Myrdin
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Posts posted by Myrdin
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34 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
Ah The Old World, just don't know if I will be able to muster the will to do another game. The base-shapes will for sure make or break it. Wonder if Kings of War has Dark Elves?
I am on the fence about my Cthulhu Cult city. It would be more functional and practical to make it a pure DE cult. But a more authentic such cult would have a high priest surrounded by a throng of dispensable maniacs: Pontifex w 20-30 Flagellants. But I want them to be sort of aquatic, so maybe I could use the 20 Corsairs I have unbuilt to make the Flagellants, but with Chaos Marauder/Forsaken style torsos/arms. Sea-helmets are fine I think. Plus the Pontifex and entourage would help out my Stanks also.
Of course a Cthulhu will be expensive (megagargant kit plus Mutalith kit, and spare chimera wings) and not synergistic or helpful at all with the City itself, just like an Old One should be.
You might find some use in this then. And if it would prove to be to costly (since its always cheaper to print for yourself then have someone print for you), you can just get those Davy Johnes heads, and slap them on any torso you desire. Little bit of greenstuff, some bitz and the correct color scheme and your Ctulhians will be ready to "summon the Kraken!" to quote the octobeard capt`n
Spoiler.jpg.b06cf094b1e712ae568e19f3990c5e2a.jpg)
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43 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
Definitely one reason I'm a little nervous I overbought with the D'Aelves...besides having too much stuff already. But the Black Guard and Excecutioners are pretty awesome looking, and really kinda almost proxyable as Lumineth spear and sword guys....they could be the opposite: the Lumbraneth. Until Malerion finally gets his act together and makes a battletome. Then they might find a home there?!
But should be at least a couple years longer we'll be able to use these oldies. So maybe I need 80 Corsairs?
Worst case scenario you will be well equipped for when / if the Old World drops in.
Thats kinda my second hope for using what I have. After taking stock I can fill out around 85%-90% of the old High Elf roster (funny coz I started building this thematic proxi army as Empire originally
), so as long as they dont scrap that idea and as long as the game doesnt return back to square bases, we should be fine.
I took another read through the new CoS tome and I just... cant see it in any way other than a massive nerf to already mid tier level army. Wont be able to utilize all I have, but at least some of the stuff is still viable. But once Dwarves (just copters and bombers) and DElves (a lot of stuff... ouch) will go bye bye in a couple of years it will suck. Hopefully by then we get proper replacement human units added, so that the HUMAN CoS can still work as a nice fun army that can do a bit of everything, be it cavalry, infantry, elite infantry, monsters, or ranged supremacy and spellcasting lists. If not ? Well... yeah, gotta keep those fingers crossed for Old World I guess.
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57 minutes ago, Austin said:
I just get so confused at the decisions GW makes. They correctly identify that this picture is awesome, and yet....no unit like this for new Cities of Sigmar.
Well once they remove the DE and Dwarves the HUMAN, part of the army will be lacking a lot of options.
Removal of Greatswords at least makes sense due to the old sculpts that simply didnt look good anymore (compared to outriders and pistolers who were still pretty well fitting. Demigryfs... well... their scale size was smaller than many other, especially new models in that unit type so while I hate it, I can justify why they got removed).
Then again, after checking out the Lumineht book... and finding out they are horribly designed "cough cough" army with only 5 units and everything else being heroes, I wouldnt put it past GW to simply not add more units for COS down the line.
Though some level of hopium in me remains that we`ll see new Demis, Greatswords and Pistolers kits making a return.
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Hi everone.
Former CoS, now potential Lumineth player here. I came here hoping for some advice.
EDIT: Ah nvm, I just noticed the entire Lumineth subthread is pretty much dead for quite some time
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7 hours ago, Satyrical Sophist said:
I absolutely understand the disappointment of units leaving. Some of them I don't quite understand, others I kind of do, but regardless it sucks. I ended up with at least 2k in elves that rotated out. For some of the units there is a good substitute, but others are harder. If you want to vent I understand completely and feel free to ignore the next section.
The easier unit proxies I see are.
Empire
Free Guild General on Foot -> Freeguild Marshal
Freeguild Crossbows/Handgunners -> Fusiliers (Needs rebasing, and perhaps parvises if you wanted)
Free Guild Guard -> Steel helms.
Free Guild Pistoliers/Outriders -> Caviliers (More of a stretch, but freeguild on horse is still freeguild on horse. Doesn't have range but is charge dependent. More of a fix for pistoliers)
High Elf.
Phoenix Guard -> Black Guard (Elf with halberd to Elf with halberd, this is what I'm planning on doing).
Shadow Warriors/Sisters of Avalorn -> Crossbow and Sword Corsairs. (I'm looking at doing this as well with my shadow warriors, and it lets you easily tell the difference between the double blade variant as well)
Phoenixs -> Black dragon riders, either dread lord or sorceress, just be clear.
Wood Elf.
Wildwood Rangers/Eternal Guard. -> Wildwood Rangers fit neatly as Executioners, I built my eternal guard without shields so I'm tempted to run eternal guard as executioners as well, though dread spears are also an option.
Sisters of the Thorn/Wild Riders -> Drake spawn Knights are still elves riding unusual mounts.
Nomad Prince -> I'd probably run as one of the other elf heroes, either a sorceress or a fleet master.
There are some harder things to work out what to substitute I have to admit, where you run the risk of making it too confusing. The difficult ones are.
Hellblaster/Helstorm.
Freeguild Greatswords.
Demigryph Knights.
I do wonder whether there was originally a heavy cav option and a heavy infantry option that didn't make it in, there is some speculation that there might be a wave 2 faster than you'd expect, though I'm unsure as to how much people are hoping on that one. My advice for these is more of a stretch.
The hellblaster and hellstorm, I think the closest is to mount it on a larger base including the crew and run as the new cannon. I'm still not sure how big the cannon base is, you could do some earth works around it to bulk up the original artillery.
Greatswords I think you run as executioners and just stress to the opponent that they are aelves and therefore cannot get human buffs. Its not the best, but it is the closest option that preserves their role. If you want to keep them as human, steel helms.
Demigryph knights are the one I'm struggling with the most. The best I can come up with is mount three on a single large base and run as a monster, probably the steam tank. Its a bit of a weird push, but best I can do.
Longer term, if you wanted your models to have a home in say, 4th or 5th edition? There are definitely options in lumineth. All the spear using aelves can be Lumineth Wardens. Shadow Warriors and sisters can be sentinels, riders can be Dawn Riders, heavy sword users can be blade lords, and I quite like the idea of using the halberd elves as stoneguard. If they ever remove aelves from cities they have a home in lumineth.
As for dwarfs, the only way I see that happening is if there is a new dwarf faction that ends up taking the iron drake/breakers and long beards,.
I'm not trying to say what happened wasn't heart breaking, but I'm trying to look on the bright side.
Funny thing you mentioning the Aelfs. I found out yesterday after doing the countdown that I have lot of those as well.
If I were to port my current CoS army to the Old world, they would fill out most of the High Elf or Dark Elf roster, despite me originaly starting it as a themed proxi WFB Empire 😅After sleeping on it, you are right. I guess Lumineth would be a solid secondary home, some units would loose their place, but the waste would be minimal compared to what I am loosing now with the future CoS. Especially if the Pheonixes get added to them (just a rumor I heard, no real source).
So its either those or the Old World High Elves as long as they wont revert back to the horrible square base system. I am not rebasing the entire thing a second time xd.
I guess I should hop into the Lumineth thread and ask there for the model count as advise. Cheers
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Spoiler
Oh wow, so I went through the book and to be honest I strongly dislike it. Even hate it all things considered They removed some of my favorite units, Shadow Warriors being one, Pistollers being second. Srsly... the Demigryphs are also gone.... I cant believe they scrapped those as well... wow, I havent felt this dissapointed with a new army release for several years.
The first one I can understand though I hate the logic behind it.
The second I dont understand at all. That was an iconic unit of this army even from before AoS, and it was a GREAT unit.
And all of HE and WE stuff is just gone like that as well. Basically all that money, time and effort gone. I guess that was to be expected considering CoS book was a amalgamation to keep the old fans around. Shame on me having hoped for them to keep it and work on that multiracial themed city with all sorts of fun builds.
We got no replacement for that, zero zilch. Hell with removal of the Wood elf units, we lost the other fast, ranged cav options as well (to hell with Dark Riders).
Why GW ? Why was it necessary to remove this unit. Taking away Hellblaster and Hellstorm battery and giving us a crappy cannon in return. This entire book feels like a nerf to me. Even if not to the rules, than to the FUN aspect for sure.
Bunch of skills becoming HUMAN only, gives you a very clear idea where this army is going and whats going to happen few years down the line once CoS get the "next" book. No more DnD fantasy style mixed race cities. Sure some of the new stuff is cool but frankly it doesnt matter to me if bunch of my stuff cant be used any longer.
And whats pissing me off the most is, that sure ok take away the units, fine. But REPLACE them with units of equal worth.
The Ogor is a joke of a unit... and its a single model unit as well. Sure as hell wasnt worth loosing those Demigryphs over it.
I guess thats it for me as a CoS player... damn this makes me sad, unless GW suddenly adds bunch of those units I have to find a new placement for my miniatures with some other army, and I dont think there is one with the range of units to cover for the old (still current atm) CoS book. I still remember the joy I had making river bases for my Demi proxis... all of that worthless now. Maybe if they release the revamped Oldhammer Fantasy they might still see table, but thats a big if and when.
Just me venting the sadness and disappointment after reading the soon to be current battletome, feel free to skip.
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Is there a summary of all the upcoming changes, including the warscrolls for new or changed units ?
Are Shadow Warriors still in ?
Unless its against the rules can someone pls link it ?
Or if it is, just point me the right way and I`ll look it up. -
1 hour ago, Flippy said:
Have you already seen this? Looks like an in-depth analysis.
So THATs why Lord Krungharr is so hyped about the Steam Tanks.
The removal of degredation table a changing some of ST randomnes namely its movement are huge overall buffs, before you even take a look at the improved shooting.
Damn I might have to get around finishing mine, since this looks promising
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13 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:
For my Cthulhu Cult Cities army, wondering if it's just terrible to ally in Bundo Whalebiter the megagargant....of course making him into a Cthulhu monster with a Mutalith face and tiny wings and scary claws of some sort? He's 440 points, is the one who can kick objectives, and stuff up to three tiny enemies in his net. Not bad actually, much better than the crappy One Eyed Grunnock Warstomper that Chaos gets.
Wondering if too much theme will sacrifice viability. I could do 2 Kharybdisses and 2 WarHydras instead for the monsters. War Hydras do seem superior for the shooting and healing, but the no Inspiring Presence/Rally bubbles are pretty nice too actually.
Nah go for it.
My entire army is Cathay-Nippon themed, and there are units I simply do not have a proper proxi for (entire dwarf line), so I dont field them. It would be great to field some of those units since they are a part of the book (talking about the previous one) and not having access to them does gimp me here and there, but its doable.
And mainly its fun playing the theme you`ve set out to play with.
That being said, if I ever get a good proxi I will try to hamfist them in haha. Saw some nice 3D printable Oni. If downscaled they might make for good hammerers.
This new book and some of the characters and units are making me hyped, since I have some good replacement for them, yet had nothing to use them for in the previous one (mostly all those support characters, and the Ogre with his sniper hummie buddy, that one I have a great thematic proxi for, though it depends on the base size the ogor is using).
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Has the release date been confirmed already ?
If so when can we expect the book to hit the shelves ?
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Hmm havent been in touch with AoS and namley CoS for almost 2 years, but since we are getting a new book I started catching up a little here and there and one of the things I noticed is we are loosing the Wanderers in their entirety.
That .... stings a bit, since the MW archers were some of the best units CoS could put on the table. And while not amazing wild riders were kinda meh/fun to play, mostly for the cool models.
Just hope the new artillery pieces will make up for it, coz Sigmar knows for a faction that uses so much gunpowder heavy weaponry as CoS does in the lore, our artillery units were utter joke that was outdone by Stormcast balista point per point and later even the orkoblins and their arbalets.
I also heard the enitre current human CoS line is getting cut... so no Demigryphs, no General on Gryphon, no Hurricanum/Luminark (this one would suck especially badly).... boy I hope that this rumor is false. I am sure many besides me have plenty of those nice looking models and it would be a damn shame if those were no longer part of the new book.
With how the whole "Azyrite" thing is shaping up I wonder if we get back a new updated version of the old papa mobile for the reimagined warrior priest to ride on. That would be cool.
One thing that DOES rub me the wrong way though is the Chimera character.... Sooooo BoC cant have feral manticores, nuh uh sir, but CoS has a tamed one ? ....Ok chief, whatever you say >__>
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Possible new Gor scuplts after all this time ?
Yes I know this is 40K but look at the models themself. You replace the weapons, and maybe few of the trinkets and you have a proper AoS Gor right there. Pretty much what they did with Tzaangors, could be done here as well.
I mean, its about damn time Beastmen got some new scuplts consider the age of our model lines.
What do you think, possible or not ?
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So with some time to playtest the thing, how is everyone finding the new book ?
What works and what doesnt ? Share some thoughts and experiences with the new Beasts
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4 hours ago, The Red King said:
Side note. FAQ is up. Nothing huge. Somehow enlightened on foot were changed to 90 points so I dont know how that typo made it in?
Yeah plenty of people had suspicion that their original price must have been a typo.
Ah look, Jabber can fly once more (lol)... srsly it, one has ot ask whether there is quality control at all in that company.
For those who want to take a look, here is the FAQ link:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/VVSN027n3ReY8FSH.pdf
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57 minutes ago, Dolomedes said:
I agree, the cost doesn't really justify the output. I think there's a place for them as an anvil unit if their points come down a bit. Bestigors, like Dragon Ogres and the Shaggoth, are likely over costed because of how well they did last season.
We have to settle up our 'Fun tax'.I think they missed out on making Bestigors feel "truly elite" by not giving them the Elite rule heh. I like the idea of them interacting when command points are being spent on orders, but this current version seems more like a half thought through beta test of what it could and should actually be for the unit to have a proper place while being fun.
My TLDR interpretation of their abilities would be: Despoilers - "when a unit within 6" of this unit (Bestigors) receives a Order, this unit gains +1 attack up to max of 1 for that turn."
Remove the second ability and instead give them the Elite special rule.
Drop them to 180-200 points and go have some well deserved fun.
In this way you would have a self sufficient unit that is no longer reliant just on the enemy orders but can pop their own if need to be, and become a grindy anvil or almost as choppy unit like Tzaangors.
Sadly Warscrolls dont change in between books (or a miracle redraw of the unit happens), so the best we can hope for now is them dropping to 160, where with the current rules they might at least be considered viable. (since Tzaans are at 170).
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Bestigors are way to overpriced in my oppinion. If they were 160 I`d say that be a somewhat fair price, considering they are 2A and 1 dmg only and in the point range they sit now everything else we have hits harder or lasts longer, or both.
At this point cost they need to have more synergy with their own passive abilities and better stat line. If not then they need to drop a big chunk in points.
A good player making big plays with Beastmen is not unheard of, but thats the 1/100 veteran who can play literally any other army and still come on top case.
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12 minutes ago, Sinfullyvannila said:
Yeah, on reading through the lore on Shaggoths; its a really shame they don't leverage them more. There's a lot of potential to make a serious antagonist opposite Stormcast.
This. I mean, if they wanna go low effort they could just use one of the draconic mounts the SC characters have, slap on top of it Ogre Myrmidon body and bam done. Throw in an updated profile (Shaggoth really should not be 4+ save when a Chaos Demon prince is 3+) with 2 casts and dispells due to the absurd points increase in the current book, and watch it seel like pancakes.
Its sad people have to convert, third party, or 3D print their Shaggoth proxies simply because the OG Shaggoth is like 20 years old sculpts that doesnt even hold out with regular old Beastmen anymore. When put next to the Drag Ogs. which were released after most of our other stuff, its like night and day.
Plus doing this would open up an opportunity to bring back Kolek Suneater as a massive, expensive model akin to Kragnos and the Sons of Behemat line.
I would really like to see some financials about our army. Is BoC cselling that badly to warrant only a single, new 28,mm miniature in years, that being the new Beastlord (with no chariot T__T), when there is a lot of untapped potential with bunch of severly outdated miniatures screaming for a replacement.
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9 hours ago, The Red King said:
They are for open or narrative play and have no cost.
Well... thats dissapointing >__>
I should have guessed its gonna be the same as the Legends characters.
Speaking of which, I wonder why with the release of a new Beastlord the BL on charriot is still not a thing.
Then again that question could be asked about some stuff like new Shaggoth mini, Razorgors or Jabberslythe as well.
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Speaking of rules I too have question about the Desolating Beastherd battalion (p.75).
The effect is really great for those units that are included, but I am not sure how to take this ?
When building the army list via Warscrol builder I am not able to add this battalion.
I have not played a game in 3.0 only in 2.0, but I know lot of things has changed. Can anyone advise how to take it ? I dont see a price on it like it used to be, nor does the app selection offer it.
Or do I just take the units that are part of it (lets say the Bullgor one), and say I am using this ?
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4 hours ago, Koala said:
Mathematically one Option is +50% ATK, the other+50% AV. So "whatever fits your style".
Since most players currently seem to use them for agressive (ambush) plays the preferred option is dual weapons.
But it is still too early to make a final judgement on this.
( Anway, i personally would guess we will not see 20+ units of Gors this edition. 32mm bases and 1" attacks are badly punished by unit coherency rules...)
Maybe not used offensively but unit of 20 with shields, sitting on objective and popping off All out Defence might be actually not half bad. Especially if the attacking enemy unit sits in Dirgehorn range.
Makes me wish the Morghurite spawns ability was at least 3 maybe 6 inches. That 1" is just pitiful.
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Since Tzaangors are the best value unit and I already have one Tzshaman ready, I decided to finally sit down and start working on mine. Nothing fancy, just a basic tabletop speedpaint. Finishing the bases and picking out more details will be done once all 40 of them have been painted
Spoiler
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Just now, Sinfullyvannila said:
They could change it so that the debuff only works against "when targeting a beasts of chaos unit". Still super strong though unless the army is ranged skewed.
You are targeting the enemy unit not your own.
And if it worked only against other BoC then it would be pretty much useless.
I guess what you meant to say is if its used by BoC army only, but sadly thats not how these rules work in AoS.
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42 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
What does the Cockatrice do now? I read somewhere they do less MW. I thought they'd just go by the wayside since they only have a Finecast model...
What it does is wait for a nerf most likely
The MW are no longer a shooting attack but an ability now. D3 instead of D6. Still on 4+
But now if the MW goes through the target unit can hit only on 6. Not -1 To Hit, straight to hits on 6 only.
When (coz its really just a question of when once everyone and their mother from Chaos starts allying this thing in) they nerf it I hope its gonna be just a drop to 5s, not ouright removal or just changing it to -1 To hit.
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On 2/6/2023 at 7:26 PM, The Red King said:
I know I said I feared they wouldn't be good because they don't benefit from almost any buffs or synergies but the math proved me very very wrong. Which ironically makes them pretty good allies for other armies again because their warscroll has all its power baked in.
What they aren't is durable but that's nothing new.
How about the big 4 armed moomoo ? Is Gorgon a decent pick now or is it a "wait for it to get cheaper" ?
The increase in attacks is nice but the reduction to 4+ To Hit sucks a lot, and someone pointed out you eat people before attacks so it doesnt work as well for coherency breaking as one would have thought.
Got two of these, both with converted flesh hooks into flesh blades (I mean the hooks are just derpy tiny things, not menacing at all. But take a pair of extra Scything claws from your local Tyranid player and bam, much cooler, much more menacing moo moo is born) and have been itching to see a day when my opponent is like "oh cr*p" when one of them just strolls in on the table.
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AoS Cities of Sigmar Battletome 2023 Discussion
in Cities of Sigmar
Posted
Does anyone know if the Stormcast heavy cav base sizes fit the Demigryf base size ?
I was thinking of a way to allow me to bring them to the table still once the new book comes out, and SCE allies is still a thing soo that might work.
Now I dont remember them perfectly, but I recall they had at least 2 types of heavy monster cavalry. Some type of demi dragons, panthers and I am not sure on this one but some type of demigryf thing of their own. Units of 3 models. Are those units decent to be worth taking as allies (but more importantly would they fit as a way to bring my Demis)
Advice on this would be greatly appreciated ^__^