ArkanautDadmiral
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Posts posted by ArkanautDadmiral
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8 hours ago, EMMachine said:
I don't know the story about Sodaz, but my guess is the following. I think the community has the point of view, that fanmade stuff has more passion and higher quality than stuff of a company that looks how to get most profit with least effort, and people either have the option to consume the content for free (generating ad revenue, or support the creator actively with patreon, and people only started with patreon because it is way to easy to be demoneytized on youtube).
So being hired by GW means a drop of quality and putting the content behind a pay wall with subscription (where the money most likely goes entirely to shareholders while the creators are underpaid). It simply feels better when Creators actually get the money instead of people that don't care about the product at all.
Most of the time subscriptions feel like scams. I mean, the Warscroll Builder has higher quality for free than the Armybuilder inside the AoS and 40k App combined which are behind a paywall.
But there’s no evidence of a drop in quality. And you can’t in one breath be concerned for Sodaz wage at GW while in the other harass him for agreeing to the deal to the point he leaves the community. It’s not for us to decide what Sodaz should be happy to be paid, it’s for Sodaz to decide.
The community can’t be defended here, they gave the guy so much hate he flat out left Warhammer.
You can feel the apps etc are a scam dude, that’s your opinion. Not everyone feels that way though.
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13 minutes ago, Gaz Taylor said:
You do have to remember there are a lot of people who seem to enjoy moaning about stuff like this. I’ve been in the hobby for about 25 years and this happens all the time. I think these people think they are defending the small business person or protecting somebody who makes cool content and are sticking it to “the man”. So there is loads of talk about boycotts and things become toxic. We don’t want that on TGA because it’s not nice to read about and in the grand scheme of things, GW aren’t evil. They do lots of things wrong and it seems they need some work to do internally as a business but they aren’t evil. It’s interesting some people on social media have been talking about not playing GW games and buying stuff, due to TTS shutting up shop but none of this in the previous discussion about staff.
As I’ve mentioned, GW also haven’t done anything yet and in my opinion are in their rights to protect their business. So unless you are in direct competition of Warhammer plus, I think a lot of content creators will be fine. Plus it means some of them may need to up their game as well.
I think the trend will continue that creators who are on top of their game will get offered partnerships too. It’s just a shame that when one of them does accept they’re suddenly the enemy in many’s eyes.
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8 hours ago, Overread said:
To date they've not sent any takedown requests. They've only made an offer to work for them or take monetizing down on any fan works. Which honestly is a very fair move. They are not removing fan content in the least, simply reinforcing that they own copyright over the IP material and that fan works must be just that - fan works without any earning attached to them. But if the creator wants to they can choose to earn from the video by working for GW and then their video will appear on Warhammer + - and lets face it Warhammer + is likely to get a huge viewership from GW fans alone.
In fact GW was very lenient allowing fan works to profit for as long as they have done and its only the rise of youtube paid ads and services like patreon which have even changed the fanworks region to something that can casually be made to turn and income and even profit. Normally most fan videos are like fanfiction - its fun hobby stuff that never earns a penny
I agree with everything you said. It was more a question for those claiming GW is shutting people down.
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7 hours ago, The Red King said:
With respect that we really have a difference of opinion of what constitutes fair use as far as parody, as a genuine unloaded question, how do supporters of these moves feel about people posting battle reports or painting videos with their miniatures and how do they personally feel it differs from TTS in the amount of GW intellectual property it uses.
My personal take is that the writing and animation and such that went into TTS far exceeds the amount of fair use that goes into recording yourself using GW official minis to play a game following GW official rules, but I assume nobody here is advocating that it would be correct, or beneficial to the community/game/bottomline, to disallow those kinds of videos that drive players to the game.
I don’t think painting videos or battle reports will be targeted at all and right now there’s 0 evidence that any have been.
Why do people feel the need to preemptively complain about something that has not and may not happen?
I signed the petition, I would like TTS to keep going but let’s not ignore the fact GW did not even contact TTS. TTS are the ones that decided to stop.
On the painting channels and battle report channels. They’re all posting videos and comments about the bad, bad GW but they’re the ones with ability to bring about some change. They should put their money where their mouth is and make more content that’s not GW centric, push some other game systems, introduce their audiences to other options, try to grow the communities of GWs competitors. Once GW sees the money flowing somewhere else you’re likely to start seeing some change.
Be the change you want to see.
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On 8/2/2021 at 3:30 PM, GrogTheGrognard said:
1. How does the amount of Patreon money matter for this discussion? If he was making $1 billion every month versus $10 every month would that change who's in the right and who's in the wrong? Would it change how GW is currently throttling the fan creativity like TTS or SODAZ?
What did GW do to Sodaz? They offered him a partnership which he initially accepted. Then he got a tonne of hate from the community for doing so and changed his mind, turned down GWs offer and moved away from the Warhammer community because of the harassment.
GW did exactly nothing to TTS either… they made no contact at all with TTS…
To date, how many animators has GW actually sent a c&d to?
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I understand both sides of the coin.
I’ll happily sign the petition, because I’d prefer a world with more fan animations. But I do understand GWs perspective if they don’t want people monetising their IP (which is all that’s happened to any creator so far).
Anyway, signed. Hopefully they get a green light to keep doing what they do or at least a clarified stance from GW that they can continue to make it without monetising it at least.
If non-monetised fan works start getting pulled, then I’ll be upset with the rest too. But that’s not the case yet.
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Escalation league starting soon at 750 points,
Thinking:
Zilfin
Endrinmaster - occular staff, tinkerer
9x ArkCo
Frigate - skymines
5x Thunderers
Gunhauler - compartments
Could just as easy switch that to Nar though.
Struggling for where to go at 1000, was thinking maybe (warlord battalion):
Bjorgen
Navigator - flare pistol
Endrinmaster (general) - occular staff, tinkerer
10x ArkCo
Frigate
5x Thunderers
Gunhauler
Profiteers
my first games of AoS will be AoS 3 because of COVID. League was supposed to start last year, still not managed to get everything painted in time!
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Just now, Golub87 said:
No, because you have acquired (what us, working class Joes consider to be) trappings of wealth. Being able to spend money on an impulse FEELS like you have more because if you did not, then you would not spend it like that right? Would I, as a rational individual, spend more than I can afford on a whim? Of course not, therefore the fact that I am spending it means that I am less poor.
Human psyche is weird.
But if I feel like I have all I want and all I need does that not make me rich? How much more material wealth are you saying I should have to ensure I’m not poor in reality anymore?
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2 minutes ago, Golub87 said:
Yes. Working class turns to consumerism in order to fill the gap that alienation from our own labor leaves in our psyche. It also makes us feel less poor.
Our beloved capitalist overlords are more than happy to oblige and feed the addiction to various toys.
Being rich does not mean being able to afford a new car or a new phone. Thinking like that just shows how removed we are from the actual material reality of being rich.
Surely the empty bank account would make me feel more poor?
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4 minutes ago, Golub87 said:
but vast majority of us, including everyone here I guess, are poor.
So poor in fact that we all spend our disposable income on admittedly expensive plastic toys. Go figure.
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2 hours ago, sandlemad said:
Good catch, that does look a bit like what you'd get if you were hit by lightning. We know these brothers fought the dragon ogres in ancient times and they're pretty adept at summoning storms, electricity, bolts from heaven. Could be that.
Or... it could be a sign of why Karazai is wandering the realm of beasts while his brother holds court in High Azyr at Sigmar's right hand. Maybe there was a disagreement with the God King, things came to harsh words, then fisticuffs, then lightning bolts.
Yep, I did consider it might have been his brother himself too, don’t they breathe lightening?
It’d be cool if it was a nod to maybe a new Shaggoth incoming but I think it’s probably most likely Sigmar related.
Looking forward to finding out regardless.
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So Karazais scars look like Lichtenberg Figures, what do we think went down?
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6 hours ago, ArkanautDadmiral said:GW are just making too much good stuff right now.
I’m excited for the drakes later but maybe it’ll be a good thing if it puts me off doing SCE haha.
Haha I spoke too soon…
Not a big fan on first impression, a head swap would have fixed it for me but doesn’t feel right on a named character.
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5 minutes ago, Malakye said:
So the biggest thing I noticed in the new core book was the massively expanded section on Ulgu with map and description of Malerion's "Legions". I don't see how it won't be Ulgu with such an expansion in info, if you haven't I suggest giving that section a good look over for some nice tidbits.
Oh yeah like I said my money would be on Ulgu. Part of me hopes Malerion is a bit further off though so I can get some other projects done first, because they’re likely going to be an insta buy haha.
GW are just making too much good stuff right now.
I’m excited for the drakes later but maybe it’ll be a good thing if it puts me off doing SCE haha.
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7 hours ago, Marius au said:
It seems that Underworlds is a bit of predictor for where the focus shifts (Shyish to Ghur), I would suspect/hope next would be the realm of Shadow.
For warbands I would like to see Kruelboyz, Stormcast, Dispossesed, Spiderfang, Mancrusher/Maneater, Unmbraneth, Eshin, Tzeentch (Ogrid Thematurge)
I think Ulgu would be the bet to put money on, but I could also see Chamon or Ghyran as possibilities.
I’d really like to start seeing Cities / Dawn Bringer Crusade war bands introduced in each realm so the artists can explore some of the aesthetics and cultures related to living in those realms.
Other than that I’d completely agree I’d like to see Duardin, Spiderfang and Eshin / Skyre.
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Just now, Kadeton said:
This thread was really depressing to read. There's so much misunderstanding about intellectual property, and it's genuinely sad to see how effectively misinformation and confusion has been propagated and weaponised by corporate interests in the broader IP conversation, as evidenced here in microcosm.
Then please explain it for everyone who’s got it wrong?
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Edit: on reflection this was all about ranty and off topic so I’ve removed it. Hopefully someone can get the thread back on track.
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I’m really looking forward to the dragons tomorrow!
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12 minutes ago, Sleboda said:
As a side note (maybe another thread?), I've always scratched my head over this use of "support."
The company needs to "support" the game.
A customer needs to "support" a YouTube channel.
A gamer "supports" a business by purchasing its products.
To me, these are all nonsense.
Entity X produces an item (model, podcast, airplane, article, whatever). People pay for it or they don't. There is no connection beyond that.
It's especially irksome when a YouTube channel - almost always a thing making money or trying to - asks for support. No, I will not "support" you. Make a thing I value enough to purchase and I'll purchase it. Transaction over. If you fail, that's not because you were not "supported." It's because what you produced was not worth me buying. End of story.
In this context, buying and using a product from GW is not supporting them. It's buying something under the terms the seller proposed.
I support my mom when she's emotionally troubled.
I support my friend by helping him move.
I support my junk with nicely fitting undies.
I buy a product when the manufacturer creates a thing I value enough to buy. It's a transaction. Incidentally, this is why I believe gamers are entitled whiners when they get mad at a company for not "supporting" a game system. When the game comes out, you buy it for, say, $100. The company owes you ZERO "support" for the game after that. You got what you paid for, and that's it.
My lawn has too many people on it.
I agree with your deeper points here but I think the ‘support’ thing is a bit of an argument about semantics which doesn’t have a huge impact on the underlying point.
But you’re right as consumers were offered a choice to buy the product or not. GW don’t force us. We’re free to spend or not spend. I can’t wrap my head around how someone can have such utter contempt for company X but still put money into their product, perpetuating the cycle. Especially when their biggest gripe is company X only cares about profits; yes, maybe, but you’re giving them to them!
Some seem to be trying to separate the product from the company that makes it here (evidenced by one users “GW don’t make things, they just own them…’ stance) which seems like a convenient way of trying to disassociate themselves from their spending relationship with the business that gives them the ability to act in ways they don’t find desirable.
EA and the Fifa series are another good example of this, every year people buy the game and complain it’s poor or nothings changed etc, but every year they still buy it!
They also ignore that maybe some people like the game doesn’t change much, maybe they’re happy to pay for just the updated kits etc, some might not think it’s worth the price, but the money being spent proves otherwise.
This has gone a little off topic though, sorry.
Im confident we won’t see any channels get shut down. If you’re making fan art the loss of monetisation (and that’s all they’ll lose) on that shouldn’t be an issue. Fan art is supposed to be a labour of love, not a revenue stream. If more channels took that approach we’d probably see more interesting content instead of the same rehashed videos amongst numerous creators.
Just look at the entitlement of Squidmar:
His content is 99% Warhammer, he has 322k followers, he makes Warhammer painting videos for a living… I know who the main beneficiary of this relationship is and it’s not GW, no one is landing on his channel without already being a Warhammer fan already. The painting channels tend to push people towards alternate paint brands rather than Citadel. Climb down Squidmar, you’d have nothing without GW. Yet they’re the leeches? Imagine the level of arrogance…There’s literally some channels monetising nothing but complaints about GW.
This turned out ranty for me but I’ll actually post instead of delete this time.
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None of these content creators are creating their own fictional entities that have been influenced by Warhammer (and by extension any other fantasy or sci-fi trope), they’re monetising content that contains GWs specific IP, their universe, characters etc
There’s a big difference between me putting a yellow bald man in an animation to putting Homer Simpson in it and setting it in Springfield with the rest of the cast.
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52 minutes ago, RexHavoc said:
I will continue to buy warhammer models that I like the look of and I will continue to enjoy playing in the warhammer sandbox…
… I will go out of my to support other wargaming companies, but not GW.You don’t consider buying and using their products as support?
58 minutes ago, RexHavoc said:They exist to sell as much stock as they can, rinse and repeat. They could sell any other type of product and nothing would change with them..
What company with a product exists to do something other than sell that product?
Despite your contempt for GW, you still keep putting money in their pockets? Do you consider maybe you’re enabling the practices you disagree with?-
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10 minutes ago, RuneBrush said:
I think we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. That you've had to explain your own opinion on economics to a number of us suggests that it's not an opinion that is that common.
Coming back to the new IP rules, pretty much it's GW's ball and they can tell us how they expect us to play with it. They're perfectly entitled to do this as the owner of the IP even if we don't agree with all the items. As I agreed with in an earlier post, I think we need to wait and see what happens going forward. I certainly expect fan films to be clamped down on, but beyond this who knows. Is this fair? No less fair than trying to make a business from somebody else's work.
I’ve never written and deleted so many responses before, thankfully when it popped up you’d written this I realised it’s probably wise not to bother engaging with that particular train of thought too.
I don’t think we’ll see an impact on any creators except those that make fictional animations based on the IP. And even then i think they’ll still be able to make them but just won’t be able to monetise them (fair enough in my opinion). Nothing will happen to battle reports, reviews or painting channels.
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7 hours ago, stratigo said:
I mean maybe I am vastly overestimating the amount of knowledge people have, but I feel like y'all know that larger, wealthier entities are better protected under the law then smaller, poorer entities. You don't seriously think the law is actually equal right? In practice or in writing. I mean, I did post the link to capitalist realism, but I didn't think people fell this hard into it to think that the system is truly strictly fair to literally everyone because this is so blatantly not the case.
You don’t have to answer this, but I’m interested to know how old you are and what industry you work in?
Only because you’re questioning other people’s knowledge and trying to assert your own authority on the subject matter.
Of course you don’t have to answer that.
8 hours ago, stratigo said:GW the business doesn't make anything. It hires people that makes things for it, who do NOT see a equal return for the things that they make proportional to what the people who own, but have no involvement in, GW make.
This is the second time you’ve claimed GW don’t create because they pay other people to do it for them, and then pay them less than they deserve. Is this strictly relating to small creators making GW ip products without a license, or for example hiring a production studio, I.e. Sun & Moon who are making Hammer & Bolter? Do you just mean in house employees?
I just want some context as to who you’re positioning the small creator as here and what their relationship with GW is, examples would be helpful. So I can fully understand who you’re referring to.
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2 hours ago, Jymmy said:
I also think that the change in the overall aesthetic is a mistake. Precisely the only think that I like in the box are the hobgrots, but because they are something fully new, and for thar reason, I find it comprehensible that they could be something exotic that stands out (also for their unknown origin). I find it harder to justify the rest of the range…
You’ve got the flip side of this argument too though.
I wouldn’t have touched this box if the Stormcast were the same style as before and/or if the Kruleboyz were more like the other Orruks.
There must have been far fewer Beast Snagga boxes. If my local received the same allocation for Dominion as they did Beast Snaggas they would have sold out of Dominion too.-
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Petition for more fan creativity
in Age of Sigmar Discussions
Posted
I’m not getting into ‘he started it’ arguments, it’s playground stuff. My issue is all accountability is being put on GW when it’s not the case. Sodaz harassment can’t be excused because of GW.
The comment you’ve quoted was in relation to someone saying GW had stifled Sodaz creativity, it’s false.