Rors
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Posts posted by Rors
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Cabalists are going to pull some crazy shenanigans too. I think a Lord of Change will be a good ally for them to get the +1 to cast bubble.
Soul boating combat heros out of no where, especially if they also have daemonic speed. Give a cheap hero a roll on eye of the gods with 3d6 and reroll 1 dice each hero phase is decent odds for a demon prince.
Or reliability to chuck winds of chaos through a spell portal.
I'm not sure what the best tech is but I think it'll be a great subfaction when someone works it out.
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9 hours ago, Koala said:
Yeah, that is obviously a wrong wording. Right now it will (on average) destroy any unit of 2wound and less models. (2/3*3,5 = 2,33 Mortal wounds per model in the unit).
It was probably meant to be per model in the unit the GBCharriot moved over.
Yeah "this" probably was intended as the gorebeast but I'm amazed that hot through drafting because it's an immediate FAQ and if the intention is the gorebeast it's broken English and terrible sentence structure.
Yeah, knights as allies will do some absolutely crazy stuff. @Grimrock@Grimrock
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Gorebeast are insane. As far as I can tell, a normal move doesn't have to be in a straight line, you can move forward an inch at the end of combat then wheel off to the side of go backwards.
Imagine hitting a hoard like gouls or zombies and getting to roll 40 dice with every 3+ being d6 mortal wounds.
Last book had an issue with lacking damage output but this new book has several units that can go nuclear.
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Let's gooooooooooo!
10 khorne knights putting out 40 attacks on 3s and 2s with rend 2 damage 2 and always strike first is a possible combo... They can also rally on a 4+
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Double range on the taker artifact looks like it could be fun too since it doubles the range... Cast bridge from outside unbind range and yeet kragnos in someone's face from up to 60 inches away.
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I doubt it'd happen but I'd really like them to develop the Oath stuff they teased with darkoath.It would be a cool and unique mechanic with Mad Max "witness me" vibes where units could declare they would do something and get some buffs, but if they failed they get punished. Like a unit declares they will kill a unit, gets +1 to wound and an extra rend. If they haven't killed the unit at the end of the turn they take mortal wounds or turn into spawn.
You could have undivided oaths, and oaths for each god, they could be better or less punishing when within aura range.
I just think it would be a powerful boost that has good strategy depth with some risk and very thematically on theme.
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17 hours ago, Ganigumo said:
Margin of error is a real thing in statistics. Its a measure of how inaccurate your results might be. Aiming for that 45-55% winrate band is the ideal that most games aim for. Doesn't mean you should stop balancing once you get there, but anything that falls out of it should become a high priority to address.
Yes margin of error is real, it's their spin that's BS. An army that is sitting on 50% might be at the 45% to 55% depending on what way the error swings. They're biasing their stats to only recognize a positive margin for 45% and a negative margin for 55% so basically, they're selling a 10% margin of error while pretending it's 5%. The reason they're doing that (IMO) is because they actually care more about perception of game ballance than having a super accurate means of measurement. Margin of error is there to help sell that narrative not to improve their balance strategy moving forward.
It's still a positive move and I'm glad they're doing it. It's just that like with the statement that bounty hunters are responsible for Kruelboys lower win rate, you need to sort out what's actually the data and what's PR from the marketing team.
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On 9/30/2022 at 2:04 PM, Ganigumo said:
The fact they lay the blame on bounty hunters is a sign they don't understand whats wrong with KB.
The only units even hit by it are boltboyz who die to a stiff breeze, hobgrots who we get killed intentionally, and gutrippaz who everybody avoided playing as much as possible even before bounty hunters.
The army needs significant rewrites, but I don't have any faith in them fixing it.
There's a good chance they know that's not it but can't say "we wrote ****** rules".
It's the same when they talk about "margin of error" for the balances to suggest that most armies are actually at a 50% win rate. There's a really good break down of it by the Honest Wargamer.
Anyway, I'd likely think this faction and gits will get the biggest improvements and it's unlikely they actually think it's dounty hunters causing the problem since they have the data. Even if they did though, unless they specifically made a rule that interacts with that key word, making the faction stronger against bounty hunters by making them cheaper or killier or sneakier or whatever, will still improve the win rate.
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So looking at the newest meta watch, nerfs will be coming.
What do you think will get nerfed and how can we adapt?
Half my BoC army is on the painting table and I'm waiting for the other half to arrive by mail so I'm really hoping it's not wrecked before I even get a game in.
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You still pay points for the endless spell you can autocast at the start of the game yeah? Just looking through a lot of lists here and people don't have any of them so I'm wondering if it's a free option they're not putting into lists.
Also, sigil looks really fun with some StD cultist allies. 70 points gets you 10 fangs that bring back a model every turn.. you could just sit the sigel with a couple units and summon 4 spawn a battleround while deck chair guarding a home objective.
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I'm thinking about a Nagash and Krondspine combo. It leave you on a crazy small budget for the rest of the list but it's two very big problems for the opponent to deal with. Also, it means Nagash is casting on +4.
I'm thinking something along the lines of grieving legion and 20 grimghast, then some chainrasps and either cogs + life swarm or a spell portal.
In a one drop.Shove 20 grimghast 9 inches from the line and teleport Nagash up behind them. Either unit can be sitting on a 4+ ward depending on what they try to deal with. Drop the chainrasp onto objectives.
I think it could just be threat saturation that's really hard to deal with. You're ahead in objectives, probably pinned in by grims, and there's two big resilient damage dealers just messing them up. It means you forgoe any screens for Nagash though.
I'll be trying the list this week.
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4 hours ago, ibel said:
Or they come in Unit of 10 with less Points for 5 and same Statline AND they can become batteline (#GalvanicVeterans)
I mean they Shows us 6 different Models so.... A Unit of 5 didnt make sense for me. A unit of 10 makes more for me.
Maybe a Unit of 10 with same Statline (Maybe with a save of 3+ would be nize) and this for mhmm 240 Points ?!
More likely the unit is now multiples of 6 in the soon to be released book and anyone who owned 5 or 10 will need to buy more.
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3 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:
That's a pretty awesome idea! Really not sure how it might fare, but with that many tiny individual units romping all over the place, could prove tough to deal with.
Yeah I think maybe the list could do okay if you just focused on screening out objectives and blocking their units from moving around the board. In hindsight I think I'd drop two Shagoths and out a Khorne demon prince in there so that the opponent is halving run and charge rolls.
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On 8/23/2022 at 4:15 PM, TechnoVampire said:
That seems fair. I haven’t had a chance to play with her yet and I don’t think she seems very competitive, but I own the model so I’ll probably use her in my casual games. I think if I was playing more competitively I’d be tempted to cut her and spend the points elsewhere, but I’m interested to know if others have found her particularly useful for a specific purpose?
I haven't used her much but the challenge is kinda that she does too much.The challenge is you're paying points for all of these so she really needs to be doing all of them. Trying to do so will often put her in risky situationations. If you don't though, you've paid points for abilities you didn't use. Some of them are also fairly random, the res ability can be great or it can really let you down, so there's a reliability issue.
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I came across an online proxy shop that sells 10 razorgor for 40 bucks (Aud). Since each model is 55 points I'm wondering about about getting 2 packs for 20 razorgor and that's half an army for dirty cheap and only 20 models to paint.
They seem okay looking at their scroll but objectively worse than the chariots that get better save, move, wounds, and more attacks for only 10 more points.
They do get mortal wounds on 6s when they charge though..
Has anyone had much experience with them?
I'm thinking about taking 30with a bunch of DOs and Shagoths. They can just screen out the board and their mortals might help with problems like nighthaunt.
Dragon Ogor Shaggoth (155) Dragon Ogor Shaggoth (155) Dragon Ogor Shaggoth (155)
1 x Razorgors (55) x20
3 x Dragon Ogors (125) x3
Doomblast Dirgehorn (30) Ravening Direflock (30)
Total: 2000 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 0 / 4 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 155 Drops: 26
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6 hours ago, greg19190 said:
They die... 😏 But they are more useful as a wound battery for your hero's so they can be protected from range attacks and bad placement so they can still do there thing, screens are a must at torniments and giant rats seem rubbish but having something that can soak up a charge or steal a galavets only point is megga think of a megga guargent not having an objective cause 1 giant rat is on it
all ways funny...
Maybe swap out the warpseer for an extra reinforsed ratoger unit and some giant rats (which come back on a 3+) and gray seer... Or if your trick is to do the death frenzy more use a warbringer.
Have you been able to play with this list alot?
I've not played with Skaven yet. I'm about to finish my current army and considering the next project.
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5 hours ago, GunslingerOy said:
I ran a sort of similar list with warbringer over warpseer and a 30 of storm vermin. You get one unit of rat ogres up field with dread death frenzy and death frenzy, rinse and repeat while the warbringer and stormvermin March up and slap. The stormvermin suck up damage for the master molders and the warbringer.
Double death frenzy certainly sounds potent. My reasoning for the warpseer is that the only clan bonus I care about in this list is the reliable charge, run, pike in bonus. Aside from that I figured I'd probably screen with the warpseer when I need to and use his warscroll spell to slow down another unit.
Stormvermin look like they hit like a truck but so squishy and in this edition how have you found them when bounty hunters show up?
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5 hours ago, greg19190 said:
There is nothing wrong with the list and the units you have slected will do stuff, what are you playing it against? And at what level?
Well ideally competitively against a range of opponents.
I'm not sure about having no screens but rat ogers seems quite good for their points cost and coming back on a 3+ seems really good.
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I'm thinking about picking up Skaven after many many years away (fantasy days). Can I have some advice on the list I've built?
Allegiance: Skaven
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Shapers of Beast-flesh
- Triumphs: Bloodthirsty
Leaders
Master Moulder (90)*
- Artefact: Rabid Crown
Master Moulder (90)*
Master Moulder (90)
Thanquol on Boneripper (415)*
- 4 Warpfire Braziers
- Lore of Ruin: Death Frenzy
Verminlord Warpseer (370)
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
Battleline
4 x Rat Ogors (280)*
- Reinforced x 1
4 x Rat Ogors (280)*
- Reinforced x 1
4 x Rat Ogors (280)*
- Reinforced x 1
Endless Spells & Invocations
Lauchon the Soulseeker (30)
Horrorghast (40)
Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment
Total: 1965 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 3 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 113
Drops: 3
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If you cast flaming weapon, give him finest hour and use all out attack you could certainly surprise someone when he suicides in with 2/2s damage 3 mortals.
While comparison with a vampire lord makes obvious sense, I don't see him that way. He's a small chaff piece that can trade up into high armor. He doesn't have huge damage output but it is very consistent output due to being all mortals. If you can get him stuck into fulminators or something he'd be okay as a counter charging sacrifice.
Not sold that's worth it in competitive play.. but yeah, while he is a vampire lord I don't think that's his comparison point due to having a different role.
He could also ride the boat in suicide into a high value target or just clear screens out of the way.
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What's your intention with the spider riders? Mobile screens?
In general, I think big yellers bolt boy lists have kinda been solved from what I've seen. You have a huge disadvantage against anything that has also skewed into shooting but at 30 inch range. You'll absolutely murder stuff like beastclaw raiders before they can break through the screens.
It seems to me that big yellers aren't bad exactly, it's just they're more prone to match up differentials than the average list.
So the meta at your tournament is going to make a big difference.
Unfortunately I think grinning blades is also a skew list by nature, just the inverse. Grinning blades love alpha shooting lists.
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I don't have any experience running 9 spirit host either but if there's lists that are winning with it then it's self evident that it can work.
That being said, especially in this edition, I really struggle to see why you would take 9 when you can take 3x3 and just clump them like a unit of 9. I guess drops is a factor but I don't usually see NH going for low drop builds.
In 9, so many hammers, especially if they're hunters will still lift the unit easily. 3x3 means if they're layered up, you get the same bonuses of 9, but they can only delete 3 on the charge unless they can pile in around all the units or have 3 inches melee.
Units like Lady O have better synergy with 3x3 for healing as does terminexus (assuming the unit of 3 has a model left). Maybe a unit of 6 with 3 behind it so you're more likely to have a unit to heal. I think a lot of the time though, stuff like mawcrushers that kills 3 will also kill 9.
There's also utility with 3x3. You can get more wave of terror in a pinch. You can unblob them and send one after an objective and still have your hero protected. There's probably other benefits I haven't considered.
This is theory though, if someone has tried 9 and found success, I'd be interested in hearing their reasons.
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Lauchon mirebrute wizard is a cool idea. It certainly helps with the lack of mobility, which is definitely where the mirebrute has a weakness
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20 hours ago, Smash said:
The only units myself and other people report not underperforming are the hobgrotz and the mirebrute. Why not spam them, with the added benefit of not getting totally shafted by shooting because of grinning blades.
My biggest issue here is actually buying the models for this list, as I would not enjoy painting 70 hobgrots and 6 mirebrutes only fit in this one list.
I was having a near identical thought process the other day.
The list I made was very similar too, only I didn't go so hard on hobgrots.
Instead I added in methdobby and an ally dankhold trog. I think Dobby's +1 hit aura really benefits mirebrutes and the danktrog gives a re-roll 1s to all trogs in 18.
That combo means you have less screens but the mirebrutes are hitting on 2s re-roll 1s.
The dankhold trog is pricey for his stat line but given how aggressively under costed mirebrutes are and the huge boost they get in combat through those buffs, I think it's a worthwhile consideration.
The mirebrutes can't get shot off and point for point, they'll win against a vast majority of units in combat.
Using the stats hammer app, a 180 point mirebrute in this army will do a rounded off average of 11 unsaved wou D's against a 2+ save and 23 against a - save unit. For 180 points!! I often play with stats hammer and I don't think I've seen damage output that good for that cheap before, although I'm not considering the cost of Dobby and the dankhold in this calculation.
all ways funny...
AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion
in Chaos
Posted · Edited by Rors
Both. In blades they loose the +1 attack on the charge but get it I bunch of other ways along with the same buffs those allies can give them in slaves.