[What are you doing Pre-3.0?]

Well, I'm done, just in time for AoS3.0.

Old School Slaves to Darkness army. Was 1kpts, now...who knows!

The newest models are from 1996

Lots of eBay diving and raiding friend's storage boxes.

[Mcthew - Signing Off]

I'm a wargamer not a warhammer player so, to a degree, I am insulated from much of the pressure from GWs marketing and weekly release train becaue I can pivot to be hyped for a new historical time period or a new rule set to reuse my existing figures completely divorced from any sales cycle. A 6mm Roman is broadly the same regardless of which manufacturer I choose to buy from and those products are on the market all over the place. The back catalog of Infinity models is huge and the Corvus Belli method of delivering rules means barrier to entry on following a passing whim or interest is incredibly low.

I can just sit down and play games with what I have or jump onto a new thread of my own personal hype train rather than be tied to years long release cycles while waiting for something that excites me about 'my faction'.

I still play AoS every now and then, it's just such a big community that it's easy to get games practically anywhere rather than having to build a community locally for something less well known. And they do still produce some nice models, nice art and good emotional hooks to get you invested in a faction.

There's tons of games and just stuff of different scales and focuses and genre and historicity and fantasy and whatever out there to be engaged and excited by to follow your own hobby whims. I hope you have a great time indulging on those whims

[The Rumour Thread]

40 minutes ago, boyadventurer said:

I bet this is the case. It would be weird for Sequitors to become full battleline while VH remain conditional. They seem to be in the same points spot -- just a little over Libs but less than Seqs.

I doub't there will be ANOTHER ranged kit -- maybe Judicators get a new kit with Thunderstrike to match the new Knight hero, maybe that would account for some of that big points hike?

 

I'm just surprised they're called VanquishOrs (and spelling be damned!) for the naming convention...

[AoS 2 - Fyreslayers Discussion]

Until we see the GHB points update I'd not worry too much about that. But losing out on more prayers is a big deal, especially as we don't have native casters to make use of the magic phase.

IIRC can still chant a prayer AND summon an invocation though. Runic Fyrewall still incredibly useful.

Unit sizes I think is going to be the big meta unknown. If everyone brings smaller units then smaller units on our side won't matter as much as it all sort of vaguely aligns. But if people still bring big units to do most of their fighting then we're in trouble.

Thing is that, on paper, with the buffs available, big Vulkite units are still good and 30 of them is a lot for most armies to deal with. Suffer from the coherency changes though.

[AoS 2 - Fyreslayers Discussion]

50 minutes ago, Clan's Cynic said:

The problem with Aurics is still their 4+ to hit. Unleash Hell is probably a waste of CP when they need 5+ to hit.

At least on your turn you can spend the CP to +1 hit their shooting.

[AoS 2 - Fyreslayers Discussion]

The main concern is that the cap on bonuses to save means no more stacking the Battlesmith and Prayer of Ash etc. to get excellent saves. But 4+ is pretty easy to achieve basically for the entire army.

I think Runeson goes up in appeal because his CA is +1 Wound and targets himself to grant an aura to every fyreslayer around him. Which means you can still stack multiple buff auras (of different types) on your units.

+1 Wound from Runeson. -1 to be Wounded from the Hermdar Trait aura, immune to battleshock in Hermdar (as you cannot repeatedly use Inspiring Presence this matters more), +1 to hit from the Karl in a unit using the All Out Attack CA, +1 save from battlesmith/prayer of ash, etc.

Bladed Slingshields won't stack with other buffs to save though as they modify the 5+ save. Can still use them to hero snipe while you charge though by throwing them at something within 8 of the charge.

Vulkites with Fyresteel Handaxes go up in value as their built in reroll to hit combined with the easy +1 to hit from CAs AND their fight on death is a nice positive.

The Curse prayer needs you to be close to the enemy but Fyreslayer priests often get close anyway just to keep their units inside their 12 inch auras. And that lets all 6s to hit deal mortals on the target unit and between throwing axes and rerolling twin handaxes and fighting on death you could really pile on some hurt by just rolling so many dice with a big chunk of vulkites to trigger the mortals on 6s enough times to be scary.

Hearthguard with big 2 handed axes also probably more appealing. 2MWs on 6s is still excellent but the easy +1 to hit from CAs helps the big axes more.

Wonder what they'll do with the minimum unit size 5 of Hearthguard/Aurics and how that interacts with Reinforcement? Plus, of course, conditional battleline and Reinforcement.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

Anyone know what happens if you're part way up a terrain piece?

E.g.: want to climb to the top of a wall that is 6 inches tall but only have a 5 inch move?

E.g.: deployed at the top of a wall that is 6 inches tall but only have 5 inch move?

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

4 minutes ago, Arzalyn said:

Yes, from the Rules about battleshock:

"If a slain model is returned to its unit in the same turn that it is slain, it still counts as having been slain in that battle round for the purposes of battleshock tests."

Which makes sense. If I've just had a literal near-death experience I'm likely to look for a way out of that situation.

[The Rumour Thread]

57 minutes ago, Athrawes said:

The new Path to Glory system seems incredible.

I mean, to the point where I cannot imagine wanting my games of AOS to be anything else besides continuing an ongoing (or starting a new) Path to Glory campaign. 

It's worth checking out Oathmark as well if PtG appeals. Might be some ideas you can lift and share between them.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

Also that 15% points increase will degrade as the edition goes along and later armies are released and GHBs update points. After a year or two it'll be the equivalent of no points increases.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

8 hours ago, Greybeard86 said:

I’d love for that to be true. Because many competitive armies in AoS are painfully boring. 
 

For me, the question is what should armies look like? Unit size, variety of types? And how will the new edition answer that question?

Will it be like the romans? Various heavy infantry in blocks with some skirmishers? Sarmatians or Parthians where it's all skirmisher cavalry with one hammer blow shock unit? Greeks with dense heavy infantry and some skirmishers? Or more like Carthage with a plethora of different troops and nationalities in a riotous mix?

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

Liberators, Judicators, Chaos Warriors, etc. all come in boxes of 10 so at a guess any unit that comes in boxes of 10 will be minimum 10.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

3 hours ago, PrimeElectrid said:

This is going to be massive for units with large vases without 2” weapons. Chaos Warriors without halberd and liberators for example would be straight in the 🗑 

Chaos warriors exist to carry a runeshield and stand on a point. They don't deal enough damage to justify losing that 5+ MW save and their role as brick walls/objective holders is valuable enough.

Liberators make great 5 model screens for fairly low points.

[The Rumour Thread]

On the plus side, if my Sotrmcast suck right out of the gate it makes it easy to play games with anyone and not feel bad about bringing an optimised list. Means I get to have the enjoyment of tweaking and planning and optimising whilst not also making my opponent have a bad time at the table.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

2 minutes ago, Ganigumo said:

Because people want fair games. Theres a big difference between WAAC tournament lists, and casual lists you play with your friends, but matched play provides a set of rules that should make the game fair for both sides. The point of matched play is to make the game fair, which is something every kind of player wants. Even when doing variations players will often start with matched play as a base since it creates equal footing.

Starting from a baseline and tweaking up or down to fit your desired experince is much easier and much more accessible than free form free for alls.

Just see how well AoS1.0 release went down.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

6 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

Certainly yes, but narrative players are a special (not in a bad way) and relatively small group. I mean, I suppose I'm narrative when I play with @TwiceIfILikeIt, the only gamer I've played Warhammer with in over a year ('cuz she's awesome and lives with me). We do what we do, tell a bit of a story, drink a ton, and get on with it.

I'm talking about matched/competitive play where you would expect that the rules that *all* players own, learn, and gain experience with are used from game to game, table to table, event to event, and so on. I mean, what's the point of learning tactics based on a universally shared set of rules if those tactics won't apply to games with new people (pick ups, tournaments, or just the new player who moved to your town)? Why force the need to unlearn or to keep several variations of the same thing in your head when there is a standard set to which all players are initially exposed and to which all players have access?

Even if (and that's a ginormous if) some guy in Topeka has created the perfect "fix" for a rule, it's just his, or his group's. Nobody else knows it. Nobody else uses it. Then the lady in Harrisburg also comes up with a perfect (different) "fix" that is equally localized. They, and a third person, show up at an event to play and all parties are on different pages about how to play.

 

It's just plain divisive, and that's counter to the idea of community.

in other words, well-intentioned actions end up creating divisions.

I think that rather depends on what they're 'comping'. If I run a 1k tournament or a Meeting Engagement event that's different. Going to play in Aus means facing a very different meta from where I am.

These communities are already highly divided by the existing practicalities of life. I don't really care what additional rules changes the Brazilian TOs get up to as I am highly unlikely to be playing in their events.

Making changes to fundamental stuff like pile ins or how you cast spells...sure I can see it.

But removing a command ability or requiring everyone to bring a monster or playing every game in one realm or a Ban phase like the Super Series or giving some armies greater or fewer points or whatever are interesting and plenty of players like to have that diverse variety of events to go to.

It also provides space for those players who might avoid an event because their faction (or just their collection of models) currently sucks and they don't want to get crushed for 2 days. A different event with rules that shake up what is allowed, what builds they'll face or bring...that all helps create space for more people to come along.

If we want to have a 'global' meta and 'global' tournament scene then sure, having everyone follow GW rules packs and FAQs is the way to go.

But the existence of a 'global' shared scene does not have to preclude a wide variety of different types of events.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

1 hour ago, Sleboda said:

Man, I really wish I could see into alternate timelines, too.

Comp is garbage. It's ego. It's fear and stubbornness masquerading as insight and intelligence. Comp is just about the most certain way to divide a global community into factions - pockets of people who, each in their own group, think they have found the One True Way to play.

Comp is a disease in search of a weak-willed host.

Do you really want build your strategies based on one set of rules only to find that in the next town other over they play by different rules that ****** up your understanding of the game? Comp does exactly that and has for decades. It is maddening to have to learn 10 different sets of the supposedly same rules just because 10 different tournament organizers or 10 different gaming groups each feel they have "fixed" the game but each in different ways.

 

 

Isn't making their own variations on the rules to suit their own friends and playgroups and community what the narrative players do all the time?

They don't seem to mind that the group the next town over has their own spin on how to handle terrain or how to limit unit spamming or what units exist in their 'era' whatever.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

20 minutes ago, Reinholt said:

I think part of it is also thinking about Stand & Shoot for the median shooting unit you encounter, which is honestly not that scary.

 

Who cares if 5 Judicators stand and shoot?

 

Now, 6 Vanguard Raptor Longstrikes or a Kharadron Ironclad or Salamanders hitting you when you hit the screen, hitting you again in their turn (twice for the longstrikes!), and then hitting you AGAIN when you finally charge them. That's less friendly.

Also, if you're an MSU army that shooting is likely to remove or cripple your small 5 model unit. So you feed a small unit to the UH, then charge with a second to be able to engage the screen.

This might explain why there are more higher saves being seen and ways of dealing damage that don't need to be  a charge. Kastelai Blood Knight for example trampling over units for MWs.

Oh. And the game does have invulnerable saves. Unrendable 2+ eels, Bastilidon, Neferata's spell.

Ethereal is not quite invulnerable in the 40k sense of the word due to the restriction on improving the save but it's pretty close and is an ability for an entire starter faction.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

47 minutes ago, Gauche said:

Yup also good advice. I started one army I want to play no matter what for the end of 2.0 but I'm waiting on everything for 3.0 to drop before picking a second army.

Yes, excellent advice.

Unless you absolutely MUST have the starter box for the models then just wait for the release, the hype to die down, the first FAQ to come out. Play with what you have and see if youre liking the new iteration. Then, well informed post-FAQ and a few games you can make informed, sensible decisions about what new stuff to buy or if you're happier stopping playing 3.0 and just playing 2.0 rules with friends instead.

Do not start spending money based on speculation and WarCom marketing hype and thn finding £100 or more of stuff in boxes you don't want to build or play with anymore.

There might be short term supply issues but if you eventually want X model or Y unit then you'll be able to get it eventually.

[The Rumour Thread]

10 minutes ago, Neverchosen said:

Yeah I run a unit of 20 with Sword and Shield... I guess I will have to create a new command and split off a portion of my unit 🤨

Sucks for the reroll saves trigger on 10+ though.

I guess an excuse ot bring more sorcerors!

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

I suspect - but have no proof beyond gut feel - that minimum unit sizes will remain whatever comes in 1 box for the models. So 5s for Hearthguard, 20 for marauders, etc.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

5 hours ago, Reinholt said:

I feel like KO are the big winner of the reinforcement rules because they are still just taking boats. Unleash Hell Ironclad is still very much a thing.

The -1 to hit though is fairly important as they already have quite a few 4+ scattered among their weapon profiles. It's a fairly dramatic swing in odds. Still better than not shooting the extra time at all, of course, just they won't be at peak output.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

Bring the Prismatic Palisade to block LoS of shooting units! Flawless path to charging glory!

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

6 minutes ago, GutrotSpume said:

Ok thanks. Loads of min sized units on the board is the first big positive I’ve seen from previews and leaks. Just gotta hope they realise what a nightmare the new coherency rules are and faq it soon after release.

If we do end up with a whole bunch of minimum sized units (and the pitched battle profiles don't change what minimum sized is of course) then the coherency rules become less of an issue anyway. Most elite units are 3-5 models. Battleline are 10 and some horde units (rats, marauders, grots) are 20.

[AoS 3 New Rules Discussion]

4 minutes ago, GutrotSpume said:

I’m really struggling to understand this reinforcement rule! So you can only make units bigger 4 times in a 2k battle?  So for example if I had 5 units of 5 Boingrot Bounders I could only make 4 of them more than 5 models?

As far as I know we don't actually have the text to see from an official source. Just rumours. So we can't really know for certain (and even then WarCom reveals are not always 100% correct anyway).