Jump to content

Jacek

Members
 View Profile  See their activity

  • Posts

    42

  • Joined

  • Last visited

 Content Type 

Posts posted by Jacek

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    4 hours ago, Gokken said:

    Ah thanks Jacek,

    I have the same experience I played 5 games with the new book I got it off 3 times, once was against glutons though so that was nice.

    I would call it a 6/10 its not bad nor it is really good and against certain things its a life saver, but it wont move and I fail 3+ all the time basicly and its 80 POINTS!

    Last night i failed both my witch brews on a 4+ and got table before I had my turn too from a shooting list.

    I feel abit the daughters became a slotmachine where you gamble for random buffs.

    That is why I prefer bloodwrack viper, in most games it kills more than it is worth (basically it does not return its points if you fail to cast it) :)

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    35 minutes ago, Gokken said:

    I am wondering if cauldrens are worth it now at all if they cannot fight, over just two hags. 

    11 attacks with damage 1 just does very litle for me, and most of my army is useally dead by turn 3.

    Also is the new endless spell heart of fury worth it now if it counts as a known prayer and takes one attempt? 

    Heart of Fury is not a prayer. It is invocation. So you can try to summon it in addition to any prayers you use.

    I played with it few times and also against it. For 80 points in my opinion it is too random. You can't take it out if you want to move it somewhere else (totally random roll at the end of each battle round) and even if it dissapear you can still fail to resummon it.

    So in short you can end up in situations:

    - It dissapears and you fail to resummon it

    - You need to move army out of it's bubble but it did not dissapear so you can't summon it anywhere else

    That is only my opinion, feel free to play with it because if it kicks in with good rolls it is awesome (I was unlucky and experienced both situations I listed above)

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    2 hours ago, 5kaven5lave said:

    So I guess with Prayergate I’m ditching Blood Sigil as it’s now pointless and taking the Iron Circlet to have a better chance of getting that one prayer off?

    Depends on your build.

    If you take avatar on foot - no need for circlet (as it rerolls 1s, not unmodified 1s - that is my understanding so far) so if you are near avatar on foot (+1 to prayer rolls) you just succeed on 2+ and on 1 you take no dmg. Then you can replace circlet with something else.

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Chumphammer said:

    If you read the pictures, its all there

    Sacrament hits 1 of your units turn 1 in hagg nar and makes that unit have zealots rage.

    Zealots rage states "In addition, friendly avatars of khaine are automatically activated"

    Hense they all are go turn 1 cause 1 unit has zealots rage 

    But those friendly avatars of khaine are not on 3rd round, I understood this rule as:

    if avatar of khaine has zealot's rage then it is animated?

    Now that might be a nice surprise. Unexpected but a welcome one :)

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted · Edited by Jacek

    1 hour ago, Chumphammer said:

    Haggnar can still work well with Avatars

    Take Iron circlet and Sacrament of blood

    Cast it on any model in the army and they now count as having Zealots rage in turn 1, so all Avatars are now awake without a roll 
    image.png.990723d259ebc4080abae91cdacb3473.pngimage.png.e4f10257ebaf34ebabe7ea2579e2e418.pngimage.png.bd67d1bdfc98c6f82040fd9d0a794df7.png

    ALL avatars? how? Sacrament of Blood is only for one model and only that model gets additional round bonus. You can cast it on avatar / cauldron to "move" it to round 3 so it would be animated AND have hit of 1s re-roll but that is still only one model.

    I don't see where it awakes all of your avatars (unless you have only one in the army, then 1 = all :D )?

    @Edit - I wrote for model because I meant avatar or cauldron, normally it may also be unit

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    Hi all,

    I made a fun list for DoK temple Khelt Nar for snakes. Very mobile but quite fragile and most importand very fun to play with many options so I can react to what enemy is doing. Won local tournament with this 3-0.

    4 drops total

    Retreat and charge same turn - AWESOME (especially for Shadow Queen or any unit you manage to cast mindrazor on even if they are already in combat) + remember that Mindrazor works until YOUR next hero phase if you charged (so in enemy turn it works as well)

    2x Khinerai + Shadowstalkers for teleporting on/near objectives + ironscale buffing Blood Sisters meaning you can practically capture up to 3 enemy objectives if he is not paying too much attention. Also help because enemy must make some hard decisions a lot of times or you will just reposition to your advantage.

    I took Crystal Heart for Medusa if I need teleport +  her built-in spell (-1 to wound rolls for enemy unit) or because of positioning casting Bloodwrack Viper (by default try to use it with Morathi)

    2x Bloodwrack shooting = nice anty-horde.

    You can use any unit as sacrificial pawn to keep enemy in combat or lure them - losing anything does not hurt much as all units in the army have great use.

     

    Allegiance: Daughters of Khaine
    - Temple: Khelt Nar

    Leaders
    Bloodwrack Shrine (160)
    - General
    - Command Trait: The Circling Flock
    - Artefact: Gaisa's Falx
    - Lore of Shadows: Steed of Shadows
    Morathi-Khaine (210)
    - Lore of Shadows: Mindrazor
    The Shadow Queen (390)
    Bloodwrack Medusa (100)
    - Artefact: Crystal Heart
    - Lore of Shadows: Mirror Dance
    Melusai Ironscale (110)

    Battleline
    15 x Blood Sisters (390)
    5 x Blood Stalkers (140)
    5 x Blood Stalkers (140)

    Units
    9 x Khainite Shadowstalkers (100)
    5 x Khinerai Heartrenders (80)

    Battalions
    Vyperic Guard (140)

    Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
    Bloodwrack Viper (40)

    Total: 2000 / 2000
    Extra Command Points: 1
    Allies: 0 / 400
    Wounds: 107

     

     

    • Like 3

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    10 minutes ago, Jaskier said:

    Is anyone else struggling to decide between the Iron Circlet and the Shadow Stone in a Hagg Narr build? I feel like getting Mindrazor off is more important than ever, but ensuring Blessing of Khaine is up is probably still more important with how deadly everything is in AoS nowadays.

    I think Iron circlet is better.

    DoK never had strong casting, there are too many possible unbinds waiting even for successful mindrazor. I treat it as bonus (if it goes through - nice). 

    Prayers can't be unbound so if it kicks in - you have it.

    If you want to be super safe for prayer - get 1 avatar on foot (it gives prayers +1 to work so with iron circlet you have 2+ with re-roll 1). Also - in this situation your worst roll outcome is 2 if you roll 1 so you do not receive MW even if you fail (on prayers it is roll of 1, not unmodified roll of 1 :D )

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    9 hours ago, Panacea said:

    I just realized that you cannot make a normal move when within 3" of an enemy unit, so that solves that issue at least. But what do you guys think about the teleport?

    I suppose you can. Retreat is a normal move (but you can't charge later same turn - unless you are Khelt Nar :D )

     

    Units starting a normal move within
    3" of an enemy unit can either
    remain stationary or retreat. If a unit
    retreats, it can move within 3" of an
    enemy, but must end the move more
    than 3" from all enemy units.     Models
    in a unit that retreats can’t shoot or
    charge later in the same turn.

    • Like 1

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    4 hours ago, Shmaravoz said:

    Guys, need an advice. How competitive do you think this snake list is? And how would you improve it?

     

    Zainhar Kai

    600 Morathi
    110 Melusai Ironscale

    110 Melusai Ironscale

    90 Hag Queen

    10 x 280 Blood Sisters

    10 x 260 Blood Stalkers 

    10 x 260 Blood Stalkers

     140 Battalion Vymperic Guard

    80 Heart of Fury

    40 Snake (endless spell)

    Total Points 1970 

     

    Or

    Zainhar Kai

    600 Morathi
    110 Melusai Ironscale

    110 Melusai Ironscale

    15 x 420 Blood Sisters

    10 x 260 Blood Stalkers 

    10 x 260 Blood Stalkers

    140 Battalion Vymperic Guard

    40 Snake (endless spell)

    + 1 CP (50 pts)


    Total Points 1990 

    Why take 2x Ironscale?

    From what I see you can use CA only once per turn in your Hero phase?

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    7 minutes ago, Lucentia said:

    I could be wrong, but I believe cauldron handmaidens/shrine goadstaves are counted as mounts, so those attacks can't be upgraded with artifacts like that.  Though if the Ulfuri just gives a flat attack bonus to the entire model that would work, but I think it only adds to a specific weapon?

    I do not see any information that says anything about mounts on cauldron warscroll. Only that it is single model armed with [ALL weapons listed]

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted · Edited by Jacek

    2 hours ago, Fred1245 said:

    Could still fight without Mindrazor, Can't TP without TP spell. Or was your plan just to move your models and hope your opponent didn't notice, lol? Also, look at this guy, bragging 'cause they did absolutely nothing to fix ****** our casting has been in the current meta

    Could still move without teleport, same efficiency as fighting without mindrazor :D and CA from Ironscale makes it easier even without teleport. Did you even play any game or just like to be toxic? Because now DoK can have multiple win conditions.

     

    2 hours ago, Fred1245 said:

    They always got extra damage on the charge. Did you even read the last book there chief? The rend is nice...or it would be if they hadn't gone up 40pts for a usable unit size. Because yunno, 320-280 is 40. Cause that's how math works? Course maybe you think 10 is plenty, what with all those big tourney lists running nothing but units of 10 witch aelves? Oh wait...lol.

    Im not sure if YOU read the book? What was 320 pts? what was usable unit size? you talk about khinerai lifetakers here? Who EVER ran 20 of them? Or WA /SoS? But they were not 320 or 280 pts? WA are 100 pts per 10 now so you can take a unit of twenty and save 40 pts (instead of 120 before). SoS are 120 for 10 without discount now. I did not play WA / SoS but I see if you take 1 unit of SoS - you still have that cost back because of cauldrons points decrease?

    Slaughter queen on cauldron is now 60 pts CHEAPER (330 down to 270).

    Hag Queen on Cauldron -> 70 pts cheaper (down from 290 to 220)

    Unless you ran your cauldron buffed WA /SoS  without cauldron before? (now that is innovative gameplay)

    Or did you even play any games before? 

    Have a nice day everyone here :)

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    1 minute ago, Eternalis said:

    Yes. The SCE player either choose between rolling the dice or the auto unbinding.

    There are possibilities, and all these changes requires more planning from us. Was it nerfs or buffs? I don't know. But now I'm much more interested in list building than before because everything looks on the same power level. I've been playing a lot with statshammer since the leaks and I've yet to understand how we could be as bad as some people here are saying.

    Same here I suppose. List building is much fun now. Especially if built in a way that you can decide on the go which unit should be buffed in specific moment and not put all eggs in one basket :)

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    24 minutes ago, Eternalis said:
    1 hour ago, Fred1245 said:

    knight incantor will be able to shut down these strategies

    Like all our strategy including Mind Razors. When will GW nerf SCE???

    I think we can still play around that. Auto unbind is once per battle and it works in 30" ?(when he tries to unbind, unless SCE got whole map unbinds and Im unaware because I don't know that army too well). So we can try to use teleport spell outside of that 30" or, for example, feed him with new snake endless spell before trying teleport? maybe that can even bait out auto unbind and if not there is a chance he will get eaten (3 dice, one 5+ and bye bye)? More depending if he is within ~17" so snake can catch up to him :)

    What I mean is - there are possibilities. It never is hopeless :D

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Eternalis said:

    The melee ones? Yeah it's so bad they gain some rend and damage when they charge. They were way better before that.
    And you know what? They were 80pts and now they are 80pts, what a freaking points hike. Unbelievable.

    I think he meant 20 Khinerai Lifetakers unit points reduction to 280 ?

    That was gamechanger and meta abused - everyone played that :D

    • Like 1

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted · Edited by Jacek

    1 hour ago, Fred1245 said:

    I love how you list a perfect example of why mirror dance is stupid like it proves that it isn't. 'See, I lost this game where I had literally perfect conditions for using the spell because it failed over and over, that proves that it could work!' What that game proved is that mirror dance sucks and is unreliable.

    This is continuing the trend of pretending like these weren't all things we could do before the book dropped, only better.  We're as much worse at taking objectives as we are at fighting. Relying on mirror dance to bail us out of how bad our rules are all over the place just means that a single knight incantor will be able to shut down these strategies  itself, yunno, if your dice don't.

    People aren't going to find 'more viable builds' because nothing changed. There were no significant updates outside of limitations a restrictions being added.

    This is more philosophical here but, every single one of these optimistic takes includes a sentence like: 'DoK requires more thinking and positioning' and 'if you play perfectly you might still be able to do stuff' like those aren't tacit admissions that the book is worse.

    Nah, on 6+ it SHOULD work theoretically more than 50% of the time. I made some stupid decisions that game as well as I am learning all the time and I don't know all details of enemy armies etc. (my hero died 2nd round, 2nd turn of my opponent so I casted that spell twice only, could have keep her back and then she could try 3rd time etc. It's not ARMY - it was MY fault. I wanted to shoot some morteks :D ). But even though I made few serious mistakes and was unlucky for teleport in the beginning - the game was close. What does it mean? It means that army is not so bad as one might think.

    Another mistake I made was charging SQ into 3 mortek crawlers, I had there also 10 blood sisters but due to lack of space (Shadow Queen is a big model) I did not capture that obj (If I did I think the game would be draw or even my win). That was my mistake for bad movement / pile in / decision making. Could do same with ANY army. It does not mean DoK suxx now.

    Going with your arguments that "it did not work that game = it suxx" -> DoK are designed around their buffs (auras, spells, prayers etc).

    So if someone had bad rolls for prayers and mindrazor and could not do alpha strike 1st round -> you say army is unplayable?

    I see I had many options and made bad decisions. That is all. But it was fun and I see I can improve.

    Armies with 1-2 playable builds with few decision making are boring for me and that is why I like DoK with new rules.

    Also - please note that it was learning game with test army build to see "how it plays now". It was SINGLE game of inexperienced DoK player vs EXPERIENCED OBR player. And still - it was close and I was NOT wholly wiped out even after round 5

     

    EDIT:

    Also - please note that even HAVING mirror dance spell (even failing it few times in a row) makes your opponent wary of what you can do with it as long as your hero is alive. Something like having khinerai in reserve. 

    EDIT2:

    You know what also went wrong? Failing my charge of blood sisters 6" from enemy TWICE (with CP reroll -> 2, 2 and 2,3 I think) which resulted in me getting to those mortek crawlers 1 round later. Not to mention they had mindrazor + catehism of murder on them.. Now you could say DoK suxx because they re-roll only 1s on charge? And we can't be happy we have this rule because it suxx if it did not work in one game?

    Also forgot to mention I forgot about my 5x khinerai summon from general and she died before using it. So many mistakes and still game was fun :)

    • Thanks 1

    AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion

    in Daughters of Khaine

    Posted · Edited by Jacek

    For endless spells / prayers invocation my opinion:

    Heart of Fury (80): Too expensive for what it does. Not all armies have 2+ dmg for attacks so for mass of 1 dmg hits it is not working at all. Too situational and even if needed in most critical time 3+ is too high risk for that price. Having 5 khinerai in reserve is better investment in my opinion. May be usable if you make build vs specific opponent to counter him or if you play torunaments where most of enemy players use armies with 2+ dmg attacks and you know it beforehand ?

    Bladewind (40): I don't see any real reason to take it, we have other ways to generate MWs and it is easy to dispel anyway. Ignore cover meaning also our units and opponent can utilize it if we get the first turn. Heavily depending on amount of terrain / obstacles if we want to use it's "ignore cover" so may be worth taking if you play with a lot of terrains etc. on the table and have 40 spare points as finishing touch and like the risk of enemy moving it (12" fly) for your disadvantage :)

    Bloodwrack Viper (40): This one seems very nice. Can move it ~18" (set-up wholly within 9" and move 9" fly). It affects only selected unit within 1" so even if opponent gets to move it - we can plan it and keep units out of it's reach. Useful for enemy heroes with 6- wounds characteristic (hello Sigvald :D ) or tough / elite units with multiple wounds that are hard to kill the normal way due to high save and / or reroll save etc. 40 pts that can fairly easily kill several times of point's cost of enemy unit.

     

×
×
  • Create New...