[AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion]

I think people are overlooking possibly our new most powerful asset, the Alpha pack battalion (in the GHB).

its 2-3 Behemoths (frigate/Ironclad) with the ability that all units in the battalion can make a normal move of up to D6" before turn 1.  And instead of making a normal move, our boats can fly high.  

Now everyone is Zilfin.

So my proposed list is:

Barak Zon 

Battle Regiment:
Dirigible - General
Dirigible
10 Thunderers
10 Thunderers
6 Wardens
6 Wardens
10 Arkanauts

Alpha Pack:
Frigate
Frigate

1980p, 3 drops

The plan being to deploy 2 frigates, 12 wardens, 20 thunderers and 2 dirigible in the opponents face, use the low drop count to go first, then shoot and charge the enemy into the ground turn 1. (Zon wardens are pretty terrifying)

It has some flaws, if your opponent can out drop you and that would put you into an akward position where you would need to deploy defensivley, and as with all alpha-strike-style armies if you don't cripple them in your opening volly, the counter attack will be hard on you.

But I think this can put out enough damage to end most games turn 1.

What do you guys think?
 

 

[AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion]

2 hours ago, Fred1245 said:

 

*salty snip*

 

Yep, Daughters suck, completely unplayable in a competitive environment ,  might as well sell your army and leave this this thread....

Now that he's gone let's get back to talking about how to actually play this army; Doomfire warlocks with mindrazor seem weirdly viable now with mindrazor, they're doing a lot of damage with 2 attack profiles.  Would they be a good alternative to lifetakers?

[AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion]

11 hours ago, Fred1245 said:

The Lauchon list was dead the moment the Shadow Queen went down to Rend -1 on Heartrender. Nothing like a 400pt model that can't reliably kill 2 sequitors.  It was also a gimmick list. And the hero phase teleport we now need to to actually be able to kill anything with the Shadow Queen being complete dead weight that bounces off of anything with a 3+ save.

Did you play them so that a witch aelf hits like a grot and loses half the unit to battleshock with a single model get further than 12" from your general? Because if you didn't then those experiences don't at all represent what it will be like to play this book. Yes, I understand wholly within was always coming, but I would have thought the implementation wouldn't be as tragically narrow minded as just changing the wording. DoK relied a lot on conga-lines to get both access to their actual buffs and be able to control the board. With 12" wholly within, you can't control multiple objectives or deny large areas of the board without the buffing hero in the center of the unit, where it's incredibly likely to just get sniped out. If you can even keep it there. Like...4 wounds on a cauldron will bring the entire army to a standstill. Alphastrike charges are basically dead 50% of the time because charging unbuffed SoS or Witch Aelves into just about anything is going to get you bounced and battleshock will take care of the rest.

We WERE fine before this(even if the book was starting to show its age) but every aspect of the army has been reduced in power with a few paltry points drops as our only compensation. We don't shoot as well anymore, our prayers are less reliable, we're slower, we have less ability to control the board, our casting got worse, our shooting got worse, our melee buffs are less reliable, our raw melee output is lower, we're far more vulnerable to battleshock, we're EVEN MORE vulnerable to character sniping, we're more battalion dependent.  Morathi-Khaine was the only thing we had going for us and they nerfed her TOO.

Even the stuff that got better isn't meaningful or got canceled out by something else getting worse. The point changes will get you...maybe a battalion on average? Provided you don't take any sisters of slaughter or never use a 20 unit of Blood Sisters. The buffs to Avatars are either irrelevant or enough to force you to bring one for the +1 to prayers which...woo, nothing like spending another 130 points on buff characters. Especially when it's just their to buff your buff characters. Khinerai got better, but not in a way that matters. Mind Razor got better, but we're down from 1-2 successful casts per game to 1 successful cast every 2 games thanks to everyone else getting better in the magic phase and MR going to 8 while shadowstone becomes both harder to access and worse. Bloodwracks got better, still easy to snipe and never going to be able to successfully cast anything. Hexwraiths got cheaper but their casting got worse. Hagg Narr now pushes the blood rites table forward at the cost of both the good 5++ bubble AND full rerolls. Morgwaeth got better but now you can't just take her Morathi and Cauldron without giving up any shot at having a useful relic.

If we hadn't lost out in every single phase of the game, I would have agreed that these could be adapted to, but they hit EVERYTHING. They even nerfed Morathi after what....3 months? With barely any events happening to give them any data?

There's no secret trick here, the book is 1 to 1 with the previous one. Everything works the same, just with the majority of units and abilities getting harsh restrictions on what they used to do.

We might still be able to stay middle of the pack if you get really, really good with the rules, but S tier or even A tier are a thing of the past.
 

Ya know... knee-****** reactionaries like you where saying that the KO book was a nerf too, because it didn't play like the last iteration,   and yet now after people figured out how to use it it's topping every event. 

There are a tonne of options in the new book, we've only had one day to look at it, and already people are thinking of S tier combos,

To quote tom Lyons from the WhatsApp, you can make 10 lifetakers (a unit that costs 160p) into a 55 wounds dealt on average Skud missile that deletes an enemy unit a turn;

So default, Lifetakers are 2 attacks each, 3+/4+/-/1.
On charge, they increase rend and damage by 1. 
Mindrazor increases rend by 1 and damage by 1 on the charge. 

The standard structure I would run these would be wrapping a Hag cauldron, between 20 witches and the Cauldron. You'll send out the missile normally in turn 2. So, the other easy buffs at hand are RR1s to hit from frenzy in turn 2 (from Hagg Nar), Witchbrew (3+ in turn 2, RR wounds), and if they charge near the Shadow Queen (who would normally be sent ahead to draw out/pin an enemy unit), they're also getting +1 attack. The Cauldron could also drop Catechism of Murder, although that isn't calculated into the math. So the unit is going to fly 14" out, and then charge with RR1s (if in Cauldron Guard, which I would be, it would also be +1 to charge). 

Their profile on the charge will be: 

30 attacks (2 base, +1 near Shadowqueen), 3+ (rr1s from allegiance)/4+ (rr from Witchbrew)/-2 rend (1 from charge, 1 from Mindrazor)/3 damage (1 base, 1 from mindrazor, 1 from charge). That averages 42-48 on a 4+ save. Catcheism of murder would on average generate 6 additional hits/4.5 wounds with reroll, thus 11.25 more damage against a 4+ (so 53.25 to 59.25 on average). 

So yeah, that is pretty good for a 160 point sacrificial missile unit.

 

Not to mention, with Cogs and the Battallion they move 16" and have plus 3 to charge,  so they'll hit the enemy lines easy turn one, Chase Shadow queen and 10 blood sisters with 10" move 2D6 run and +2 to charge you will alpha strike the hell out of the enemy.

[AoS 2 - Daughters of Khaine Discussion]

Could someone put a link to the DoK WhatsApp? I need to see what's going on in there!

[AoS 2 - Har Kuron (Broken Realms: Morathi) Discussion]

So I feel like our rules are a little glitched at the moment...

Right now, we lose the "way of the free people's" trait, which means we don't get access to adjutant's and empowered spells, but it also means we don't get the "strongholds of order" trait.

The strongholds if order trait gives the specific city keyword to units, and there's  nothing in the Har Kuron rules to replace that.  That means that the only units in the city to be Har Kuron are the DoK units, BUT you can only tale those if you have 3 other Har Kuron units, which without "strongholds of order" don't exist.

So as the rules stand, we can't take any DoK units, and none of our heroes can take the command traits, artefacts, or spells because those are for Har Kuron heroes only.

I feel like we need an FAQ soon...

[AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion]

Ok guys, I made a detailed list rundown here: https://thehonestwargamer.com/aos-list-rundowns/kharadron-overlords-skyhooks-for-days/

I'll put a play-by-play and tactica Article on AoS shorts website in a few days!

@jake3991 , I actually managed to skip all the death armies there!  but I do pretty well v Nighthaunt because they all have fly.

 @Kramer I took the Evocators mainly because theyre wizards, can do mortal wound, and are tougher than Endrinriggers.  I love our balloon boys though!

[AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion]

Hey guys, I'm Krohn, Thanks for the support! Cancon was really great, and it felt awsome to get onto the stream twice! (Day 2 games 1 and 3). I think they're still available on the honest wargamer's YouTube.

 

Here's the list I took, and a couple ideas I had going into it.

Barak-Zilfin + there's no trading with some people

Khemist
General - stickler for the code - these are just guidelines

Khemist
Artifact - aethershock earbuster (this one goes in the frigate)

40 arkanauts
12 skyhooks

10 arkanauts
3 volley guns

10 arkanauts
3 volley guns

14 thunderers
14 carbines

5 evocators
3 grandstaves

5 evocators
2 grandstaves

Frigate - cannon
Artifact - eatherspheric endrins

 

- 12 skyhooks and a khemist is amazing

- I find volley guns work better on the small squads without khemist support

- 14 thunderers and a khemist fit perfectly in a frigate, and do a lot of damage

- I also won a LOT of points by charging the thunderers and retreating.  That's how I beat a Hagg Nar at the start of turn 3 in knife to the heart

- I love endrinriggers, but they just die too fast, so I took the evocators instead, since they can also dispel

- when I needed to screen (which was often) it was with the 10 man arkanauts out front, and the evocators directly behind, so they could provide a strong counter attack

- I like Mohrnar, but I needed the deepstriking boat for maneuverability since I didn't have any endrinriggers, and the rerolls against flying things is really good, especially with the amount of death around.  And if I fought an army with no flying, that's what "these are just guidelines" was for

 

If you guys want me to write up a more detailed game walkthrough, I can write one up later today

[AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion]

Hey guys, I'm going to a relatively large GT (for au anyway) of 74 people, and I'm taking my KO. I'll let you know what happens, bit for now here's the list I'm using!

Barak Zilfin + there's no trading with some people

Leaders

Khemist, General - stickler for the code-these are just guidelines

Khemist, aethershock Earbuster

Knight Azyros, Ally

Units

40 Arkanauts W/ 12x light skyhook

10 Arkanauts W/ 3x volley guns

10 Arkanauts W/ 3x volley guns

20 thunderers W/ 20x rifles

Warmachines

Ironclad w/ aetherspheric endrins, volley cannon

1960p

[AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion]

Hi guys,

I'm headed to a pretty big 2k GT (70) and an having trouble deciding on a list. I have 4 that I'm currently wondering about, and was hoping I could get some input

1st is a 1 drop, objective grabbing list, with some CC, but I think it lacks damage output

Mohrnar

Khemist                                                              Admiral.                                                              Iron Sky Squadron.                                       40 skyhook Arkanauts.                              10 volley gun Arkanauts X2.                   2 frigates.                                                           9 Endrinriggers

Then I have a massive firepower list, but it lacks maneuverability and CC

Mhornar

Khemist.                                                             Endrinmaster.                                                 Lord Ordinator.                                              40 skyhook Arkanauts.                              10 volley gun Arkanauts X2.                   Ironclad x2

Then a combat focussed list, but I'm not sure if the endrinriggers will survive enough

Urbaz

Khemist.                                                          Brokk Grungsson.                                          40 skyhook Arkanauts.                               10 volley gun Arkanauts X2.                   6 endrinriggers X2                                       Knight Azyros

And finally a bit of a clown car, not sure if idoneth are popular right now, but this is the only list I see beating them.

Zilfin

Khemist.                                                              Khemist. (In ironclad)                                  40 skyhook Arkanauts.                              10 volley gun Arkanauts X2.                   20 thunderers (in ironclad).                     Ironclad (with tp engines).                      Knight Azyros (tp's with ironclad)

I dunno, which one do you think I should take?

[AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion]

I dunno about double ironclad anymore, after the Zilfin "move and get out" and the ordinator double-shoot got canned

[AoS 2 - Kharadron Overlords Discussion]

Hi Guys, I've been lurking for awhile, and just made an account, but does it run anyone else the wrong way that realm rules where specifically designed to hurt shooting armies?

"For example, if you don’t use the Realm of Battle rules, which include a chance that visibility in a battle can be greatly reduced, then extreme ‘gunline’ armies can be taken without any risk of fighting a battle that doesn’t allow them to fight at maximum effect."

A quote from a recent Community article.  Most of my games are at a local GW, so we use these rules quite often, and I find they don't actually effect KO in a huge way, but just the fact that GW is actively trying to stop our army type really feels poor form.