Two questions

[Miyokari]

Hello,I am considering collecting death army and I am wondering either about deathrattle or nighthaunt (or mix between two). Problem that I noticed is that deathrattle and nighthaunt don't have many units and my most problem with them is.. Are the armies diverse? As in, can I play several different warscrolls or my army will always look the same?

[Kugane]

Of course this is my personal opinion, but in terms of diversity, Death is most likely the least diverse army to go for at this point of time if you go with a certain allegiance such as mostly Deathrattle or mostly Nighthaunt stuff. If you play mixed Death however, you have more stuff to choose from. You can for example have different kinds of battlelines: skeletons, zombies, dire wolves, etc, and mix in things like ghouls, vargheist, morghast, different leaders and such. This creates some diversity. The army as a whole however is quite underwhelming in comparison to other AOS armies. Death lacks choices in terms of mobility or ranged attacks, and all the different factions dont work along with eachother all to well. I think there will be much more support coming for them later this year or next year - but as they stand right now, other than tomb kings, the army is lacking a bit.

[Miyokari]

49 minutes ago, Kugane said:

Of course this is my personal opinion, but in terms of diversity, Death is most likely the least diverse army to go for at this point of time if you go with a certain allegiance such as mostly Deathrattle or mostly Nighthaunt stuff. If you play mixed Death however, you have more stuff to choose from. You can for example have different kinds of battlelines: skeletons, zombies, dire wolves, etc, and mix in things like ghouls, vargheist, morghast, different leaders and such. This creates some diversity. The army as a whole however is quite underwhelming in comparison to other AOS armies. Death lacks choices in terms of mobility or ranged attacks, and all the different factions dont work along with eachother all to well. I think there will be much more support coming for them later this year or next year - but as they stand right now, other than tomb kings, the army is lacking a bit.

I see... Hmm, how about going Deathlords army with alliance taking like 40 skeletons from Deathrattle? The figures of Death are so beautiful that I would love to collect them, but I don't want to invest in something that may disappear/I will lose every single battle...

[AverageBoss]

The micro armies of Death are very much so lacking in diversity. This unfortunately is the result of the entire Grand Alliance being made of a single army from old Warhammer (Vampire Counts), that was split into 7 separate armies. Outside Tomb Kings (which were a separate and now discontinued army), and long, long ago skeletal crossbowmen, undead have always lacked shooting, and have retained that in AoS.

Playing GA:D can let you build some really cool looking a diverse undead armies. But the vampire, ghost, and ghoul micro lists (soulblight, nighthaunt, FEC), give you much cooler (and most likely more potent) army special rules, at the cost of that divesity.

There would be absolutely zero point in limiting yourself to Deathlords at this point in time unless you want Morghast battleline. They have no faction benefits at all other than that.

[Miyokari]

25 minutes ago, AverageBoss said:

The micro armies of Death are very much so lacking in diversity. This unfortunately is the result of the entire Grand Alliance being made of a single army from old Warhammer (Vampire Counts), that was split into 7 separate armies. Outside Tomb Kings (which were a separate and now discontinued army), and long, long ago skeletal crossbowmen, undead have always lacked shooting, and have retained that in AoS.

Playing GA:D can let you build some really cool looking a diverse undead armies. But the vampire, ghost, and ghoul micro lists (soulblight, nighthaunt, FEC), give you much cooler (and most likely more potent) army special rules, at the cost of that divesity.

There would be absolutely zero point in limiting yourself to Deathlords at this point in time unless you want Morghast battleline. They have no faction benefits at all other than that.

I really like Nagash figure and would like to use him, this is why I was considering Deathlords... Anything else I had in mind were Deathrattle/Nighthaunts because I don't like ghouls/zombies figures too much

[AverageBoss]

3 minutes ago, Miyokari said:

I really like Nagash figure and would like to use him, this is why I was considering Deathlords... Anything else I had in mind were Deathrattle/Nighthaunts because I don't like ghouls/zombies figures too much

You can still use Nagash in a Grand Alliance Death army, and have FAR more options for army construction. You don't need to limit yourself to Deathlords only.

[Miyokari]

26 minutes ago, AverageBoss said:

You can still use Nagash in a Grand Alliance Death army, and have FAR more options for army construction. You don't need to limit yourself to Deathlords only.

Ohh right! I forgot this is a thing, thanks for the remainder, so I can actually mix wraiths, deathrattle and Nagash together! Or some other combos, thank You!

[Kugane]

3 hours ago, Miyokari said:

Ohh right! I forgot this is a thing, thanks for the remainder, so I can actually mix wraiths, deathrattle and Nagash together! Or some other combos, thank You!

You will want to look at some synergy for your army though. For example: A wight king goes well with a Skeleton horde, because he helps to recover your units with his banner. You could for example also get 1 Wight king, 3 units of skeleton warriors, 1 unit of black knights and 1 unit of grave guard to get the Battalion for some extra rules. Another unit to consider is stuff such as a Necromancer for buffing and summoning, or a corpse cart if you plan to take some zombies or dire wolves. Fenrisian wolves from warhammer 40k make splendid dire wolves by the way!

I think if you want to play stuff like Nagash and don't plan to go tournaments you are better off with a GA:D style army and just getting the units you like to build a nice army. Nagash himself isn't worth the point cost as far I'm aware, but you can always use him in fun battles! I am currently trying to see if having a GA:D army is better than an allegiance, because you can take stuff like Mannfred buffing your units.

 

[Miyokari]

4 minutes ago, Kugane said:

You will want to look at some synergy for your army though. For example: A wight king goes well with a Skeleton horde, because he helps to recover your units with his banner. You could for example also get 1 Wight king, 3 units of skeleton warriors, 1 unit of black knights and 1 unit of grave guard to get the Battalion for some extra rules. Another unit to consider is stuff such as a Necromancer for buffing and summoning, or a corpse cart if you plan to take some zombies or dire wolves. Fenrisian wolves from warhammer 40k make splendid dire wolves by the way!

I think if you want to play stuff like Nagash and don't plan to go tournaments you are better off with a GA:D style army and just getting the units you like to build a nice army. Nagash himself isn't worth the point cost as far I'm aware, but you can always use him in fun battles! I am currently trying to see if having a GA:D army is better than an allegiance, because you can take stuff like Mannfred buffing your units.

 

Yeah, I thought that Nagash (point wise) wouldn't be much worth it until I could really somehow find a synergy for him. I was thinking of building an army rounded around a skeleton horde (once I get past my hatred of using too many models back from WFB times, up to 90 is good number.. Getting past that number is something that I just find annoying while playing). My only problem with death is that I don't like too much units like zombies, so I would like to evade it - hence I was looking towards Nighthaunt and Deathrattle as their models look great in my opinion and looking at the rules it seems I can build something nice (hopefully). Yeah, Nagash I would be mostly using in fun battles while on tournaments I would use something more like an army of skeleton horde.

 

How about Neferata? Is she worth using?

[Kugane]

2 minutes ago, Miyokari said:

Yeah, I thought that Nagash (point wise) wouldn't be much worth it until I could really somehow find a synergy for him. I was thinking of building an army rounded around a skeleton horde (once I get past my hatred of using too many models back from WFB times, up to 90 is good number.. Getting past that number is something that I just find annoying while playing). My only problem with death is that I don't like too much units like zombies, so I would like to evade it - hence I was looking towards Nighthaunt and Deathrattle as their models look great in my opinion and looking at the rules it seems I can build something nice (hopefully). Yeah, Nagash I would be mostly using in fun battles while on tournaments I would use something more like an army of skeleton horde.

 

How about Neferata? Is she worth using?

I read an article about Nagash a while ago, I can't find it anywhere, but it basically narrowed down to the fact that Nagash is an amazing unit, but that he can rarely to never kill enough points to make his cost worthwhile. Especially since the opponent will try to get him into combat and such.

I can understand, I absolutely hate painting up horde armies. Its a hell to clean all the moldlines and then do hundreds of conversion (I like to convert my units). I have no painted up 40 skeletons with spears and 10 with swords and I *might* end up painting some more since at least they are relatively easy to paint, but still, I'm not a fan of monotone painting. I like to really take my time and dive into 1 mini instead. 

I personally don't use nighthaunt stuff, but I saw people complain about lack of units, I guess some hexwraiths would be ok to add in?

Neferata is considered one of the best generals in the game by some people. Her command ability really helps survival for your army by a lot, especially since it stacks with every other survival buff you can give yourself :).

[Miyokari]

11 minutes ago, Kugane said:

I read an article about Nagash a while ago, I can't find it anywhere, but it basically narrowed down to the fact that Nagash is an amazing unit, but that he can rarely to never kill enough points to make his cost worthwhile. Especially since the opponent will try to get him into combat and such.

I can understand, I absolutely hate painting up horde armies. Its a hell to clean all the moldlines and then do hundreds of conversion (I like to convert my units). I have no painted up 40 skeletons with spears and 10 with swords and I *might* end up painting some more since at least they are relatively easy to paint, but still, I'm not a fan of monotone painting. I like to really take my time and dive into 1 mini instead. 

I personally don't use nighthaunt stuff, but I saw people complain about lack of units, I guess some hexwraiths would be ok to add in?

Neferata is considered one of the best generals in the game by some people. Her command ability really helps survival for your army by a lot, especially since it stacks with every other survival buff you can give yourself :).

Yeah, it's not even about painting but also moving over 100 units which is a bit of a pain, but I guess with time I will change my mindset about that  

Thanks for the help ! I guess I will experiment around and post some rosters on the site this or next week, maybe I will try using Nagash and see myself his downsides and ups..

I see about Neferata, that's great because I saw many people using Mannfred but I don't like him lore-wise so I wanted to evade using him, so seeing this actually makes me happy

 

Thanks overall for your help, I will probably still return asking more questions as I am new to AoS and new to death overall  

[Kugane]

Just now, Miyokari said:

Yeah, it's not even about painting but also moving over 100 units which is a bit of a pain, but I guess with time I will change my mindset about that  

Thanks for the help ! I guess I will experiment around and post some rosters on the site this or next week, maybe I will try using Nagash and see myself his downsides and ups..

I see about Neferata, that's great because I saw many people using Mannfred but I don't like him lore-wise so I wanted to evade using him, so seeing this actually makes me happy

 

Thanks overall for your help, I will probably still return asking more questions as I am new to AoS and new to death overall  

I think the thing between Mannfred and Beferata is, 1 is good for more offense giving an amazing buff, the other for defense :). Since skeletons keep coming back to life, it can be a real hell for the opponent to bite through them if they are hard to kill like that.

I really love the Nagash model too! If you find a use for him ,please share so I have an excuse to buy it haha!