XReN
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Posts posted by XReN
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17 minutes ago, Nymzee said:
I wasn’t sure if I’d necessarily the best thread but I wanted to ask people a FEC lore question. Please direct me elsewhere if there is a lore thread on here.
Basically, as I understand it the FEC are all completely delusional and see themselves as how we’d generalise a medieval kingdom with castles, a king, court feasts, servants, knights on horses etc. but is actually the polar opposite in reality. Now my questions are:
- If this is true and they do believe in their own delusion why then do the characters have names such as King Goretalon etc.? Surely they would simply have human names?
- If they do believe in their delusion how do they fight side-by-side at times with Nagash’s armies or do they see them under delusion as well? It isn’t clear at what point of Nagash’s reign the Carrion King served prior to his transformation.
- If they do believe in their delusion how then are they able to raise dragons from the dead etc.? What could they see this as through their delusion?
You better read through the battletome, but here is some knowledge:
They think that names like Goretalon are normal human names
There are courts that follow Nagash and there are courts who flee from him and they all see him differently. Also Nagash himself can control FEC in his presence through the Abhorrants, unlike Ghouls they are proper undead and therefore belong to Arch Necromancer. And they see literaly everything and everyone delusionaly, they can see their allies as noble knights even if it's actually madened tourtured souls of Nighthaunts and they can see Stormcast as vile abbominations that came to destroy their kingdom.
They think they tame the beast, whille actually they just ressurect one with help of Shyishian magic, to make this absolutely clear: they can see anything as anything else, they don't see themselves as nobles performing necromantic ritual over half-eaten rotten body of a dragon or what not, they see themselves as nobles training their gryphon.
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8 minutes ago, Fundre said:
I don't know if this has been asked but can you take stormcast allies in your cities lists if you wanted to take more SC than the 1/4 allowed?
Cities can't ally with SCE, so no. You can take SCE only per "Stormkeeps" battle trait as part of the City
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Just now, Fundre said:
So it's one drop but allows an additional unit in the sky? Sorry for being daft here...
Yep
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54 minutes ago, Fundre said:
Can anyone tell me if the gryph hound that you get to set up with the castellant counts as a unit deployed for scions of the storm? Like, does the gryph hound allow one more unit to stay in reserve in the heavens in addition to the castellant? And does it count as a "drop" for deployment?
It does count as "a unit on the table", it goes in the same "drop" as Lord Castellant/Veritant
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9 minutes ago, Raffonerd said:
clearly it wont work. Try this against sylvaneth and you will see.
I don't think it's that easy to counter with Sylvaneth, the amount of woods they can set up is limited by terrain set-up and deployment, they will also have to take 1st turn to protect themselves therefor making it possible for shootcast double turn, with THAT many birds they also won't be able to touch Shootcast in melee for a whille, at the same time multiple reserve deployments would mess with Sylvaneth's ability to place new woods even more.
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Just now, Televiper11 said:
Thanks for the clarification!
Unless you meant warscroll realm spells and I'm just a dummy.
In that case you get to know Arcane Bolt, Mystic Shield, 1 spell from warscroll and 1 from City Lore
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3 minutes ago, Televiper11 said:
Quick question that may have been answered elsewhere already (if so, apologies):
Is it correct that Battlemages in any city configuration can take two spells automatically? Their city spell and a realm spell?
No, realm spells are used only when you use realm magic rules from malign sorcery, don't confuse the ability to use them with realm an army hails from.
IF you use mentioned rules than all your mages know all realm spells for the duration of the battle
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1 hour ago, Hanneskannes said:
I googeled "Hammerhalian Lancers" and found a Picture using a flock of griphon hounds in excange for the last 3 demigryphs knights. Do u Think it can work? Are they even available in CoS? It looks fun and they are fast to paint.
They are available, but author just used them for theme and good picture, you can't take them instead of proper Demis in battalion, just to be clear.
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By pure stats - Hydra is better, more damage, shooting attack, unconditional wound regen, better move and better damage chart makes it a superior choice over Kharibdyss
However, Kharibdyss has two pros that need to be mentioned: if it's healing procs - it will work before opponent can deal it any more damage and it can proc every turn instead of Hydra's every battleround, that can make a difference between life and death and is also nice to have with Acidic Blood Curse, so it will tank damage and dish out MW longer. And it also has the -1 bravery aura that synergises well with Drakeblood Curse that gives another bravery debuff.
What I would do is this: take both types of monsters and choose a 2nd Curse as Illicit Dealing - give Felgaze to Hydra (so you give your opponent a combined -3 penalty to bravery distributed between 2 monsters) and Acidic Blood to Kharibdis because it has the chance to stay alive longer.
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13 hours ago, Furythrow2 said:
If people have decided that gunline armies are no fun then maybe the ranger command trait offers a bit of fun with run and shoot? At that point you have steam tanks moving 3d6 per turn and still shooting. Alternatively pretend those volley guns little gun wagons, try and rush up the board and double tap with the battalion. If you're really scraping the barrel use it with the general on griffon ( with +1 save) and give those pistoliers run and shoot.
If I manage to slap together enough units untill this Saturday I'll run this Command Trait in Meeting Engagements list, so my Rearguard (consisting of Cogsmith, 10 Freeguild Guards and 2 Volleyguns) can get into position faster. The copters would also benefit from this trait to make long bombing runs and still shoot their guns.
And gunlines are fun when they can actually push onto objectives fast enough to also win the game
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1 minute ago, Indecisive said:
Now that the release isn't so far off, what are your must gets and will skips?
Like, top 3 models you wanna buy and the 3 you're almost guaranteed to walk past.I'll buy everything. But will start with a battletome and Mortarch
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7 minutes ago, Gdead909 said:
So I apologize because I am sure you get this all the time but this thread is massive, so where do you start with SCE? There are so many lots out there for purchase.
is there more then one book? Any help would be appreciated guys.
There is only one book, you either buy whatever you like or check out Anvistrike list (there was a link a page or 2 back), any way you pick you need to learn the rules and play some games to get you going.
The better units in our book are:
Lord Castellant
Lord Relictor or Lord Veritant (they share some functions)
Knight Incantor
Knight Azyros
Vanguard Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows
Aetherwings (when used with Vanguard Raptors)
Evocators on foot (called just "Evocators")
Sequitors
Dracothian Guard (4 types of dudes riding wingless dragon things that come in pairs)Knights Heraldor and Vexilor, as well as some named characters are usefull in some lists
Liberators and Judicators are a decent choice for battleline requirements-
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1 hour ago, Double Misfire said:
I want to love Greywater Fastness's rules, I really do, but the strict focus on static, long ranged shooting, and not Steam Tanks or Gyrocopters is making me seriously look at keeping my army in Tempest's Eye (where they landed up when Firestorm came out on account of GWF being the only city to not use Dispossessed, I even painted up a Tempest Lods Lord-Ordinator), or rebranding them as Spell Hunters using Hallowheart's rules.
Gunline armies are horrible to play against, and if Realmscape features are in play run the risk of being a guaranteed loss. It would have been nice if GWF's allegiance abilities and battalion could have done more for the non static Ironweld units (which are arguably better under other cities), giving at least the option to non gunline without feeling sub-optimal. Granted, part of me's keen to go all in on a full Artillery Company battalion + Ordinator for almost half my points, take off almost half my opponent's army in the first turn and then play a vastly quicker game.
Small glimmers of hope I've come up with trying to craft non gunline GWF lists (with little success):
- Three stacking -1 to hit spells with Descending Ash Cloud + a Sorceress and Hyish Battlemage. Possibly throw in a Nomad Prince too.
- 11" Gyrocopter steam cannons, potentially with +1 to hit on a unit of 3 via a Runelord.
- Drillmaster on non stationary missile units like Sisters of the Thorn and Shadow Warriors (though the Tempest's Eye trait Hawk-eyed) arguably does this but better).
- Steam-piston Plate Mail for a 2+ save big monster (Hammerhal can also do this...)
If I've missed anything, please let me know. I'm as keen to shake some use out of GWF as @XReN is.
After a lot of bashing my head against the wall I came up with this list
SpoilerAllegiance: Cities of Sigmar
Leaders
Cogsmith (60)
- Artefact: Mastro Vivetti's Maginificent Macroscope
- City Role: General's Adjutant (Must be 6 wounds or less)
Freeguild General (100)
Celestial Hurricanum With Celestial Battlemage (280)
- Artefact: Steam-piston Plate Mail
- Spell: Lore of Smog - Descending Ash Cloud (Greywater Fastness Wizard)
Battlemage (90)
- Spell: Lore of Smog - Choking Fumes (Greywater Fastness Wizard)
- Mortal Realm: Hysh
Battlemage (90)
- Spell: Lore of Smog - Choking Fumes (Greywater Fastness Wizard)
- Mortal Realm: Chamon
Lord-Ordinator (140)
- General
- Trait: Drillmaster
Battleline
30 x Freeguild Handgunners (300)
- City Role: Honoured Retinue (Must be 5-20 models)
20 x Freeguild Guard (160)
- Halberds and Shields
20 x Freeguild Guard (160)
- Halberds and Shields
War Machines
Helblaster Volley Gun (120)
Helblaster Volley Gun (120)
Helstorm Rocket Battery (130)
Helstorm Rocket Battery (130)
Battalions
Greywater Artillery Company (120)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 134
That is pretty generic "Everyone loves Celestial Hurricanum list"
Compliments arty by making it a 2+ to hit when within aura of both the Lordinator and Hurricanum, good GWS spells by buffing battlemages that are honestly just too good not to take (Hi Hollowheart) and together with City's CA (the only scenario it's actually good at) it makes Handgunners 2+ to hit even when they move and when they don't - it negates any -1 to hit.Sadly no tanks, no copters (btw the stupid wording on steam guns don't allow them to benefit from battle trait), you just pray that your firepower, MWs and to hit penalties would allow you to cleanse the table early enough to still win by points.
Also you can somewhat safely take first turn with it because Hold the Line doesn't prevent you from moving - you just use it and wholle opponent's turn he has to face 2+ 2+ halberds and handguns.
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You are also using wrong point costs in your list, they have been changed in FAQ
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Use this to build your list:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/warscroll-builder/
PLEASE NO CUSTOM NAMES, you can add them later when you settle on what list you likeThen post your list here:
https://www.tga.community/forums/topic/18228-aos-2-flesh-eater-courts-discussion/?page=113
Then we can discuss it.
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Buy second-hand models
You can save up and buy an army second-hands once you find a good deal.Or play Stormcast, they are by far the cheapest to collect because they are elite (means more points for less models) and poster boys ( means having loads of 2 faction boxes, battalion boxes and start collectings which you can buy yourself, split with a buddy orm again, buy second hand for low price)
If SCE are not your cup of tea - you can still choose a more elite army to go for (like FEC, you can get 2000 points for very cheap price)
Don't buy units because they are cheap, buy what you actually want when such opportunity arrives.
If you stumble into a deal with units that you do want and don't want you can still buy it, strip whatever you don't want of paint and re-sell, or just re-sell it, I just think stripping models of paint would add some value to them for not that much effort.
Trade bits, make conversions, lately I've got a unit of freeguild guard for free with mish-mashed weapons, I just need to find some bit's to build a normal unit from them. I also converted myself a Ghast Courtier for my FEC from bits and Blackstone Fortress' Ur-Ghoul that I've got really cheap.
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Man this thread is quiet, @Double Misfire maybe you have any interesting list ideas to keep things going 'round here? I also struggle to make a list for this City that I'd like.
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9 hours ago, Marzillius said:
Time for a tournament report!
SpoilerI played the following list:
Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
- Stormhost: Celestial Vindicators
Leaders
Lord-Arcanum on Celestial Dracoline (220)
- General
- Trait: Single-minded Fury
- Artefact: Stormrage Blade
- Spell: Azyrite Halo
- Mount Trait: Pride Leader
Lord-Castellant (120)
Lord-Ordinator (140)
Knight-Heraldor (100)
Battleline
5 x Liberators (100)
- Warhammer & Shield
- 1x Grandhammers
5 x Liberators (100)
- Warhammer & Shield
- 1x Grandhammers
5 x Liberators (100)
- Warhammer & Shield
- 1x Grandhammers
Units
6 x Evocators on Dracolines (600)
War Machines
Celestar Ballista (110)
Celestar Ballista (110)
Celestar Ballista (110)
Celestar Ballista (110)
Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Chronomantic Cogs (80)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 111
Game 1 vs old Ironjawz: Focal Points. I screen my Dracolines using the Liberators, the Ballistae battery is in the sky. He teleports a 20-man unit of Ardboyz into the Liberator screen turn 1, along with some Goregruntas. A Mawkrusha boss charges the Castellant's free Gryph-Hound to kill it with a MW charge and then charge into something else. However, he only does 3 mortal wounds, so I save it using the Cycle of the Storm, meaning his entire Mawkrusha is wasted fighting the Gryph-Hound. The Evocators kill some boyz, and in my turn I retreat-charge them using the Heraldor and wipe the boyz. I fail to cast Cogs though, and the Ballistae fail to kill the Mawkrusha, leaving him on 1 wound. My screen is dead, and I have no re-roll save on the Evocators, so now I need the double turn. Luckily I get it and wipe his army down to 5 models at the end of round 2. Max win for me.
Game 2 vs Legion of Grief: Starstrike. Standard Dreadblade Harrow list with a bunch of ghosts. He takes first turn and summons most of his army from gravesites 9" away from my Liberator screen. He makes 2 of the charges and kills like 8 Libs, I kill some ghosts back. Then I retreat-charge the Evocators and kill 20 Harridans and 12 Myrmourns. The Ballistae kill a Knight of Shrouds. I get the double, the Evocators kill 20 Bladegheists, the Ballistae a Guardian of Souls and a bunch of Myrmourns, and the Arcanum another Guardian and nearly another Knight of Shrouds. I now cover 3 of the gravesites and there is a massive terrainpiece preventing charges from the fourth. Now it turns sour, because the 1-wound Knight of Shrouds managed to kill my Arcanum against all odds, freeing up a Gravesite. He teleports the Harrow in, summons a bunch of stuff back, then he AGAIN makes two 9" charges, sandwiches the Evocators and kill my entire army bar the Ballistae. It was all decided on a few strange dice rolls. Epic loss for me.
Game 3 vs Gloomspite Gitz: Places of Arcane Power. List with 60 Stabbas, 40 Stabbas, 20 Shootas, 10 Fanatics, Snufflers, an Arachnarok, Skragrott and some spellcasters and a Loonboss. He lets me go first, I fail to kill the Arachnarok with the Ballistae and take no points. On his turn he moves up and takes a point with the Arachnarok. He gets the double and sends the Fanatics into the Evocators. They roll really badly and I make a bunch of saves, so only 2 die. He also roll snake-eyes on the 40 Stabbas to charge the Gryph-Hound which is standing on an objective, which lets me move up and take the point without charging him. Then the Evocators are let loose and kills half the Goblins. I manage to sneak my Arcanum past his screens to slay his hero holding the middle, taking it for myself. At the end of turn 5 a single Liberator Prime manages to liberate Skragrotts brains from his skull, giving me the win.
Game 4 vs Flesh Eater Courts, Blisterskin. Blood and Glory. 2 Terrorgheists, 30 Ghouls, bunch of Horrors and Flayers and 2 Courtiers. I get first turn, buff up the Evos and establish a massive Liberator screen and shoot 5 wounds off a Terrorgheist with long range with the Ballistae. Then he goes, charges a Terrorgheist and the ghouls into said screen. Of course kills them, but draws the Evocators behind into the combat as well. The Evos obliterate the Ghouls and halves the Terrorgheist. Then I win the initiative, retreat-charge the Evos into the other Terrorgheist while the Ballistae finish off the wounded one. Then it's just clean-up until I hold all four points in round 5. Max win for me.
Game 5 vs Tzeentch, Change Host. Scorched Earth. The nightmare match-up. He gives me first turn, halves the move of the Evocators using the Changeling so they fail their turn 1 charge. The Ballistae kills a unit of Pink Horrors.. In his turn his magic is lackluster (fails infernal gateway, rolls 0 6s on the Purple Sun, Pendulum deals 1 MW etc). I get priority and the Evocators smashes a flank, burning one of his objectives. Then a torrent of blue horrors show up and lock down the entire battleline, which I have to fight my way through. I win priority again, and the Evos burn another of his objectives. It is now looking dire for him, so he charges the Lord of Change into 8 Libs and the Ordinator. He whiffs his attacks and I get him down to four wounds. I get the Arcanum into combat with the LoC as well, but then he gets EXTREMELY LUCKY. He saves five 5+ saves and three 4+ saves in a row and lives with 1 wound. Then summons a whole load of Brimstones into my backline and burns all my objectives. Incredibly frustrating way to end a tournament. In the end we draw.
I end up at 9th place out of 36 with 3-1-1, which is actually quite alright. I only managed to cast Cogs in game 4, I failed to cast them 9 times in a row after that, and then 2 times again in the Tzeentch game. So I succeeded in casting a 7 cast spell once out of 12 tries. That has to be some kind of world record. I love playing with the Dracolines however, they are pure murder machines. If you point them at something when they have gotten their buffs off, that thing will die. The Ballistae disappoint again, they were always a wound off killing important targets. This is the third tournament in a row where they disappoint me. I will let them sit in the shelf for a loooong time now.
Awesome report, thank you for sharing.
Do you by any chance have any photos from those games? At least after deployment?
My friend who is interested in running similar list would like to see that. Also, what are you planning to run instead of ballistas in Evos on Dracolines list? -
3 hours ago, bonzai said:
Hey guys!
I have a friend that wants to get into AoS and wants to start Stormcasts. I have picked up some models from some night haunt box sets and was thinking of donating them to him. I figure if he buys 1 box of sequitors, a battletome, and combines them with the models I am donating, he would get a running start with the following list:
Lord Arcanum on Gryph charger
Knight Incantor
Knight Incantor
5 Evocators
3 Castigators
3 Castigators
1 celestar bastilla
1 celestar bastilla
5 sequitors
5 sequitors
5 sequitors
Total: 1490My question is how solid is this list for a begining player? I play more horde style armies so elite armies are not my wheel house. As such my gut reaction is that it needs more bodies. My instincts for playing the list would be to split the army into 3 groups. 2 groups with a squad of sequitors, castigators, bastilla, and knight to hold objectives or apply ranged pressure with a sequitor screen, while the 3rd sequitor screens the lord and Evocators while they go on offense.
I am not really sold on the castigators. On paper they look under whelming. How do you guys find them? I am only using them because I will already have the models. Everything else on the list seems decent (sequitors) to down right nasty (evocators).
Lastly, any recomendations command traits, artifacts, etc... and what to add to bring it up to 2k would be greatly appreciated
Considering units:
You are right on spot about castigators, they are overpriced for not being a battleline, shorter range than Judicators, less shots than ballista
Ballistas are best when you take 4 of them with LOrdinator
Evocators are great
Incantor is good
Sequitors are good
Lord Arcanum is your "tax" for battleline Sequitors
Usually SCE can do well regardless of the list, but for competetive play your friend will need to go Anvilstrike route. -
just to add to @Kramer's pretty accurate response - like mentioned in the lore sometimes reforging can return a stormcast to the same battle in which he was slain. It's probably a long battle, but it's still rather impressive.
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2 minutes ago, Charlo said:
That's much better, thanks!
I wanted to add them to my Cities of Sigmar army so was looking at what is the best option, are they viable as a fast but somewhat tough distraction etc
Sorry, your initial question haven't transfered your intentions that well.
Yes, they are viable as skirmishing distraction unit, you can also use vanguard palladors in such role.
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3 minutes ago, Charlo said:
Sorry but that's not very helpful at all.
I'm asking about the units themselves and you've suggested playing entirely different ones?!
Yes I suggest that you play entirely dfferent units, because Prosecutors can't be the core of your list and aren't intended to be one, they don't have what it takes to do so. They are purely utility - you can use melee ones for tying up missle units or charging into the corner of big blob to mess with it's pile-in whille your main fighting unit charges other side and deals damage, you can also run them with shields and Grandaxe so they will deal some damage in the process and stay in combat longer. You can use ranged prosecutors to chip down wounds on multi-wounded targets and flank with them, then throw them in opponent's way to prevent a charge to more valuable unit.
And knight Azyros is only usefull for his lantern, his combat abilities aren't any better than any other hero.
I have been using Prosecutors for more than a year back in 1st edition, they are great fun, but there are better options damage-wise, so you have to use Prosecutors for utility they bring.
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We also still need a command trait as good as staunch defender and more battle traits, that make sense - "here guys, we give you this amazing battle trait of -1 to hit but it only works in your turn, we also take away all your battalion's abilities that would synergise with this trait, except one that have a bunch of tax units, have fun"
Named characters that are not golden boys, seeing Lynus is a sign of hope though.
Further reduction of Celestant Prime's cost and give him 2+ save already! That is an Alpha Stormcast, he deserves to be the only model in this game that has a native 2+ save.
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Flesh-Eaters are their own allegiance, skeletons and vampires are part of Legions of Nagash book and can be taken under 4 different allegiances. You can ally those units between allegiances (though FEC can't ally vampires). And you can field them as a single army under Grand Alliance Death allegiance.
But keep in mind that Allies are restricted by points you can spend on them and ratio at which you can include allied units (1/4 allied/all), they usually don't bring any sinergy with units from other allegiances and GA Death allegiance is rather unimpressive compared to FEC/LoN
AoS 2 - Cities of Sigmar Discussion
in Cities of Sigmar
Posted
I think Gyrocopters and then mop up with missle infantry, you would also need something that can body block other threats though. I already played against full bonesplitter Big Waaagh army and something I observed is that: they are stupidly tough, strong and numerous, but don't have spare CPs for auto-battleshock, so my opponent lost 2 units due to models fleeing after I killed like 2/3s of unit myself. Also Hollowheart spell isn't great against 2 wound models, but will work just fine against gobbos and aelves.