SentinelGuy
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Posts posted by SentinelGuy
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5 minutes ago, Fred1245 said:
To be fair, only like 12 people had a Sisters army at that time and of them maybe 3 ever bothered going through the heartache of assembling those ridiculous (and terrible on the tabletop at the time) metal penitent engines and the only things that really suffered in the new book were the new models and the exorcist/immolator. Even then, the immolator was bad before.
The metal exorcist may be the most fiddly kit I've ever had to attempt to build. I actually gave up building a second and just took more dominions instead.
The rest of the old metal kits were pretty easy though.
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31 minutes ago, Noserenda said:
Yeah i dont think its unusual to have mixed feelings about AoS still afters its abysmal launch. I think most folks are moving past outright hatred though, at least if they are paying attention, the future feels a lot more interesting and bright for AoS than 40k which feels like its disappearing up its own backside somewhat
Yep. I feel like 40k has been going downhill since mid 5th edition and hasn't really recovered. I had high hopes for the Sisters of Battle release but then GW decided to slap heavy bolters into the hulls of existing tanks, reduced the base size of penitent engines and made the new flail superior to the old buzzsaws, just to make more £. Then they dropped a second Sisters codex not long after the first one. I got 2 games in with the old codex before this new one arrived.
it's a sad state of affairs when every rumour of a release by GW is quickly followed by a stomach churning fear that they'll kill off half your army just because they can.
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I do wonder if it's possible that some people are just waiting to see the errata documents before committing to this new edition. I mean that's where I am right now. I haven't pre-ordered the GHB because I want to see if they actually manage to release good quality fixes to the army lists first.
Now if GW marketing had any sense, they'd probably have released the errata files when the GHB flick through went up on YouTube. Instead they've kind of left things to fester for a few weeks. That can't be good for business.
Then there was the GW article from a few days ago, which came across as a bit desperate, where they were trying to defend their changes to points costs. Something which I don't think they did very well.
So, it's entirely possible that they're frantically re-editing the errata documents before release so that they can then turn around and say - see, we fixed it all.
At which point Dominion sales may increase again.
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23 minutes ago, PJetski said:
An even easier fix is to errata the Sentinel warscroll so that Sunmetal Weapons only deals mortal wounds in the shooting phase.
^ this and increase their points by at least 25.
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2 hours ago, Zeblasky said:
Hammerhal CA only gives you an option to fight twice with melee weapons in Combat phase, not shoot and fight.
Doh! That'll teach me to check the book first.
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49 minutes ago, Frowny said:
1) Taking cheap chaff to stop shooting units strength is a cost imposed on taking melee units and melee centered armies, which now might need an accompanying chaff unit. This is exactly the cost we are all worried about, now just codified by you into a direct point cost. It feels strange to say that to even the odds against 300 points of shooters, your 300 points of melee needs to take a further 80 points of chaff to take the unleash hell. It should be lopsidedly in favor of the melee unit or at least an even fight (300 pts vs 300 pts).
2) Taking shooting units to counter shooting units is a problematic solution, but it sounds like you agree that shooting is quite strong.
3) See #1. This is the same point. Dividing up your 300 point melee unit into 3x100 point units still means you lose 100 points on the charge, where before you lost zero, with minimal changes to the shooting unit I would consider this a buff to shooting.
4) Spending more points on better and more wizards to counter shooting units is exactly the same as #1. You are proposing a tax on armies that rely on melee.
5) This at least needs more explanation. Also losing a hundred points of a horde on the charge still seems to advantage the shooting unit, where before the horde would have lost nothing on the charge and would have much better odds of wiping the shooters out efficiently.
That being said, overall I think the new rules are cool and do indeed give a lot more interaction in opposing turns, and I'm not entirely opposed to unleash hell. I think unleash hell will be interesting, although think the opportunity cost may be a little low. You will use it nearly 100% of the time with the relevant units, since CP's are relatively plentiful and fight twice abilities (or shoot twice abilities) are amazing. I think it will not be an interesting decision, since when appropriate, it is so obviously the best choice that it isn't a decision.
I'm also super excited about redeploy since it also helps in melee vs melee matchups as you can keep a unit safe from a charge to guarantee a strike youreslf. Also gives reason to have flank attacks/ pincers, since then units can't as easily redeploy away.
I think the biggest fix will just be selective nerfing of a few shooting units points. balance is definitely doable to balance in the current ruleset. Mostly it is just things with very high output with either a good to hit or MW on 6's. Selective nerfs to Irondrakes, lumineth archers and DOK Stalkers would probably be fine as a place to start. I think my challenge is more that they got off with on-rate increases, rather than even bigger increases than other units given how much extra utility they got. The new missions also help them a lot.
Having to take chaff or wizards is a tax that everybody pays, it's not solely a combat army issue.
I agree on changing specific units though. Lumineth archers should be a lot more expensive. Irondrakes should definitely not be battle line - I don't think they need a further points increase at the moment. I have never faced or used stalker so cannot comment on them.
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14 hours ago, Zeblasky said:
Just had this idea in New Rules thread: take 10-15 Pistoliers (battleline in Tempest Eye), find a weak enough unit, shoot it, charge it, shoot again, finish it off, then Unleash Hell when you get charged in turn. That's 3 shooting attacks within a battle round, and without any buffs or debuffs from a 15 man unit that's potentially 30 -1 rend damage for 315 points. And you still have a decent melee profile here. A specific, but quite strong setup for sure.
I could see 10 working, but 15 may be a bit unwieldy if people are using more terrain.
If you did it in Hammerhal you could charge twice!
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18 minutes ago, Fred1245 said:
It sounds to me like you've kind of missed the point.
In order to avoid a unit of 30 sentinels nuking you on the charge you have to have take multiple risks, invest multiple units, enough points to take the geminids, a spell cast, and possibly several other abilities.
In order to nuke a charging unit with 30 Sentinels you need: 1 CP.
The problem is that there is a disproportionate effort vs reward difference in the shooting players favor.
People are getting far too hung up on Unleash Hell when there are plenty of ways to counter it.
Take cheap chaff units and charge them in first.
Shoot their shooting units to reduce return fire.
Run MSU lists.
Take more/better wizards.
Take hordes and swarm them.
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4 minutes ago, Christopher Rowe said:
I have clearly missed a memo. Or at least an updated warscroll somewhere. How exactly do geminids counter this ability?
Their ability changes in the new GHB. Now when they move over a unit it takes a mortal wound on a 2+ and cannot use CAs. It's actually a pretty handy spell for stopping CAs generally, and for drawing out dispels.
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Just use Geminids to stop Unleash Hell. Fly them over a unit, deal a mortal wound and stop them from issuing or being issued an order.
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GW focuses too much on Stormcast Eternals. If this set had contained new Cities minis, I'd have been all over it.
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I'm a bit on the fence about all this human crusader and dwarf unity talk to be honest. I'm fully onboard with the cities being huge cultural melting pots where dwarves, elves and humans rub shoulders and fight together. I get that they have to change things to generate £$€, but would rather they added new units and do a proper job of writing a new army book that melds the various units together and doesn't leave them with silly keyword restrictions.
I've also got concerns about the state of most of the cities in the new rules. Hallowheart and Settlers Gain seem to be the big winners with others like Living City and Misthavn being dependent on mission - not being able to use reserves basically removes their main ability. If the upcoming errata for the new edition fixes any of these problems, I'll be surprised.
Half of the cities are useless at the moment - Misthavn, Phoenicium, Greywater, even the new Excelsis is bad (and I've really tried to like it as it fits the fluff for my homebrew city).
I had to laugh a few days ago when GW claimed that their new method for generating points was great. I'm sorry, but in what world are 80 point flagellants good value, when skinks are 75? No shooting, pathetic save, weak in combat, only battleline if a human is general, slow and their ability is circumstantial - 80 points, lol. 5 points more gets you a unit of Freeguild or Corsairs.
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5 minutes ago, Doko said:
I dont know how put the spoiler window so i gonna alert.
SPOILER of last white dwarf next......
Last white dwarf have told us that grugnir have reforged(revived) to grombrindal.
And he have done so grombrindal gonna be who gather together every dwarf race in a same army all together.
And he have told us the reason from lore to do it:
Fyreslayers: was a huge surprise but he told us that grinnir is alive but isnt ready to come back yet,so in place of his brother he gonna help them.
Kharadrons: he know that dwarfs dont forget grudges and he got a huge grudge when he left alone to the kharadrons in the era of khaos,this is the reason that he revived to grombrindral,because they wont follow him(grugnir due to grudges), but they gonna follow to the white dwarf.
So i think is 100% for sure we gonna get a next dwarf soup tome with the new mini of grombrindall and kharadrons and fureslayers togethers,i hope dispossesseed and ironweld too but they havent said anything of them in the history.
As dwarf player im veeeery happy and i cant wait to know more
I hope Dispossessed stay an option in Cities of Sigmar even if they get combined into a dwarf list.
Getting tired of constantly having to reforge my armies into something entirely different every couple of editions.
It kind of feels like GW twisting the knife - first they insist on breaking the old Fantasy armies up, then they kill off most of the units and put the leftovers together in Cities of Sigmar. Now GW have decided to merge them back into racial armies once again.
i wouldn't be at all surprised if 4th edition AoS uses square bases.
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4 hours ago, EccentricCircle said:
So this is a genuine question, not trying to be sarcastic...
What do people like about battle reports? Warhammer is a slow game to start with, I can think of few things more tedious than spending three hours watching someone else I don't know play a game. I'm not even that fussed about watching my friends play games, and there I can join in with the joking and discussion.
But clearly there is a major appeal? Is it a way to get your gaming fix if you don't play often? Do you follow certain player's careers as though its sports and want to see how their armies are doing? Is there somehow enough of a story in there that its worth wading through hours of dice rolling and minis being moved to get too?
I don't get it?
For me it's about seeing how an army plays without having to buy the GW products first. I work part time (for health reasons), have a mortgage and live on my own, so I don't have the disposable income required to commit like I used to. It wasn't so bad a decade or two ago, but the price hikes really have made me question staying in the hobby. In the old days a hero mini was about £5, now many are pushing £20. I just don't want to waste big bucks on a unit only to find out it's rubbish and will sit on a shelf gathering dust.
I usually watch battle reports when I'm preparing food, multitasking makes them go faster
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7 minutes ago, PJetski said:
The 2021 Battle Tactics seem to heavily favour having multiple MONSTER warscrolls in an army.
You score an additional VP per round if you slay a MONSTER in that round but I think that's not going to make up the difference in being able to score a bonus point from almost every Battle Tactic. The spell to transform any HERO into a MONSTER will help but it's not guaranteed to go off and also requires a WIZARD who will probably want to cast some other spells. Could be a rough time for armies with few good MONSTER units to play objectives as well as other armies.
Armies with zero MONSTER:
- Kharadron
- Nighthaunt
- Bonesplitterz
- Gutbusters (can bring in Beastclaw units)
Armies with few usable MONSTER:
- Idoneth (Leviadon)
- Daughters of Khaine (Morathi)
- Lumineth (Teclis - does anyone use the mountain spirits?)
Cities monsters are pretty bad even if they do have lots of different ones available. I think the only reason they used to get taken was for the battalion requirements. These days they're even more of a hard sell. 10 Irondrakes or a Hydra - I'm taking the Irondrakes. Sorceress on dragon or Runelord, 10 Irondrakes and almost enough leftover for a unit of Aetherwings.
The ones with a longer ranged attack may have a very niche role in Living City - that's about the only benefit I can see.
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I can't see any reason to take a second troops unit in the Warlord battalion. It seems totally pointless. Am I missing something?
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28 minutes ago, Eldarain said:
@SentinelGuy It is odd as the Core ones have no such restriction. I like the list maybe this will open up something exciting in the rework.
It's funny, I was just looking through the cheap heroes we have access to and noticed the Cogsmith is as cheap as the Fleetmaster. Now that's got me thinking about swapping him in for the Fleetmaster. He'd be more vulnerable with his weaker save, but he's packing multiple ranged weapons, so he won't just be stood there doing nothing but spellcasting, like the elf would be. It's not like I really planned to use his CA on the privateer units I am taking. Taking a fully armed Cogsmith isn't even that bad these days as he'll still get the +1 to hit from the Hurricanum. Hmm.
I'm also torn on the 1 drop - my build is basically MSU, so it's not often I'm going to be getting the benefit. If I drop my Eternals to Dreadspears then they're losing so much, just so I can take an average hero that the list doesn't feel like it needs. I'd also still like to keep the Eternals/Dreadspears as my beast hunter shield wall, but the Wild Riders might be cool with it. Then again, a 5+save means they'll die anyway if they can't kill it on the charge.
So now I'm leaning towards the single drop being a bit of a trap. Perhaps the best option is to keep the list the same and just make the 3 Eternal Guard units the hunter detachment? I am still considering the Cogsmith swap though. What do you think, is his shooting more beneficial than the Fleetmaster's save? Does it just make him more of a target?
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19 minutes ago, Eldarain said:
@SentinelGuy you'll have to rework your battalions in that list a bit. Can only use the GHB Battalions once each.
Well that's annoying. Can't believe I missed that rule. Ah well, looks like I'll be working in the 1 drop battalion somehow then. Thanks for making me aware.
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59 minutes ago, Lightbox said:
Swivel gun elves sounds like a really interesting idea! Could definitely make some interesting floating rocks for them. I have some of the greenstuff world arcane rollers so can have nice sigil patterns on them. And I absolutely love pavises so may have to try that Irondrake idea too! Will probably want to use plasticard for that and paint nice runes on the front of them or something. Dark riders as pistoliers also sounds like a pretty simple and safe option, can use them again if I want outriders too. Thanks for the help!
No problem
If you need a swivel gun, GW used to make some decades ago and you can usually find them on eBay. There were 2 different ones - it's my opinion that the one with the aiming pole out the back of the gun looks better. It originally had dwarf crewmen, but I used one in my old Dogs of War army with human crew and it looked fine.
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19 hours ago, zilberfrid said:
It does depend how bad the mw spam gets. High saves does nothing vs mortal wounds.
This is why I'm running elves as my defensive line. I'll take Eternal Guard to start, and then if mortal wound spam gets out of control they can be downgraded to Dreadspears without needing to buy and build lots of new minis. The points saved can then go into something else.
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3 hours ago, Lightbox said:
So as apparently Greywater fastness conversion/kitbash projects are something I consistently gravitate toward I have decided that I have an idea for my next heavy conversion army project. This one based entirely off some cool artwork I once saw.
So my project I'm planning is gunpowder elves (*angry dwarven screams in the distance*) one of the main unit ideas I have for now is sisters of the watch but with magical glowy muskets instead of bows and potentially shadow warriors with pistols replacing their bows. Obviously with AoS3 on the horizon trying to build a list right now is perhaps not the easiest of jobs but I figure for a project like this it's better to go with cool models/units rather than 'what works right now'.
One of thing difficulties I'm having with this project idea though is working out how best to do war machines such as steam tanks or volley guns etc, whether to just have them as they are with elf crew or whether there might actually be better models to base off to give a more elven motif. Any suggestions/ideas on good kits / ideas to look at would be heavily appreciated! And also as I doubt we'll get a new book anytime soon whether anyone can advise on any particular standout units to try and include or avoid within greywater.Shadow Warriors and Sisters of the Watch are both still really useful. You could also make pistoliers from Doomfire Warlocks/Dark Riders and give them pistols. Gyrocopters are great in Grey water, so maybe floating chunks of rock with elves on swivel guns as counts as? Irondrakes are also excellent, perhaps have some elves behind pavises with guns resting on them?
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8 minutes ago, Doko said:
How dispell 3 spells?he dispell one and one extra with the being a wizard?
Where get the 3 th extra dispell?halowhearth can do him cast two spells but it dont give extra dispells
Yes, he'll have a single dispel still at +2 for being a Runelord.
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56 minutes ago, stratigo said:
6th Ed highly promoted murder lords in small high damage cav units
Never seemed to have much of a problem dealing with them. Artillery and armour piercing/higher strength shooting usually did the trick. Could have used lore of metals, or even just countering them with your own cavalry or great weapon armed troops. Basic tactics like bait and fleeing to set up counter charges, terror bombs, stand and shoot etc. Most units had a single attack each, so small units of cavalry weren't dealing huge damage against large blocks of infantry with ranks and a banner. Half the time you could panic them before they even made it into combat. The lord's weren't that tough in comparison to later editions - there were a few outliers, but mostly they were a little overpriced for standard 2000 point games.
If anything, 6th edition promoted ranking and flanking, combined arms and actual tactics.
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18 minutes ago, Frowny said:
Have people thought of making the runelord a wizard with the generic tome? Would seem good to augment his already +2 to dispel, giving him up to 3 dispels, I think. Or maybe I'm reading it wrong or misunderstanding.
I think ironbreakers may be better than pheonix guard now if all you want is tanking. Easy casting mystic shield to put them on a 2+ save, and easy command use for all out defense to ignore the first rend is pretty strong. A 2+ is comparable to a 3+/4++ (pheonix guard with all out defense or mystic shield) but they also benefit from being much cheaper. Slightly less offensive at base, but if you were bringing support heroes, especially the +1 attack form the king they start to be killier too. Many lists already have a runelord for irondrakes, and the -1 rend is situationally great on them as well.
I thought about the tome on the Runelord but had concerns about mistcasting mixed with enemy priests trying to snipe him with their prayer. Maybe it's too many eggs in one basket?
AoS 2 - Living City Discussion
in Cities of Sigmar
Posted
I think they'll really shine in Hallowheart when accompanied by an Anointed on phoenix. Give him the arcane tome and choose ignite weapons and flaming weapon. Cast ignite weapons on the Wild Riders and flaming weapon on himself. Or skip flaming weapon and go for geminids to try and prevent CAs.