[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

@Connelj2 I’d consider adding “Fold Reality” to add models back to the Daemon units as an option.

[AoS 2 - Blades of Khorne Discussion]

7 hours ago, tamthethird said:

The centrepiece will be a Verminlord Deciever.

From a game mechanics perspective, you'd have to be using Grand Alliance: Chaos. (Which means loosing out on the Khorne prayers and Bloodtithe.)

The only one of the Verminlords that are able to be slotted in as allies is the Verminlord Corruptor, due to the Nurgle keyword.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

52 minutes ago, Myzyrael said:

You could do this with one also, no? Just use it twice with one of them.

It doesn’t look like it is worded to stack from a single model:

“Beacon of Sorcery: [...] If a Lord of Change uses this ability, then until your next hero phase you can add 1 to all casting and unbinding rolls made for friendly TZEENTCH DAEMON WIZARDS that are within 18" of the Lord of Change.”

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

46 minutes ago, Richelieu said:

I have two examples that I think should help clear this up.

1) Branchwraith summon spell.  Nobody would argue that just because Curseling can steal the spell that you should be able to summon your opponent's models.

2) Just because you can cast a spell doesn't mean the rest of the spell's obligations are automatically met.  Setting up an endless spell is one of the effects of casting the spell.  In order to carry out that effect, you must possess the model.  This is completely independent of the rules that allow you to cast the spell.  This is no different than say, arcane bolt.  I can cast the spell, but it won't actually do anything unless I meet the further requirement of a unit being within 18".  

I completely agree with you, the Tzeentch player would need to have the models to perform a cast that results in a model (or models) showing up on the table. (ie They don’t get to borrow their opponents models, they need their own... unless they have a very gracious opponent.)

One might posit that one could do the spell cast and then place the available number of models, which could be as few as 0 models. 

So, as long as the Tzeentch player has the appropriate models in their box of models that they brought to an event do you see anything that would prevent them from casting the spell?  And having it take effect? (Tzeentch controlled Dryads .... interesting ...)

[AoS 2 - Blades of Khorne Discussion]

It doesn’t look like the knights are specifically geared to anti-spell ... they just happen to ignore mortal wounds on rolls of 5 or 6 due to their shields.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

5 minutes ago, ianob said:

Neither give permission to use Endless Spells or Endless Spell models. The warscroll says nothing about Endless Spells or using Endless Spell models, so that's irrelevant too. You're reaching with your counterarguments here.

To clarify, we’re talking about the June 2018 DoT designers commentary  where “the answers are provided by the rules writing team explain (sic) and how the rules are intended to be used. [...]” here? (https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/age_of_sigmar_disciples_of_tzeentch_designers_commentary_en.pdf )

“Q: Can a Curseling, having unbound an endless spell, use the Vessel of Chaos ability to attempt to cast that endless spell?
A: Yes.”

14 minutes ago, ianob said:

We're going to have to agree to disagree  until we see an FAQ otherwise we're going to go round in circles 

Okay. It does seem rather straightforward. But it does sound like you would want a clearer faq indicating something else. I hope they can get you what you’re asking for.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

46 minutes ago, ianob said:

The rules simply don't cover it, and since AoS is a permissive ruleset, without an FAQ that explicitly allows this in matched play it's not legal.

If the issue is that the ruleset is permissive, and the Designers commentary and Warscroll give permission ... we only wouldn’t be able to use the core rules in Matched Play if there was an additional restriction that stated that this functionality from the core rules doesn’t work that way in Matched.

The Matched Play Rules add restrictions and limits to the core rules.  If there are no restrictions or limits stated that are different than Core Rules ... and the Designers Commentary And a warscroll specifically state that a spell that is dispelled can be cast... (as long as you’re meeting the ‘who can cast’ requirement on the actual spell (some endless spells have restrictions on who can cast them, ie Nighthaunt/Nagash only)) and given that warscrolls can override core rules, it seems pretty cut and dried.

The only “other restriction” on casting an endless spell that I see is that you have to have the model for the spell available. (P.262 Core Book) And if the player already has one of that kind of endless spells on the board, because say they stole it in a prior turn, they couldn’t have two copies “they own” on the board per the GHB updates in a Matched Play game.

46 minutes ago, ianob said:

there is a *completely separate* qualifier for your ability to use or not use an endless spell model. You've just quoted one of them

If you could point me at that qualification that can’t be over-ruled by a Warscroll unit Ability, I’d be really appreciative.

If the issue is “knowing the spell” the Curseling can cast spells that they don’t know. (They actually doesn’t even know it after casting.)

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

2 hours ago, ianob said:

The rules don't actually stipulate that you need to pay point to know OR use the endless spell, but its plainly obvious that that's what's intended by them having PB profiles

“Endless spells have Pitched Battle profiles and a points cost. By paying the spell’s points cost, all WIZARDS in the player’s army know that endless spell, and the player can use (and re-use) one endless spell model of the appropriate type in the battle.” GHB 2018 p.48

The Curseling can redirect a casting attempt through ‘Vessel Of Chaos’.

The qualifiers are in game, and because the Warscroll abilities over-ride Core Rules they would have access to knowledge/items that they wouldn’t normally as part of army creation. 

A Curseling could dispel the spell, with vessel of chaos, and could immediately attempt to cast it ... but they don’t know the the spell  ... and couldn’t cast it later in game. (That is a different ability.)  And can’t steal it from a unit using ‘glean magic’ ... because it is not on the unit’s Warscroll.

[AoS 2 - Blades of Khorne Discussion]

The Khorne marked Marauders on Horseback actually would give a ranged attack option. They have Javelins with a 9” range.

Though they’re not cheap at 90 points for 5.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

On 7/14/2018 at 5:15 PM, ianob said:

It definitely doesn’t have zero ambiguity I agree, but Endless spells do have a min and max unit size, and you don’t get to just *use things* in matched play if they have  points values without paying for them, so  no idea why people would think this would be an exception to the rule.

You only pay for things before the game begins. Anything summoned onto the board after the game begins doesn’t use the points mechanic anymore.

eg Summoned Daemons ... no longer use any reserve points. You would need to have your available models. But I don’t need to pay reserve points to bring on a new Blue Horrors Unit. I just need to have them in my available models to place on table. (And fulfil Any in-game mechanic required.)

So, the player would need to have their own copy of the model in their “bag of tricks”. Because one can’t summon stuff to the board if you don’t have the model. (Because even though they are stealing the spell, they’re not stealing the model from their opponent.)

[AoS 2 - Clan Verminus / Skaven Discussion]

1 minute ago, Kugane said:

The mini is the exact same height as a Verminlord Deceiver and same base size :). The model was just small, so I had to make it bigger to keep things fair.

I’d go up against it as an opponent. The (only) concern that I could see was if it had been modeled for advantage. (Given the way Command Abilities and Unit Abilities work within X range.)

But the conversion looks sweet. It looks like boneripper?

[AoS 2 - Clan Verminus / Skaven Discussion]

21 minutes ago, Kugane said:

Not done painting yet, but, you do think this one can substitute a verminlord warbringer? 

From a rule of cool perspective ... sure. It’s just seems to be using a huge base ... is it still a 120mm x92mm?

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

1 hour ago, Drib said:

magnetized the whole chest. Same with all my Tzaangors. Only problem is that the Enlightened and Skyfire Champion share their chests, so I only got 1 each out of 2 packs.

I can’t quite tell from the sprue picture, but did they give you enough torsos to have an Leader torso and a standard torso for that model?

Basically does it give you 7 torsos? (1 for the champion, 3 for each of the Skyfires and Exlightened?)

How do they define the “unit champion”? (Guy with the arms spread wide?)

 

[Warscroll Designer (BETA)]

1 hour ago, MacDuff said:

I love the images of the actual miniatures on the new warscrolls - really helps out as model lines grow and names proliferate.

The only challenge I can see is that local database storage is seriously limited for web browsers...

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

2 hours ago, DaftSkunk said:

Looking at the Witch Elf poses it seems tricky to me to get shields onto them. How would you go about it?  I've also been trying to get more variety in my tzeentch mortals, but the question of how to get female Kairic Acolytes has me stumped. Would love some ideas for that, as I plan to get at least another 20, maybe even 40 as I grow my cult. 

We lucked out.

The Wytch Elf’s have two configurations (the box makes both Wytch Elves and Sisters of Slaughter.

Sisters of Slaughter have shields.  

https://www.games-workshop.com/Daughters-Of-Khaine-Sisters-of-Slaughter-2018

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

25 minutes ago, Binkbinkplx said:

Its the the Chaos Lord, not the Sorcerer Lord. So unfortunately he does not get a spell I believe?

The Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore is actually 50 points less than the Chaos Lord on Manticore....

17 minutes ago, Binkbinkplx said:

if you roll a 1 into a 1 he dies

Not sure where that rule is?

Currently unmodified save rolls of 1 are failures... (Update in the core rules.) and the Paradoxical Shield was rewritten to “Re-roll successful save rolls for the bearer. In addition, add 2 to the save rolls for the bearer (after any re-rolls have been taken).”

For the Fatemaster with a Paradoxical Shield, this means that, by default:

You re-roll saves of 4+ (You don’t Reroll 1,2,3’s)

Against an opponent with rend of up to -2, and a non-flying opponent you’re looking for “anything but 1’s”.  (ie a 2+)

Against a flying opponent, with rend “-“ you are still looking for a 2+...

With someone casting Mystic Shield on him... you could even re-roll those failed rolls of 1...., and because a die can only be rerolled once ... you wouldn’t Reroll that die from Paradoxical Shield.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

5 minutes ago, The Cyclop Owl said:

Actually I fully built the Skyfires previously, and so I had to start from there. I cut the lances of the Enlightened from the sprues and made them all one handed. From there I figured how to connect the Skyfires bow arms with the lances, used heat on a blade to get a decent clean cut and started drilling very small holes before I went bigger. The magnets I have are 3x2mm, and they sometimes protrude from the arms, so I might have to come up with a greenstuff patch to hide them properly. I hid the connection in the wrists and elbows, so that it doesn't matter if there's a slight imbalance in the alignment.
To keep the Skyfire build clean, I've cut the engaged arrow at the feather, very close to the hand with a heated blade. 

As for accessories, so far I've left the quivers, I don't know that I'll go crazy and fully magnetise every piece of kit. Timewise, it's taken me 3 hours to do 3 of them last night. To be honest, the result is quite satisfactory.

@The Cyclop Owl any potential for pics of the units? It sounds pretty interesting.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

16 minutes ago, Boss Salvage said:

Speaking of beatdowns, I wrote another report over on my Dakka blog, this time 1k vs Mixed Order. Just linking to it for the interested, as pasting it in felt like it messed with this thread.

Ahh nice run through of the DP+Horrors list ...

You mentioned : “Prince uses Treason to compel the grandhammer on the bridge to smash the lightning out of his Liberator buddy.”

Was that just a literary turn of phrase? Or were you using the “attack with their own weapon, the instead of the faq’d Treason Of Tzeentch”?

I noticed that all all of your Horrors in the pics were painted blue? And none of the pinks appeared to be pink....?

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

42 minutes ago, Korvak said:

The awesome thing about that box is that if you magnetise your Skyfires/enlightened,

If you don’t mind the curiosity, how are you handling the magnetizing of the Skyfires? That sounds like it could be fun... (or insane ... I haven’t determined which.)

[Warscroll Designer (BETA)]

@RuneBrush Quick heads-up bug report. Keywords don't clear when you select "Clear Form" on Safari

 

As a 'feature request' it would be great to be able to input 'custom' Warhammer Quest heroes, or Adversaries ... 

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

12 minutes ago, Plokoone said:

Please do not bully the Fatemaster. He is very self-conscious.

We do need more female models in the Tzeentch line... (not that one can tell male v.s. female for Tzaangor ...)

I've seriously considered converting up a bunch of the Witch elves as Kairic Acolytes .... either with two blades, or blade and shield. (That and they're awesome models.) Alternately I've considered doing a minor conversion of adding the additional sword to the Sorcereress and running her as a Chaos Sorcerer Lord.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

4 minutes ago, Origin said:

And on a side note, the Fatemaster. Coming from outside Tzeentch he seems crazy good for 120 points, yet he does not seem to feature in many lists and indeed i cannot seem to find space for him. 

The Fatemaster happens to be one of two units in a Tzeentch Arcanites Army that has Command abilities (the other being Kairos).

ps The finecast model appears to be female.

[AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion]

20 minutes ago, Boss Salvage said:

All that said, I'm happy that there are tournaments coming up that ban the realm artefacts. Good call, TOs.

So, one advantage of Realm Artefacts is that there are options now for Grand Alliance armies. 

Theyre not just stuck with the 6 available Artefacts for their GA.

Those Artefacts also allow armies that didn’t get the “SCE and Nighthaunt Treatment” or the AoS v2 treatment to fight back with options.

There are really good ones. While A tournament is the TO’s domain where they can do anything they want.

Without them, we might not have seen Sweden take 2nd in 6 Nations.

Taking away complexity because stuff has issues at this moment ... kinda makes me sad.

[AoS 2 - Clan Verminus / Skaven Discussion]

10 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

 Yeah same problem here, I’ve even send an email to them,  but for some reason they never responded?

Anyone asked the question up on the FB AoS Page?

[AoS 2 - Clan Verminus / Skaven Discussion]

Other than the Scrollbuilder webpage, has there been any communication from GW (Facebook, etc) indicating the actual points for Stormvermin?

(Not sure that it makes sense for them to be a premium cost for a unit of 30.)

The Profile in the AoS app still shows them at max 30 @ 500 Points.