hellalugosi

With this release does anyone thing well see a rise of named characters to showcase the fluff of the game? Were already seeing things like brokk for kharadrons, so i welcome this, as long as we still get generic un named style champions.

What i'd really like to see is a warscroll for Ionus with the old sculpt, and a brand new kit for generic lord relictors, full of plenty deathy bits to customize it with. Excited to see the new warscrolls! I've been wanting this exact thing for a while!

Infinitely excited for this book! Ive got plague garden preordered and am ready to pull the trigger on this one when it hits the web store!

had a playtest night with my club for heroic play hinterlands, and it was a pretty wild night. My Stormcast took on Deathrattle and I've got a battle report below: On a side note, i just saw your post about adding a link to the frontpage, i'd love to!

i think people are missing out on the fact that campaigns start at are listed to start at around 25 renown. 50 - 100 is just sizing examples. I think 50 renown battles are going to be similar to what we've seen on stream, with a hero that essentially takes up all the points, and a small regiment to follow him. I assume 100 renown games will mostly feature more than one hero, and if most heroes will be 20+ its safe to say that the game still wont look too big.

As a fan of the khorne dominion battle mat, im really excited for the new mat, especially since its death centric! This skirmish release looks like its going to be a fun launch

I think the challenge a hero mechanic would make a great battleplan instead of a rule! That way you can go over the top with how it works. Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

@bottle I like how it is now and im very much behind making heroes equivalent to numerous weaker models. Making them full strength i think is just too overpowered. I think the missions should help reflect balance between few models vs many models as @Taffin mentioned. Im super excited for AOS skirmish and im definitely going to convert my content to match with it when it launches. However, until then, ive been super into Hinterlands. If you both haven't seen my thread Allegiances and More for Hinterlands i'm attempting to create a general's handbook of sorts, with seperate ways to approach hinterlands. Like i've mentioned before in the thread, i play a lot of pick up and play games, and my club forms a narrative on the spot, since many of us don't have the schedule to commit to a full campaign. I think carrying over the "three ways to play" motto would be a good idea for hinterlands. OPEN Multiplayer Freeform warband building More random additions to make each game different Simple battleplans for jumping into the game NARRATiVE Campaigns Thematic and Asymetrical Battleplans Structure as a guideline, and not a definitive MATCHED Balanced battleplans warband customization options matched structure battlefield roles like GHB

Yeah now that i think of it, these would be more exciting if they were in the hero phase, less status effects to keep track of as well. I'm working on a page for the seraphon right now, so ill put up the edits at the same time. I'm starting to think wounds = level is a easy compromise, as long as it goes hand in hand with a way of averaging out wounds, which is why i think a cap of 3 to start with would make the games more enjoyable. I'll put my suggestion for an alternative exp scale below. I'm definitely going to change the first one to it to within 6" haha! As for the Biggest Boss, ill have to play with it, but i think its okay as it requires a model kill first. And because we've taken away the destruction command trait for ironjaws specific ones, they have to work harder to get into combat. As stated above, i like your suggestion to make it 6", so ill make it that. I think personally it'd be easier to give a cap of advancements, reduce the injury chances, and make it so each battle you can only upgrade few models after the battle. Its more narrow, but its way less swingy, which is my problem now, where a player has a kurnoth hunter with like 6 wounds, 2 up hits, and 7 movement or something, but hes lost every battle objective wise. Here's my suggestions for a campaign overhaul. INJURIES 1 : Severe Injury (-d3 wounds, if lost all wounds, model is retired) 2-5 : Recovered 6 : Character Event (at which point the character gains an advancement and the player makes up a heroic story or nickname etc) Sure, its less detailed, but i think it will save warbands from getting completely destroyed by warbands with killy models, and being forced to remake a warband. ADVANCEMENTS I'm going to say it here first. I don't like experience per kills. I think its too one sided and avalanches easily. I propose that it be replaced with a simple advancement system. After each battle the winner will be granted D3 advancements, and the loser will receive 1 advancement. Keeping track of which models has which amount of kills and what it has killed has gotten cumbersome during the games unfortunately. The players are free to decide which of their models gains the advancement, relying on developing interesting stories to reason why the character got the advancement and whatnot. During the advancement phase, you will apply these advancements, rolling on the advancement table similar to the one already included in the packet. You can not advance a character more than once in this phase, so you can't stack all the level ups on one model per phase. This means you can gradually see your warband get powerful, as opposed to MASSIVELY STRONG or CRIPPLINGLY WEAK. Here is a table i would suggest we use 1 : Wound +1 2: Save +1 3: Move +1 4: Weapon Skill +1 (pick weapon, your choice which stat, from range/to hit/to wound) 5: Weapon Quality +1 (pick weapon, your choice which stat (apply or increase Rend/damage) 6: Your choice of advancement. Its simpler with a little more freedom, of course. I also would prefer that you can only upgrade a statistic of any kind once. So you'll only become slightly stronger than your baseline, and i think that'll be more balanced. LEVELS Each advancement means you've leveled up your model. You may only level up a model up to level 10. (which in turn means a model can only take advancements if they can go up a level) A model's starting level is their starting amount of wounds. Models with the HERO keyword always start at 5 as it is now, and any models with health higher than 3 wounds, start their wounds at 3. So from the get go, all models on the table at the beginning of a campaign have a fairly good chance of being slain. UNDERDOG VALUE So this might be random, but i'd suggest we just go off the total combined levels of every model in the warband. Im not sure if that would work well, but I want to try it! also while i'm working on all these battleplans and allegiance abilities and what not, i think i'm going to have to make a whole new thread so i can keep the content on the front page of that.

I've decided to undertake the difficult task of creating full allegiance pages for many of the factions starting with the Fyreslayers and the Ironjawz. Input on what you guys would like to see next would be helpful! Maybe i should pack all this content up as an expansion pack when I'm done? I'm definitely trying to keep the pages in line with simplicity such as (two command traits per allegiance), while still offering some fun new faction specific things. Here we have the fyreslayers, who can definitely benefit from movement buffs, as well as more things for the priests to do. I wanted to do something different for the ironjawz, and thought that hinterlands was a perfect place for the Warchanter to shine on his own. He gets a lore of "Rhythms" like i said, any suggestions for what people wanna see done? Edit: i already see some typos and things i need to clarify! i'll get those fixed soon

Honestly id love to just flat out consider a models health = to their starting level. Id also like it if a models health is just capped at 3 wounds to start, that way heroes and tough elites like kurnoths are just balanced. However i think the exp scale would have to be changed a bit to reflect this.

I've got two battleplans to try out! I'm trying to be as thematic as possible!

So while i'm still going to be testing the battleplan generator, i've cooked up a battleplan to try out this week with my club. Enjoy!

Ive been playtesting with Asymetrical battleplan generation, in line with me trying to make content for one off battles and am looking to try them out this weekend, heres what i have so far: DESTINED ENCOUNTER Set up: each player rolls 1d6. The result of these rolls will assign objectives to the player. In the future ill be adding allegiance specific choices so that a warband can decide to roll or choose the objective thats available to them. 1. Sacred artifact: place an objectice marker within 6 inches of the center of the board. When one of your models moves over this marker, you may pick it up and complete your movement. You drop this if you are slain. Place this within 3" of the slain model immediately. Starting from round 3, If you end your turn within 3" of the edge of the board, you win the battle. 2. Liberate: your opponent places an objective marker (or a model set on its side to represent a hostage!) in their territory, atleast 6" away from the edges of the board. Starting from round 3, At the end of any turn if you have a unit within 3" of the marker and no enemy models within 3", you win the battleplan. 3. For Glory: slay the enemy general while your general is within 6" of them. You immediately win the battle. 4. Raiding Party: roll a die for each friendly unit within 3" of a piece of terrain at the end of any of your turns. On a 4, that piece of terrain is removed from the battle. Once you have destroyed more than 50% of terrain, you win the battle. If both players get this objective, then set up one player as the defender, they win if by the end of 5 rounds, the raiding party has not completed the objective. 5. Conquest: set up a marker in the center of the board. If by the end of 5 rounds, you have more models within 6" than your opponent, you win the battle. 6. Caravan: place an objetive marker (try using a cavalry base or a mounted model or vehicle) within 3" of the edge of your side of table. Roll a dice for every friendly unit within 6" of this marker at the end of your turn. Pick at a maximum of 3 of these dice results and move the marker forward that many inches. If this marker is within 6" of your opponenrs board edge at the end of the turn, you win the battle. So there you have it, ill try to balance these when i play this weekend, any thoughts guys? Would Love some feedback.

Maybe just tweaking it to 50%? I feel like by then, the game has gone a good length?

I Definitely think the SWA routing system works really well. We could have it be roll at the beginning of turn just the same, 1d6 vs your leaders bravery, permanently adding 1 per friendly model lost in the entire game. Starting as soon as you lose more than 25% of the warband?

So @bottle i play a lot of pick and play non campaign games of hinterlands since i like trying out different groups of models all the time, and i think the addition of community created sub plots could help make those games as well as campaign games more engaging. So for example it would work like SWA, and you could roll off a chart, and find that one of your models must be deployed in the middle of the battlefield because they are lost, or theres a bounty on an enemy model and you can reroll failed hit and wounds against him but they do double damage etc. This helps make pick up games immediately start with a story alongside a battleplan. I also feel like these could be faction specific, any ideas guys?

Good quick fix, very clear now! Im also looking forward to more campaign and battleplan ideas. Has anyone thought about doing time of war rules specifically for hinterlands?

Okay so i thought of something.... What if we are looking at it the wrong way? What if we were to give more incentive to slay with regular attacks over mortal wounds? So hows this, what if a separate mechanic was introduced that made it so mortal wounds was instead KNOCKDOWN Wounds. So everything plays normally except if you are to take a mortal wound that would slay your model, your model does not take that wound but is KNOCKED DOWN. placing the model laying down, they are out of action until the owners next hero phase or battleshock phase of this turn or what have you, and effectively mortal wounds become utility that happens to deal damage, but it situationally worse or better than straight killing a model. Thoughts, @bottle?

I think abilities and spells that cause mortal wounds could simply be scaled, anything that causes d3 mortal wounds is treated as a single one, and anything d6 is treated as d3? The problem of multi target wounding like the lord celestant is still pretty bonkers though. Battleplan looks neat ill have to try it out!

So the remedy ive found for that is allowing players to take standardized icon bearers instead of the ones allowed on the warscroll. A generic 6" bubble of battleshock immunity could be the way to go. So if i had 6 clan rats, i could take one with the standard bubble that allows me to retreat and charge as well as a clan rat that can make everyone immune to battleshock, benefitting horde warbands for sticking together even more so. As for undead and demons, i think them being immune period is a thematic part of them. Id also recommend extending this to the musician models, granting the option to take a generic musician that add a basic bonus to run or charge? One more thing, id suggest is having a model automatically gain the leader/champion aspect of its warscroll if it is chosen as the leader of the warband.

Awesome! Cant wait to try out the new fixes! Also some feedback from my club day yesterday, we tried a battleshock variant, at the end of a turn that any model is slain in your warband, you take battleshock test for everyone in your warband, adding a flat +1 to your roll. This worked really well and kept the game tense as we wanted to tip toe around each other until we can most likely get a kill. We also played this as a phase that only activates when you have more than 25% of models slain. We also played with getting +1 save when running against shooting attacks. This also worked fantastic.

So now that SWA has come out, any things from the base ruleset and campaign ruleset you are interested in taking so far @bottle ? I think getting +1 to save when running is at least one thing i'd take, as well as rules for relationships between characters, such as rival! also, any news on a battleshock alternative that works so far? tomorrow I'm gonna be testing out a few mods to the ruleset and one thing i ran by my club is as soon as a model dies in the warband, at the end of that turn in the battleshock phase, roll a single dice for each model in the warband, if you roll below your bravery, you pass, anything higher will cause a removal of the model, dropping any objectives in the process. This makes it so heroes are virtually immune to fleeing, and as most models have bravery 6 or 5, its not hard to pass this test on a single die. any thought?

Well for my melanok idea, i'd have some of them travel in different ways. Wave runners have tentacled lower halves, traveling through mystic currents, Chimera's stand on humanoid legs, as they constantly shift and mutate to whatever suits their tactics. Your basic Melanok warrior slides through the ground with their fishy lower half through mystic waters too. I'm a big fan of Slardar from Dota 2, so that's where i'm grabbing a lot of inspiration from. Basically the way warcraft does it. The harvesters help them mutate lungs using aquatic life who are capable of doing so, and bonding them to the army. However, this changes from realm to realm, as maybe the requirements for what they breathe and how are different. For example, your basic ghur or ghyranite Melanok will breathe in water, but the Melanok of Chamon and aqshy are completely alien in those traits. The Melanok have been disturbed by the shifting of realmgates by mortals above. They are curious and thirst for new places to conquer as all they have known is the deep. Taking their newly meddled realmgates to the surfaces of the realms, they'll probably meet EVERYTHING with hostility before being added to sigmar's alliances, as they are by origin, made by remnants of the world that was.

I've always wanted a high fantasy army that is made up of a deep sea race. So heres my attempt at a new faction! Melanok Tide [my sketch up of a basic troop] The Melanok are the horrendous spawn of Mallus, shards of the world that was pierced the oceans deep across the mortal realms. From the dawn of Sigmar's arrival to the realms, hidden civilizations of monstrous creatures and vicious warriors thrive below the wars of chaos, connected by sunken celestial realmgates. As the wars come to an end, new realmgates realign with the old, and the Melanok arrive to the Mortal Realms in the name of conquest! So basically they're Celestially touched sea life, which evolved to develop kingdoms, as well as integrate with normal sea life through bonding mutations. I envision them seperated into 3 castes, which are non gender specific. Melanok Tide Lords Melanok Harvester - A shaman and tether to the particular shard of mallus the Tide belongs to, allowing them to channel mutations and bonds with sealife. Their role is advisor on field. Melanok Chimera - A master of combat and the largest of Melanok warrior class. These lords carry an entire army within their skin. They lead the charge and plan mission strategies. Melanok Lord of Mallus - The first Melanok to emerge from the abyss of a shattered mallus will always lead a kingdom. These Lords are noble kings and queens who have lived for centuries, becoming vessels for celestial power. Whatever the lord wills, the Tide enforces. Melanok Leviathan Lords Melanok under this title are worshiped as the carriers of life. They are massive Melanok who carry the spawn kin of the Tide Lords, Ensuring that more warrior class can be raised in the spread for the mortal realms. Leviathan lords are potent seige units, giving them a reputation as symbols of life, and death. Melanok Warriors Melanok Tide Warriors - These Melanok come from all walks of deep sea life, taking arms when the kingdom needs it to be so. Even the common class can stand eye to eye with the average stormcast. They can be bonded with lesser sea creatures for added abilities in the unit. Melanok Wave Runners - Wave Runners are the predators you never see coming. They assail their targets using portals of mystical water, the act of which gives them their name. They are armed with lascerator hooks that can pull enemies out of position. Melanok Mallus Bound - Very few Melanok have the honor of becoming a Mallus Bound. Exceptional Melanok soldiers may be bestowed weapons and armor forged with shards of Mallus, knights of the kingdom, chosen of the king or queen. These warriors tend to rely on mutating their enemies rather than mutating themselves. hope that was enjoyable!