Grimrock
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Posts posted by Grimrock
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2 hours ago, itgnightraven said:
they can already fight in two ranks this season as they are just straight up gally vets
Didn't they change that over to a battalion in the latest GHB? So no chance for a one drop if you want to get good use out of your melee infantry. Plus who knows what we'll have in the next season, maybe it'll stick around maybe not. I'd rather have it on the warscroll like with chaos knights.
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2 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:
I was wondering if mobs of Bloodletters might be viable again. Hoping they get 2 attacks base, but not holding my breath. I like those old 2nd edition ones and also the 3rd edition goat looking ones. More keen on getting daemons, but the mortal models are super cheap!
I hope they'll be viable, I love painting up daemons and they feature prominently in the 40k Chaos Daemons combat patrol box so I'd like an excuse to pick that up. If the rumors are right and they're going up to 2 wounds then I'd definitely expect them to get an extra attack at minimum, and hopefully some way to attack in multiple ranks like a 2" reach or some special rule.
Today's article looked interesting. I like the changes to the bloodstoker in particular. We're probably losing re-roll to wounds and I'm not in love with the likely return of daisy chaining, but anything to get rid of wholly within 8" haha. The other changes seem nice but it is a lot of focus on heroes that have historically been quite awful. Hopefully this is a sign that they've gone through and re-tooled all the hero profiles.
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Question for anyone that has bought the new Exalted Hero of Chaos model, how does it compare size wise to the standard chaos warriors? I've been thinking of picking up the Khagra's Ravagers box and using it for a chaos lord, two exalted heroes, and a chaos sorcerer, but I'm not sure if they'll be a suitable standins once they're on 40mm bases.
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23 minutes ago, OkayestDM said:
I'm looking at this as a Stormcast player. I'd kill for our MW on death ability to work more like this.
The stormcast wounds are exactly what I thought of when I saw the rules. The rules are extremely similar: the 3" range is definitely an improvement over stormcast, but if you have a thunderstrike unit you're looking at doing at at least double the number of wounds for any models that are actually in engagement range. So stormcast get the chance to tigger it less, but generally do more damage when it triggers. I've never actually seen the stormcast wounds make any significant difference in a game (admittedly I have very little experience so maybe it happens more than I think), so I'm not exactly excited to see this ported over to Khorne. Especially when it already had a bunch of similar mechanics that worked perfectly well (and in the case of wrathmongers and skullreapers did significantly more damage on average).
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39 minutes ago, AresX8 said:
@Marcvs This is a huge deal for Khorne, who had almost no way (only answer was Unfettered Fury command ability) of handling shooting/magic heavy matchups. This is an answer to that and a massive deal.
Also, there is a super strong hint that the army is being redesigned. Look at the last sentence written about the Blood Tithe reward:
"The Blood God has given his followers special permission to use this as many times as they want – if enough blood is shed to earn it."
Blood Tithe rewards never added extra attacks. Extra attack sources were always tied to an aura on a unit, up to 3: Bloodsecrator, Wrathmongers, and Aspiring Deathbringer.
Based on the wording it sounds like the tithe system might be moving over to the recently introduced version from the 40k World Eaters. For them you generate tithe points in the same way, but you spend them to buy persistent army-wide buffs. Stuff like +1 to charge, exploding 6's to hit in combat, 6+ ward save, etc. That would mean a total re-work of the whole tithe table and it would definitely be a huge foundational shift to the army. No free movement or free rounds of combat in the hero phase would be an absolutely massive shake up. It could also mean that the summoning is going away, but I kind of doubt it because GW seems to love having summoning in chaos armies. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing more.
As far as the other rules go I'm not totally sold. A 5+ ward is pretty great, don't get me wrong, but daemons are super fragile as is so it's not like they're going to hit maggotkin levels of resilience. It won't really make them hard to kill at range, it'll just sort of make them normal instead of a total pushover. Now if this is combined with a general improvement to saves for the daemons or maybe a big bump in wounds for the bloodthirsters then we could be looking at something really interesting. The mortal wounds on death look... kinda awful? Like a hero will do a whole mortal wound on average when they die. A ~200 point unit of blood warriors will do maybe 3 when they get wiped out? Extra chip damage is nice but this just feels like a lot of dice rolling and measuring for next to no impact. I'm also worried that this means they'll be removing all the other fight on death style mechanics in the faction.
Finally, those tomb king bits look totally dope. They were my second army in fantasy waaay back in the day and I love to see them getting the attention. The flow and design of the weapons is fantastic and it's definitely getting me to consider the old world again.
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3 hours ago, JackStreicher said:
(Green washing)
If they sell their Sprues (which they will for sure) I want them to grant incentives for the consumers. I am not a fan of I-recycle-so-you-get-richer
Well we've made them richer by buying models often enough. How much better if it's at least for a good cause? I have a frankly embarrassing pile of old sprues sitting around in boxes from 20 or so odd years of this hobby. If they were doing this in my country I'd be more than happy to clip everything and make the trip to the not so local gw.
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25 minutes ago, StarFyreXXX said:
im sure they will be updated. hopefully the saurus knights box can make the character as opposed to wasting a seperate 'slot' on it
SF
Oof, no no no that's the last thing you want. Buying a whole box just so you can make a single character model? If AoS allowed understrength units it'd be fine but as is mixing a character model into a unit box is a terrible idea.
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New sculpts for the Khorne and Slaanesh minis look great, but man that rules preview has me nervous for Khorne. Instead of giving us a resculpt of Valkia and providing something that the faction is lacking (a small based hero that can actually fight, not something that you would think is hard to find in Khorne but here we are), they gave us yet another situational buff model with an extremely limited range. Not only that but it's a buff that's redundant with the globally available All Out Attack and can't stack with it. If our prayers haven't changed then it's also redundant with those. It's just... why. Why, when you have the unlimited possibilities of a brand new model, do you make yet another buffing foot hero (Khorne already has 13 foot hero models!!) and make its buff work off a 'wholly within 8" ' bubble (something every Khorne player already knows and hates with a passion) and then make that buff completely redundant with multiple, much easier to acquire, versions of it.
GW please, if you're listening, stop it. Just stop. I know you like foot hero models, but when you get to a faction that is already drowning in them please, please, please, just use some common sense. It doesn't have to be crazy, a resculpt works perfectly fine. Or a small unit. Or maybe cut a new sprue with those models from the 1st edition starterbox we haven't been able to buy separately for all of AoS. Anything really other than just the exact same thing you've been doing for the last 5 years. I would literally have been happier with no new model at all rather than getting this.
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On 2/21/2023 at 12:32 PM, Hannibal said:
Hi, a short Question regarding Horticulous Slimux:
He can plant an additional Nurgle Tree at the beginning of my hero phase.
Gaining Contagion Points also happens at the start of the hero phase.
Am I right, that the Maggotkin player (who ist the active player in his own hero phase) decides, which of these happens first? Ie I first plant the additional tree, then I gain the contagion point out of that tree?
if tht´s the case, I can get 7 contagion points with ease in the first turn:
Befouling Host, Horticulous Slimux => overall 3 trees => 3 contagion points
being in my territory and no foe in my territory => 4 contagion points.
Is that right?
As far as I know yes, that's the correct way to play it according to section 1.6.2 in the rules. I usually run befouling host and having a semi-guaranteed sloppity bilepiper turn 1 has been huge in the majority of my games. Being able to toss him pretty much anywhere he's needed to shut down pile ins or to get that little extra punch of damage is a really big deal.
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6 hours ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:
GW has historically been pretty reliable when it comes to keeping models playable in their respective faction, but have been pretty bad when it comes to preserving options that break faction barriers. Over the course of the last few years, we lost a number of those options: Grand alliances after the shift to 3rd edition, mercenary companies from GHB 2019 I believe when GHB 2020 came out, Legion of Grief just after Soulblight Gravelords released and also Lethisian Defenders at some point.
Personally, I have become pretty weary of allies and mercenaries. They have a tendency to just disappear when point updates come out and they are not on the list. Plus, by running allies, you are making yourself doubly vulnerable to tome updates breaking existing synergy. I used to run a Knight Azyros in Cities, but that interaction broke when Stormcast got updated. I believe there was also a bunch of trouble with Slaves to Darkness and Beasts of Chaos coallition at the start of this edition.
Preserving cross-faction compatibility just does not seem to be much of a priority for GW. So if you want to get one of those ROR boxes to play them in a faction that can't usually run them, you should accept the possibility that the option might go away as soon as next GHB, and very likely with the next edition.
Exactly, I originally bought into Slaves to Darkness, and Archaon in particular, because I owned the 4 major god armies and figured they were a great purchase because they fit into all 4 armies at once. Because of the keyword system I thought I'd always be able to find at least one of my armies to use them in and there should always be some synergy somewhere. Then this edition they dropped the keyword system entirely and absolutely gutted all synergy between the god armies and S2D. As happy as I am with the current Slaves book and how good everything is, I'm really bummed out with the way GW has been systematically removing the fun cross faction stuff. I would have happily bought into Beasts of Chaos for the same reason as Slaves, but now there's no way.
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2 hours ago, Ogregut said:
I really like the chaos one, the waycry monsters are great sculpts.
Regarding clearing stock - I'm sure they have the technology now to grind up sprues to be reused.
Surely they would do that if they had an excess of stock rather than pay for new packaging, artwork and other resources?
Uh, no? If they grind up the models they make zero profit and maybe recoup a buck in materials per box. If re-packaging models makes it possible to sell them then of course GW would do it. Sure the profit margin would be a little smaller, but it's still going to be more profit than just grinding up the plastic.
Just in case anyone wasn't around in second edition, GW pulled something very similar there. They added mercenary rules to the game and then dropped them immediately at the next GHB and pretended like they never existed. The majority of the mercenary companies were for models that stuck around, but once they sold out of the dwarf cannons in particular they promptly deleted from the game. I would not be surprised at all to see the same thing here. It's possible they might herald some resculpts (for example there was a blood knight mercenary company before the new plastics dropped), but I'm guessing the dwarves will disappear from the game before the edition is out.
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2 hours ago, Jefferson Skarsnik said:
Is there particular stuff that the Gitz are really missing as an army, other than things that just generally expand or fit better visually with the (admittedly a bit out on a limb) wolf rider aesthetic? It seemed like the early 2019 GG release was substantial and had a lot of great looking stuff in it, and what they mainly needed was to make them actually fun to use in games
I've been checked out of AOS 3.0 almost entirely beyond chewing through painting a Lumineth army at a glacial pace, but that Gitz vanguard box briefly tugged at the Impulsive Pile of Shame Purchase bit of even my brain
I know it's kinda awful in AoS, but back in WFB days goblins used to man the artillery. Spear chukkas and rock lobbas might be a bit mundane for AoS but Doom Diver Catapults would fit right in. Could have tweaked it to launch squigs if they needed to make it more gloomspite-y.
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3 hours ago, The Red King said:
So with the new errata for blades of khorne I cant recall if coalition units gain the "blades of khorne" keyword or if there is now literally no reason to use the coalition rule unless the unit in question is utterly broken in it's own book since you give up all allegiance abilities on them. Is that right?
They just get the Khorne keyword, not Blades of Khorne, so yeah you're right. Currently next to no reason to bring anything in unless it's totally busted on it's own or it provides something we don't have access to in our book. That doesn't write absolutely everything off, Marauder cavalry for example could be decent with their speed and new ability, but generally speaking better to just run models from our book. It's also worth noting that a few things in the Tzeentch book support the Tzeentch keyword instead of just Disciples of Tzeentch, so it's not impossible they'll re-shuffle when the new book comes out.
Edit: Something funny I just noticed, all of the Khorne prayers have been updated so you can't take them on a chaos warshrine but they missed the Judgements and the Skull Altar. They still work with any Khorne priest.
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1 hour ago, Twisted Firaun said:
Speaking as a Tomb Kings fan and Total War player, it’s hard to play them when Khorne and Tzeentch are coming after you from both sides. And THEN the bloody bretonnians decide to attack you instead of the daemons…..
Yeah the Thunderdome us tough enough playing as one of the really strong factions. Any time I think of playing tomb kings I just kinda squirm inside and move on to something a little more manageable. The game is a blast though, and if we actually do see Cathay on the table I really hope we see the dragons too. They'd make absolutely stunning kits. Not to mention the celestial guard, artillery, sky junks... Man Cathay would be so freaking cool on the tabletop.
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4 hours ago, whispersofblood said:
Hitting on 4s is terrible. I have had 5 knights tank 6 scythe hunters so that's probably what they are best at... But it's not really a good use of points.
There are a lot of good infantry units that are going to show up as Bodyguards and knights are bad against all of them.
I've been testing slaanesh theridons as my skirmishing unit of choice and it's been good.
Yeah I think that's the biggest problem with MSU knights, you really need to give them something to improve the hit roll and there's only so many buffs to go around. If you can get daemonic power on them they can wreck most things, but that really lends itself to having a single big unit with a banner and then getting other things that don't need buffs like chosen or varanguard.
How many theridons are you using in your lists? I like the models but when I saw their scrolls I was leaning towards chosen instead. It's good to hear they're working out well.
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5 hours ago, Bayul said:
You can bring Flamers in S2D as allies. Add an Exalted Flamer to buff them. Or Skyfires or Horrors or Kairic Acolytes. Everything with range >8" can fire right away.
But then you really are putting all your eggs in the silvered portal basket (so you're starting further in the whole if you run up against an opponent you can't use it against), and you're getting less out of it than you would if you were just playing straight Tzeentch. No Eternal Conflagration for the flamers and no Lord of Fate from the Fatemaster, and you can't bring 6 flamers to really pile on the hurt because you'd go over the ally limit. It's not a terrible idea and it would definitely be an interesting way to change up the Slaves playstyle, but you might be better off just going Disciples of Tzeentch and bringing Slaves allies at that point. Slaves as allies still have their rock solid base stats to carry them through and then you could really get the most out of the portal.
5 hours ago, Bayul said:I'd argue that the best S2D units to deep strike are slow units like Chosen or Chaos Warriors. Chaos Warriors might even get their bonus attacks with proper positioning. Chaos Knights don't need it. The Gaunt Summoner can cast Daemonic Speed with +1 to cast on them in the first hero phase, send them away and still do his trick with his units in reserve afterwards.
I was thinking about that and honestly I'm not really sure if it would be helpful with them. First off, it's obviously not a reliable alpha strike. Even with their +1 to charge it's too much of a coin flip. Also, like you said, we're not really hurting for alpha strike options so there's no need for it anyway. That means the goal would really be to put them somewhere they couldn't reach normally, but boards are pretty small and the objectives you'd be going for early game are typically in the middle. Unless the new GHB changes things up there are no mid field objectives warriors couldn't reach using a command point for a 6" run so you don't need the portal to get them into position. Beyond that if you end up going second you might be guaranteed to not be able to get the warriors on the objective if your opponent zones you out. You could hold the portal until turn 2 or 3 in order to threaten backline objectives but then you're significantly increasing the risk of your opponent surprising you and taking out the summoner before depositing his payload. You also have access to dirt cheap cultists that can do the same thing with none of the risk.
I can totally see the portal helping in some situations, it's just the question of whether it's worth the cost of the gaunt summoner to use it. Personally all the little interactions and risks push me away from wanting to use it but I'm pretty risk averse and I like a more steady/consistent game. Where exactly are you planning to put the warriors/chosen? Are you thinking of dropping them on an objective, or maybe trying to pin your opponent in their deployment zone? Or maybe something else?
5 hours ago, Bayul said:edit: Why is the TZEENTCH keyword useless? You mentioned Warp Reality. A mobile hero is the best candidate to utilize it. A Gaunt Summoner on Disc in the opponents flank can +1 cast Warp Reality > Deamonic Speed on Chaos Knights for example.
Sorry, I was just trying to say the base ability of the mark for the 6+ shrug on spells is really weak compared to the other marks. It was a half formed attempt at noting the opportunity cost of taking the mark of Tzeentch in order to use the Silvered Portal. For example if you're marking warriors to put them in the portal then they can't have the mark of Nurgle, so no -1 to wound and no banner for -1 rend. You're taking a big hit to their potential survivability in order to put them in the portal and you need to consider if that cost is worth it. Same for chosen losing access to Slaanesh or Khorne for the extra damage.
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The problem with the summoner is that a big chunk of his points are tied up in the silvered portal ability. If you're not using that you're left with a 2 cast wizard with good mobility, meh combat stats, and a so-so spell. He's not bad, but he's definitely not worth 240 points if you're not using the portal. He's expensive enough that you need to build around him a bit to get good use out of his abilities, but then against the wrong opponent you just have to not use those abilities. That puts you in the hole right from the start since you're paying points for nothing and having to re-organize your game plan. The manticore sorcerer is massively more resilient, has a solid combat profile, is a monster for stomp and roar, and has a much better spell (50% more range and 50% more damage).
The other question is what are you putting in the portal? The summoner makes some sense in Tzeentch because you can put flamers in there; his 16" move gets them much further than they could on their own and they're still 100% effective outside of 9". In slaves there aren't really many ideal units to teleport. Chaos knights are probably your best bet, but even with their musician a 9" charge is far from guaranteed. To make matters worse your units will be off the table during the hero phase so no Daemonic Power or Daemonic Speed. On top of that you have to take the mark of Tzeentch which is almost entirely useless, and you could set up a pseudo portal anyway by using Warp Reality on a significantly cheaper hero.
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I'd guess that the big reveal for Christmas will be the next season of war/incarnate. Feels like it's about the right time for it and it's probably the next big thing for AoS.
Was there any hard evidence that khorne is the next chaos tome after beasts? I know they've been out the longest, but a little while back someone said that heard a leak that khorne was being playtested and they were way too strong currently. If they're still in the playtesting phase then the book can't be finished yet right? We should have a minimum what... 6 months to a year? For them to finish, send it to the printers, and get it shipped. Maybe the next book is actually slaanesh.
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58 minutes ago, EntMan said:
...and it's a whole load of made to order old space marines.
Is this the first time they've done standard plastic in made to order? I thought it was always just older resin models.
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The thing with the chosen is you don't always need to have a unit rocket across the board for a turn 1 alpha strike. Sometimes what you need is a high damage dealer than can counterstrike your opponent's heavy hitters after they've committed to your lines, and chosen are quite good for that. If you're bringing a big unit of warriors a unit of 5 chosen can happily tag along behind them and wait to counter strike whatever your opponent throws in. They may not have a ward, but if they're behind 20 warriors your opponent should really struggle to get them in range of any meaningful spells. If the opponent commits ranged units to shooting the chosen then they'll be risking getting charged by the warriors in turn, which can often be a favourable trade.
I guess what I'm saying is try not to think of them in a vacuum, think of how they'll work on the tabletop. Sure varanguard are faster and more resilient, but they pay for that by doing less damage per point. Knights are fantastic, but their huge footprint can make them unwieldy and difficult to focus on a small area. It's all about figuring out what your plan is and what makes it work best. I see chosen working extremely well in a defensive warrior focused list that only moves far up enough to camp objectives and tries to grind the opponent out. In that environment they don't need to be fast, just fast enough to kill the things that get stuck in the warrior tar pit or show up in the back lines.
All that being said, if the only thing you want to do is win tournaments then you really should be looking at cultists. Splintered fang put out a wholly ridiculous amount of mortal wounds for their cost and are easy to spam. If I wanted to lose some friends I think I'd be looking at host of the everchosen with a couple heroes including an idolator lord, 40 warriors, and about a hundred cultists. 50-60 splintered fangs for damage, 20-30 corvus cabal for forward objectives, 10-20 iron golems for rear objectives. Just swarm the board and grind them out.
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1 hour ago, Bayul said:
So Arcane Tome for a Cabalist hero is redundant?
Yeah, but specifically only for Heroes that aren't wizards to start with. It seems like you can still double dip on a sorcerer lord and take it from a 1 cast wizard to a 3 cast. Not sure why GW felt the need to target that one specifically but oh well.
Everything else looks more or less like I expected. Thankfully they didn't mess with any of the Daemon Prince traits so my plans for running despoilers still work. I'm still hoping they update the other chaos FAQ's to close out the weird mark wording, but the book hasn't even been fully released yet so no rush.
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8 hours ago, Biboune said:
I think that cheaper and less efficient screen could be raptoryx: 25 pts cheaper, same base size but 6 models. They are sold with furies, another good option for screen. If a 2 units a furies get charged, one will survive (if there is no strike first/last in the equation).
The boxe is quite cheap and the models are quite recent.
Annoyingly enough having 6 models is their downside. Because of coherency rules 5 models can actually cover a lot more ground than 6, so the horsemen are still the more effective screen. A bit of a shame because I'd like to be able to use my raptoryx.
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34 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
Wondering if some Screamers might be good allies. Super fast to intercept charges, and at 3 wounds each, not super easy to remove models. I also like that they can cause MW for any type of move they do, and good for absorbing Unleash Hell if needed. Can't think of an equally fast StD unit that's a good cheap screen; need something to keep up with Chariots and Knights to kinda block off undesirable interferences.
The biggest issue using them for screens is their base size. Since they're on 32 mm bases they really don't block a lot of space at all, and even though they're 3 wounds they don't have much of a save so they'll still die pretty quick. Their high speed, flight, and small footprint do make them excellent for threatening undefended objectives, but not great for screening.
I think marauder horsemen are definitely worth considering. 5 cavalry bases make them excellent screeners if you don't mind seeing them sideways on the board, and while they might not be screamer fast they're still faster than knights. Plus with the -1 to wound it's even harder for the opponent to clear the screen with shooting. Definitely worth the 5 points over screamers in my mind.
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2 hours ago, Captaniser said:
I kinda hope they don't bring Felix back in AoS, one of the major themes in Gotrek's new adventures is to let go and make peace with what is.
Also i don't want more characters from WHFB to show up. We still know Malerion and Tyrion are around, just not a part of the narrative yet, but i feel like the setting will just be anchored too heavily to it's past if the only characters in it are those from ages past. Look at what is happening with 40k, every rumor is about which primarch/30k character will return next, which older character will get a remake next and yadayadayada.
It makes the settings feel smaller than what they are, newer characters being ignored or looked at with disdain by the fanbase. New narratives with new relations and dynamics to play around with is what i want, sure the occasional old face is a welcome surprise, but i am afraid that GW will just milk the character nostalgia to the point where other narratives will ignored. It's part of the reason i don't engage with 40k anymore to any real extent, it's just turning into a type of soap opera where the same 10 characters interact with eachother and ignores the wider universe.
It's kind of a complicated issue right? The old characters have traction right off the bat because of all the old stories and lore that already exist, so they're easy for GW to bring in. Newer characters are lacking all that background so GW really has to invest a lot of resources into making them exciting, but they rarely seem to want to put the work in. It's not like it's impossible to make good AoS characters, but their desire to just endlessly churn out hero models seems to have outpaced their story telling. You end up with characters like Bastian Carthalos or Gobsprakk that are definitely important to their faction but nobody really cares about because they just sort of come out of nowhere and really only exist as an excuse to sell centerpiece models.
Personally, I feel kind of conflicted over it. I would absolutely like to see new characters and new stories flourish. Slaanesh in particular has done really well recently with Glutos and Synessa/Dexcessa getting some good lore outside of their army book. It should also be noted that their lore was shared with a resurrected Sigvald, but I don't think they were overshadowed at all. On the other hand my favourite AoS characters and models so far were ported over from fantasy with upgraded kits. In the end I don't think I really care about which characters show up and which don't, the main thing is that GW does a good job telling the story and supporting their models with intriguing narrative.
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The Rumour Thread
in Age of Sigmar Discussions
Posted · Edited by Grimrock
Currently by raw I'm pretty sure it does, but it isn't limited to just +3/+3. They can issue a command every phase, 3 times each, and the buff lasts until the end of the turn. On the Honest Wargamer stream they showed that the other trait for pretenders is they generate 3 command points instead of 1 for the general being alive, so that's 5-6 command points in a turn with the heroic action. Considering they could issue a command in the hero, movement, shooting, charge, and combat phases I think they max out at +15 to each. Super unlikely to get that high, but +9 to each would be easy. Obviously I think we're going to get a day one FAQ limiting it to only giving +1. Classic GW rule writing.