

Points not confirmed yet and its unlikely to be a command ability. I think he will retain his rerolls.

It works in your opponents turn also.

Forcing an enemy unit to be redeployed would be a great ability. Come on their board edge after turn one for example. Lumineth rules blew things wide open creativity wise, however so far our rules seem pretty tame. Mannfred can at least be charged and forced to relocate, or you can use pike in tricks to get him. Sevireth says ****** you way more than Mannfred.

I'm hoping for a VLoZD to be a viable choice in any list, had quite high hopes for running one or Vhordrai alongside something like Lauka or one of the Mortarchs.

You can charge another unit, but stay outside of 3". That unit can be taken out by another of your units, you are then free to pile in 3" and in to Mannfred. It's something that's been done to counter things like Skinks retreating, or FEC back when they were rampaging.

It's countered via always strike first, or by charging something else then piling in to him from more than 3" away. It can be countered.

Yeah I was a bit dismayed when I saw this. Legion of Blood, Skeletons? Black Knights as Battleline? Doesn't make sense.

Battleline Terrorgheists/Zombie Dragons is fine on it's own, but I reeeeally hope it's not the main gimmick for Avengorii. I'm coming over from FEC, I didn't play battleline dragons there either. Unless they really boost the units it could be a bit of a miss.

Hmm looks like the Legion of Night is more or less the same. Depends on what else is provided. The teleport is neat.

I think a happy medium would be for the Kastellai dynasty to give all Vampire keyworded units Retreat and Charge. So they get these extra buffs within their dedicated subfaction. I do agree with others that the wording is odd, why specify that you can make a normal move when within 3" of enemy units if you could do that anyway? Most likely written with 3,0 in mind.

Yeah, I'm still convinced that the intent is for this to be a levelled up retreat and charge and it would make them so much better if so.

That's interesting, currently, does a normal move specify that you MUST finish outside of 3" in the core rules?

We need something with high rend and/or consistent mortals. Terrorgheists can spike but it's inconsistent, especially without rerolls. "Can Opener" is the term I've heard, I'd love to see something with Rend -3 but most likely that would only be a VLoZD or Vhordrai on the charge and then it's contained to a single unit with a huge target anyway.

I'm hopeful, with the amount of named characters we have, that the trend of "this unit is counted as the General in addition" continues. It would allow you to take Mannfred, Vhordrai and still get use out of a command trait for a regular foot vamp or whatever.

Wait til Saturday?

From whats been discussed/leaked Morghasts (and Arkhan) will not.

Yeah definitely sounds like it would need an FAQ.

Oh so I just twigged, that the unit that is destroyed keeps coming back half strength, so 60 zombies becomes 30, and if that 30 dies you bring back the original unit as another 30. In my head it would have gone 60-30-15-8. This is better! Also the fact that it's battleshock phase means you can use it to re-screen ahead of your opponents turn, or if you get the double, that unit can move and isn't restricted to a 9" charge.

Well spotted, it's not a terrible change, but an impactful one for sure. I do like the changes to gravesites so far, I definitely had analysis paralysis with 4 gravesites, though at the same time Legion of Grief was my first 2k army so maybe I'd have fared better nowadays. Changing it to this, and not a full unit for a CP, is definitely healthier for the game overall. My hope is that by changing this rule, they can balance the power of the book elsewhere, namely harder hitting/more durable units!

I'm surprised people expected anything other than wholly within, though I feel an extension to 15" or even 18" (generals only) would hardly break the game.

What makes you say that? It's always been in 10's for hordes like this.

Really excited for this, as expecting Mannfred, Neferata and Vhordrai retain their bloodlines, alongside the new Vyrkos and Avengorii. Nagash does remain also.

I don't expect to be able to take Neferata as General in a Von Carstein Dynasty. Though I do imagine that the rule will be that they are treated as the General "in addition".

I believe its still Skellies 40 and Zombies 60

For those comparing Duvalle to Vamp Lord, don’t forget the lord is on a bigger 40mm base. Bodes well for an extra wound and a slightly choppier profile.