Poryague
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Posts posted by Poryague
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If the 10 Wound rule now applies to cover that would mean the Voice gets cover. The reason I say this is the 10 Wound thing showed up on sylvaneth army terrain piece as well monster and flying rule disappeared. This may be a new thing throughout.
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7 hours ago, CeleFAZE said:
We're okay when it comes to CP generation, but only for one of our hosts, and not nearly to the extent of Seraphon, who are already a top dog in the meta. The twins will help for sure, but we still have the problem of being locked into very specific builds to play on the same level as armies with far more freedom.
I'll try to withhold judgment until we have a better idea of what's in the pipeline, but I feel rather burnt out on hoping for a silver bullet for our shortcomings as a faction.
The silver bullet at this point would be point drops across multiple units which is the most likely. Unfortunately I don't see that happening until December. I don't see the July points adjustment having to many adjustments.
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2 hours ago, CeleFAZE said:
My only issue with the idea that the new 3.0 rules will make our stuff better is that the other armies get the benefit of those rules too. A rising tide lifts all ships as it were, and we'll still be dealing with more subpar baseline rules with our book, while enjoying the same benefits.
On the note of fiction for our faction, as an artist and partners with a writer, I may take it upon myself to create a webcomic series following a hedonite host when my schedule frees up a bit after the next few months. If GW won't make content I'll do it myself until the inevitable C&D order.
Except not all armies will benefit equally. Slaanesh can generate a lot of cp it is on the higher end. Add in the twins you get infinite range and 1 free cp use each player turn. We will benefit more from it then most.
Most model rules are ok. The hosts probably needed some reworking or new ones introduced. As well as the buff pieces and spells being easier to use. Though the worst offender is points which hopefully go down because it's to restrictive.
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1 minute ago, Enoby said:
The bonus to monsters is also very interesting for them - might up Dex's damage considerably, depending on what the bonuses are.
Will write up the full details of the game, but won against Sylvaneth 16-2 top of turn 2 using the twins
With the news of AoS 3 being good for heroes and monsters with command points, I'm more optimistic about the twins.
I think the Voice could be more powerful depending on command changes with its ability to have infinite range. Shrinking of the table size may explain some of the ranges being awkward. Also maybe they changed the order of the phases.
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So the table size went down 48x72 to 44x60. We got extra command stuff to do which may change the value of the twins depending on what they allow. If reaction commands do anything interesting having unlimited range from the Voice could be really useful.
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1 hour ago, swarmofseals said:
Just wanted to report in on another game that was a ton of fun. I took the following list:
MY LIST
Keeper of Secrets (General, Speed Chaser, Enrapturing Circlet, Progeny of Damnation)
Keeper of Secrets (Path of Damnation)
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (Battle Rapture)
5 Slickblade Seekers
40 Chaos Marauders
2x1 Chaos Spawn
2x11 Blissbarb Archers
2x8 Iron Golems (allies)
1x5 Plague Censer Bearers (allies)
So this one was a bit heavier on Slaves to Darkness units than my previous version.
My opponent was a typical Maggotkin PBK list with a Great Unclean One, a shedload of Putrid Blightkings and a Lord of Blights in a Blight Cyst battalion and Gutrot Spume and geminids (slightly unusual).The battleplan was Total Conquest.
SUMMARY
I deployed with my iron golems screening my close corner and down both sides, with my slickblades covering the rest of the border to the bottom table edge and the marauders to the right of the iron golems along the midline toward the right table edge. My two keepers were toward the close corner with the blissbarbs crowded in around/behind. The sorcerer lord was with the marauders, and the chaos spawns were behind the seekers with the plague censers fairly centrally placed to tag many of my units.
He took the first turn and pushed 20 PBKs around and down to charge my top golems and the marauders. 10 PBKs did the same on the other side, pinning the other golems and tagging the seekers. Gutrot and 5 PBKs came behind me on the narrow flank of the marauders. The PBKs didn't make their charge but Gutrot did, making piling in very awkward.
We traded hits on his first turn and he scored 4. I didn't have a ton of options on my turn as I was pinned in, but luckily between pile ins and casualties I was able to create a big enough gap where my seekers had been to let one of my keepers dash through and take the bottom left objective back. I had 9 depravity at this point and knew I'd be making a lot more later in the turn, but I made a mistake and decided not to summon as I wasn't confident that I'd be able to make enough depravity to hit 12 on the following turn if I got the double turn. I'm still not sure if this was the right choice in the abstract, but in practice I should have summoned either 5 seekers or a Bladebringer on Exalted Chariot.
More combat happened and my marauders killed Gutrot while both of my units of Iron Golems went down after taking a ton of punishment. With the slickblades, my second Keeper and the Chaos Spawns getting in the mix I was able to deal with the rest of the blight kings on my left. I scored 4 (my home objective and then 3 for taking the bottom left back with a leader.)
He won the priority roll and pushed up the center and from behind with more PBKs as well as down onto the bottom left objective. He killed loads of marauders and started in on my archers.
In my turn I continued the fight for the bottom left objective with my two keepers and the remaining slickblades, and then retreated my handful of remaining marauders around the blightkings and took the top right objective. The sorcerer lord ran up as well, and managed to summon in 30 Daemonettes to consolidate that objective. I made the charge with the Daemonettes to get into his Lord of Blights and keep the big unit of PBKs pinned in combat at an awkward angle. I knew my archers were going to go down and I would lose my home objective but nothing to be done about it.
The following turn he won the priority roll again and we kept up the fight for the two corner objectives while I lost my home objective. He managed to kill about half of the Daemonettes while I got his Lord of Blights and held that objective. I also barely hung on to the bottom left objective. During my turn I was able to summon in 30 Daemonettes to help in the bottom right while I retreated on the top left to hold it for one more turn. I also stole his home objective with a retreat from a single remaining slickblade.
He won the priority roll for turn 4, but at this point things were solidly in my favor. He took the top right objective and tried to screen off his home objective, but during my turn 4 I brought in yet another 30 daemonettes and was able to take his home objective and take my home objective back.
We called it before the first turn as I was now very solidly ahead both on board and on points. In the end I had both Keepers and a shedload of daemonettes while he had about 9 PBKs and his GUO.
Overall I felt really good about how the list played. I don't think luck was a huge factor this game. We both had some good and bad combat rounds. He won all of the priority rolls, but I did get off two out of 3 9" charges with my summoned Daemonettes.
I definitely think I'd drop the second keeper. There just isn't enough CP to justify two. I'd probably try to replace it either with Glutos or with a Contorted Epitome.
Marauders are sweet, but I'm not really sold on them vs 10 slickblades.
Iron Golems continue to impress.
I think that having a small DP battery with either Plague Censer Bearers or a Plague Priest is a good idea, but going over the top on it doesn't seem great.
if 2 keepers require more cp invaders seems to generate a lot of cp. May be worth a try if the list is cp hungry. While God seekers may lean more heavily towards summoning. Intentional or not 1 host being a good cp farmer for cp heavy list while the other is better at summoning and making those 9in charges is not bad.
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7 hours ago, swarmofseals said:
Its an interesting idea, but it will be very unreliable as it requires beating bravery scores and resolving two separate spells with no bonuses to cast.
There's certainly plenty of room for reasonable people to disagree, but I can't help but wonder why more people don't see what I see in this book. I've been playing with a couple of lists now and have found the gameplay to be very satisfying and very thematic. Just to respond to a few of the points raised:
- If your balanced "correct" way to play list is solidly mid tier then isn't that a sign of a pretty well designed book? If a hodgepodge thematic list is busted isn't that a bad thing?
- I've found the "power gamed" versions of Slaanesh to be in many ways more thematically on point than the more normal lists. I think the power gamed version of Slaanesh is a build that uses mobility to pin and torture enemy units without killing them outright, plays cat and mouse with objectives, and eventually uses all of the depravity built up to build an overwhelming advantage before finally finishing the opponent off -- all while actively looking for ways to cause pain to your own units to generate even more depravity. How is that not utterly Slaaneshi?
- I think you may be right that there will be a high tier depravity focused build, although I think it will have some natural predators as well. There should be enough bad matchups to keep it honest.
- Boring is the absolute last way I would describe the games I have played with this tome so far
- I also play DoK, and I find it strange that people here are so jealous of the DoK book when so many in the DoK thread are complaining bitterly about that tome being terrible. Personally I think it's a solid tome and I do worry about the shooting a bit, but DoK did get some very significant nerfs. The old Witch Aelf/Sister of Slaughter spam playstyle is substantially weakened.
- I'm 100% sympathetic to some of the disappointment in the new Slaanesh mortals units. Slaangors are an absolute mess, and I think the Myrmidesh also miss the mark. The Twinsouls and Sigvald are both OK -- good enough for mid tier play for sure, and they won't cripple more competitive lists that want to include them or anything. Glutos I'm really not sure about. I think he is at least in line with Twinsouls/Sigvald and very possibly better. The same goes for the Blissbarb Seekers. The Blissbarb Archers and Slickblade Seekers are both very strong. I think the Shardspeaker is solid and will be quite good if the meta shifts away from shooting some. I'd love to see some of these warscrolls brought up to snuff, but I also can't say that I agree with those of you who are saying that all of the new models are terrible on the table.
Dok had small changes that brought some rules in line with wholly within rules. They had all point drops across the board for rules that simply made the book behave as other books.
Almost all key units to the army had 10 to 70 point drop.
Mindrazer no longer requires a bravery check it works on charge with -1 rend and +1damage so the gets cranked to 2 damage rend 1 on charge casting value went to 8 to cast. Heall you can get unit of witch aelves to rend 2 2 damage.
The command traits and artifacts changed slightly it was only 3 of them.
Vince Venturella does a good job explaining it. Basically DoK is and has been strong with high offense and defense now with more bodies. Some list could see more then 200 points free up to get more stuff. It's night and. Day between the books. There was no brining DoK to fat middle it feels like it shot to the top with good rule design and aggressive on pointing.
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Looking at both the dok and HoS. The difference is insane. DoK is just win. The disparity here makes no sense you can look at both books and it's like they didn't bother looking at the other books. This disparity happens way to often.
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1 hour ago, Yoid said:
I've Seen 2 battle reports so far of new Daemons of Slaanesh VS new Daughters of Khaine. It went terrible for Slaanesh both times.
Lists were pretty similar (some Keepers, some Chariots (with some herlads and exalteds), some Seekers, some Hellstriders, and lots of Demonettes. VS big unit of mele melusai + big unit of ranged melusai + one unit of witch aelves, + cauldrons + medusa + Morathi)
In both matches every DoK unit killed around double their point cost in models in just two turns wiping Slaaanesh army. Slaanesh attacks were really bland and killed around 300pts of the DoK army before being wiped out, even when summoning 30 more Daemonettes to the table by turn 2.
Then at the end of the battle reports both players talked about everything important in DoK going down 10 to 40 pts, specially heroes, while everything in Slaanesh going up 10 to 40 pts, specially cavalry and heroes, and Keepers not working at the current point value.
As a good follower of slaanesh i feel jealous of what they got, it seems like we have the short stick in this double battletome release.
Of course we still got to see the mortals in play, but im feeling like they aren't gonna help too much, we got the high prices and not so good buffs that maybe make our units hit 1.5x harder, while they got price decreases and better buffs to turn the units into real blenders that hit 3x harder.Not surprising dok are a very synergistic army. The units and aligience abilities feed of eachother very well and is very cohesive
Slaanesh not so much there are interesting builds that could be done but points will hamper things.
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32 minutes ago, Enoby said:
A bit of a half formed idea for a tanky list in Slaanesh:
Invaders Host (Lurid haze)
90 Exalted hero of chaos (someone has to stand around headbutting the fane for daemons)
150pts Lord of Pain (general) with the Lurid artefact and command trait
150pts Lord of Pain with rod of misrule
200pts Syll'Esske (general, also I feel I spell this name differently each time)
340pts 10 Twin Souls
340pts 10 Twin Souls
340 pts 10 Twin Souls
160(?) for the Syberite Battalion
160(?) for the nobles Battalion
50 extra CP
87 wounds
1980pts
Hopefully we'll start the game with 5 CP (possibly six) and two drops, and will generate about 3 a turn.
The hope is to use a mixture of the Lurid Haze's +1 to save, 5++ on the Syberites, and battleshock immunity from Syll'Esske to keep everything around and summon in more units over time. It's very CP heavy, but not all CP need to be used at once, and RRs will be provided on a need to basis.
Alternatively, scrap the nobles battalion for either another LoP (though I don't think you'll need one) or a Shardspeaker for some more casting.
If they have the 5++ save and the 3+ save, a unit of 6 charging Morrsarr Guard do about 8 damage, killing 4 of the 10.
In addition, with their buffed save, unbuffed Archaon does about 7 and a bit damage against them, killing 3 and a bit of the 10.
The list would struggle to do damage against high saves (3+ or better), so it may be worth turning one of the Twin Souls unit into a Painbringer unit. Painbringers with a 3+ rr is very nice, but lacks MW protection and does less damage.
Hopefully with Syll'Esske, they would lost nothing to battleshock and they would generate a lot of DP.
Probably wouldn't bother with teleporting unless the opponent has left a massive defensive hole. or I think I can tie up the army
This the best way to get shardspeaker within range. Also get glutos across the board quick. If you run glutos with fiends well they can just appear in range and now you have a debuff on that makes -2 to hit fiends unit in your enemies face as well as debuff to enemy spell casts.
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Almost forgot about the everchosen book there are additional modifiers for each host. Some of those may be useful. Like invaders command ability to get +1 to save in combat once per turn and the ability to come in from a board edge.
God's seeker command ability of if you charge unmodified 6 to save rolls in combat kicks back a mortal wound.
Pretenders ca ignore the first 2 wounds in combat once per turn
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13 minutes ago, Grimrock said:
Are you giving the keeper an artifact and command trait for those calculations? There's no way I'd be paying points for a naked keeper, so there's not much use in considering one without at least the permanent +1 to hit from the fane. I know Glutos can grab it once on the first turn, but after that he'll likely be too far away to get the buff.
Regardless, like @Rivener said they're both going to be primarily support pieces. I like the keeper's kit for that more though, the locus makes them incredibly difficult to handle and the command ability to attack twice can be amazingly powerful on the right unit. Glutos is tanky, but he offers very little meaningful support for the rest of the army despite his wall of text. Also the biggest issue I've run into so far is a lack of significant damange, not resilience. I'm not saying he's awful or anything, but being tanky and killing a unit of liberators every turn just doesn't seem like enough for 400 points. Maybe I jut need to give him a shot and see how it goes.
Save Kos +1 to hit Glutos Glutos rr hit from LoP Kos +1 attack on claws 2+ 5.17 5.21 6.61 5.54 3+ 6.75 7.51 9.53 7.22 4+ 8.33 9.81 12.44 8.9 5+ 9.92 12.1 15.36 10.58 6+ 10.67 13.98 17.75 11.22 - 10.67 14.19 18.03 11.22 Looks like +1 attack on the claws does more to close the gap.
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8 minutes ago, Grimrock said:
Are you giving the keeper an artifact and command trait for those calculations? There's no way I'd be paying points for a naked keeper, so there's not much use in considering one without at least the permanent +1 to hit from the fane. I know Glutos can grab it once on the first turn, but after that he'll likely be too far away to get the buff.
Regardless, like @Rivener said they're both going to be primarily support pieces. I like the keeper's kit for that more though, the locus makes them incredibly difficult to handle and the command ability to attack twice can be amazingly powerful on the right unit. Glutos is tanky, but he offers very little meaningful support for the rest of the army despite his wall of text. Also the biggest issue I've run into so far is a lack of significant damange, not resilience. Maybe I jut need to give him a shot and see how it goes.
I didn't give kos something because there a lot of choices depending on what you want the kos to do and which host. Obviously if hard focus on killing you can close the gap like by giving kos +1 attack for the claws. Then rr to hit from a lord of pain on Glutos would be hard to close the gap on.
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The army is to much glass and does not hit hard enough. One way to play that stands out is pinning and harrasing units. Use daemon heroes to pin units. A kos can pin a more dangerous unit and chip at it. Glutos can slow down a dangerous unit. archers grab objectives shoot anything in range maybe kill some foot heroes , shoot at soft unit, support fire for a daemon hero is pinning a unit. Then our slower or more squishy combat units come in to help.
So it's all about stopping the opponent from moving and soften the enemy units then come in for the kill. This would also generate dp. The main problem is points to pull it off with the right combination of units. Also there are armies this won't work with to well.
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13 minutes ago, Grimrock said:
My pleasure, it helps me when I organize my thoughts like this as well. I'm not really sure on the screening honestly. The army is already lacking in damage so dropping a unit of Slickblades completely might hurt it too much. The best I could come up with would be downgrading both units of Slickblades to chaos knights and making use of the 80 points that frees up for a unit of Iron Golems. One unit might not be enough of a screen, but it would help a little at least. I did have a lot of success with my last game running a big block of 15 chaos warriors as a screen but that requires a more significant list rewrite.
Fiends and Glutos would be an absolute terror for a melee army to deal with to be sure. My main problems are it's 760 points and, like you said, a shooting army would pick the fiends apart too quickly. I'm also having trouble envisioning how to use Glutos. He's super tanky and his kit gets him into combat really quickly, but once he gets there he just doesn't do enough damage to justify his points. Not enough meaningful support either.
Save Kos Glutos Glutos rr hit from LoP 2+ 4.36 5.21 6.61 3+ 5.69 7.51 9.53 4+ 7.03 9.81 12.44 5+ 8.36 12.1 15.36 6+ 9 13.98 17.75 - 9 14.19 18.03 Gluto does do more damage then a kos is more survivable offers more to the army. With a lord of pain ca he shoots way past a kos. You can also activate him again with kos.
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Save Chosen Chosen buffed Myrmerdish Myrmerdish buffed 2+ 5.19 8.76 3.56 5.16 3+ 6.67 11.26 4.58 6.77 4+ 8.15 13.76 5.6 8.39 5+ 9.63 16.26 6.62 10 6+ 11.11 18.77 7.64 11.61 - 11.11 18.77 7.64 11.61 Chosen are 140 and myrmerdish are 150. Chosen buffed by sorcerer. Myrmerdish buffed by lord of pain and shard bringer survived to get off plus 1 to wound. I would say even adjusting for summoning they are 10-30ish points over.
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35 minutes ago, Yoid said:
Im still seeing it as fair. Sorcerer Lord buff different units that need those buffs to really shine. Meanwhile Sharspeaker can buff a unit of 30 Daemonettes + a Keeper as an example. Both will do a good job with +1 to wound and -1 to be wounded. Daemonettes with exploding 6s into 3 hits and 3+ to wound are amazing blenders, the other nearby unit like a KoS getting the buff too is a nice addition.
Yes Shardspeaker is slow and got short range, that is her weak spot. She can run every turn anyway as nor the spell or ability is negated while runing.
Im fine with Shardspeaker having down-sides and up-sides. Maybe she goes down in points with time but i still like her ahs she is now.
If you want the Chaos Sorcerer Lord so much you can play a heavy STD list, no euphoric killers to you, but better DP generation in the point per model value. Im not saying he is bad or anything, im saying they do two different things for they both different armies that seems similarly powerful in my mind once you add up everything.It's not about wanting the sorcerer lord it's about the purpose of the piece. They both support pieces. With the way the shard works it would have to come down in points significantly to make more sense.
Summoning is just OK its nothing to be supper excited about. Your not seeing stuff summoned until probably round 3 unless you lean into it. Only 1 unit is showing up a turn once you have dp its more strategic now which is good and a much better play experience. It seems some units are being pointed based off of the old allegiance abilities.
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7 minutes ago, Yoid said:
If im not mistaken Chaos Sorcerer Lord buff an ally (single ally) Shardspeaker debuff an enemy (Potentially multiple units on your side buff). Shardspeaker got more survability too as the save increase from 5+ to 3+ when you cast a spell. (You can count that as having some extra wounds)
I really like the Shardpeaker, im sure if GW make her buff an ally it would be mortal only. But as it is you can buff Daemons too. You can debuff an enemy unit with Viceleader/Bladebringer and Shardspeaker to have your whole army rr1s and +1 to wound and -1 to be wounded by it. That is huge value. (Syll'Esske also work for the rr1s)Sorcerer lord is a 4+ all the time. So I would say on average sorcerer lord is more survivable.
Even if she can tag a single unit with the debuff you have to be dangerously close. Range is the issue.
Yes sorcerer lord buff mortals only but the buffs are strong. Point at a unit rr all saves the spell rr hit and wounds. Is much stronger then a +1 to w or -1 to w. Also there is a 40 point gap. So targeting 1 hedonite unit should be OK
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Save Auralan sentinel 18in 120p Auralan sentinel 120p 36in Auralan sentinel 18in 120p 5+mw Auralan sentinel 120p 36in 5+mw 2+ 2.5 2.22 3.89 3.61 3+ 2.92 2.5 4.17 3.75 4+ 3.33 2.78 4.44 3.89 5+ 3.75 3.06 4.72 4.03 6+ 4.17 3.33 5 4.17 - 4.17 3.33 5 4.17 Save Blood stalkers 24in140p Namarti 18in 120 Namarti 9in 120 Skinks 120p 16in 2+ 2.78 0.42 1.25 0.37 3+ 3.33 0.83 2.5 0.74 4+ 3.89 1.25 3.75 1.11 5+ 4.44 1.67 5 1.48 6+ 5 2.08 6.25 1.85 - 5 2.5 7.5 2.22 Save Blissbarb 160 18in Blissbarb seeker 180 18in copy 2+ 2.22 2.08 3+ 3.33 2.5 4+ 4.44 2.92 5+ 5.56 3.33 6+ 6.67 3.75 - 6.67 3.75 Damge wise compared to some other archers the foot bows are ok. Far as armor our foot bows are the only one who can't get a 5+ save. Only ours in this list run and shoot.
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2 minutes ago, The Red King said:
As a BoC dabbler, bullgor aren't even that good (generally you have to find SOME outside buffs to make them good) in a faction that already struggles. So if you cant compare favorably to bullgors you're in trouble.
The bullgor on there own are significantly stronger then slangor using euphoric killers and there charge mechanic. You better off taking bullgors they seem to fill the same roll better.
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Chaos sorcer is 110
Shardspeaker is 150
They both are force multipliers but 1 is much worse then thee other.
Change shard to buff hour units with the spell and Ability or the ability buff our units and the spell range is increased to 18.
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Save Bullgor twin axe Bullgor great axe Slangor Slangor charge 2+ 4.31 4.83 2.22 3.11 3+ 5.86 6.25 3.19 4.44 4+ 7.41 7.67 4.15 5.78 5+ 8.95 9.08 5.11 7.11 6+ 10.5 9.33 5.78 8 - 10.75 9.58 5.78 8
This is bullgors vs slangor and slangor is using euphoric killers. Bullgors are a shock troop I don't know what slangor is doing.
Solutions.
1. Increase claw rend or damage maybe both.
2. The points come down to maybe 110 maybe 100.
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12 minutes ago, Enoby said:
Sorry, forgot about the disk variant. However, I think we should look at units as we can't buy singular models in AoS and we pay for the unit - I do see the value of looking at models generally, but in AoS when the discussion is about a unit being worth it, I think looking at the unit as a whole suffices.
On allegiance abilities, I didn't want to include or mention depravity as it's too variable and speculative, but I think we should include Euphoric Killers as it's always on to the point it could be written on the warscroll and nothing would change ruleswise. Unlike the other allegiance abilities, nothing can go wrong with EK and so it should always be included.
That said, I agree it's very hard to measure cost in relation to allegiance abilities.
I meant unit vs unit that's what that comparison is as well as similar pointed units. I also understand looking at just damage is not perfect as well. Its more complicated with a unit that is somewhere in between offense and defense. The 3 culprits that caused the problems have been toned down significantly. Stopping pile in is OK its situational and ONLY daemon heroes can use it. Summoning as written appears to allow 1 summon a turn so there is no holy ****** moment as 700+ points appear all at once and slamm into you. The kos ca only targets other units so to use it on a kos you need 2. Yet some units points still went up a lot with subtle changes if any. Some lost abilities and saw no change in points.
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44 minutes ago, Enoby said:
Just thought it was worth looking at the other Chaos Chosen type models compared to our own, only using buffs available on the warscroll and always on allegiance abilities. In the table, the twin souls are rr hits but the Tzaangor are not (because realistically they are usually dead if they strike last), however I will note down twin souls unbuffed and Tzaangors buffed underneath.
Tzaangors buffed by striking last: 9.51 damage against a 4+ save
Twin souls choosing not to rr hits: 6.66r (fitting) against a 4+ save (we definitely want to be rr if we can help it)
In a normal situation, that is Tzaangors aren't attacking last at full strength and Twin Souls have chosen to rr hits, the Twin Souls are the clear winner across all units damage wise.
Points for these units are, and damage per point (dpp) against a 4+ save:
Blightkings: 140, 0.0476 dpp
Chosen: 140, 0.0529 dpp
Skullreapers: 180, 0.0457 dpp
Tzaangor enlightened: 100, 0.0469 dpp
Twin Souls: 170, 0.0539 dpp
This shows that, when looking at how much damage you get per point (used mostly just for comparison), Twin Souls are worth their cost compared to other chosen equivalents. While other factions can get other buffs that may put them above Twin Souls, I only wanted to look at the always on abilities or the abilities that are very likely to happen (as in, nothing more than saying it happens need to happen for it to trigger); while we could add a blood portal man (his name completely escapes me but I think it's blood something) or Chaos Sorcerer Lord into the mix, that's more points and much more likely to go wrong (being out of range or having to support another unit or just being dead) and we have our own buffs anyway.
In addition to this, Twin Souls have the option to reduce their damage for a 5+ shrug and they have 8" move (which surprised me when I looked at it - they're as fast as a giant!)
Probably better to compare them to models in same point range.
Save Twin soul Tzangor on disc Twin soul rr Tzangor on disc rr 2+ 1.78 3.64 2.67 7.32 3+ 3.56 5.5 5.33 11.08 4+ 5.33 7.36 8 14.85 5+ 7.11 9.22 10.67 18.61 6+ 8.89 11.08 13.33 22.38 - 10.67 11.17 16 22.58 So that would be tzangor on disc. Also it should just be model to model. I am sure though that allegiance abilities add to cost but for now we should ignore that sense this harder to weight. So under model vs model of equivalent points.
Twin 170 is .047
Tzang disc 180 is .082
This also means they are competing with models like eels etc.
AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion
in Hedonites of Slaanesh
Posted
I don't know about stacking. But potentially benefiting from cover is cool I will take a 3+ save an some infinite range abilities.