Grdaat
-
Posts
220 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Gallery
Store
Downloads
Blogs
Events
Posts posted by Grdaat
-
-
12 hours ago, Grdaat said:
So is the app very out of date then? That's what I had been using because I know they update it frequently with the changes made in stuff like the FAQ's, and I thought it would be very odd if their Chaos Allegiance bit was two whole years out of date.
Quoting myself here because the AoS app is out of date, by two years in fact and it doesn't include an up to date version of the Chaos Allegiance Abilities/Artefacts, my mistake.
-
18 minutes ago, Kurrilino said:
I just gave examples what else you can do. I am aware that Plaque and witherstave is not possible.
You actually reach the same effect with geminids or the shards but without plaquetouched.
Glottkin and -2 bravery spell plus -2 bravery items will do the same.
Both options would replace Plaquetouched and allow you witherstave
That's what I thought, I was confused because the way you wrote it made it look like you were using the two together.
-
7 hours ago, Poppityping said:
I dont think it would be legal to run as generic Chaos, as Fireglaives are only Battleline if your allegiance is Legions of Azgorh.
That's true, you'd need some more Ironsworn or some cheaper option from a different faction, but I think you could still probably do it with 5 or so Fireglaives.
7 hours ago, Charly2912 said:You would have to bring 3 units of ironsworn or Another generic Chaos battleline.
I still dont See the worth in generic Chaos. Dark avenger was changed with aos 2.0. It only adds +1 hit for the General against order. (Instead of +1 hit to units nearby)
Crown of Commands is only 6" ignore battleshock. Might help a Big kdaai unit or some centaurs, but there are much better artefact options.
There might be the usual Chaos battle trait combined with the command trait for 5+ to add One hit to a unit when it attacks
Using this ability on all units should procc sometimes, but i would Not rely on 5s.
So is the app very out of date then? That's what I had been using because I know they update it frequently with the changes made in stuff like the FAQ's, and I thought it would be very odd if their Chaos Allegiance bit was two whole years out of date.
-
On 6/22/2019 at 11:19 AM, Kurrilino said:
Yeah, you guys are totally underrating Archaon here and most people don't know how to play him anyways.
His CP ability is not useless it is indeed what you are paying 660 points for.
I give you a couple of examples. Lord of Blights and Harbinger always fight for command points, now you use both of them.
30 Nurgle warriors -1 to hit melee, -2 hit shooting, 5+ ward/5+ward. Having now Lord of Blights AND Harbinger let's you take the Witherstave to make the opponents reroll 6's to hit and magic Archi putting Blades of Putr. on them plus a juicy Geminids which make them -2 hit in comabt and -3 shooting.
He can also buffs a group of 3 Fatemaster on Disks. Those little guys now let opponents reroll 4,5,6 to hit if you choose so while having a 2+ save in combat.
You could also buff Fatesworn several Tzeench Gorebeast chariots groups with Lord on Demonic Mounts abilities to make sure you get 18 wounds with -1 per charge.
There are really countless options that makes him 660 points. You guys just have to learn to play something else than cookiecutter list from the net.
I usually run 30 warriors with Blightlord and Harbinger in Plaqutouched Battalion. I mix in some 30 PLaquebearers and the mortals i need to make it happen usually 3x5 Blightlords and Gutrot spume and Spawns to make it as cheap as possible. Magic is always the Geminids and now the new Shards.
This makes my 30 Warriors -4 to hit in combat and -5 to shooting while the opponent has to reroll all 6's to hit and they have 2x 5+ wardsaves.
Same for the 30 Plaquebearers and if you play the 3 Fatemasters you have a unremovable roadblock doesn't matter how big the horde is you are blocking
I played a Khorne player when the new book came out and he just gave up in round 2. I also played in a tournament with 6 games and i lost 1 Chaos warrior over the whole tournament with winning all games.
So there is a use for Archaon it's just about using him right and he will be deadly. I am not surprised he stayed where he is point whise
I'm a bit late on this, but you can't run Plaguetouched in a Nurgle Allegiance, so how exactly are you getting the Witherstave?
-
1
-
-
12 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
Interesting idea! Would one even miss the Blackshard Armor Allegiance Ability that much? Being a shooty force the Grotesque command trait isnt all that important.
I have wanted to try out a grand Chaos alliance for my Skullcrackers and Bull Centaurs too to see if that +1 to hit trait could work some extra wonders too.
I've been wondering that myself, the list I'm most fond of at the moment uses four Fireglaives and I feel like it's much better to buff my chances of hitting than ignoring the first wound suffered. The Crown of Conquest also seems like it would help, since it seems like it implies you get to use command abilities without spending command points.
-
1
-
-
35 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
This is silly and might be the most ranged mortal wounds I think any army could do, and all without spells! Not saying it would win a bunch, but I think it could spoil someone's day
400 4x Daemonsmiths (give 1 the Thermalrider Cloak)
600 6x Fireglaives
400 4x Cockatrices (allies, Monsters of Chaos)
560 4x Magma Cannons
1960 total, good for a triumph. I'm only 2 Daemonsmiths, 20 Fireglaives, and 4 Cockatrices away! Boy, Azgorh is fun to play......
With that setup you might want to just take Chaos as your allegiance, since you can use Dark Avenger or Lord of War to boost those units of Fireglaives. Dark Avenger against Order units with them would be disgusting.
-
Scratch what I said about the Legion of Azgorh not being able to take Chaos Siege Gargants, I didn't notice they could take Monsters of Chaos as allies, which Siege Gargants technically are. This also opens up the following as allies:
Razorgors, Warhounds, Jabberslythe, Chimera, Cockatrice, Slaughterbrute, Mutalith Vortex Beast, Curs'd Ettin, Gigantic Chaos Spawn, Skinwolves and the Warpfire Dragon.
Anyone play with any of these in a Legion of Azgorh army? I'd think the Cockatrice would be good, they usually are. The rules for the Gigantic Chaos Spawn look promising, the Skin Wolves look a little too pricey, but the Chimera seems like it could put in some good work. What do you think, or should I just avoid all of them and stick with my Mammoth?
-
35 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
A Chaos Mammoth is kinda like Skarbrand; the enemy MUST target it or they will be destroyed by it. Problem with the Mammoth now is the new base size, it's as big as a sheet of paper! So very hard to maneuver around the table at all.
What I was thinking is if I took something like a Mammoth, my opponents would be so busy dealing with it that they'd be neglecting my Maga Cannons and Fireglaives. I'd like to bring along something good to help beef up my army in a major way and so a monster like a Mammoth seemed like a good idea. Their rules also seemed really good, and I was curious if other people thought so as well. I take it you're in favour of them, base size aside?
-
Out of curiosity, what would be the better ally to pull in if I wanted to bring in a monster, a regular Giant/Gargant, a Siege variant, or a Mammoth? A list I put up before used the Mammoth, but I'd like to try a Siege Gargant since they were made by the Legion of Azgorh before. Are they any good, or would it be better to go with a regular one or just stick with the Mammoth?
I should probably mention that technically the Siege Gargant doesn't have the CHAOS GARGANT keyword, it only has the CHAOS, GARGANT keywords. Nobody that I play with is going to use that technicality to prevent me from using them though.
-
5 hours ago, Poppityping said:
Hi everyone. I just finished reading the Warcry short story the iron promise, as it heavily features chaos dwarfs (or 1 at least). There is a very curious passage from the story however, where the chaos dwarf states that they "tricked a god into raising this mountain for us, and took his secrets"
That's probably something new, the only think I can think of that would refer to from the old world is raising Zharr-Naggrund from the ground. However I highly doubt anyone would claim they were tricking Hashut into raising it up so that they could learn his secrets.
-
5 minutes ago, Charly2912 said:
Im at Work right Now and cant get much into Detail, but something I've realised is that the sayls list, Sounds awesome in theory, but cant be used due to the ability says Pick One Friendly Slaves to Darknes Unit.
Sadly he doesnt Work on other Chaos units.
You're right, my mistake I missed that little bit. I'll edit that list out then, as mentioned it was something I was toying with but I'm more curious about the Mammoth list anyway.
-
So I wrote up three lists, and I'm a little unsure which one I should use. One's a melee focused list, which I'm not very happy with and would gladly appreciate pointers on how I could improve it. The second one's a ranged list, which I'm more happy with and looking around it seems like a lot of people had very similar lists, and might've even had the exact same list. The final one however is an allied behemoth list, taking advantage of something I haven't seen other people in the thread mention, but it seems to be legal so I'd also like advice on how to improve it. All of these lists are in spoilers because otherwise they would take up a lot of space, and all lists are copy-pasted from the Warscroll builder, made for pitched battles of 2000 points (and they all use up all 2000 of those points).
So the first up is my Blackshard List:
SpoilerAllegiance: Legion of Azgorh
LEADERS
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (160)
- Runestaff
- Allies
Infernal Guard Castellan (120)
- General
- Command Trait : Relentless
- Darkforged Weapon & Spiteshield
- Artefact : Armour of Bazherak the Cruel
Infernal Guard Battle Standard Bearer (100)
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
- Artefact : Chalice of Blood and Darkness
UNITS
20 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (180)
20 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (180)
20 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (200)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
9 x K'Daai Fireborn (420)
WAR MACHINES
Magma Cannon (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
BATTALIONS
Blackshard Warhost (160)I was thinking about testing this out for a lark, but I do kinda like the way it plays. Despite using all 2000 points I don't think it's very optimized though, and I wasn't too sure on where to go with it. It might be that this is simply all that can be done with a Blackshard Warhost list. I tried to make up for the lack of mobile punch with the Sorcerer Lord + K'daai combo that a lot of people love, but since they're the only ones who can really get up front I'm iffy on that too.
Next up is the ranged list:
SpoilerAllegiance: Legion of Azgorh
LEADERS
Chaos Sorcerer Lord (160)
- Runestaff
- Allies
Infernal Guard Castellan (120)
- General
- Command Trait : Grotesque
- Darkforged Weapon & Spiteshield
- Artefact : Armour of Bazherak the Cruel
Infernal Guard Battle Standard Bearer (100)
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
UNITS
30 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (240)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
9 x K'Daai Fireborn (420)
WAR MACHINES
Magma Cannon (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
Iron Daemon War Engine (180)This type of list seems pretty common here, some good ranged damage while the K'daai run in with buffs from the Sorcerer Lord to tear it up in close combat. The only thing I regret is not being able to get the discount for 12 K'daai, but I simply ran out of points and am unsure of what I should change to free up points to get those.
Finally we have my Chaos War Mammoth List:
SpoilerAllegiance: Legion of Azgorh
LEADERS
Infernal Guard Castellan (120)
- General
- Command Trait : Grotesque
- Darkforged Weapon & Spiteshield
- Artefact : Armour of Bazherak the Cruel
Infernal Guard Battle Standard Bearer (100)
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
Daemonsmith (100)
- Darkforged Weapon
UNITS
30 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (240)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
BEHEMOTHS
Chaos War Mammoth (320)
- Allies
WAR MACHINES
Iron Daemon War Engine (180)
Magma Cannon (140)
Magma Cannon (140)
ENDLESS SPELLS / TERRAIN
Horrorghast (60)I toyed with the idea of bringing Renders or K'daai who could run with the Mammoth, but the point of the Mammoth isn't supposed to be something that my force is based around, to use 40k as an example, it's a Distraction Carnifex: something my opponent can't exactly afford to ignore and is immediately threatening right off the bat, but it isn't where the meat of my damage will come from, so the goal is to direct incoming fire at it and not all of the units behind it. Since it's going to last a long time my opponent can allocate a lot of firepower to it without too much worry, and even when it finally dies it can still wreck havoc (many targets it doesn't squash can be finished off by my magma cannons). If my opponent focuses too much fire on it, they get shot to death in return while if they try to run past it, I've got the Ironsworn to block them, or the Mammoth to run them over if they choose to go more to my flank. In addition there's also a second Daemonsmith, but his purpose is not to hang around the machines, but to be used to both unbind spells (I'd prefer to have two wizards for that) and cast Fireball or create the Horrorghast, preferably after the other Daemonsmith has already used Ash Storm against whichever unit is trying to kill the Mammoth. Horrorghast is an Endless Spell I'm choosing because with the Mammoth's Earth-shaking Charge, it inflicts -4 to the enemy's leadership, and that's before the Mammoth attacks. It'll also help when I'm shooting from afar, although It'll only be at -2 in those cases the amount of regular and Mortal Wounds I'm putting out should have some good returns on them when it comes to Battleshock. The only thing I'm not quite sure about is running 5 units of Fireglaives, but at the same time I'm unsure what I should run instead. If I were to move points for anything that isn't a Leader I'd have to delete at least two units of Fireglaives, and I'm not sure that the unit replacing them would be more effective. I'm open to suggestions on that front.
As said above, suggestions on how to improve these would be appreciated, especially on the teleport list and the Chaos War Mammoth list.
EDIT: If anyone saw this earlier there was a list that included Sayl, but as pointed out in the comment right below he cannot use his spell on Chaos Dwarfs, so I removed the list.
-
13 minutes ago, Qcbob025 said:
I am not talking if we should or not, but about if we could. I am not really building my list on 3 times de same things or max combo. I like building on diversity and thematic The question is if Chaos Keyword is automatically imply as Allied, is it a mistypo from GW that forgot to add it.. seem very weird to me that a hellcannon... cannot join a chaos dwarf army to be fair
To play the devil's advocate for a second, the Legion of Azgorh is not the Chaos Dwarf army, they're a penal Legion. They have many similarities but taking them as representatives of the Chaos Dwarfs is like taking Fyreslayers as representatives of all Duardin.
It would still be very odd if they couldn't get Hellcannons, however that could be written off quite easily as something the Legion of Azgorh doesn't have access to for a variety of reasons, if they were part of the "main" Chaos Dwarf faction and not the Legion for example. I doubt we'll get any confirmation of that though.
-
1
-
-
I'm not a fan of the artillery train just because I'd rather have Magma Cannons and more Battleline/ K'daai instead of the Rockets and Mortar. Getting extra CP and an extra item is good and all, but I don't think the cost is worth it in this case.
-
8 hours ago, mattbarker said:
I still think it applies. Only due to the nature of the wording.
Our ability doesn't negate a mortal wound / regular wound. Its not a save or a shrug or a negation. It simply states after all wounds have been allocated, ignore the first one. Important part being once allocated. Not before they're allocated (i.e a save or pre-check or a type screening where a distinction is made between the type of wound). As such the core rules, which have no FAQ comment to imply they are anything other than as written, applies so they're treated the same, the same as healing.
Our ability is a retrospective thing, not a pre-allocation.
It's not a negation? Let's check the rules:
"The first wound that is allocated to each unit with this battle trait in each shooting phase and each combat phase is negated."
Well I think that's pretty clear, it's negation. After thinking on it you probably could argue that it still works since when it takes effect mortal wounds no longer exist, so technically you're not negating a mortal wound.
Also after thinking on it more I think arguing that it works when mortal wounds no longer exist is the only way there isn't a contradiction between the designer's commentary and the actual rules, so with that logic you'd still be able to get the negation.
-
Hey so I also came across some evidence that helps support the idea that the Chaos Dwarfs Blackshard Battalion would be able to both charge and pile in, while still retaining the bonuses. Here's a bit from the Core Rules designer's commentary:
"Q: Some abilities allow a model to make a move out of sequence (in the hero phase, for example), or to make a specific type of move (a ‘6" retreat move’, for example). Can I run when I make these moves?
A: You can only run if the ability refers to making a ‘normal move’ (which includes any move made ‘as if it were the movement phase’) and the ability doesn’t specify the distance of the move. Note that the restrictions that apply to normal moves (not moving within 3" of the enemy, and having to retreat if they start within 3" of the enemy) also apply to normal moves made in any other phase. Also note that the increase to the unit’s Move characteristic for running only applies to that move."
So the Blackshard Battalion says "a move", not any kind of move or movement as if it were the movement phase, which is odd since it is still vague. I'd find it even stranger though if "a move" wasn't supposed to mean "a normal move", which can only happen if it's the movement phase, instead meant any kind of move, which would mess you up if you wanted to pile in.
You probably could still argue it either way, so it's something you need to talk with your opponent about in advance.
Unfortunately here's something else I found in the same designer's commentary:
"Q: If an ability says it negates a wound, will it also negate a mortal wound?
A: No, unless the ability specifically says it negates mortal wounds. By the same token, an ability that negates only mortal wounds will not negate wounds."
So sorry to say, but the bit in the rulebook stating "After they have been allocated, a mortal wound is treated in the same manner as any other wound for all rules purposes" should be ignored. You actually still do treat them differently for almost all rules purposes (with healing being the only exception I can think of).
-
So here's something I just realized to help people who are still separating wounds and mortal wounds even after they've been allocated (and so think the armour can't negate them). You know how there are some models who can heal themselves or others? If Mortal wounds and wounds were always kept separate, you would never be able to heal damage done by mortal wounds, since there isn't a single datasheet in the game that says you can heal mortal wounds that were done to a model/unit.
-
1
-
-
35 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
I totally agree; in AoS they always (as far as I can remember of the units I've used) specify wounds AND mortal wounds, or just one or the other.
I put the Cloak on the Castellan for an 8" fly, and run, and use a CP to get him to run 6" if really needed, which gets him to a 14" move, and flying of course. That gets him into a good position for turn 2, which is hopefully when the Skullcrackers are in range to attack. And if the enemy is closing in before turn 2, which is often the case, then no CP is needed. But I have the extra one from the Artillery Train battalion to use for the +1 to wound ability. Worked super well against the Mangler Squigs and Rogue Idol in one game. He can thwack people in combat reasonably well too.
EDIT: Sorry for the double-post, I'm new here and tried posting the first reply as a guest. For whatever reason it didn't show up so I wrote this second reply.
-
29 minutes ago, Lord Krungharr said:
I totally agree; in AoS they always (as far as I can remember of the units I've used) specify wounds AND mortal wounds, or just one or the other.
I put the Cloak on the Castellan for an 8" fly, and run, and use a CP to get him to run 6" if really needed, which gets him to a 14" move, and flying of course. That gets him into a good position for turn 2, which is hopefully when the Skullcrackers are in range to attack. And if the enemy is closing in before turn 2, which is often the case, then no CP is needed. But I have the extra one from the Artillery Train battalion to use for the +1 to wound ability. Worked super well against the Mangler Squigs and Rogue Idol in one game. He can thwack people in combat reasonably well too.
I'm new here but I have to agree with mattbarker, the wound is negated after it's allocated, and at that point mortal wounds and wounds are treated as the same thing. The reason the armour and other gear specify mortal wounds is because it's allowing you to take a save roll against them (aka before they're allocated), and normally you cannot do that. Since the armour's effect happens once there's technically no difference between the two, then you should be able to negate it.
AoS 2 - Legion Of Azgorh Discussion
in Chaos
Posted · Edited by Grdaat
Yeah, it would've been a good idea, and aside from one ability that Chaos has to give only a single unit +1 to hit (on a 4+) I'm not too sure where else we can get boosts for the Fireglaives.