Nurgle vs Ironjawz/stormcast

[shadowgra]

well i have to play against these 2 armies, which i think are one of the strongest atm. they surely have the upper hand, with tons of mortal wounds and rend. 

since my friends are bringing 2 pretty strong lists (gordrakk, 15 brutes, 10 hard, mega, warchanter and weirdnob for ironjawz, stormcast have templar, retributors, liberators, judicators and so  on) there is something that can bring me even with them? 

at the moment i think that the plaguetouched warband formation is maybe the most interesting for nurgle, also because it can apply to a lot of units and does not require a really weak lord of plague.

i thought about a core of :

plagueband formation 140

10 warriors of chaos, shield, mon 180

28 marauders, axe, shield, +1 leadership standard, mon 180

blightkings 180

blightkings 180

these are a core of 720 points of battleline, that can survive i think pretty well, with good meatshields in marauder and warriors. the -1 for hit is really handful in survivability, or at least nullifies their +1.

at this point i have really few option, since i think that i need mortal wounds to deal with both of them, or high rend high damage weapons, which nurgle does not excel at.

i thought about 2 paths: glottkin one and archaon one.

glottkin one gives me a lot more survivability on marauders, which simply won't die, a good behemoth that can at least handle the drakesworn  for a bit of time (gordrakk will eat him i suppose). however is not that great cause stormcast abuse mortal wounds with almost all their units.

archaon one: gives me the varanguard, the only cavalry with -2 rend and can be potentially devastating. also they can have nurgle keywords to take the buffs from blightkings and heroes. also archaon simply won't die at any stage of the game, unless he is vs 15 hammer paladins. however he costs a shitton of point and even more to use his command effectively.

the third path is to simply take a massive amount of blightkings, a maggoth lord (orghotts) and some mages to spread mortal wounds with blightkings aura and spells.

what do you think? how will you build against those 2 armies? did i identified well their weaknesses or am i totally wrong?

[Arkiham]

this is what im taking against those two exact armies. it has plenty or survivability, mortal wounds, damage and bodies. i lack on the rend a little but thats what festus is for. 

Unit name	Minumum Models in unit	Cost	Number of units	Unit cost	Models	Total
						2000
Harbinger of Decay	1	140	1	140	1	1860
Plaguetouched warband				140	0	1720
Blightkings	5	180	3	540	15	1180
Bloab rotspawned	1	260	1	260	1	920
Festus the Leechlord	1	120	1	120	1	800
Chaos warriors	10	180	3	540	30	260
Gorebeast chariot	1	100	2	200	2	60
Chaos marauders	10	60	1	60	10	0
Remaining points						0

 

[Mosgruaber]

Just a quick question: Doesn't the Plaguetouched Warband need multiples of 7 to work? For example 14 Chaos Warriors or 7 Blightkings.

[Arkiham]

it does, my formula isnt too good for stuff like that. i should alter it really once i figure out how. it'll be units deployed in multiples. 

[shadowgra]

2 hours ago, Arkiham said:

this is what im taking against those two exact armies. it has plenty or survivability, mortal wounds, damage and bodies. i lack on the rend a little but thats what festus is for. 

 

Unit name	Minumum Models in unit	Cost	Number of units	Unit cost	Models	Total
						2000
Harbinger of Decay	1	140	1	140	1	1860
Plaguetouched warband				140	0	1720
Blightkings	5	180	3	540	15	1180
Bloab rotspawned	1	260	1	260	1	920
Festus the Leechlord	1	120	1	120	1	800
Chaos warriors	10	180	3	540	30	260
Gorebeast chariot	1	100	2	200	2	60
Chaos marauders	10	60	1	60	10	0
Remaining points						0

 

Well this is so tough! U are relating on withering enemies with high wound/save/regen while weakening them! Diabolic ^^

I thought a bit about ur list and i came up with this:

Heroes:

Harbinger 140

Bloab 260

Festus (really liking this guy, even more than i saw that he has self regen, thing i didn't noticed on first glance)

Battleline

2*5 putrid blightkings 180*2

10 putrid blightkings 360

10 chaos warriors, shield, mon 180

28 marauders, mon, axe, icon 180

Units

Chaos spawn, mon 60

2 gorebeast chariots, mon, great weapon (i already have 1 of these guys ^^)

2000 points

 

I think that 20 marauders and 5 putrid are better than warriors in this case, they bring more auras/passive healing damage and more total wound count. Also is a nice way to steal obj since u have to rely on number of models. The chaos spawn is there for... ehm.. there were 60 points left

What do you think?

[Arkiham]

If you don't need the spawn,  drop it. The triumph table is handy to have tbh and if you roll reroll failed wounds that can massively help thethe blightkings do damage, with rolling on to hit on 5+ as I'll assume that's the trait you're going for you've a 1/3 chance to do d6 wound rolls. Rerolling failed ones can swing the combat.

 

While those marauders may provide a larger wound pool how effective are those wounds, I think that 180 point of warriors would do better, I feel that the unit is going to force you to use inspire on them so they don't die to battle shock, they'll typically have a 6+ save or none if you haven't put shields on them, which means no 5+ aoe ward save

 

Do you have 5 battleline units of have I misread that.  If it is 5 you may be better off setting up your battleline how I have, as with loads of smaller units your buffs become less effective, as they affect less. it's only a 1/6 chance to proc the blightkings heal/damage so don't rely on it.

I only put the gorebeasts in to proc Bloab spell for another turn, and then combat obviously. don't really suit the theme of this army, they move too fast. This is a slow March up the board, if at all. 

Festus is more effective when used with a balewind vortex I own one so I'll be using that with him, otherwise he's not very good.

[shadowgra]

20 minutes ago, Arkiham said:

If you don't need the spawn,  drop it. The triumph table is handy to have tbh and if you roll reroll failed wounds that can massively help thethe blightkings do damage, with rolling on to hit on 5+ as I'll assume that's the trait you're going for you've a 1/3 chance to do d6 wound rolls. Rerolling failed ones can swing the combat.

What's the triumph table? Sorry i am new to age of sigmar and with so many books is hard to find rule for everything.

Marauders have shields, only forgot to write that

On the battleline then is better to have few bigger units than more smaller? Cause kings have quite a large base and 1" weapons... in ur list i did not understand if u play 30 warriors or 3*10 warriors and same for other units, i dont know the format

28 minutes ago, Arkiham said:

 

I only put the gorebeasts in to proc Bloab spell for another turn, and then combat obviously. don't really suit the theme of this army, they move too fast. This is a slow March up the board, if at all. 

Festus is more effective when used with a balewind vortex I own one so I'll be using that with him, otherwise he's not very good.

I got ur use of gorebeast for bloab, i think is pretty cool. However i think that every army needs at least 1 fast moving unit for contesting and such

The balewind vortex is so meaningful on festus? I mean, i dont know if we are gonna play with pieces of terrain or not (prob not)

[Arkiham]

It's a spell which forms a terrain peice, and you need terrain. Game is dull otherwise.

Due to the lack of buffing units in the list and available to nurgle, other than wizards yeah I'd say so, fewer large units, at least in this list as the aoe ward save from the general is 7" and can benefit both large groups on my list.

The triumph table is what you get for not spending all your point allowance 

[shadowgra]

Where can i find that? However i think i will just follow ur suggestion and incorporate the bk and maybe drop 5 for 10 warriors that will be addes to the other unit. I think i will also drop 1 king to get the formation bonus

So in the end they are 30 marauders, 20 warriors and 15 kings

[Arkiham]

It's ok. But it's not what I'd take honestly. The Marauders aren't able to stand up to the damage the Ironjawz an stormcast put out. They'll die so fast. The if you drop the spawn, and only take 10 marauders they act as a unit of chaff. They aren't a fighting unit which can stand up to the likes of your opponents armies. they'll be brutally murdered.

If you take another 8 warriors, that makes the unit 28 strong, you gain the buff from the battalion, and the warriors gain rerolls 1 for armour saves. 

But if you're happy with your list try it, see how it goes.

[shadowgra]

I will think about it, surely 28 warriors are not so easy to take down

Where can i find the triumph table and costs?

[Mosgruaber]

You find it on page 103 in the GH (at least in the german version ).

[Arkiham]

1 hour ago, shadowgra said:

I will think about it, surely 28 warriors are not so easy to take down

Where can i find the triumph table and costs?

Sorry, missed that. Yeah it's around page 100, and it's free, it's a bonus to who ever has the most points left over after army creation. You roll a d3 on it an get the result for one battle round , it's either rerolls to hit,  rerolls to wound or reroll saves I think.

And no, 28 chaos warriors won't be easy to take down. I'll be using great weapons as they'll be within range of my general for the 5+ ward. But if you take them sword an board, or halberds, they'll gain another 5+ ward against mortal wounds.

So the chaos warriors will have a battle profile of.

Atk: 2 attacks 3+4+ 1 damage.

Def: -1 (-2) to hit 4+ rr1 5+(5+mw) deals mortal wound on to wound roll of 6.

Very difficult to remove tbh.

[Nico]

Agree with Arkiham above. The rerolls are for one unit in one combat phase from memory.

[shadowgra]

Ok then i will try with 28 warriors (i already got 12) and will buy 10 marauders as last thing (maybe will convert bloodreavers models, still unsure about that)

So far i like the list, thanks all for the help