Ironjawz wound based army

[Thor0298]

So I already had a few armies but really liked the ironjawz models so I bought a few. I tried four games yesterday using my flgs wound based and keyword limited system. Has anyone used them yet? Especially in a similar comp system?  They weren't even quasi competitive. If your opponent has shooting with rend these guys leave the table like crazy. I also fail to see how megaboss is even worth it. His command ability requires many units on the board and most of these units are very expensive in wound based system  by the time I'm able to field six units of ironjawz I would be in a high enough bracket to just take maw crusha  unless I'm missing some buffs somewhere I just don't see the viability.  I'm hoping match play fixes this.

Anyone have any tips? I was playing 30 and 50 wound games.  

Fir 30 wound, 7 can be hero and 8 monster. For 50 wound, 12 can be hero and 12 monster.  If it's a hero/monster it counts under both. 

[DeadlySarcasm]

I think this just points out how terrible limiting wounds is at balancing games. I really don't like wounds, because it doesn't factor in how hard something hits, or how good a save it has, or what its abilities are. 

What was in your army? What was in his? Help us to help you

[Thor0298]

Megaboss and brutes

 

i agree wounds isn't great but everyone at my local store plays that way. Have any comps been updated with them in yet?

[gnaleinad]

With all due respect bro, do not use wound for limitation of models. It's the most unfair system out there. 
Why? It doesn't take number of attacks, effectiveness of attacks, save rolls of unit and special rules into account.
30 wounds? How much Ironjaws can we have? 15 Ardboyz? 10 Brutes? 

One unit of 25 Stormvermin and one Skaven Warlord will most likely eat you, 3 attacks(after warlord boost) each, 2" range ensure tons of attacks, 3+ to hit and wound, rend -1, decent save of 5+(or 4+ if you deal only 1 damage).. They will hurt when they poke you..
Or one unit of 25 Phoenix Guard and one Anointed will outlast you, 2 attacks each, also 2" range ensuring tons of attacks, 3+ to hit and wound, no rend, saves of 4+ and wound/mortal wound save of 4+.. They are immune to battleshock when near their hero.. 
Or one unit of 20 Pink Horrors and one Lord of Change will smite you with range attacks and spells.. 

You get what I mean.. So don't create perceived balanced using wound. 
Even using http://www.scrollbuilder.com/ is better than that.. 

I honestly had most fun playing narrative games.. Throw "fair/balance" out of the window. Try playing a storyline. Create people who fight, create reasons why you fight, create the scene/battlefield that you fight, create the conditions of the fight(raining/underground/night) and then create the fight. And then write down the story.
All fantasy fans should have a kick out of it..

[Thor0298]

Like I previously stated its what the store uses. So everyone there plays that way. If I drive another hour one way those guys use scgt but prefer to usually play closer to home especially when time is tight. 

 

Well with 30 wounds my seraphon list beats just about anything. I was just trying to make them competitive in a wound based 30 or 50 wound limit game.  I know wounds are horrible for balance   Everyone uses it to prep for league  

 

Most at likely going to be seeing grave guard, blight kings, jezzails, reavers

[Thor0298]

Btw I have used scroll builder they aren't even in there

[DeadlySarcasm]

The comp systems are community made, so updates don't necessarily go in the day new models are released. Scroll builder is individually maintained by someone, so it may take a while for updates to hit that. 

AFAIK clash comp has the new Ironjaw units. Scrollbuilder might not be updated with the new stuff yet.

As far as your situation in your store, you could take a few printed PDFs of the pool document of your chosen comp, then when agreeing games with your opponent suggest using the pools. Explain to them where they come from, and that they are community driven and are updated based on feedback. If people still insist on playing a wound based game, then unfortunately there isn't anything else you can do other than play wounds or don'd play at all. Although hopefully your opponent would appreciate a more balanced game, as its not fun for either player if one army simply rolls over the other.

[gnaleinad]

Hmmm. Most competitive list? I see where you are driving at.. 
I already mention some very powerful list for a 30 wound cap..
Here are a few list..

Chaos, Skaven, Clan Verminus:
1 Skaven Warlord and 1 unit of 25 Stormvermin - They will rape who ever they get to charge.

Order, Aelf, Phoenix Temple:
1 Anointed and 1 unit of 25 Phoenix Guards - Maximum punching force.
or
1 Anointed and 5 unit of 5 Phoenix Guards -  They will laugh at range attacks or spells(And yes including THE 15 JEZZAILS), run up and finish you off.
or 
1 Anointed, 1 Archmage and 2 units of 10 Phoenix Guards - They will laugh harder at range attacks or spells.

Chaos, Daemons of Tzeentch 
1 Lord of Change and 2 units of 10 Pink Horrors - Shoot and cast spells until your enemy fries..

Order, Duardin, Dispossessed:
1 Warden King, 1 Rune Lord, 4 units of 5 Irondrakes(each with one Grudgehammer Torpedo) - The synergy here creates range attacks that hits their single chosen target on 3s and wounds on 2s and have rend of -2, and they shoot twice if you don't move. The Grudegehammer have rend -3 and Damage of D3, and you have 4 of them, very likely to shoot twice. Plus you have +2 to unbind spells. Most likely you will shoot your enemies dead.


These are just a few.. I am sure there are more. But these are the one that I can think of while flipping thru my Chaos and Order Grand Alliance book.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

[NitosApprentice]

I know you don't have much options, but I would consider age of balance.

www.ageofbalance.com

 

I've had more incredibly close games with that system than any other out there.

[DeadlySarcasm]

3 minutes ago, NitosApprentice said:

I know you don't have much options, but I would consider age of balance.

www.ageofbalance.com

 

I've had more incredibly close games with that system than any other out there.

Just had a brief look at this, as I've never come across it before. 

Seem like a decent way of balancing kitchenhammer games. Although it doesn't take into account abilities and how they affect the game. I can see how this would be great for balancing club games, where you understand not to abuse the system. If you were to add some consideration for abilities it would be a vast improvement I think.

[NitosApprentice]

Give it a try, it actually does take into account abilities. Of course AoS is a casual game. If there is a unit that constantly has +1 to save all the time, it should be moved up a bracket but those are rare and far between. There is also a special page for "Special units" giving them a specific warscroll count. I've played countless games trying to abuse this and haven't had any luck, with the except of the worst army every created. Lots and lots of goblins, goblin shaman x2 and the formation. Basically gives you way too many ranged attacks each turn.