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dmorley21

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Posts posted by dmorley21

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    3 hours ago, Tropical Ghost General said:

    It's how all negative modifiers used to work, because 4+ is a successful hit, but then the -1 modifier turns it into a 3, which makes it fail. Same thing goes for blades re-rolls with a torment if they are at -1 to hit. 

    Overall it's a lot of points, but what other options do we really have 🤷‍♂️? 

    Yeesh, I have definitely been playing the re-rolls wrong. Was that in a FAQ? This is where the game has serious rule bloat and could use a simplification. 

    As for the other options, I guess it boils down to intent. I've never used Olynder or Kurdoss as I haven't seen them being worth it on paper, which is why I'm curious to hear how you're using them. 

    Does Olynder get off spells without having any modifiers to her casting? Does she survive to cause the mortals? 

    Is Kurdoss a better assassin than 10 Blades/10 Harridans/8 Myrmourns/5 Hexwraiths? 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    4 hours ago, Obeisance said:

    Do Nighthaunts have any game outside spamming Reapers with Cogs from off the table?

    I have a Nighthaunt army I've never actually played with, can't seem to sell and that's the only tournament build I've seen.

    What is actually good, list-wise, for the faction post FAQ?

    Oddly, I haven't actually seen many lists like what you mention apart from what I ran (60 Reapers in Death Stalkers), but I've never played in a tournament. 

    The bottom line is that Nighthaunt are not a competitive tournament army, so if you want to try for top 10 don't take them. 

    The key to a good list with them is maximizing their stellar movement and Wave of Terror abilities. Many of us are starting to think that means lots of minimum sized units. 

    • Like 1

    Most powerful factions after GHB2019 & FAQs

    in Age of Sigmar Discussions

    Posted

    On 8/1/2019 at 11:44 PM, 123lac said:

    Who in their right mind buys 90 grimghast reapers? Who in their right mind buys 90 of any one particular model?

    Have zero sympathy for people who power game like this and then find their net list is no longer top tier.

    Not saying you're one of these people but I really dislike it when people spam one unit just because it happens to be good at a particular point in time.

    I bought 60 Reapers just because I love the look of them. I play Nighthaunt, not LoN, and was running them in a battalion. They're a great unit, look really cool (I don't put in their heads), are battleline, and fit the lore of my army. 

    I get that power gaming is not cool, but there's reasons why someone might buy a lot of a certain unit. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    27 minutes ago, Tropical Ghost General said:

    @dmorley21I have considered a pure chainrasp army. 

    Lady O (general for fluff reasons) 

    GoS with +1 to cast relic

    Spirit Torment

    19 x 10 rasps

    2000pts - 22 drops - 11 underworlds deployments - 207 wounds 

    For me, Chainrasps don't hit hard enough to make an entire army out of them. And when talking about optimizing the army, I don't think a force of just them does that either. 

    The only warscroll in our army that can be the entire army (apart from heroes) is Reapers IMO and even then it's far from optimized. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    7 minutes ago, Tropical Ghost General said:

    is the days of unlimited CP for 50pts each time I'd agree, but having no inbuilt immunity to battleshock, 40 rasps will disappear really quickly, and no way to res the entire unit back outside of LoG or LoN is tough. I like the idea of blobs of rasps tarpitting though, but wonder if it could be more effective to simply put 8 x 10 or 4 x 20 down instead, less likely to battleshock, more targets for opponents to have to focus on , etc...

    Yeah, that's a great point. Even without the horde discount they are pretty cheap and I think we underuse them as a community based on what I read on here and on Facebook. I get it - they're not a fun choice but I really think having a good number of them allows our other units to be more effective at specific tasks. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    I was inspired by the idea of an optimized list for Nighthaunt not based on just using the stuff we/I like and came up with this:

     

    Harrow (General/RotSH/Aetherquartz Brooch)

    Reikenor (Soul Cage)

    Spirit Torment (Pendant of the Fell Wind)

    Guardian of Souls w/ Nightmare Lantern

    40 Chainrasps

    40 Chainrasps

    10 Reapers

     2 Chainghasts

    10 Bladegheists

    10 Bladegheists

    The Condemned battalion/Chronomantic Cogs/Purple Sun/Command Point

    2000 pts exactly.

    136 wounds/7 drops/2 command points

     

    I'd set up the Chainrasps on the table. They'll be a massive footprint that you can use to grab objectives, tarpit an opponent's model/unit, and just have board control. With the re-rolls they get out of the battalion, they can actually sneak in a little damage at times too which might take an opponent by surprise. They'll still wilt pretty easily to most combat units, but they have enough wounds for it to take more than a single combat phase. Reikenor starts on the board too and sends out Purple Sun as soon as possible to give the opponent something to think about.

    The Reapers and two units of Bladegheists will then be used to deepstrike. On the turn when you think you'll deep strike them, cast Cogs.

     

    Overall, I think if someone wants to be as competitive as possible with Nighthaunt, you've got to have two units of 40 Chainrasps. They're cheap and so very useful to have as the big footprint unit you deploy in the beginning of the game, which gives you more freedom with your better stuff. Now, I don't care for huge units like that, so I would probably never field it. But that's probably how to play the most optimized lists.

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    7 minutes ago, Frowny said:

    I am considering starting nighthaunt but have a few questions.

    They seem to have ok anvils, high mobility(hexwraiths, deepstrike) great board control (deepstrike, many models), but not really any hammers. 

    For example, my friend has a tomb Kings army regenerating 10 wounds per squad per turn. Chewing through that seems difficult. 

    Any thoughts on good hammers either to use or ally in? Or how to bring a lower model count hammer within the battletome?

    They lack elite hammers and anvils IMO.

    For hammers, there's a few options. Bladegheists can get the job done, but most tend to use them in units of 10. Reapers are still great against units of 10+ and if you face an opponent that relies on one unit you can take Reapers in the Death Stalkers battalion. Some people have luck with Myrmourns and I think Harridans are underrated. 

    As for the lower model count, some people swear by Spirit Hosts. I haven't tried them as I don't see it, but they are a lower model count build. The Death Riders battalion is another option for a lower model count. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    14 minutes ago, Tropical Ghost General said:

    I find cogs is a mixed blessing, in that for all the benefit that we get from it, it doesn't help towards getting WoT and only adds to the overall speed that your opponent will have in the following turn.

    Yeah, it really is there for deep striking or charging after teleporting. If you're just using it to increase movement, then Pendant of the Fell Wind has you covered. The other thing worth noting for Cogs, is that if you don't need the bonus for charges that turn, it's great to camp Reikenor next to it so he can use his casting bonus to get off two spells.

    • Like 2

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    17 hours ago, punkycloud said:

    Came second in a 2 day event this weekend going 4-1. Ran a dreadblade as general for teleporting shinanigans.

    My question is is cogs essential for NH? I made only one 9" charge following teleporting all weekend, and while it didn't result in punishing me it did mean on a couple of occasions I was banking on the double turn to enable me to get the unit in before I lost it. 

    I don't typically put stuff in deepstrike for the same reason, especially as I need run fell wind pendant so normally have plenty of movement, cogs would also give me the confidence to deploy in deepstrike knowing they could drop and have a reasonable chance of hitting something that turn. 

    Way to go! I'm having trouble fitting Cogs into lists with it going up in points, but it's still important for me because I do like to deepstrike. It just adds something else for my opponents to think about even if it doesn't work for me.

    1 hour ago, Tropical Ghost General said:

    So I ran Riek and purple sun at a tournament last month and it was swingy (like a lot of things in our army 😂) but very effective when it went off. I have another one in a few weeks and am taking the same list.

    Tbh MSUs is the way to go with ghosts. We have no counters to the current gross stuff in the game, such as fyreslayers or Slaanesh or Skaven, we have no reliable way to take part in the activation wars, but we can do movement shenanigans better than most. Hopefully after Mawtribes, orruk tribes and cities of sigmar drop, we can see whether the recent slew of books that have been stupid (Skaven, FEC but only gristlegore, Slaanesh and Fyreslayers) are just anomalies or whether the other books (Khorne, Sylvaneth, BoC, Gloomspite) are actually the odd balls in not being broken AF. I'm hoping that the new books aren't stupidly broken, but it depends on who is taking lead writer on them, as you can see the general trend as to which books are bent AF and who has had a consistent input to their creation.

    I agree about Slaanesh and Skaven being probelms for Nighthaunt, but I don't think Fyreslayers are as bad. They're a slower army, so we can dance around them pretty well. I also typically run 60 Reapers in a Death Stalkers battalion, which can chew through their slow, death star builds. I've started looking at other, MSU style builds, but if you know you're playing Fyreslayers, that's the way to go.

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    59 minutes ago, Frowny said:

    I really like the models and playstyle of nighthaunt and am considering starting an army. However, I currently play sylvaneth, mostly as a horde of dryads and revenants, with 90ish models on the field

    Is it possible to play a reasonably competitive nighthaunt army without hordes? For example, I was thinking of allying in some Bloodknights and/or morghasts

    I know legions of nagash has the ability to use most of the same models, but also allows for some harder hitters (e.g. morghasts, blood knights). Do you think that might be a better route? It doesn't allow for the same mobility though, which was definitely a perk for me. Another challenge is that you always want summonable units to take advantage of the gravesites and invocations of death, but they are all hordes, almost by default. 

    There's some debate right now about how viable a list with the Death Riders battalion is. That's really the only way to avoid hordes as they army is designed rules and fluff wise to be hordes. You can and probably should run lots of small units, but your model count will still approach 90ish. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    4 minutes ago, punkycloud said:

    Hi, have a choice between 2 artifacts, fell wind pennant or lantern (D6+3 heal), which should I take, speed or resilience? 

    I'd go with Pennant. The D6+3 lantern is really nice when you successfully cast the spell, but at 6+ that won't be all the time whereas the pennant always works. I once brought back 9 Harridans with that lantern which was epic, but I've had it not work multiple times. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted · Edited by dmorley21
    Typo

    On 7/9/2019 at 2:06 PM, Tropical Ghost General said:

    For me personally it seems like a lot of investment in battalions, which could be better spent on more bodies.

    On 7/9/2019 at 3:33 PM, relic456 said:

    Yeah in general I agree, the NH battalions just feel so soft sometimes.

    I honestly think double battalions may still have a place in MSU style armies.

    They get you a command point. We know command points are really important for NH.

    They get you an additional artefact. Aetherquartz Brooch, Pendant of the Fell Wind, Wychlight Lantern, Midnight Tome - those are all really strong artifacts IMO that really upgrade our heroes.

    Command points are worth 50 pts and are important for our army. How many points would you say those artefacts are worth? I'd say at least 25 pts. So that's 75 points before you consider the special rules of the battalion or that it lowers your drops. Since many of us are into minimum sized units now, let's take a look at minimum battalions.

    Shroudguard - 410/460: 2 x 5 Bladegheists, MKoES/Reikenor - 16/17 wounds... 25.7/27 pts per wound... 3 chances for WoT

    Deathriders - 760: 1 Harrow, 2 x 5 Hexwraiths, 1 Black Coach - 37 wounds... 20.5 pts per wound... 4 chances for 9+ WoT

    The Condemned - 660: 1 Torment, 1 x 2 Chainghasts, 2 x 20 Chainrasps - 49 wounds... 13.5 pts per wound... 4 chances for WoT

    Chainguard - 580: 1 Guardian, 2 x 20 Chainrasps - 45 wounds... 12.9 pts per wound... 3 chances for WoT

    Execution Horde - 540: 1 Executioner, 3 x 3 Spirit Hosts - 32 wounds... 16.9 pts per wound... 4 chances for WoT

    Death Stalkers - 620: 1 Wraith, 2 x 10 Reapers, 2 x 4 Stalkers - 32 wounds... 19.4 pts per wound... 5 chances for WoT

    Shrieker Host - 520: 1 Tomb Banshee, 2 x 5 Harridans, 2 x 4 Myrmourns - 22 wounds... 23.7 pts per wound... 5 chances for WoT

     

    That's interesting. Deathriders remains the most expensive battalion, but Shroudguard is actually the worst bang for your buck for both wounds and WoT opportunities. Shrieker Host got cheaper but is still really expensive per wound. Obviously things change if you max some of the units, but it's interesting food for thought. I think there may be room for a double battalion MSU list. Or maybe I rely too much on command points and artefacts.

    • Like 4

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    2 hours ago, Malakithe said:

    Thats not really a mechanic I would try to push to use. I was thinking more of how to maximize their retreat then charge again ability. They are cheaper then Grims but smaller max unit size...maybe 3x20? Would that work? Just flood the table with them lol

    I tend to agree that Blades don't work that well in max sized units. It really takes away from their abilities, and they're expensive.

    If you want to run full sized units, I'd suggest trying Harridans instead. You're paying 40 less points so with three full sized units that's an extra 120 points. There's a lot you can do with those extra points. Then, if you look at the damage output, Harridans actually do better than Blades on turns when Blades don't charge and if the Blades don't have a nearby ST/Chainghast. With the new command ability to re-roll 1s, Harridans can be supported by characters other than Spirit Torments. And while everyone focuses on the fact that they need to face low bravery opponents for one of their abilities, I've always had a lot of success with their double damage ability. Helps to do a couple extra wounds.

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    Anyone catch the Nighthaunt faction reaction podcast today from The Honest Wargamer? Playing the army as an MSU type force was brought up a bit. I know some of you have done that as well. Curious to hear other thoughts. 

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    40 minutes ago, Greasygeek said:

    So this looks interesting. Sad about the reapers but as people said it was kinda expected and I always run only a single unit of 20 so its only another 40pt I have to find somewhere. However the coach sounds good so does dreadscythe, knights, and Olynder. Even our useless spells got cheap. A bit odd there is no mention of changed warscrolls. Was really hoping for a changed scrolls for stalkers and endless spells and another command ability for Olynder. Love the stalker model so sad there is absolutely no use for it.

    I don't think a General's Handbook has ever changed a warscroll, so I wasn't hoping for that. We'll have to wait for a new book for that.

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    13 minutes ago, Ahn-ket said:

    Nothing changed on battalions only Things with a star in front have something changed

    Thanks for pointing that out to me.

    Overall, it seems like anyone who wanted to run a Death Riders style list is winning the most from these changes.

    Also my days of running the Death Stalkers battalion with 60 Grimghast Reapers seem over. I figured the Reapers would go up, but hoped the Stalkers and Cairn Wraith would go down.

    AoS 2 - Nighthaunt Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    I don't see either happening anytime soon, but I'd rather have a new book that rewrites some war scrolls instead of a piece of terrain. To me, Nightmare Lanterns and Black Coaches should be as close to terrain as the army gets due to the lore of the army.

    As for the new GHB, is anybody else hoping for battalion point drops? I think that could have a large impact.

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