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Btimmy

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    Is Death the WORST faction in AoS?

    in Death

    Posted

    1 hour ago, Saxon said:

    PE are not a fun match up for a lot of armies. A lot of commentary is that they just weren't fun to play against. I certainly didn't enjoy a game against OBR. The OBR player knew what you had to do to avoid their cheese and it was wash rinse and repeat for most games against them. Yawn, 

    Balancing the game for "fun match-up" is an impossibility. I certainly don't have fun playing against the all bow kurnoth hunter list that my friend plays often but that doesn't make it overpowered or needed to be changed. Furthermore, the change to PE has not changed literally anything about the way OBR is played. If your army struggled against them before, it will still struggle against them if you try to run up and smash. 

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    Is Death the WORST faction in AoS?

    in Death

    Posted

    People who think PE was broken are people who couldn't think of any other strategy than "run up with my dudes and try to smash." PE lists, same as all OBR lists were extremely vulnerable to shooting, mortals, and out of combat fighting, which the other top lists have in droves. Couple this weakness with OBR's complete lack of offensive spell casting and mortal wound output and the only thing allowing them to play with the top tables was their rock solid defense. They have no tricks, limited mobility, and an extremely simple game plan. PE was a legion that buffed both their offensive and defensive powers. Without it, OBR is pillow fisted and still vulnerable to all of the weaknesses it had before. Furthermore, the PE nerf is going to only hurt OBR list diversity. Katakros and Mortis Praetorians is going to be the list going forward. Gone are the varied days of Nagash being playable. 

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    Is Death the WORST faction in AoS?

    in Death

    Posted

    Nice video! I think destruction is actually the worse at the moment. Both FEC and OBR can get wins at a competitive level, whereas the most competitive army for destruction are Mawtribes (BCR) or Ironjaws. Both of these armies aren't very strong. 

    • Like 1
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    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    47 minutes ago, Tropical Ghost General said:

    Best bravery based element is our command trait Terrifying Entity. Super OP cheese feast. I banned myself from ever using it after just one game because of how effective it was and the negative play experience it created for my opponent. 

    (please note that the above comment is sarcasm) 

    I had to go read what it does because I've literally never seen anyone play with or against this trait. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    7 hours ago, Thamalys said:

    I beg to differ.  A number of shooting and even melee attacks (thus tacking place in the shooting and fight phase, respectively), including the mechanism proposed above by @Bayul, do involve the bravery characteristic and their effect are resolved during either the shooting or fight phases. Thus, I think it's quite incorrect to state that bravery is only relevant during battleshock.

    Having said that, there's no need to look at FEC's Crypt Flayers - our very own Tomb Banshee has the Ghostly Howl which is very much equivalent to the Death Scream discussed above. Personally, though, I don't consider mechanics relying on bravery to be efficient at all - too many factions with bravery ten or so around, and the effort of lowering that baseline to interesting values it's just too much of an investment in terms of points.

    Grand total of I believe exactly 2 bravery based attacks in the entire NH army isn't a great basis for arguing that bravery is relevant other than the BS phase. That combined with the Harridans -1 to hit if less than 6 wraps up the entirety of all non-BS phase based bravery effects that NH has, but I could be missing some. Point being, overwhelmingly bravery is used only for BS phase, and BS phase is overwhelmingly ignored. 

    • Like 1

    New player trying to decide on 1st army (Ossiarch Bonereapers questions)

    in Death

    Posted

    3 hours ago, NeoSoul said:

    Hello!

    (Disclaimer):
    I couldn't find a faction specific section so I'm asking these questions in the appropriate Grand Alliance forums.  I want to get into AOS and I'm having a hard time deciding on which army to go with as many of them look unique and cool.  I watched a long video that roughly went over every faction but it was slightly outdated (not all of the 2nd edition tomes were out yet back then).  The look of the army is my most important criteria as I love to collect miniatures and want to be motivated to paint them.  However, I still want to play the game, I like strategy games and RTS (I normally do well at them) so since I'm having a hard time deciding based off looks, I'm trying to learn a bit more about the different play styles.  I'm not usually a big fan of cookie cutter builds and metas in games, I know it can change a lot but I'm trying not to totally ignore people's comments about some factions severely underperforming as I'd still probably like to be able to win games once in a while once I get decent at it.  The factions that I'm hesitating most between right now are Orruk Warclans, Slaves to Darkness, Maggotkin of Nurgle and Ossiarch Bonereapers.

    This one post is about Ossiarch Bonereapers.  Here are some pros and cons I'd see with them so far:

    Pros:

    - There are some models that I like more than others but in general, unlike any other faction, I think that I like every single Ossiarch Bonereapers models as they're all new models, very nice and detailed.

    - Tier lists and people seem to be saying that this faction is very solid for competitive play.

    - The units are supposed to be very tanky.

    - Elite units means that I can have fewer cooler models instead of spending countless hours painting small units that I don't like as much (in theory).

    - Cool and unique aesthetics that I haven't seen in other games.

    - Nagash looks amazing and fun to play with.

    - Bones and armor might be easier to paint with basic techniques such as wash/dry brush for someone like me who is a novice painter (I can do an ok job but nothing spectacular and painting faces might be difficult for me).

    Cons:

    - They're supposed to be super slow.

    - Most of the lists I looked at seem to be spamming almost nothing but a ton of Mortek Guards which is a shame because they're alright looking for infantry but they're probably my least favorite in the faction and it means I couldn't use all of the other cooler models that I'd want (Morghast Archai/Harbingers, Necropolis Stalkers, harversters and Deathriders).

    - There is no Start to Collect box and apparently many of the other local players are new and only using their specific starter box as an army.  This means that I have no idea what I should buy to get started with OB and have a similar amount of points to play with those people.  It also means that I guess getting into OB would cost me quite a bit more money.

    - No large really cool looking beast (like Archaon, Megaboss on Maw-krusha, etc.), it would be very cool to have some sort of large bone armored dracolich.  I guess Nagash is pretty large though and replaces that option.

     

    So here are my questions:

    1- Is Mortek Guards spam almost necessary (and making it so the other models can't really be used)?

    2- If I have to buy everything new, is it much more expensive to start with OB since they don't have a Start to Collect box?

    3- What should I look into buying first to match the Start to Collect box of other factions in terms of army points?

    4- What makes Ossiarch Bonereapers fun and unique to play with in terms of game play and mechanics?  Do they have something that they're very good at?

    5- Any other specific useful information you think I should know about them that could make me interested in them over an other faction?

    To provide some context to my responses, OBR is my main army and I've won a tournament or two with them. In response to your questions:

    1. It depends on how competitive you want to be. Battleline-wise mortek guard are far far better than the deathriders, and thus no matter what the guard will be the core of every OBR army. If you were looking to avoid being very horde-y or wanting to be super elite, OBR isn't really a great fit for that competitively. Blocks of guard are on the same base size as normal skeletons (25 mm) and you will almost always be running at least 60 of them. 

    2. Yes, OBR is a more expensive army to start pursuing. It is a newer army with no start collecting or deals. The Feast of bones box features very little actually competitively desirable units (just 10 of the guard, the stalkers are of dubious competitive quality). You might be able to find some deals secondhand after people start jumping ship now that OBR is far less competitive following the Petrifix Elite change. 

    3.  As mentioned previous, the guard are the backbone of your army, so you want at least a few boxes of those. Mounted hero is essentially a necessity/ You can skip the soul reaper, but both the soul mender and the soul mason is solid. Katakros is great and is likely the most competitive option now. Arkan is also an okayish pick. 

    4. With PE, OBR was a wall that melee armies charged into and bounced off of. Now the fantasy for OBR is slightly diluted. They can still be tanky with the ability to re roll saves. Their fantasy is probably capsulated best as a grindy, "elite" army. 

    5. I would just caution you about buying into people who say that OBR is still a top army after the recent FAQ changes. Petrifix elite was the only thing that allowed an army with no tricks, teleports, or strong offensive output play with the top tables. That is now gone, so the new OBR top list is Mortis Praetorians,  Katakros, and a bunch of catapults. 

    • Like 1

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    My counter argument to this is that lower bravery units should be punishable by armies that exploit it. Being able to ignore a weakness of a unit with a surplus of command points (like most armies have) continues the trend of making the BS phase essentially irrelevant. Furthermore, the ability requires that NH units be within a certain range, if we try to engage in combat, Troggoths will just murder all the ghosts, and thus they won't be affected. 

    • Like 2

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    You only speed up cogs when you are going to go for your big deepstrike drops, other times you just slow down time to give Riekenor an extra spell to cast. I think increasing the consistency of making a 9" charge is essential, otherwise your deepstrikes are not threatening at all as you will statistically not get them in when you drop them, leaving you to hope for a double or for them to just engage your weak units (referring to all of NH, we don't exactly have powerhouse units).

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    I agree with @Tropical Ghost General. I find that a strong majority of my wins comes from TPing the DB harrow for free, then CP'ing a unit of like 40 chain rasps into the enemies backline is usually enough to steal a point. Bonus points for using cogs and making the 9 inch charge only a 7 inch one with a reroll available if necessary. 

    AoS 2 - Grand Host of Nagash Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    Yeah I just asked this question so I know the answer! You cannot. You can only place a model within 3 inches of an enemy unit if the unit that the model is being returned to is already within 3 inches of that same enemy unit. There is text in the night haunt tome with this ruling. 

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