[What would you like for AoS 3]

3 minutes ago, Bayul said:

None of this requires a new edition.

Nope but a new edition increases the likelihood 

[What Percentage of Models Should be Left on the Table at the End of the Game]

Again, I’m utterly agnostic. To my experience, no two games of AoS are ever quite the same and GW has made an effort each year to improve their battleplans, with GHB 2020 being particularly excellent in that regard.

I would like more battleplans that have a variety of “objectives” and not just holding a space, for example objectives along the lines of their previous Hidden Agendas, so that we can further vary the outcome. For example, for each round that your General is alive gain escalating VP. 
 

To me, no single battle should be judged by the remaining models on the table. Yes, it’s nice to have survivors; being tabled isn’t fun but I’m glad it’s part of the game. I ate my fair share of humiliating defeats in that regard, particularly my first year but I learned from it. AoS as a game should be, and is, fun but not each individual battle can be. 
 

As a player I like to play though, once I see I have no path to VP victory, I start setting my own goals. That said, if it’s late or time is short, I will concede early.
 

[What would you like for AoS 3]

Wishlisting:

• More useful battalions for CoS and new cities
• New plastics for Seraphon, Skaven, Beasts Of Chaos
• Chaos Undivided for StD w/Belakor (in plastic) as General option
• Updated Gloomspite tome that integrates the new White Dwarf rules
• Duardin United Battletome that includes Dispossessed
• Beasts Of Chaos new tome including the god-marked models
• New models/units for Ironjawz & Bonesplitterz

[AoS 2 - Bonesplitterz Discussion]

[AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/02/05/the-evolution-of-the-beastmen/

[Discussion of AoS Rules Crunch]

Better than eating spam 

[What is Your Idealized Rate of Model Loss in a Game?]

58 minutes ago, yukishiro1 said:

In the brave new world of ranged AOS, you don't even need to ****** up your deployment to get cleared off the table, all that needs to happen is you lose the roll-off and get double-turned on the T1 to T2 transition, and the ranged army has about an 85% chance of winning the game from that point. Unless you play a faction like IDK that can control where the ranged attacks go, screening won't typically stop you from starting your T2 with half or less of your army. 

Sounds like you’ve had some really bad experiences. 

[Discussion of AoS Rules Crunch]

I’ve always struggled with taking a MW off a to-hit roll rather than a to-wound roll. Shouldn’t the wound roll determine if the wound is mortal or not?

[What is Your Idealized Rate of Model Loss in a Game?]

If GW revamps Path To Glory to be more like 40K Crusade, I think that would make many people happy, in terms of how games play.

[What is Your Idealized Rate of Model Loss in a Game?]

I am utterly agnostic.

My first year of playing a very underpowered army, I was disheartened to see the rate at which my models vacated the table. It was certainly humbling; but it also forced me to adapt. As I've improved as a player, I've learned to enjoy the diverse variety of outcomes AoS provides, from being tabled T2 to duking it out til T5. While I never played WHFB, from my observations of that game, it seemed like a total slog, highly repetitive. I've played very few games of AoS that were similar to each other.

One caveat is that I'm only a casual painter and fully own-up to buying painted models/units as suits me. I'd estimate having only painted 1/3 of my stuff myself, so I am less invested on that scale, in terms of model removal. I do get why it bothers the more dedicated hobby-ers.

I do think AoS could use an overhaul in terms of a) the amount of MW spam & b) a standardization of reach/rend/dmg for shooting & melee. There are also too many shrug saves and not enough Battleshock -- all intentional, I think, by GW, to speed the game up. I would rather they dial that stuff back, crank up the points, and get back to a smaller footprint game.

[Range that needs updating]

BoC are highly underrated on the table, imo.

[AoS 2 - Beasts of Chaos Discussion]

Anyone have any good Razorgor proxy ideas? I was thinking of using Gorebeasts.

[What would you like for AoS 3]

On a snarky note, we know GW wants to speed the game up so maybe broken shooting is how they envision it 😉

[Range that needs updating]

Bullgors look awesome to me: I have 12

[What would you like for AoS 3]

1 hour ago, yukishiro1 said:

Nobody's talking about getting double turned by that dude with a single weirdnob shaman. Kroak can hit anything anywhere on the board. Teclis can portal and then cast through it, on minimum 10s and on 12s if he really wants to, hitting potentially your entire army twice. KO will drop an uncounterable WLV on you and have it go off 3x before you can do anything about it if they get the double. A LoC's average casting roll is about a 9.5, or an 11.5 with the trait to reroll casting rolls. Shooting focused-armies all have either teleports that don't even require a casting roll (KO, Tzeentch, Seraphon) or 30" range and ability to ignore LOS (LRL). 

Not trying to be rude here at all, but it sounds like you don't play against the sort of competitive ranged lists people are discussing, because you absolutely cannot screen them out, and you absolutely cannot weather their firepower for two turns of their whole army going at you. These lists are all capable of destroying over 50% of the opponent's force over the double turn. 

You’re right, I don’t normally face net lists. Only a sliver of those who play Warhammer do. But I have faced many magic & shooting strong armies like Tzeentch, Skaven, & CoS.

Should those things be nerfed? Yes. Does it mean double turns are unviable as a mechanic? No.

[What would you like for AoS 3]

5 hours ago, Ragest said:

Double turn works fine with melee, you can screen and you have alternating activations.

But what about magic and shooting? That’s the real problem to me, not double turn per se.

Magic can be scary but I also find that outside a few super-casters, magic only goes off about 50% of the time, and that’s before unbind. It’s also easy to keep squishy Heroes out of most spell ranges.

I screen for shooting with expendable chaff units whenever I can. Yeah, the new Lumineth rule is a bummer abs Soulscream Bridge is annoying but generally, I find you can weather a double turn of shooting if you’ve prepared yourself for it. If I don’t have a low drop army, I always set-up and prep to be double turned.

[The Rumour Thread]

Grotbag Scuttlers, perhaps? The bottom of a ship with Duardin trophies dangling off?

[What would you like for AoS 3]

As someone who lost dozens of games in my first year playing, rarely was the double-turn the sole reason. Getting double turned on def sucks as a new player but then getting to do it yourself can really teach you how to maximize your army, as well as how to defend against the double turn. And the latter is the key take-away: I stopped losing when I started learning how to screen properly and use my movement to create charge threat bubbles to prevent absorbing too much dmg on a double turn. I think it’s a great mechanic and I hope they don’t get rid of it

[Beasts of Chaos army rules changes ideas]

I’d love to see a battalion for hunting packs of Centigors, Razorgors & Chaos Hounds — all with new plastic kits, natch! Would make a great battlebox, GW, especially with a new, named Centigor hero.

[Beasts of Chaos army rules changes ideas]

Our Ambush ability should mimic Living City. We should be a premier Ambush army.  The Darkwalker redeploy should also be standard.

[Range that needs updating]

1 hour ago, Overread said:

How come? 

Most of the traditional forest range of BoC is still resin or metal; the aesthetic is Old World and we see that aesthetic slowly getting squatted or replaced. New plastics are god specific and that will continue. I could see BoC as a separate army going away, maybe the generics being absorbed into StD. 

[Range that needs updating]

I fear BoC’s days as an army are numbered.

[What would you like for AoS 3]

Many battles in history have been won off luck & random elements. The double turn reflects that, IMO.

Make shooting be YGIG like combat and beef up Look Out Sir and/or allow wound soaking bodyguards for Heroes and you solve the issue without losing the double turn.

The lack of double turn in 40K is why I’ve never started playing it. 

[What would you like for AoS 3]

Personally, I love the double turn because it gives weaker armies (like my BoC) a chance to actually win games! It could use some incentive tweaking though. I like the idea that the person who suffers the double turn gains a CP to spend on things like Inspired Presence or you get an auto-ability like “Dug In” that lets you pick one unit to either auto-pass Battleshock or get +1 Save, forcing you opponent to make hard choices.

Speaking of Battleshock, I def think it needs an overhaul: 1) too many units (sometimes whole armies) are immune to it for the whole game now. As a mechanic, Battleshock immunity can be very fluffy but it needs to be used sparingly, like the Oathstone. It should always be a CP spend, IMO.

I don’t want to roll more dice, ala making Battleshock rolls for each model in a unit. But I don’t really know what would work better. Nothing is more backbreaking to me, as a BoC, player than to have 20+ Ungors run away.

I have issues with mvt too, particularly failed charges. @Beer & Pretzels Gamer has some good thoughts on fixing that. Maybe he will share.

I’d also like to see melee weapon range & rend standardized to reflect the model. Mega-Gargant melee profiles really revealed how flawed many of the game’s melee weapon profiles are.

If they are gonna squat models, units, or armies, I’d love some advance notice.

Overall though,  I’m happy with how AoS has evolved. If they revised Path To Glory to be more like 40K Crusade, I’d be ecstatic! More narrative gaming is always a plus.

 

[AoS 2 - Soulblight Discussion]

After a quick battletome perusal, this is what I've come up with. Totally see the glaring weaknesses in terms of screening off my Heroes and maintaining a strong objective presence. On the other hand, it also looks like it would hit like a hammer and maybe I just need to play to table.

Allegiance: Soulblight
- Bloodline: Dragon Warriors
Prince Vhordrai (460)
- Lore of the Vampires: Soulpike
Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (440)
- General
- Vampiric Sword & Shield & Chalice
- Command Trait: Mist Form
- Artefact: The Saccharine Goblet
- Lore of the Vampires: Vile Transference
Coven Throne (240)
- Lore of the Vampires: Spirit Gale
Vampire Lord (140)
- Lore of the Vampires: Amaranthine Orb
6 x Vargheists (300)
3 x Vargheists (150)
3 x Vargheists (150)
5 x Dire Wolves (70)
- Allies
Extra Command Point (50)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 70 / 400
Wounds: 103
 

Run the Dire Wolves out as an early objective grabber/distraction, while I focus on just overrunning my opponent with multiple charges. Strong spellcasting a plus too. An optimized list? No way, but for the games I play on Zoom with @Beer & Pretzels Gamer, which tend to run toward elite builds for brevity's sake, could be fun.