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And now, Death Star explained! It's in the Writs of the Mortarch section. At 35 pages, over 20,000 words, it would be really nice to be able to incorporate pages, headers, content links, or something...

Updated my guide with the FAQ updates. Not much changed so I'll list them here. No more question on if KC's enhanced Deathless Spirits also applies to mortal wounds (it does). No more question on if Lady Olynder gets a free use of her CA in Emerald Host (she does not as she cannot take a Command Trait). No more question on if the Warscroll Battalions Chainguard and The Condemned stack with the Procession: Reikenor's Condemned (the possibility doesn't exist in matched play, do what you want in casual). Mourngul now debuffs all units within 6". I'll add a more detailed look into the Deathstar or Castle tactic soon.

To quote an Englishman: "This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move." There's already talk that this was likely a misprint--reading like two questions got rolled into one and only answered the second one--and TOs might not allow it. Many tournament players have also said they won't be taking advantage of it. A few have called it bad sportsmanship if anyone does. And though I can't cite it and it therefore might be conjecture or a straight lie, I read that Sam Pearson said this was going to be submitted for a rush fix. Give the Cities thread a look and you can see how runaway this can get if you play someone who decides to use stacking. For an army like us, though, it can protect a key hero from range sniping a bit, but only one and not that much if they are being hard-targeted. I think we kind of missed the train on this one.

Makes list building a lot easier, too. I got my Halloween present with this FAQ.

Didn't realize it was in the Legends section. I blame my bleary eyes at the time. Ah well. They also didn't touch on our Processions from Be'lakor.

Balewind Vortex got an update, too. But I didn't see any points for it in my quick look this morning. If we can use it the changes to it are pretty nice, except that Reikenor (or any other unique) can't use it..

No pointers or real feedback. Just that I've found my best success completely abandoning our old 2.0 ways and trying completely new setups.

Updated my guide with Sotek's list in the sample list section and our podcast with him in the section just after.

The "buddy" method makes the whole thing easier. Our parents were always right, hold hands when crossing the street! And thanks for the sentiment, but it isn't just me. Capn' and Sotek got it all started, and it's all of us who play and love this faction that are championing it. Me? I just don't shut up around here

Hey Coach, long time listener, first time caller! Welcome to our thread! Glad to see you talking Nighthaunt, and Sotek was a great choice this time around. Just finished talking with him myself and he was a delight to have. We're not professional (my first time recording anything like this at all), and I mumbled, fumbled, and stuttered, so I can only imagine what it's like juggling rules, warscrolls, topic points, and keeping the conversation going all for a faction you might not be super familiar with. Hats off to you, sir. Your video is very relevant, and it was pretty much the subtopic of our talk. We pretty much just expanded on what he started in your video. Hope you give it a listen.

Same. Which is why I reduced them to 1 unit in my escalation league list for now.

I've been assigning 3 out of my 10 to be "cohesion buddies." All they do is make sure all hands are being held properly. I'm not too put off by it since my opponent has to do the same. We both view it as, yes 7 out of 10 will attack at a given time, but once you lose 5 suddenly 3 more enter the fray. Kind of like a second wind as the unit dies down. This gives the distances some play. So if my line needs to wrap around an enemy unit or a large base, I can shift a few millimeters and still have coherency. And, as I take models away, the "buddies" in the back can use their 3" pile in to fill gaps to keep the lines overlapping. This doesn't apply to Reapers, of course. They stay in two ranks, even while wrapping around a target.

Escalation League: 1250 points 3 games down, 3 wins. Okay, now I'm getting suspicious... To refresh the rules of the league, each game is an increment of 250 points. So for three games it's 750, 1000, and 1250 so far. Next game will be 1500. We have an odd number of players, so the winner of the first game becomes the champion to defeat in the next game. After each game we get to add our new point limit to our lists and make minor changes, but we have to keep the core of our lists the same, so no more than two units can be removed at a time, but there's nothing holding you back on additions. My 1250 point list: Compared to the last round, I dropped a unit of Reapers and picked up a reinforced unit of Chainraps and a unit of Chainghasts, and two Endless Spells. I also changed artifact holders and spells, made necessary by adding the Procession: Reikenor's Condemned. Lastly the Grand Strategy was updated to Prized Sorcery. My opponent was either going to be a classic (before Dominion) Stormcast list or a Living Cities list, so I wanted to start building for inevitable monsters and elites on the field, while also being prepared for horde units. I thought I would be able to hit hordes extra hard with Gravetide, but that didn't work out so well. I ended up pitted against the Living City staring down the barrel of a Spirit of Durthu, a Treelord Ancient, and a bunch of swords and boards and a couple units of ranged. Takeaways from this game: Looking forward: At 1500 points things change. Hero limit goes up to 4. Reinforcement limit is now 3. The board is now 44x60. Everything gets just a bit bigger. I might use the extra hero slot for a second ST to pal around with the Harridans and drop the Chainghasts, Captured Soul Energy just too stronk. Chainrasps get reinforced again for sure. If I drop the Terminexus I can bring the Black Coach. Or, if I keep the Terminexus I could also bring the Vault of Souls and keep the Chainghasts or slot in Myrmourn Banshees, instead. Or, I could drop both Endless Spells and add a Spirit Torment and a Spirit Host unit reinforced once. If I did that I'd switch the General over to him to back up those 3-wound bases with RotSH. What do you guys think?

I'm down. I love the idea.

If Coach chose Sotek to talk about Nighthaunt, I think it was because he's been a solid player and knows the faction. I'll second that his list and playstyle are very unorthodox for us, but I also say that I've never gone up against the meta that he mentioned. I plan on using his list/tactic in the future to see how it feels. I will also put a slight criticism on Sotek in that I have never seen a competitive-level player play NH and get the names of the abilities right. Just my pettiness here, but they get other armies right, but for us it's always "that one that does X" or "uh, uh, uh...yeah, that." Not a criticism of Sotek himself, just in general. Similarly, his excitement and love of KC and his ward save was killed on camera, not by Coach, but by the comments. This makes me believe that Sotek has played the KC at competitive-level events already and no one challenged it. He had such a completeness of what the shooting, combined with buffs of the other heroes, can do to various opponent types that I think he's ran this list or a similar one with a KC in it a lot, and other similarly competitive players accepted the KC saving both mortals and normals on a 5+. Even Coach was a little hand-wavy, saying that he's heard the comparison to DoK a lot, but he didn't think it was the same argument and a FAQ is needed, but stopped just short of saying that it didn't matter, hinting that at that level it's accepted. I am very happy to hear Sotek talk about a fighting tactic that wasn't Hammer and Anvil. The "deathstar" he talked about he goes into a bit more detail toward the end of the video is a main force in front in a semi-circle, all heroes in the center, with a secondary force on the table. He mentions the Pendant of Fell Winds for speed of the main pack and the mobility of Underworlds for the roaming force. This means he uses the Pincer tactic without a diversionary force. Or, rather, the diversionary force is the pack of heroes in the center which should all be targeted but any one is only partially important to the whole. I love this and is the main reason I want to try this list. I want to see my opponent try to work out the math on what's the better tactical kill and if I can punish them for any choice. But, he didn't get into how the fighting actually works. Chainrasps can attack over themselves, k. Reapers can attack over the 'rasps. But Kurdoss? Does the star open an edge for him? Does he charge over top? Does he try to swing over the 'rasps, too? He mentions that he's mostly there for his newly enhanced CP-steal, but also loves his damage. How does he leverage it? The only comment I'll make about Sotek's enthusiasm is that I love to see it. That's some joy right there. It's sad the comments tried to kill it, or he took it that way, but it's a genuine appreciation for the game and the faction, which we need. Over the top sometimes? Yeah. Overly critical of some design elements? We're guilty of that, too. Honestly, I'd love to spend two hours talking about it all with him, myself.

Let's discuss it. What made you scratch your head?

They are a unit of 2, so they have to follow the same unit consistency rules any other unit does, which is staying within 1" horizontally and 6" vertically of each other.

Presented without comment

Looks like a fun list!

Negative modifiers Go ahead and stack them, still. Yes, the maximum they can ever be is a +1 or -1 to Hit or Wound, or +1 to Save, stacks still matter. If her opponent can stack multiple +1s to negate a -1 you put out, you can engage in that arms race and try to stack more -1s. Basically, whoever wins gets the 1 in their favor. Bravery Shenanigans -1 for being within 6" of Nighthaunt Terrifying Entity: Command Trait that pushes enemies away if they are within 3" of the general and they roll higher than their own Bravery, which counts the negatives you brought Reaper of Sorrows: Weapon - Roll 2d6 before attacking and if the result is higher than target Bravery (after modifiers) Rend turns into -3 Mirror of Screaming Souls: Relic - In the shooting phase, shoot an enemy 8" away if you roll 2d6 and roll higher than their Bravery for 1 mortal wound. Harder to pull off at 8" because our -Bravery abilities function at 6" or closer. Wail of the Damned: Olynder's shooting ability. Same as above except 10" range, affects ALL enemy units within range, and D3 wounds. Tomb Banshee: Ghostly Howl - Shooting ability that targets an enemy within 10", rolls 2d6, and if the result his higher than their Bravery does damage based on the difference of the roll and that Bravery New Dreadscythe Harridans ability: Harrowing Shriek - -1 to Hit rolls for every enemy model that is within 3" of the Harridan unit and has a Bravery of 7 or lower, after modifications. Endless Spell: Horrorghast - Units wholly within 12" of this cannot receive any Battleshock command abilities, and if they fail battleshock D3 more models flee Yeah, our Bravery shenanigans have been nerfed, but so has a few other armies. We can do some things with it, but probably not at a competitive level Broken Realms Be'lakor Dreadscythe Harridans got a new warscroll The Slasher Crone, the 4-armed model, can not appear 1 for every 5 models The Crone is a leader, so can issue Command Abilities to their own unit The -1 debuff now works on Bravery 7 and lower Instead of a 6 on a Wound roll, a 6 on a Hit roll doubles the hit YES they are worth taking. Probably the most worth unit to bring behind Reapers. Krulghast Cruciator Brand new hero Two new subfactions called Processions These are abilities in addition, but you can opt not to take either and be vanilla The Emerald Host - Buffs Hexwraiths, shares wounds with whoever your general is, and permanently debuffs an enemy hero, but takes away the Command Trait and forces an artefact on your first capable hero - both geared toward a Knight of Shrouds, but you don't have to take one as your general. Olynder is a popular choice. Reikenor's Condemned - Buffs Chainrasps and Glaivewraiths. Also forces an artefact, but you can keep your Command Trait. You are going to either get the Be'lakor book or find an image somewhere. There are guides out there, like mine, that can give you more details Myrmourn Banshees Yep. Min 4, max 8, no more 12s possible. Not sure if worth the points for the utility Gameplay Games are going to get into combat much faster now. But, with everyone across the board going through the same point hikes and unit size reductions, the army sizes are smaller, games are faster, and in general things feel way more balanced. We're always going to be a points-hunting army. A new book, the mythical magical thing that it is, may change that for us in the future, but we're going to always want to focus on gaining as many points as possible. This is in our favor with Battle Tactics which can be surprisingly easily attainable for us This is NOT in our favor with anything to do with Monsters, as we only have one, it's super expensive, and just doesn't hold a candle to the other monsters out there Everyone has more Command Points. Plan on going second on purpose and get at least 1 more. Use that to teleport if you want, but I found that using them for All-out Attack, Knight of Shrouds (either one) buffs, the max run command or the re-roll charge commands to be more useful. From the Underworlds should be enough trickery, but if you need more you can jump around with a Dreadblade. I figure that won't be common anymore. And lastly, don't let the non-female models deter her from expanding her lists. After all, in this army, Lady Olynder rules supreme. And after that the rest are all ghosts, they could have all been female ghosts in her own army. Paint/mold them as desired and declare it an all-female army. I'd love to see that.

Just finished two more games of my escalation league series. These were up to 1,000 points. Here's my list. (We'll see if Battlescribe export works...) I played against Cities of Sigmar and Stormcast again, and I won both games. Some more takeaways: Going for the one-drop might just be overrated. I opted for the second artefact and command point battalion and the option to take on monsters I happen to face any. The artefact (Midnight Tome) was worth it's weight in gold. Just being able to cast a second spell and get another unbind this early in our league prevented so much potential damage it likely won me both games. Going second on purpose meant I had that planned, which meant I deployed and played accordingly. Harridans are amazing. I was rolling hot today, so I got a fair amount of exploding 6s. But, more than that, the Bravery threshold of 7 is so strong at shutting down incoming damage. Dracolions and other big baddies still did a ton of damage, but never a team wipe. Even when attacked by multiple units they stuck around and became the hands-down damage dealers in both games. They were also voted the most hated unit by both opponents. I still think Ruler of the Spirit Hosts is too valuable to lose. Especially at these unit sizes. 1-3 models is now a third of a unit. Speaking of which, Captured Soul Energy is still the MVP ability. Again, 1-3 models, another time. At these sizes... Krulghast Cruciator is seriously underrated. In an army with nearly no ranged a reliable 3+/3+ set of attacks was worth bringing him alone. Chip damage, sure, but it all adds up now. All scales are smaller, including wound pools, so that 1 or 2 he can bring out, at range, can cause pause. Plus the ward save (my opponents both ruled it all wounds at 5+, but never had to shrug mortals with it) helped in the mitigation game. Which leads me to my last takeaway: We're still not an army that should play at attrition, but it's not so stark anymore. As long as you keep pressure up I'm starting to think it's okay to put a lot of resources into bringing models back. This might change by the time I'm at 2k, but at this level each returned model was almost equal to about one wound dealt later, and that's huge. Next set of games will be 1250 points. What do I add? 20 Chainrasps and Emerald Lifeswarm? Black Coach? I'm open to suggestions.

After nearly 400 games Nighthaunt placed 23rd (with @Ellarr), 30th, and 40th out of 71 reported finishes at the Mancunian Challenge event. Squarely the middle of the pack! That's actually a very good thing! Hey @Ellarr, what was the list you ran and how was your experience?

I'm going to go with my general advice for both of you guys. I don't think we're an hammer-and-anvil style army. We want as many roaming threat units as possible. So you'll get more for your investment with units that can perform multiple roles: Reapers, Harridans, Spirit Hosts. Fill out whatever you don't already have.

Is there specific advice you're looking for?

The Mourngul might be officially retired soon if the rumors are true. Having a brand new, fully flavored in-theme monster ghost(s) would be amazing, and a good reason to hype a new book. I can only imagine what they'd be like. A shooting one would be a fever dream made real. But I'd never want the Black Coach to be one. There's too many armies and abilities out there that benefit when targeting monsters that without some sort of buff it would trivialize the Coach out of all usefulness. In the very least a hero keyword and accompanying ward save.