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Allegiance vs Faction vs Allies?


TheOtherJosh

Question

I'm seeing threads running around asking a similar question, so I figured I'd ask ...

 

Faction: (p.86 GHB 2017)

A list of units that is part of a Pitched Battle Profile. These lists will sometimes have other Faction lists that they can bring as allies. The Pitched Battle Profiles in GHB 2017 replace all prior published versions and including those with no publication date.

 

Allies: (p.86 GHB 2017)

A list of Factions that can ally with the main faction without changing the Allegiance of an Army.

 

Allegiance: (p.116 GHB 2017)

These are based on a common KEYWORD on the warscrolls chosen for your Army. If all units share a keyword then they can be part of the same Allegiance. If you have taken units as Allies, they do not need to have the same KEYWORD as you chosen Allegiance, but they do not gain any bonuses from the allegiance abilities either.

 

So, there are Factions that have different Allegiances than their faction name.

 

For example:

Disciples of Tzeentch. (Allegiance: Tzeentch)

Blades of Khorne (Allegiance: Khorne)

Daemons of Chaos (Allegiance: None Specified, Can take a Mark and change Allegiance)

 

Of note, there is no "Khorne" or "Tzeentch" (as an example) faction in the Pitched Army profiles.

 

However, in the GHB 2017, Factions and Allegiance are sometimes used interchangeably.

 

For example:

“The Pitched Battle profile for each faction lists the allegiances of the allied units you can take. Allied units can have a different allegiance to the rest of the army." (Allies, GHB 2017, p.76)

 

Warscroll Battalions: (p.117 GHB 2017)

Allow you to bypass Allegiance Requirements:

“When picking your army’s allegiance, all units in a warscroll battalion are considered to have the allegiance noted above the title on the warscroll."

 

However, does this reference for "Allegiance" in Warscroll Battalions actually mean "Faction"?

 

So, RAW, the "Factions" as listed in the Pitched Battle Profiles are what army lists are based on and one chooses an "Allegiance" based on a KEYWORD; and "Factions" can bring Allies along as part of their force... but those Allies can't be battleline for the main "Faction".

 

For example:

When creating a Diciples of Tzeentch List. The DoT have their own battleline force options and the DoT can ally with Slaves to Darkness and they could bring along some Chaos Marauders (who happen to be Tzeentch marked).

 

From a purely KEYWORD standpoint the Marauders meet the Allegiance keyword.

 

However they are not part of the main Faction in the Battle Profile and thus couldn't be part of the main Faction force? And therefore couldn't actually be Battleline because they would have to be taken as Allies? Even if they can take the same keyword that gives them the Allegiance...

 

Similarly, "Daemons of Chaos" have no Factions they can ally with. (And there goes the Soulgrinder in the army idea ....) Though there are Warscroll Battalions that can take aligned Daemons...

 

As I follow down this odd rabbit hole with Factions that don't have the same name as their Allegiance... can, for example, one take Slaves to Darkness Chaos Marauders (Tzeentch Marked) as Battleline for a Disciples of Tzeentch Faction force, or does one actually need to take DoT battleline? (Acolytes, Tzaangor, Pink Horrors)

 

It feels like I'm missing something...

 

 

 

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Not sure I spotted your what your "question" is, it looks like you are just restarting another thread on the topic which has already been flogged beyond death.  

On 8/30/2017 at 4:35 AM, TheOtherJosh said:

When creating a Diciples of Tzeentch List. The DoT have their own battleline force options and the DoT can ally with Slaves to Darkness and they could bring along some Chaos Marauders (who happen to be Tzeentch marked).

...

However they are not part of the main Faction in the Battle Profile and thus couldn't be part of the main Faction force? And therefore couldn't actually be Battleline because they would have to be taken as Allies? Even if they can take the same keyword that gives them the Allegiance...

...

It feels like I'm missing something...

This example has already been answered.  If you have a Tzeentch allegiance army and you give the marauders Mark of Tzeentch, they are in your main army and battleline.  If you mark them differently to Tzeentch they will be in your allies and not contribute to battleline.  

The something your missing is that people have read way too much into a concept that was meant to be straightforward. It has now been rules-mongered by some into a new concept that is more confusing, far more complicated than it needs to be and far less elegant than what was intended.  When the errata eventually comes, it will be ruled that faction = allegiance and Disciples of Tzeenth = Tzeentch keyword, as intended.

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