Elazar The Glorified

@Enoby@docofallplagues Umbral Spell Portal looks to be the same except a slight change to how it's summoned. You place both parts wholly within 18" of the caster so in theory you could set up the portal with one model for another to use. @Feorag Great conversion!

Can't remember off the top of my head for certain but I don't think much has changed since that warscroll @docofallplagues The new rules are in tbe General's Handbook. Which I think is a little cheeky as they didn't update the Malign Sorcery errata with those warscrolls like they did the battletomes... Haven't got mine to hand to check

The limitations on stuff out of the Slaves to Darkness book with the Slaanesh keyword is 1 in every 2 isn't it? So your Soul Grinder list works from an is it legal perspective as long as the points work.

You're definitely correct around Synessa's flexibility. Using Hysterical Frenzy does means pushing them right up though as your target has to be wholly within which is potentially a bit different from keeping their at max range for avoiding Unbinds or max range of their shooting. The flexibility of the extra cast is balanced against the flexibility of the Jaws being something that Be'lakor can be casting instead. Not sure which is the right option. I didn't have the points to choose for my list so I also hope the Cogs 😂

The cogs has definitely got merit for Synessa on the second cast and the utility for the charge boost option also. I'm finding when I don't have the points for our Endless Spells I'm seeing the most value in the Jaws for being a slightly narrower focused Wheels equivalent or the Cogs for boosting casting. My only thing with the Cogs for your list @KrispyXIV would be that only Synessa really benefits from the Slowing Time option as Be'lakor has no use for a third cast (other than if you used him to set up the Cogs perhaps). Maybe worth some playtesting either way to see what feels right with some use I've got Cogs in my list above too so hopefully Synessa makes good value of it! 😁

The Warscroll Builder lets you do it though. I know that's not a real sign of intent but certainly says that it's not clear enough! 😂 Although looking at it there's more wrong than right with Warscroll Builder at the moment lol

I was hoping for an FAQ on this as I feel that the every (their emphasis) contradicts the rule that Unique units don't benefit from enhancements. Then the errata on battletome lores muddied the waters further I think. But we are where we are for now 😕

The Gnashing Jaws maybe?

I haven't. I did try a list without the hand and using the Aegis when we first got the rules to see if I was happy with the level of healing with the Heroic Actions as an option (didn't use any of the generic artefacts for my game as we didn't have a chance to look at them properly before our game as it was the day the free rules came out). My Keeper rode its luck a bit for staying alive but if you made sure you had a healing spell I'd reckon it's worth trying. I think there are some doubts about the Keeper at the moment but if you have a clear purpose for them that'll help. I'm not sure you'd necessarily want them going into Monsters to get the most from the whip without something to back it up though...

Interesting to get some of the rationale on the list @Enoby Funnily enough I was playing with a couple of list ideas for last night and one was to see if I could get something I liked with both Glutos and Be'lakor and one I want to try is: Warlord Battalion Be'lakor Infernal Enrapturess - General (Delusions of Infallibility), Amulet of Destiny Synessa The Dread Pageant Battle Regiment Glutos The Masque 11 Blissbarb Archers 5 Hellstriders w/ Claw-spears 5 Hellstriders w/ Claw-spears Grand Strategy Prized Sorcery Endless Spells Chronomatic Cogs Going to try this out in my next game or two. It has all the currently non-negotiable pieces for me (Glutos, The Dread Pageant, Hellstriders and Blissbarb Battleline) and feels like the possibile end-goal of my obsession with the Prized Sorcery Grand Strategy that seems to have become a bit of a constant in all my list ideas at present. Glutos, Synessa and Be'lakor feel like 3 good Wizards to tie those VP to and not have to be scared of getting the most from them. The Enrapturess and the Masque then add some toolbox smaller heroes to occupy oppenents.

Agree with a lot of this. From my games so far I think it's a nice to have in your back-pocket rather than to plan around. I tried it on Syll’esske's Scourge for example and I think you'll see the most benefit from it on profiles like that and the Contorted Epitome's where it's doubling the damage output of a high volume of normally 1 damage attacks as it can suddenly turn it into a bit more of a blender weapon or something that other Heroes / Monsters need to be more concerned about. If nothing else it seems to draw out an Unbind attempt much quicker than Arcane Bolt with my opponents so far!

Well maxes at 12 on the first turn but that max increases by 4 each battle round after the first in combat for the Joyous Battle Fury rule. The main things for me though with Dexcessa from my use is they're self-sufficient. They do everything they need to natively and get a free command point to use on a Friendly Daemon (themselves) once per turn. They're a Monster and a Hero so all the benefits that come with that in 3rd edition (and with the extra opportunities for scoring and healing). They don't have a degrading profile and if you give them some support, such as a summoned Keeper you're doubling that and they're quite competitively pointed.

2-3 Troops. The troops in the battalion can't be picked as the targets of Monstrous Rampages which is huge with a lot of emphasis on Monsters in the Pitched Battles battlepack in the General's Handbook (where this battalion is found also)

Looks a fun list to be fair and agree quite different to what people have been posting so far. Hunters will definitely be a useful battalion for this next year. Protects certain key units (Twinsouls make lots of sense as you don't want them being neutered by Rampages in key combats) in what is going to be a monster centric meta for a bit at least.

Depends how you want to play. The default is that they count as Battleline but the matched play rules in the General's Handbook make it so Coalition don't count towards Battleline for that battlepack.

This is definitely a huge boon. Especially in the context of definitely not being able to use Wildfire Taurus if we coalition in some Beasts (and it got nerfed too) the Dark Prince giveth and he taketh away. Sadly, whilst Beasts of Chaos can no longer take Slaangor (???) we've had no such luck and are still lumbered with them!

The Core Rules FAQ adds a little value to Synessa. Allegiance based Command Abilities can't be used by unit Champions so there's some merit in an infinite range Lurid Haze They've also got some potential value in Monster heavy lists for Feral Roar on a key piece. Might be very fringe but I'm trying! All my lists in 3rd so far have been magic heavy. Using the Prized Sorcery Grand Strategy to go all in on that too. Might try an Infernal Enrapturess with the Arcane Tome as an extra wizard would they get access to Born of Damnation?

Played a game last night against Blades of Khorne. Went for pretty much the Invaders list I posted the other day. Battle Regiment Shardspeaker - General (Master of Magic), Rod of Misrule, Levitate Syll’esske - General, Flaming Weapon Glutos - Judgement of Excess 11 Blissbarb Archers 5 Hellstriders w/ Claw-spears 5 Hellstriders w/ Claw-spears 6 Fiends The Dread Pageant Endless Spells Wheels of Excruciation The Mesmerising Mirror Grand Strategy Prized Sorcery My opponent's list I'm not 100% sure on how he had structured it and prayers etc but was mortal heavy Goretide and roughly: Lord of Khorne on Juggernaut - General (Hew the Foe), Thronebreakers Torc Bloodsecrator Slaughterpriest Slaughterpriest 10 Blood Warriors 10 Bloodreavers 10 Bloodreavers 10 Bloodreavers 5 Flesh Hounds 5 Flesh Hounds 6 Mighty Skullcrushers 5 Wrathmongers Khorgorath Khorgorath Bleeding Icon Wrath-Axe Grand Strategy - Pillars of Belief I'll not do a full report but the Battle Tactics and Grand Strategies certainly add a bit more to the games now I've had a chance to use those also. The game was called in favour of Slaanesh at the top of Turn 3 when I won the priority roll and my 10-6 lead would have been extended too far for the Khorne player to catch back up as I still had the bulk of my numbers with Depravity in the bank to add to them and the Blood Tithe wouldn't have been able to keep up with the attrition. I also was still on course to achieve my Grand Strategy whereas the Khorne one was looking increasingly precarious. Syll'Esske was pretty much as you warned me @Enoby. Didn't do anything wrong but just didn’t quite add enough of anything to make me think I needed them in the list. They dealt with what they needed to but when I wanted them to tip a combat between the Fiends and Lord of Khorne and Skullcrushers, they just didn't quite have the clout. If they could cast twice or had a ward save to tank a bit more or hit a little harder (and they set their Scourge on fire every turn and it still didn't feel quite enough) they'd be amazing but instead they're just a bit Jack-of-all-trades. Probably awesome in smaller games though! I think I'd be considering shuffling points around to get either a Contorted Epitome for magic or Dexcessa for hitting stuff if I ran the list again. The Shardspeaker did well as Mesmerising Mirror is always my favourite thing to throw at Priest heavy Khorne because they tend to all be gathered around the altar in a lovely bubble for spreading mortal wounds! With the Bloodsecrator on the board and so many Unbind and Dispels though I didn't get as much value from magic overall and she didn't do much else other than survive… which was in keeping with my Grand Strategy! Found them not that useful without some Twinsouls etc to support but if looking for them in that role would try a similar setup again. Endless Spells are still awesome for Depravity though. I think the two and The Dread Pageant are probably the first things on my list at the moment as they're all great little tools for playing the Tactics and Depravity game. The Dread Pageant were once again one of my best performers. The Mortal Wound output coupled with their tankiness in Vasillac and just being too small a unit to justify committing too much to means they're flying under the radar of all of my opponent's so far. They clear out screening MSU units, they chip away with shooting for Depravity and they tip the balance on key objectives. Love them! Rod of Misrule… I only rolled 1s. That's obviously no reflection on the artefact but so far in my game's in 3rd I've not had all the extra CP through either through not having the Rod or not getting any joy from it. I'm feeling a bit liberated from the theory of it and Invaders as a result! Invaders are still great for getting Battleline Painbringers and Twinsouls without having to waste the 'real' generalship on a Lord of Pain but I'm finding other stuff working well enough so far that I feel comfortable for the next game going for Pretenders or Godseekers and not ruing the CP I could have had! Glutos. Tanker gonna tank. Pick a spot and hold it. Nothing new I can really say about him. Got less from his magic today but got more from his attacks against squishy Khornate Mortals. 2+ save on him from either All Out Defence or Mystic Shield is invaluable. Fiends. The other anvil for my army. Would have preferred they'd been killier but they did what I wanted them to in this game which was tie up all of his cavalry for the duration. Needed a summoned Keeper to tip things into winning that combat though. Blissbarbs and Hellstriders for Battleline, continuing to serve me well. Not expecting much of any of them which maybe isn't the best seal kf approval but keeping them out of the press as much as possible and just focusing on the speed of the Hellstriders for nabbing objectives and the weight of shots on the Blissbarbs to farm depravity that bit quicker. Next list is definitely having some Beasts of Chaos in!

Overjoyed that some of my Beasts can come out into partial retirement at least and get back into my Slaanesh lists. Not sure the Ungor Raiders replace the Blissbarbs as even 2 units can't match their shooting output by the time you account for the High Tempter, Rend and Homonculus but their pregame move etc definitely makes them effective screens but I'm not managing to get that much into my lists and I'm not sure Ungor Raiders are where I'd want to spend those points (plus the cost of the 6 other units to get 2 Ungor Raiders into the list) however they have little pot-bellies and that's worth something! 😂 A Shaman, Doombull, Ghorgons, Cygors and Bestigors are probably higher on my list to try squeezing into some lists (not all together obviously!) The big cows gaining ambush through Lurid Haze could be fun - was always the one appeal with Darkwalkers - especially now Monsters have some additional use for stomping scenery etc - it's always the psychological impact on your opponent for knowing they're coming - worth trying a Battle Regiment for to guarantee they're taking first turn and caught in two minds when you want them to.

Yeah potentially, I'm choosing for the underlined every in the rulebook to mean that literally for now though 😁 It does mean I might try that Pretenders list first so I can see if they FAQ the spells that way or not.

In truth I'm trying Syll'Esske more for the rest of their output more than the Battleshock Immunity. My theory is Syll'Esske, the Fiends and The Dread Pageant work as a little block out towards the one flank with the Shardspeaker being babysat by Glutos, the Blissbarbs on the other with the Hellstriders on early objective grab and screening duties. Syll'Esske strikes me as a good target for Flaming Weapon or Metamorphosis depending on what support the Fiends need and with the two cohorts working a little independently I can maximise the rerolling 1s from Syll'Esske to help fish for Mortal Wounds on The Dread Pageant etc. The Battleshock Immunity will just be a bonus if I need it out on that flank is my thinking. The Contorted Epitome might be a better choice to be honest but would mean dropping one of the other bits I want to try out and I reckon Syll'Esske with them makes the Fiends look like something worth sending a big target like they want to engage with after them.

Your Pretenders list won't work as you have no battleline without making the Lord of Pain your general. I've got a couple of lists I want to try in upcoming games torn over which to use first though! Invaders Shardspeaker - General (Master of Magic), Rod of Misrule, Ghost Mist, Dark Delusions Syll'Esske - General, Flaming Weapon, Born of Damnation Glutos - Judgement of Excess, Levitate 11 Blissbarb Archers 5 Claw-spear Hellstriders 5 Claw-spear Hellstriders 6 Fiends The Dread Pageant Wheels of Excruciation Mesmerising Mirror Pretenders (Faultless Blades) Keeper of Secrets - General (Contest of Cruelty and Battle-Lust) Amulet of Destiny, Flaming Weapon Contorted Epitome - Contemptuous Brand, Hysterical Frenzy Shardspeaker - Dark Delusions 11 Blissbarb Archers 5 Claw-spear Hellstriders 5 Claw-spear Hellstriders 10 Symbaresh Twinsouls The Dread Pageant Wheels of Excruciation Mesmerising Mirror Similar thinking that neither is necessarily a great list but want to try Invaders without the Painbringers and Twinsouls and using the Fiends and Syll'Esske as the other block to Glutos. For Pretenders, I need to get the Keeper of Secrets with the Flaming Weapon spell out of my head and on the table so I can move on haha!

There's the Flaming Weapon spell... It keeps making me wonder if there's a fun Hero Monster hunting Faultless Blades Keeper with Master of Magic, that Spell and the Amulet of Destiny...

Is there any merit in running the Shardspeaker as a Master of Magic for a reroll on casting, unbinding and dispelling in each Hero phase? Feel like it mitigates a little against their biggest limitation as a caster just can't make up my mind on whether losing Glory Hog on something else in an Invaders army is too much of an opportunity cost but if the Rod of Misrule is in the list that's potentially sufficient...

Slaangor needed that increase in points...