Requizen

Anvils CA on Cats would be hard there since you have to have the nearby Hero to use it, but it's possible. Plus, if you burn it when not in combat, it just gives the Dracolines an extra 3" move in the Hero Phase! Likely he was using it for the occasional extra shot with the Ballistas. A Ballista isnt' the best use of a Point, but it's not bad by a long shot and 3 Ballista + Ordinator will ruin so many things it's not even funny.

Focal points for me. I think it's the best designed, benefitting most army types (you can brawl in the middle, or try to flank and get multiple objectives, or sit back on a couple and shoot until you clear, etc) and just has a lot of fun play involved with it. I enjoy Relocation Orb and Scorched Earth, but I tend not to like them when it comes to tournament play. I dislike missions with too much randomness - while Gift From The Heavens and Starstrike are random in landing, you at least know where they might come down, they don't move, and you know the scoring. Random number scoring and random movement are pretty iffy for me when I go to an event.

Most anything works for Stormcast at 1k as long as you don't go too crazy. Heck, I've run a Stardrake at 1k and it won me the tournament XD If you bring 2 units or more of shooting at low points, you're usually in a good spot. Being able to pump out good damage from a distance is so nice, you can't go wrong with stuff like Ballistas and Judicators. Hm, I don't really think many of the Stormcast spells are too great. I'd rather just give both the Evocators Speed of Lightning, as Empower is better than Celestial Blades anyways so it's a bit redundant. I'd give the foot Incantor Lightning Blast or Stormcaller to have some ranged threat, and then give the Arcanum... anything really. They're all kinda equivalent, and she'll probably just be casting Arcane Bolt or a realm spell most of the time anyways. Azyrite Halo is the best spell in the book, but really only good if you have a strong tanky unit that's going to be rolling a lot of saves with rerolls. It's not great on Evos since they usually kill what they're in combat with before they take rolls, but I guess you could cast it on the Sequitors or something?

Hm, I think if you're running Phalanx, you really want bigger units to take advantage of the buffing and what not. I would either drop the Hurricanes to take more Sequitors, or just not take the Battalion, drop the foot Evocators, and run 6 Dracoline Evocators instead. It feels a bit like trying to take a little of everything, and fails to be good at any one thing. I am interested in the use of a Drakesworn Templar. I love my LCoSD, but the extra 100 points is pretty noteworthy.

Sorry, here you go! I have since decided to swap my Lord-Castellant with a Knight-Incantor for a few reasons, which leaves me without the extra CP but I think the auto-dispel is more important overall. Taking it to an event this weekend so I'll report on how it performs. So far I have quite a good record at events with it, I believe 10-3, only losses to two Nagash meta lists (still trying to figure this one out, hopefully the Incantor helps) and one wonky FEC summoning army (though now that I've played it I think I could have had a shot at winning if I had deployed differently, it's far from an unwinnable matchup). It basically auto-wins against anything that has to just walk across the table. Other shooting armies can give it trouble, but depends on ranges and what not. 4 Stonehorns will mess it up all the way but I think you can still play missions well into them.

I've got a pretty solid performance record with Anvils of the Heldenhammer, you can see my list earlier in this thread. There are a couple ways to play Anvils with shooting units. PJetski has been working on what seems to be a TAC Astral Templars list that I would love to try sometime, using Ballistas and Evocators. Stardrake builds are still quite powerful, as well.

The power isn't in Evos though. Like, you might take a unit of 10, but the real strength of the Gav Bomb is in Sequitors. 20 Sequitors bringing 9 Greatmaces will put the hurt on pretty much every chaff unit already, and then be extremely durable to any counterpunch. 2x20 Sequitors and 10 Evos plays the old Vanguard Wing game - I'm going to tie up your whole army that I can touch, you're not going to be able to easily kill me, and I'm going to countercharge anything that pops through. Meanwhile, my Heroes and other units will sit on objectives and outscore you. Gary P actually ran straight up 60 Sequitors and just Birds and Heraldors to hold objectives, and I'm pretty sure only lost to the overall winner (though there was basically no coverage). It's basically exactly what Vanguard Wing did - it's not so much an Alpha that kills everything so much as it is an Alpha that doesn't let your opponent play the game.

I see this sentiment a lot but again, it's a lot easier to say on paper than it is in practice. Even if you do bubble out your army behind chaff, then the Gav player is just going to charge in and blast them, and make a wall of 40 wound, rerolling saves units (two or more, likely) that you have to chew through before moving out on the map, and then countercharging with Evocators. It's one-note, but one-note doesn't mean easily shut down when that note is "control most of the board and still deal lots of damage". We already learned that with Vanguard Wing, and this is basically the 2.0 version of that (or perhaps the 3.0 version of Warrior Brotherhood).

Hm I don't agree that "everyone knows how to counter it" at this point. It's still likely one of the strongest Stormcast lists at the moment. Many armies can't bubble out far enough to prevent a good drop, or don't have enough models in the army to really stop the charge from doing devastating damage. And the 40+ Sequitor versions are still insane at holding objectives and grinding the game out by locking entire armies in place. It is very one-note though, and certain armies (LoN, for example) are basically immune to it in the long run. But it's not "bad" nor is it out of meta.

While Maniaks are nice, it's just so light on bodies and hitting power. If you go that route, while I understand the desire to not take Endless Spells, I might find a way to get Cogs in there at least.

Yeah, for sure, but considering the model is no longer being printed I just wouldn't be surprised if it happened. Use it until it changes though Personally I'm looking at allying in Mollog. I really like the model (yay Underworlds!) and a tough Hero with a MW weapon is nothing to sneeze at for just 170. Kind of like a mini Dankhold Troggboss.

Correct, allies can never take Artifacts. I would also caution people relying on the Orc Warboss too much, I'm pretty sure it's getting changed to only affect <Orc and Goblin> units soon. You can find the Orc and Goblin Legends pdf here at the Legends page, I'm pretty sure it'll replace the one in the app before too long.

Ranged is generally the best option for us against monsters. Chipping them down before they reach melee reduces the punch, and killing them outright is better. Other than that, any of the hard-hitting melee units will make short work of one... assuming you go first. Protectors (6s!), Retributors, Evocators (mounted or not), Fulminators, or Concussors should all make relatively short work of a big monster, but are also the prime targets for said monsters. It's a bit of a game you have to play - if you get charged, you die or at least lose a huge chunk of the unit. If you charge, you generally remove or at least cripple the monster before it swings. A big part about playing against heavy threats (monsters, big scary units like Grimghasts or other Evos, etc) is not particularly counterpicking, but also making sure you engage in such a way that you deal the most damage before taking any yourself. Stormcast are actually a lot more fragile than it would seem. While we have great saves and wound counts, our army also loses effectiveness super quickly once we take damage, especially if you go heavy on one or two important units. You have to play aggressively while also protecting the aggressive units. Hope that helps!

Hm, very interesting option there. The pregame move is a big deal, and you're right about a lot of Monsters being important right now. The rest is pretty meh, the Artifact and CA being basically pointless, but if you're doing a well-rounded build and won't particularly miss Staunch it's a fair choice.

Oh yeah, I don't think any of those lists are 5-0 lists, but they're pretty good spoiler lists for some of the big stuff out there. Mass shooting is, as I said, one of the few things to threaten Nagash, and depending on terrain setup and what not, a great way to shut down DoK combo pieces.

6 Raptors isn't nearly as scary as 9, but it's still pretty good. You're not getting as much out of the Command Ability, but it opens up the list a bit if nothing else. Instead of Evos altogether, you could add in some chump units. More Aetherwings, any number of Skinks, and yeah some 5 man Sequitor/Liberator units do fine for reaching out to grab objectives or stand in the way.

Most people don't care if Astreia's model is used as a normal LA, but you could always swap the head and/or staff pretty easily. Nobody has ever called me out for using Vandus as a regular LCoD. I dunno how effective just 3 Evocats are, but the idea is sound. Honestly if you dropped the Dracolines and one unit of Libs, you could take Evos 10 on foot, which is my personal preference unless you're going all in on Dracolines (6+ with the LAoD)

Continuing thought experiments on "melee is for suckers" Stormcast. Anvils of the Heldenhammer Incantor - General, Deathly Aura, Lightning Blast, Staff of Focus Relictor - Translocation Azyros - Soulthief 5x Liberators 5x Judicators - Bows 5x Judicators - Bows 9x Longstrikes 3x Longstrikes 3x Hurricanes 3x Aetherwings 3x Aetherwings 3x Aetherwings Vanguard Justicar Conclave Comet 7 drops is pretty good for Stormcast, especially this heavy shooting. Could shift away from Anvils and split the Longstrikes to 2x6, but I like the capacity to absolutely ruin melee armies. Extremely light on bodies but should pump out enough ranged damage to nullify any threats. Alternatively: Anvils of the Heldenhammer Venator - Soulthief Incantor - General, Deathly Aura, Lightning Blast Incantor - Stormcaller Ordinator 5x Judicators - Bows 5x Judicators - Bows 5x Liberators 9x Longstrikes 3x Aetherwings 3x Aetherwings Ballista Ballista Ballista Ballista An absolutely barbaric amount of shooting, potentially enough to end friendships. Could instead drop a Ballista to get a Comet, but that's purely preferential. Again, if not Anvils, maybe break up the Longstrikes, but overall the amount of ouchies this puts out is pretty high. Both almost immediately lose to Sylvaneth who know how to block LOS well, or Idoneth who just ram 12+ Eels into your guts and remove your whole army. Both basically turbomurder any melee-only army that walks across the table. I feel like they could be great anti-Nagash spoiler armies, since Rend-2 shooting is the best way to deal with the big lug, but if you don't instagib him, the jig is pretty much up. I kinda want to take one of these to a 2-day that's happening this weekend but I'd have to speed paint a couple things.

Anything good to be made out of Snaga Rukk and/or Icebone? I find myself really liking the Boars and would be greatly amused if I could do an all-cavarly or at least mostly-cavalry army.

Good question. I've found the Heraldor invaluable since the 5" on Evocators is nothing special. Getting the occasional 11" movement turns them from a static counter-charge unit to a board-wide threat depending on where they are, but if you're just using them for an immobile counter-charge threat, then maybe you don't need it. It might depend on how many Wizards you have. I always say, I don't take an Endless Spell, especially one as expensive as Comet, without at least 2 Wizards to cast it. Though the Anvils list is quite defensive, there's always the chance that your one Incantor will get sniped, or want to cast a Realm Spell/Halo, and then the Comet languishes in disuse. But that's personal opinion, not necessarily a rule. Damage wise, the Comet will generally do more, and gives us a the capability to one-shot Morathi with lucky rolling. But the Heraldor is no slouch himself, especially if there's a large piece of terrain that can cover a big section of the board (or, you know, Sylvaneth), so it's fairly even. I'd test both and see what feels better.

No, Gav lists are considered among the best if not the strongest Stormcast lists for events. They're just not popular for other reasons, but if you want to play one then play it. Yes, you have to make the whole army Hammers, which means your General needs the trait (which is still not terrible) and the first Artifact will be the mediocre Hammers one.

Well, I can tell you from experience the extra CP has been fairly well worth the 50 points in most of my Anvilstrike games, and that I often wished I could have a good Artifact in addition to the crappy required one. Prosecutors are still a hard sell, sure, but they are pretty mobile for a Stormcast army and the Javelin ones bring a pretty solid shooting attack that can't be ignored. 20 Judis already outdamage Longstrikes on a point-by-point basis, but this just takes it to the logical extreme. Between 20 double tapping, exploding Judis and 9 shooting Prosecutors, you'll be doing the type of ranged damage output that will ruin friendships. I don't think it's strictly better or worse than my current build, but it's different and interesting for sure.

Hm, that's not a bad thought. It's double synergy with Anvils Judicators, making a pretty brutal shooting blob, and you can drop in 20 Judis alongside 3 Prosecutors no problem. Min battalion with a unit of 20 Judis is 1180, not bad for being 5 units, including 2 Battlelines. Not sure what to kit the rest of the force with, probably again a Relictor for teleporting shenanigans, maybe an Azyros for the rerolls. Perhaps you can do a heavier frontline? Arcanum (General, Ignax Scales, Azyrite Halo) Relictor (Translocation, Soulthief) Incantor (Azyrite Halo) 20x Sequitors 20x Judicators 5x Liberators 3x Prosecutors 3x Prosecutors 3x Prosecutors Vanguard Wing 2000/2000 You can start the Judis on the table and try to Translocate them into range T1, or you can start them off the board with some Prosecutors. 5 drops, not bad. Perhaps it might be better to go MSU. 6 man Prosecutor units with Greatweapons aren't half bad, since you can even drop in and reliably make that 3d6" charge. How does Vanguard Wing work with Shockbolt Bows? If the Shockbolt Bow rolls a 6 to hit, do each of the d6 hits deal 2 Wounds instead?

Getting Objectives as Stormcast is always a pickle since we're not particularly fast or numerous, and rarely both. Generally we get objectives by killing everything else that scores and winning with what we have left over. The above list in particular will punch a hole through the midfield between Breath Attacks, Judis, and the Comet. Remember, you don't need to hold every Objective, in general you only need to hold more than your opponent, so choosing one third or half of the battlefield to focus on generally will do the trick.

Yes, it's just as good as it's always been. Potentially better, with some of the shifts in Meta and item inclusions. Ignax's Scales make a "traditional" Stardrake list a bit hardier, since it has some defense against MWs, which was always his big weakness. Additionally, there's a build going around out there that looks like this: LC on Stardrake (Staunch, Smouldering Helm) Lord-Castellant Knight-Incantor (Azyrite Halo) Knight-Incantor (Azyrite Halo) Judicators x5 Judicators x5 Judicators x5 Fulminators x2 Fulminators x2 Everblaze Comet 2000/2000 Lots of ranged damage, much of it MWs. Cast Halo and Lantern on the Stardrake, and it'll do more MWs to an attacking unit with no rend than there were attacks against the Stardrake in the first place: -Each natural 6 is two MWs from Halo and Helm, three if it was a reroll -Each 4 or 5 to save is a MW from Helm, two if it was a reroll -Each 2 or 3 is a MW if it was a reroll So if a unit with no rend attacks a Helm/Halo Stardrake: 1/36 (2.7%) chance for 3 MW 2/9 (22.2%) chance for 2 MW 7/18 (38.9%) chance for 1 MW 1/3 (33.3%) chance for no save but no MW 1/36 (2.7%) chance to take a wound (remember to save any wounds from Lantern as well) So a unit of 40 Skeletons with Spears all getting to attack does 3 attacks per model 4+/4+/-/1. 30 saves rolled, on average the Stardrake takes .8 wounds and the Skeletons take back 27.5 MWs. Anything without Rend explodes. Anything with Rend -1 (or Rend 0 but the Stardrake charges) explodes a bit less but still explodes. Anything with Rend 2 or higher is a real threat, but hopefully you're chunking them down a bit before they get there. Of course, this version is way more susceptible to MWs, so watch out for that, but a lot of the game currently has to do with bricks of Chaff and the Stardrake will drop them with a laugh.