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Riff_Raff_Rascal

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Everything posted by Riff_Raff_Rascal

  1. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    Has anyone else been trying out the Plagueclaw catapult and Horrorghast combo? I'm currently magnetizing my lightning cannons retro-actively to make a plagueclaw heavy list, just seems too fun.
  2. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    I should note, I'm unsure about the discrepancy between "having charged" and "having made a charge move". Everyone's instincts would say they are the same, but I would have to dig into FAQ's to be really sure.
  3. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @greg19190 So I assume you are abusing the following: Core Rules 12.1: "A unit is eligible to fight if it is within 3" of an enemy unit and it has not fought in that phase, or if it made a charge move in the same turn and it has not fought in that phase." Doom-flayer Hidden Weapon Team Ability: "...A unit set up with this ability is treated as having charged in the same turn." I had to think for a moment why you were able to fight at all by setting up outside of 3" of your front line. I like it. The real trick will be reliably getting the clanrats into position on the charge, in addition to the clawlord. Perhaps best suited to let clanrats take the charge on your opponents turn, then on your next turn, retreat, charge for efficient spacing?
  4. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @El_Dicko If its been that long since you've played, don't worry about the season rules. Whats a shame and a criticism I have is that the current scenarios are mostly tied to the Galletian Veterans rule. Theres simply no generic battle pack for people to just pick up a game. if you can find an opponent who wouldn't mind skipping out on this season's battalions at the very least, you'll have a much more enjoyable experience. In fact, skip battle tactics too if you can if you feel rusty.
  5. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @greg19190 I really want your doomflayer idea to work. I'm having trouble visualizing you delivery package for them. Relying on your opponent's pile-in is a tough sell, but I'm an eager customer. Help me see the light.
  6. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @El_Dicko Way to lean into the hordes. if you wanted you could drop one reinforcement point of stormvermin to splice in some warp-grinders for mobility or switch it for reinforcing the other Rat ogre squad. That way you could have some mid- game threats or have more proper hammer units. You have enough other interesting things for an opponent to target that you foot heroes would be wasted effort. Frankly, during this season, just go all GV's if you can with your chosen Grand Strat. If you stick with practicing in this list you'll be well situated for the next season too when bounty hunters rotate out.
  7. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    So looks like the FAQ revealed more fun was detected from our Masterclan trait and thus stomped out. In other news, doomwheels are cheaper now, so we got that going for us, which is nice.
  8. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @Skreech Verminking I've might been limiting myself this whole time, but do you mean to tell me you can use more than one spark per shooting phase spread out amongst your heroes? Is that the extra damage you speak of?
  9. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @Skreech Verminking You truly are mad (rat)man. Kinda amazing what you can fit in a list when you don't choose a 400 pt hero.
  10. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @Skreech Verminking Intriguing. I've always had the opposite approach. I've always got the feeling we are a power-pair style book, linking heroes to units with buff abilities. Thus, I usually am picking heroes first always. I'm pretty sure the importance of our heroes was doubled-down in this new book, being so closely linked to our battleline. I'm curious about your list building patterns.
  11. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    The Krondspine perhaps, Verminlord Warbringer perhaps. I'm never against having a meme list, I run many doomwheels at a time after all. I will say that a moderately strong Skaven list has 2 factors: 1) You don't want to be in more than 1 combat at a time and 2) the list can play in every phase of the game. This is the skaven weakness and strength. If you don't have enough chaff, you end up in many unfavorable combats at once, and I'll tell ya, a 4+ save on verminlords don't mean much. If you wanna go ham, you can try out a mercenary giant first and see how that feels. Or just add it to the mix. who knows.
  12. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    I'd like to add a neat list building package that I think you fine folks should try out: Horrorghast + Plagueclaw(s) + Thanquol I've had consistent success with pushing out the endless spell, the plagueclaw guarantees the debuff and any reason to play Thanquol is fun. I was gonna do a few battle reports with this but I've found that regardless of outcome in the game, this combo gets serious mileage, and thus each list I've built has been fun. For the most part, additional shooting is great in a list with this. Even having your own hordes is fine because you can push the Horrorghast out super far (24" the turn its summoned). Personally, I've justifed 2x3 Jezzails with 1 catipult with many lists so that I can sit back and watch my opponent play conservatively with their foot heroes while actually wanting to target their troops. I've played around with a Moulder shell to not worry about bravery so much as well as an Eshin support list to add more chip damage while also precisely avoiding my own horrorghast. Obviously its not great against some armies, but I would argue that multi-wound, multi-model units such as bounty hunter calvary is our bane right now and I think this is just the ticket.
  13. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    Quick battle report: I just ran a triple Plagueclaw Catapult list combined with the Horrorghast endless spell and it this artillery piece works as intended. I must qualify this that artillery as a whole isn't fixed and I could strongly argue that this particular unit's damage is still meh (rolling low on 2d6 damage and/or missing the one shot). However, the addition of the bravery de-buff ability gives it reliable role in a list none-the-less. I'm happy thus far where this design space has gone and await further artillery updates. Carry on.
  14. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @Kugane Oh certainly, I would argue we have one of the more balanced books out there too. That said, I whole-heartedly believe we are not a beginner's army. If you're not new to wargaming, I think you'd be fine getting back into AOS. Only problem will be getting a hold of our silly old models.
  15. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @W1tchhunter Highly recommend making some yourself. I literally just made holes in the ground. 5" average diameter so I just made circles. Doesn't have to be glowing green anywhere. Just get messy with making terrain. Here's what I did as an example. If I remember correctly the kit was super spindly and the scaffolding around the gnawhole was a nuisance. That was even before they added the impassable rule, people tried to put models on them.
  16. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    The real kicker was I had the Masterclan trait active, there just wasn't anything else to activate first. Otherwise, it would have be another ability proc for mortals on the second pile-in
  17. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @W1tchhunter It does now. The recent FAQ tacked on the "treated as having charged" when it pops out.
  18. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @Rangeltoft I'll try my best to explain this madness. Some things that happened off screen was I never rolled a 1 on the ability, so there's that. My opponent was aware of my ability to roll over chaff, tried to redeploy his hero away and rolled poorly. I also used all of my ranged attacks (which I overclocked successfully) on something else nearby. Here was the setup: Movement Phase: 10" away from 2 MSU shooting units and a hero behind them about 5", I roll for movement and double it due to the artifact. I move 30". I run circles around all three of them and land outside of 3" of 2 of them. 3d3 MW. Charge Phase: I roll a 6" charge (barely enough) and Tokyo drift over all 3 units. Very critically I declare with intent to place it equidistant of all 3 and less than an 1" (the base was big enough for all 3), thus allowing me to choose which "closest" model to pile into. My opponent measured it out for me, said it was good, and was morbidly curious what I was doing. 3d3 MW. Combat Phase: I activate the doomwheel and declare I'm piling in <1" direction over the 2 shooting units and then travel back over to the hero <2" landing base to base contact with the model. It is important to play with intent in the pile-in step and declare that I "knick" the enemy units base by moving only 1mm or something small. 3d3 MW To be fair, only the hero died completely and was staring at 4 enemy models left putting myself out of melee range after pile in (?).
  19. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    Hey hamsterwheel fans, get a load of this list: I played against shoot-Cast the other day with this list. I've lost to that style of play many times as doomwheels don't like it. However, the tides have turned. The Night Runners have been added from previous iterations for one reason: when I go second in round, its impossible to screen out 24" shooting. Now I more reliably can. The dum-dum Doom-Flayers are no longer a joke. I will tell you that Death Frenzied, Bounty Hunter mini Doomwheels eat battline Annihilators for lunch, can confirm. Even though it was more of a tax, the Warpseer's bravery 10 bubble kept all 3 units of clanrats alive (1 unit having only a single model left after 1 round), and then stumbled into round 3 with all 3 units alive and over half strength. Value. All of this paled in comparison to seeing the combo actually go off: Levitate and MMMWP on a single Doomwheel that was slapped in the behind with a Vial of the Fulminator. In range of 3 units, 1 of which was a hero, I did in total 9d3 triggers of MWs! Combat phase was an afterthought. Its complicated but my opponent bunched up and wasn't expecting a flying unit suddenly. Nobody expects the flying Doomwheel.
  20. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    So we did lose our Master Moulder charge bonus for the Masterclan trait, but as I understand it, Clanrats naturally add 2 to run rolls when they move. Since the first part about running in the battle trait remains open to modified rolls, I assume we can lean into that? Still valuable if your fielding a bunch of run and shoot units I would think.
  21. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @Cosmicsheep I just so happened to play a FOUR SLAAN summoning list last week so I can give you a preview. Mortal wound from magic heavy seraphon lists is for real (not to mention shooting from those stupid salamanders. Unique thing about Kroak in particular is that he is allowed to machine gun the same multi-target MW spell. Edit: Missed that you are playing against Thunderlizards, most of the following was for Starborn. Oops. When you approach the game assume they can start MW from across the board. If its a magic heavy seraphon list, kiss your spells goodbye. If you force magic into your list, don't bring synergy spells, or at least don't build a list relying on them (i.e. MMMWP). For this reason, shooting can be a great alternative to project your damage, however Jezzails aren't gonna cut it for the following reason. Saurus guard: boy do they have a great bodyguard presence. They may only have a 4+ to pass wounds, but combined with the Starborn's 6+ ward and the favorable wording, good luck trying to one-shot a Slaan. If you have damage to dish, dish it out with the intention of killing foot troops. Which is a segway into my solution to all of this: Disposable troops! We have so many worthless wounds available to us, just swarm the board with them. Seraphon currently love to bunker down with magic and shooting so why not give them worthless wounds to take. Clanrats will win you the game if you take them in big blobs of 60, give them the Bless prayer and always have CP's for rally and inspiring presence. Take control of the board, with bodies popping up everywhere early game and force them into having to play catch up. The only way they can is to summon and thus are forgoing casting more magic. All of this is to say, if they bring big dino's as well, focus fire them down first as they will engage your troops, killing many and preventing rally. In your current list I think you'll do just fine against big stompy dino's particularly with the cannons. Thanquol is a great magic dom now and can compete with Kroak if need be, just make sure to focus unbinds on damage spells only to help you save your clanrats. I'll let you know right now that Kroak and co. can wipe 20's of clanrats in a magic phase, especially with a 5+ horde thinner spell at hand. So finding ways to reinforce them in your list is a good idea. Side note: you do have Thanquol to dual rally in a turn which I didn't have in my game, in addition with the 10 bravery from the Warpseer. A great counterplay to the MW splashes everywhere. And lastly and most importantly, gang rush those stupid wizards, your centerpeices are vulnerable at the get go to MW spam. If they spend the first 2 rounds trying to kill them (which is likely), you're probably in a great position on the table at large. A weakness of seraphon is that they often don't have much chaff to start (at least for wizard builds) and only have those stupid Saurus, so all the more reason to make them feel fear.
  22. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    I just ran a 3 bell list to test/understand what was happening with the new scroll. So theres 3 roles to the bell (at least in theory) Summoning: So the theory is that you have the ability to toggle on and off the masterclan body guard rule of a 3+ ward near some rats to better control the damage taken to the bell. This rule doesn't matter. Ultimately, if you are trying to summon, you are leaving the choice to summon to your opponent. Leaving choice to your opponent for your abilities to work has never been good game design. Spell casting: the +2/+1 to cast/pray are legit, statistically more relevant than the warpstone ability the foot greyseers have Ringing the Bell: Damaging yourself, not great, considering its the same likelyhood as the rest. Dont trick yourself into thinking it will synergize with summoning. Extra movement is redundant for two reasons: the masterclan battletrait lets everything run faster and even if you run this first youre stuck behind your chaff and theres the likely hood of not being able to move at all. 1/6 chance to get a 1/2 chance to do damage to units? Rolling dice to roll dice is dead weight in a 5 round game. Do MWs on charge? Who charges with a bell? The deny-command-issuing is always bad with this wording because the receiving unit is all that matters when generals can issue from 18" away (and a 5+ to boot). Finally, the -1 to hit aura is amazing. At 325 pts, at every turn outside the Hero Phase, I wish I had just paid for a verminlord. Now I am not one to completely dismiss units until I've fielded them enough, but I certainly had a game plan with my list of 3. I skitterleaped a Deathmaster with a Gnawbomb artifact near terrain of my opponents front line. Use the artifact, turning it into a gnawhole. Each bell was setup near different gnawholes that I kept in my backfield. At end of movement phase I moved all 3 to the center of my opponents line, the popped up 60 clanrats BEHIND the bells. They could then charge unimpeded if need be and also act as chaff for my more important, point scoring unit, the clanrats. I lost 1 bell in my opponents turn to focus fire, then had two half-strength bells to activate. I proceded to whiff the summon roles for both and was a lame duck the rest of the game. Points wise it was close, but nowhere near as fun as it could have been. Take that as you will. I will try this list again, perhaps with the bell of doom or even, dare I say, the maelstrom endless spells for self damage.
  23. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    Redmaw Plague reads as follows: "...At the start of the combat phase, if the infected HERO is within 3" of any other units in your opponent’s army and is not within 3" of any units in your army, then you can treat that HERO as a friendly unit until the end of that combat phase." Just to throw a few points out there: You can activate the hero to trigger the masterclan pile-in battle trait. Interesting. This checks only at the beginning of the phase, and thus remains a friendly unit even if you pile-in within 3" of your own units during its activation while trying to smackle something. You can issue command abilities to it and it can issue commands at the default range of 12" or 18" if its a totem This is a triggered effect and thus depending on who's turn it is, will determine the order in which things happen. If its your turn, you can have this trigger first, then apply any beginning of combat phase buffs (if any), then your opponent can apply their debuffs. This situation is very important when considering enemy armies that have abilities that make units strike first or strike last. On your turn, you will have to invoke this first before your opponent gets to do anything, potentially allowing them to make an "enemy unit gains strike-last". However, to @J4yzor's point, we are assuming that the opponent now treats their own model as an enemy unit in addition. RAW the prayer doesn't address the converse situation. This is an understandable hole in the rules for the sake of minimizing text. Now I might be getting to A confusing part as I'm typing this out: Is my opponent forced to attack their own model? Core Rules12.3 Pile in"...When you make a pile-in move with a model, it must finish the move no further from the nearest enemy unit than it was at the start of the move." Core Rules 12.3 Combat Attacks "...you must make combat attacks with each model in the unit that is within range of an enemy model In both cases, RAW would allow my opponent to just ignore the mind-controlled unit. Another confusing point There are other nuances as well, considering the differences between "treated as a friendly model" and "controlled by you" or "treated as part of your army". This is particularly relevant for the question: who "controls" their abilities? You might be thinking 'hey I'm activating it, so I do'. Lets say the warscroll has triggered abilities that say "when you kill an enemy model, do X". Who's "you" in this situation? Because if its the owner, their own models maybe getting slain, but they are not enemy models in their eyes. This is the view that the owner still controls the unit for purposes of being in their army. We slay our own models all the time as skaven but they're all still all friends in the end, right? If the "you" is the activating player, then yes this type of ability would trigger. However, who controls the ability? Again, this comes down to what "control" actively means. I did some digging and found this in the Core Rules: 22.4 Abilities: "You must use the rules on a unit’s warscroll if the unit is part of your army." This is a fascinating discovery. This would be evidence for the argument that we CAN'T use the sought after once-per-game abilities to deny our opponent that resource (which is why people loved this prayer). However, however, 1.2.1 Friendly and Enemy Models: "Models from your army are referred to as friendly models" The plot thickens. Our prayer states that the model is "treated as a friendly" model. The gut reaction now becomes the above equates models from army to friendly models. However there is an argument to be made that the converse isn't true by omission in the rules. Staggering. GW not covering all of their bases. I guess they're not perfect after all. In conclusion, its anyone's guess what happens with abilities of that dum-dum you infected. I don't know, decide for yourselves. Tell your friends ahead of time. Work it out. Let this tide you over in place of GW just FAQ'ing this dumb thing. Your're welcome.
  24. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    @Skreech Verminking What was the confusion surrounding the Redmaw? I don't believe it changed too much other than remaining for the rest of the game on an enemy hero.
  25. Riff_Raff_Rascal
    Which is super peculiar seeing as they effectively got a mutation rolled into their new warscroll. Fortunately it was one of the most commonly picked ones. Its also inconsistent with the fact that HPA kept their mutation list. This is another bit of evidence that a good chunk of our new book was half-baked, they ported over half the Kragnos rules for Moulder but ultimately made moulder battle traits pretty boring. Their units got the tune-up they needed for sure, but much to be desired for a thematic all-Moulder list. Still waiting for that Flesh Golem Verminlord kit. That would be dope.
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