Jump to content

Nezzhil

Members
 View Profile  See their activity

  • Posts

    2,349

  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    19

 Content Type 

Posts posted by Nezzhil

    Sons of Behemat Discussion 👣

    in Destruction

    Posted

    FAQs UP!!

     

    "Change the first sentence of the rule to: ‘When this model makes a normal move, it can ignore models that have a Wounds characteristic of 10 or less, endless spells, magmic invocations, judgements of Khorne and terrain features that are less than 4" tall at their highest point."

    "Q: Some objectives behave differently in different areas of the battlefield (e.g. ‘Battleplan: Scorched Earth 2020’ or ‘Battleplan: Border War’). Does this mean that the value of an objective can change when it’s kicked into different territories? A: Yes."

    "Q: The designer’s note on ‘Mightier Makes Rightier’ states that in battleplans that do not follow the normal rules for controlling objectives, you can pick whether to use the battle trait or to follow the rules from the battleplan. Does this mean, for example, in ‘Battleplan: Places of Arcane Power’, I could choose to contest an objective with a friendly Mancrusher unit even though it does not have the Leader battlefield role? A: Yes."

    • Like 1
    • Thanks 1

    AoS 2 - Gloomspite Gitz Discussion

    in Destruction

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Aelfric said:

    Don't forget that basic Grots do not have a sub-faction.  There's still hope that Skragrott perhaps will get sub-faction rules in Broken Realms.  I'm sure Gordrak will have some use for them in the Waaagh to end all Waaaghs.

    I'm not sure if Gordrakk is using Skragrott or Skragrott is using Gordrakk... who knows...

    • Like 2

    The Rumour Thread

    in Age of Sigmar Discussions

    Posted

    8 minutes ago, Athrawes said:

    This is wrong. Sisters of Battle were released as part of psychic awakening tied in with faith and fury. Additionally, both Aeldari and Drukari, got new units in addition to new heroes with the Phoenix rising box set. 

    I'm not wrong, the motive of the launchment of the boxset months earlier was because they promised to release Sisters in the 2019. Sisters of Battle were delayed, they were planned to be released earlier but the project was very big and complex.

    Aeldari and Drukhari units weren't new, they were a resculpt and only two units. You are talking about a new subarmy.

    • Confused 1

    The Rumour Thread

    in Age of Sigmar Discussions

    Posted · Edited by Nezzhil

    For Slaanesh will be the new Broken Realms book and it's enough:


    - The campaigns like this are created to shake the interesting of the game before a new edition, and to avoid to release "half-edition book" like DoK or Nurgle.

    - PA didn't release any new game of miniatures, only a few characters.

    - We know from the last Preview that Mechanicus, Sisters, Orks and Drukhari will have new miniatures in the next months.

    - GW is very apprehensive to release a big new miniature release for an army without a new battletome/codex for it. Only the Spaces Marine Primaris are the exception.

    - W40k is the BIG game and it needs news every few months.

    - They are going to release a Xenos army in January.

    - The plates and shoulder pads are 100% Drukhari.

    • Confused 1

    The Rumour Thread

    in Age of Sigmar Discussions

    Posted

    6 minutes ago, The Brotherhood of Necros said:

    Crossing fingers Decadence encompasses two teases — Drukhari 40k AND Slaanesh AoS...

    I don't expect a new Battletome before the release of the new Core Set.

     

    1 minute ago, Elazar The Glorified said:

    The shoulder pad looks Drukhari but the owner of the shoulder pad looks quite chunky for an Eldar but could just be the angle etc

    I think it is Vect in his throne.

    The Rumour Thread

    in Age of Sigmar Discussions

    Posted

    It is Conspiracy time!!

    Element Games have a lot of articles with a date of reposition from June. For the "conspiracy moment," I'm gonna avoid the only "available to order" boxes.

    If we take a look, all of them have the AoS 1.0 brand but we have three grand exceptions:

    - Slaanesh
    - Flesh-Eaters
    - Nighthaunt

     

    AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

    in Chaos

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Grimrock said:

    Sorry, I've removed the 'wrong' part because it was overly antagonistic. 

    The problem is you're taking an FAQ that is specifically clearing up a different rule and using it as an excuse to change a rule to be the way you want it. The reason the FAQ on 'counts as their movement' was needed is there was no indication on whether that instance of 'counts as' impacted their ability to use other rules. Similarly, there is no indication in the rules that 'count as slain' is meant to prevent 'Split and Split Again' from being used.  Of course 'count as' does imply that a fleeing model is not explicitly slain. The problem is we don't know what that entails. We don't know if they count as slain for the purposes of triggers, victory conditions, healing, or anything else. In the absence of a clarification one could assume it means anything or nothing. Since we have no way of knowing which assumptions are correct and which aren't we are stuck going back to the rule as written.

    No problem, I'm 100% agree with you 😄

    • Like 1

    AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

    in Chaos

    Posted

    4 minutes ago, Grimrock said:

    Well then I'm sorry to say but you've been playing those rules wrong.

    There are definitely instances where 'count as' are not equal to the original statement, and that makes perfect sense because what would be the point of saying 'count as' in the first place? The issue with this rule is that there are no limiters to the statement to define what 'count as' means. We can guess at it all day long, but there is nothing in the rules to support those guesses. You can say that a model counting as slain shouldn't get the benefit of one rule or another because it doesn't make sense, but that doesn't suddenly make it a core rule. Until we get an FAQ or clarification, counts as slain can mean nothing other than counts as slain. 

    Why is your argument the truth and am I wrong?
    I'm assuming that the wording of any FAQ is applied to all the cases with the same wording. You are assuming that the game didn't contain any wording and all the cases must be explained, as a player of a lot of games that is unthinkable to me.

    Please tell me a FAQ that said "as count" implies all the possible effects.

    AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

    in Chaos

    Posted · Edited by Nezzhil

    13 minutes ago, Grimrock said:

    Listen guys, I know it seems weird but there are no restrictions in the rules on what 'counts as slain' means. Currently as the rules are written the only direct interpretation is that the models count as slain for all purposes. It doesn't say 'counts as slain for the purposes of victory conditions' or 'counts as slain except for the purposes of triggering special rules', it says 'counts as slain'. That means they count as slain, full stop. We have a restriction for 'counts as their move' due to the FAQ, but nothing for slain. Until we have a restriction or an FAQ, there is absolutely nothing in the rules that supports your argument directly and telling people that they're wrong when using the rules as written is silly. I wouldn't be surprised at all if they FAQ it later to support your arguments, but as of right now they're only based on your feelings of what you think should be correct. A model that flees counts as slain, and all things that apply to slain apply to fleeing. 

    As for other triggers that work with slain, there are usually limits on them that keep them from working in the battleshock phase. I don't know Skaven, but I do know Khorne blood warriors for example say 'If a model from this unit is slain in the combat phase'. There are similar limitations on skullreapers and the bood tithe table, but nothing on wrathmongers. GW could have easily applied a similar limitation on Horrors like 'when this model is slain in any phase other than battleshock', but they didn't. 

    The Skaven is at any moment, the Ushoran is at any moment, the Icon is at any moment and we never apply that.

    Your statement implies that AoS core rules are trash. If we can't use the wording of the FAQs to resolve question like "what it means 'as X'" it implies that none of the abilities could be evaluated as RAW because none of the words are FAQed and well explained for all the cases and purposes.

    I can argue that as RAW "'as count' is not 100% equal to 'is'" because a FAQ restricts the "as count" and it is the only reference we have that explains what it is "as count" for the wording of the rules. 

    AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

    in Chaos

    Posted

    And we have some FAQs that like this:

    "Q: Some abilities allow you to remove a unit from the battlefield and set it up again, and say that this ‘counts as their move for the movement phase’ (or words to that effect). Do these units count as having made a move for the purposes of any other rules or abilities? A: No, it simply restricts them from making a move later  on."

    When an effect is "as other state", it is only applicable to the evaluate the state of a model but it can't be used to trigger other effects caused by abilities.

    For example: "You can attack with a unit in the Hero phase that model but you can't use CT of the combat phase because you are not in the combat phase." or "You can return models that were slain but the moment when a model was removed by a battleshock don't trigger the slain event".

    AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

    in Chaos

    Posted

    10 minutes ago, Kasper said:

    Im just not convinced that this directly describes the difference between "count as slain" and "is slain" as you so desire it to be. The answer just explains that a unit is destroyed and count towards things such as kill points etc. regardless if you remove the unit due to a failed battleshock, or if it has been wiped in combat. 

    Ok, but that implies that only the Tzeentch players are clever to understand that. The general consensus is that I expect o see a lot of Skaven player using the Death Frenzy + Warbringer spell, or Ossiarch players using the fled models with a Harvester, or the STD or FeC Endless Spell counting the fled models. But, all these powerful strategies are dismissed and I don't understand why.

    AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

    in Chaos

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Kasper said:

    I cant find anywhere that describes the difference between "fled models that count as being slain" and straight up "slain models". Ultimately the model is dead and removed from play. Honestly I think the RAI is becoming "just as crazy". People make up their own rules and interpretations of rules, instead of keeping things simpler and just looking at what the rules say.

    "Some abilities refer to units that have been ‘destroyed’. What does this mean exactly?
    A: A unit is considered to be destroyed when the last model from the unit is slain or flees. When measuring the range to a destroyed unit, measure to the position occupied by the last model in the unit to be slain or flee."

    A model that fled is not dead. You can't add words to the rule too. A model that flee is removed from the game and it count as slain, but it isn't slain. Why do you need to add all this verbose when the slain rule remove the models from the game too? They could said "then slain X numbers of models from the unit" or something like that.

    AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

    in Chaos

    Posted · Edited by Nezzhil

    32 minutes ago, Kasper said:

    The Death Frenzy should work too. Otherwise what is the intention of "count as slain" at all then? Is it just for the old system of tiebreakers? It sounds like an awful mess if you have to keep track of what models died and what models fled from battleshock in regards to return/healing mechanics etc.

    But it wasn't a problem a year ago. 

    Another point is the FAQs difference fled models and slain models.

    I think that during the last year the RAW is becoming crazy and we are forgotten some things in the past Battletomes and older rules or FAQs because we need to justify the power creep and the points cost of some units.

×
×
  • Create New...