Nerdkingdan
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Posts posted by Nerdkingdan
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6 hours ago, smartalek said:
This 3 drop list is currently what I was thinking of:
Allegiance: Idoneth Deepkin
- Enclave: Fuethan
Isharann Tidecaster (100)
- General
- Trait: Lord of Storm and Sea
- Artefact: Augury Shells
- Lore of the Deeps: Abyssal Darkness
Isharann Soulrender (80)
- Artefact: Lliandra's Last Lament
Branchwych (80)
Treelord Ancient (300)
Branchwraith (80)
- Allies
20 x Namarti Thralls (260)
10 x Namarti Reavers (130)
10 x Dryads (100)
10 x Dryads (100)
1 x Akhelian Allopexes (120)
6 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (340)
3 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (170)
Alliance of Wood and Sea (140)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 80 / 400
Wounds: 126
Let's me flip the tides and strike fast, but also the Branchwraith to summon more dryads and tie up one section of the board. I figured the Soulrender would give some resilience to the Namarti, especially with the artefact.
I think you want the soul Scyrer, consider the benefit of taking away cover or flight with a ritual with all that extra terrain. You can try without him of course but he is a priest for the extra plus 1. The extra summon is interesting though.
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13 hours ago, smartalek said:
Has anyone taken a look at the Alliance of Wood and Sea Battalion since the new Sylvaneth tome is coming out soon?
Yes, and Alliance of Wood and sea has two issues, and a question.
First, Your Sylvaneth are not the best near the boats, and your deepkin are not the best near the woods. The second issue is that new battle tomes seem to be doing away with these mixed faction battalions, so the entire thing is likely to be gone as soon as deepkin sees an update, though that could be a ways away, or could be soon.
The question is I'm unclear if the sylvaneth gain the Enclave ability? For example a unit of Dryaids and the Treelord ancient having a weak flight ability or certain rerolls could be good, but I am unsure how it works, so I have not looked too deeply into it till I am sure of the answer.
With that said I believe the way to make this good is to make it into a single drop battalion with tide flip losing your artifact bonus I believe, or possible a 2-3 drop battalion to add a soul scryer and get something out of the extra artifact. The battalion could be for lack of a better term, mid-tier competitive, likely good enough for small stuff, and fun, but not top tier competition. The idea would be a tide flip , go second, run charge turn one, Go first in combat turn 2, and maybe score a double turn. You have a good amount of bodies to tie up things, while the eels fly around and take things out. The tree lords stomp ability could be great to get more out of the thralls for example, but again it would be hard to work with the issues of your placed boat and woods. Ultimately this kind of list would be better set up up with just deepkin, but its workable if your wanting the variety. I for one do, and am working on building it up, but I want to do sylvaneth too.
You end up with 1 unit of nine Morrsarr, the soulscryer and the full battalion with the other eel unit as Ishlean, lot of units, lot of bodies, and turn two first in combat phase, the big eel unit picking its fights or flanking with soul scryer.
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40 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:
Yeah, my Reavers seems to always do well, the Thralls are there as a threat, but i also play BoC, and Bestigors are just better in everyway it feels (they have the same problem 32mm with 1" range) Bestigors are 2 attack, 4+/3+ (+1 to hit vs units of 10 or more) and can get +1 attack on the charge, they are 4+ save and 12 points, they move 6+1+run and +3 if near a shaman and can run and charge, with a +1 pile in Rend -1. So for 12points with a 11-17" movement and the ability to stack + attacks like the King can, IDK why Thralls are still 13pts each. A 30man Bestigor can get re-roll 1's to hit, wound, saves, and +1 attack per CP, i have done turn 1 multi charge with 30 5 attacks each, 3+/3+ re-roll all 1's, killing 40 Dark coven Executioners in a tournament (Adepticon). I understand Thralls can not be shot at if other units are in front, but that is "army rules" and if all army rules are equal (BoC has summoning) then the units should be priced accordingly. Remember thralls are only 5+ save normally. I have sat Bestigors in cover for 3+ with re-roll 1's on objectives. For 120points it was well worth it.
Not that i dont like Thralls i still play with 20 of them every game, but i wont play 40+ like i do with Bestigors.The only thing I can think of is that GW over values the soul renders ability to return models, probably in part because the ranged mechanic limits armies ability to shot him out. However regardless of the soul renders survivablity, it just doesn't work in practice due to the wholly within requirement, and the poor Bravery. If the soul render got a rework, so that the unit would still be around to get those returned models or it worked in a more reliable way, the points would make sense.
I do really want to run a thrall army, I just can't see a path to it, save playing against some friends whose armies and tactical choices are super casual.
As a side note, I only have 2 reavers units, and recently purchased 2 more to start experimenting with more, butI wonder if someone has tried just Reaver spam?-
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57 minutes ago, Maddpainting said:
A Namarti Corps with Eels isnt bad tho, now that the battalions units are 50pts cheaper, but it is still 700pts and many will say 3 units of Eels are better, but I actually like using it a lot. And they are bad vs 2-3 wounds not 2-4 wounds its "4 or more".
Why i like it is, +1 relic, +1CP, and bodies, with some range, even tho its only 40 shots, 40 shots are very important sometimes, there are many heroes in odd spots that are 3-5 wounds and 5+/6+, also Reavers are fast, and its all 1 drop.Yep, 2-3....
For some reason I thought it was 2-4, I did short myself at least once then, I know I did.... Oh well.... most of my frustrations with Namarti are base size to attacks, which is still the core issue. I do however play the Namariti core in almost every single game, (save the 1k ones) I do like them for the single drop. Most of the time my thralls get ganked, but hey something has to screen. I consistently get more out of reavers.
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3 hours ago, thediceabide said:
Eel lists are boring, how are people running Namarti lists these days?
I don't think they are, I went looking around for this a few weeks back, thinking with lower Namarti points it would opened something up. 10 points less for each unit, adds up to one extra 10 man block in a namarti list, at a max, which isn't enough to make up for how bad they are. I keep hearing how great these guys would be in another faction, but we don't use them because we got eels. My experience is, that its not the existence of eels, but the lack of tools to make them work that is the core problem. The kings buff doesn't work on them, the other ones are often 9" or 12" wholly within, which just doesn't work, and they really don't put out enough attacks, have bravery and save issues. Units with this base size and damage output have other tools at their disposal, or people just don't use them.
The only suggestion I was given when I asked around was to stack Lotann and an aspect of the seas buffs to get a thrall unit to some reasonable damage output, But that suggestion was bad, really bad, terrible in fact. The thralls only can get a small number of their models in combat at a time, because of scenery, speed etc, other factions have better tools to ramp up, or units that perform better with a smaller foot print, and your spending around 500 points to get what works out to be a few wounds at best, not to mention your 500 points is stuck sitting behind this thrall unit. They thralls are especially bad on 2-4 wound enemies. There just isn't away around the flawed warscroll of the soul render, lotann, and the high points cost of the Edilon.
You can however run a mixed army well, using a small number of thralls 40 or so, with a single soul render in the battalion, on a tide flip army works very will WITH the eels. I have been running that, and it does work, but only really as a reduction of my units for determining who is first, the thralls and reavers mostly die, and inflict little or no damage, but they work as speed bumps, for the eels to do their thing. If you want the Thralls to do anything they have to go first, which means you can't have a lot of units. The poor bravery and save means you have to be in small units, or they can't fit inside any of the buffs we have, and the low bravery and save means larger units vanish too quickly for the cost when the fight starts.
The best list I tested was to use the Enclave that allows the namarti limited flight, which let me abuse cover, and get more models in by "flying" over obstacles. I used the ritual to remove their cover save or flight, and tried to steer combat on scenery itself, limiting their move and maximizing my damage. It was better, I wouldn't say good.
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44 minutes ago, Kelsicle said:
Has anyone tried magnetising the arm on Akhelian Guard to swap between Morrsarr and Ishlaen? Any tips on doing so?
I was hoping it would be easy but the join isn’t a flat surface like the Thralls were
I looked at this, and then I determined I would only likely run small min units of Ishlean at the same time as Morrsarr, and decided wasn't worth the effort, Also thinking to use two different eel schemes.
With that said I've heard of people doing it. and it takes really small magnets.-
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1 hour ago, Paladin of Khorne said:
Hey all, I’m considering taking the plunge (oof) into the ID when the new Battleforce drops, and wanted to know if it’s a smart idea.
I am attracted to the aesthetics, colors, uniqueness of the faction, the tide table, and the ability to field a smallish AoS force.
Im a bit leery of this supposed reliance on eels; they’re expensive and I don’t really like spamming units to have a fun, semi competitive gaming session.
Can you make a fun and effective list utilizing a few different heroes, a good core of the infantry (archers included) and a smattering of the monsters?
I don’t want to buy 15-20 eels to have fun playing the game with the army, so if that’s what is necessary I won’t bother with the battleforce. Thanks!
Fun and Effective? I would say maybe.
My local group is not that great competition wise. They play bad factions and poor lists. When I take an eel list I crush them. When I take a mix army with unit variety including reavers, I still win but it’s not by much.
if my opponents were running optimized lists and top factions it would not be a real option.
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If they did nerf it, when would you expect to see the nerf?
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On 10/2/2018 at 10:28 AM, Charlo said:
Very quick question, do the Sylvaneth in the the "Alliance of Wood and Sea" Warscroll Battalion use up the allies points or not?
My gut feeling is not as the Faction at the top is listed as Idoneth Deepkin.
They don’t you can still have additional allies. I was thinking could make an interesting ionarch list.
Also the battalion gets enclave bonus as well.
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7 hours ago, DantePQ said:
So first Ishalean Guard unit is ready to go, first up is my all Eels build then I will add Thralls and Reavers.
Just wondering did you paint the riders separatethen glue them on? -
2 hours ago, DantePQ said:
My list looked like this
2xTidecaster
Soulscryer
2x10 Reavers
30 Thralls
9 Ishalean Guards
6 Ishalean Guards
6 Morssar Guards
it's 2k but I would probably scrap something for 1CP
Why larger Ishalean units? 3 man units are rather effective.
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4 hours ago, DantePQ said:
It's just something I want to try out next and I will get 30 Thralls painted before Reavers so it's what I will have ready first. Also Thralls are some kind of tax for Tidecaster and Reverse Tides ability. Also I will play much more with Deepkin now as I am little tired with DoK after winning Throne of Skulls with them and as my ID are currently being painted I will play a lot DoK for one more month or so.
Actually I like your list a lot and I wouldn't add any endless spells - extra CP is huge for Deepkins. But I think you can struggle with objectives as your army isn't full force alpha strike (like 3 Morssar units lists) but doesn't have many drops to contest objectives with only 3 units.
So if you had the Reavers what would the list look like?
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On 8/17/2018 at 11:20 AM, Amradiel said:
Another option might be just one Tidecaster and use Aspect of the sea. What do you guys think? Also which endless spells work well for us?
So looking at your army, I had some thoughts... Keep in mind I'm new to sigmar, so take it with a grain of salt.
First I don't think the big unit of thralls makes much sense with the rest of the list. They can't reroll run if you bring them in the side like an eel unit with musician could, you don't have a reroll 1 with them, you can't bring any back and the large unit is more worried about battle shock, unless you do put the sea in.
I have had a hard time finding a place for Morrsaar and Thralls in the same list, and. I'm also finding two to four min units of Ishlaen to be a core to just about every list I've come up with, as a way to get my other units into combat. Very little I've run into can kill through a 3 man unit with ignore rend and cover, and reroll of 1s through the shield spell. Mortal wounds and other mechanics its better to have that smaller unit than a larger one.So my suggestion is divide the Ishlean into two units, and you are done with battle line. That frees up 360 points and since you have 60 already left over giving you a total of 420 points to play with. I might try a 10 man thrall unit to hold back and deliver turn 3.
I keep coming back to Sea or Turtle for more cover after turn 1, if don't have Sea I run tidecasters. If I have an Akhelian King so guard are battle line I don't do thralls.
My two cents.
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8 hours ago, Nerdkingdan said:
What site? Can I see this?
I found it, didn't realize Blackout was the name of the event, new to Sigmar. Interesting stuff.
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7 hours ago, DantePQ said:
BTW list from Blackout are up and Les Martin list is very nice
Dhom-Hain, Shyish
Volturnos General
Aspect of the Storm with Ethereal Amulet
Tidecaster with Steed of Tides
2xSoulScryer
3x6 Morssar Guards
And list that finished 7th
Fuethan
Tidecaster General
Tidecaster
2xSoulScryer
3x10 Thralls
9 Morssar
9 Morssar
3 Ishalean
What site? Can I see this?
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16 hours ago, Curzex said:
Thanks all.
I will try play some different list.
A mix of infantry and eels list. Dhom hain or nautilar. I always play the shark. Maybe i buy another one.
I have a question? After Faq turtle make 12 shoots or 6? I think is 12, 6 per weapon.
15 hours ago, Kitty said:12
This is now 12! Is it because it says pair of launchers, and each has 6, isn't it normally shown as 12, in other listings? Think this is a mistake? Seems like they meant 6 when the shark is 3, and has 1 launcher.
Just wondering. -
1 hour ago, Nerdkingdan said:
Is this a legal list? I didn't think you could use the same model twice to count in two different battalions?
Don’t both need a king? Don’t have my book with me, could be wrong.
Betting I’m remembering wrong.
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On 7/30/2018 at 8:34 PM, Manxs said:
The only things i have brought is the king a soulrender and tidecaster i also have a unit of thralls and one unit of revers
but after looking at what you guys have said i was looking more in to this i will be looking to replace the tralls and the revers
Allegiance: Idoneth Deepkin
- Enclave: Nautilar
Leaders
Vulturnos, High King of the Deep (280)
- General
Isharann Tidecaster (100)
- Artefact: Arcane Pearl
- Lore of the Deeps: Protective Barrier (Nautilar Tidecasters)
Isharann Soulscryer (100)
- Artefact: Black Pearl
Battleline
3 x Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (140)
6 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (320)
10 x Namarti Thralls (140)
Units
1 x Akhelian Allopexes (140)
10 x Namarti Reavers (140)
Behemoths
Akhelian Leviadon (380)
Battalions
Royal Council (140)
Akhelian Corps (100)
Total: 1980 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 98
Is this a legal list? I didn't think you could use the same model twice to count in two different battalions?
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2 hours ago, thundrchickn said:
I'm on my phone now so I can't double check like I'd like but I thought I did put the in with higher precision but just formatted to 2 places for visual appeal. Most people don't understand the concept of Significant Figures anyways. It wouldn't matter anyways is that the difference of hundredths of a percentage would usually still fall within the Margin of Error so long as the calculations follow the same procedure throughout.
I went through and played with the downloaded copy before I mentioned it, changing it to 2/3 or 66.67 did up the results of models with 3+ rolls. What you did makes the Reavers look slightly better since they are mostly 50%
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16 hours ago, thundrchickn said:
Don't want to nitpick, but 3+ isn't actually 66%, its 66.6 repeating. You often use 1/2 or 5/6 and the like, but instead in some places you use a rounded percentage, for example you opted for 66% instead of 2/3 or 4/6. While this wouldn't be a big change over all its skewing your numbers especially when things are close or have a large number of attacks. Anything that has a 2/3 chance is losing some of its actual damage, and it does add up when we are comparing things that ultimately vary only a few decimal places.
Otherwise thanks, great info.
For some reason I thought it was 2-4, I did short myself at least once then, I know I did.... Oh well.... most of my frustrations with Namarti are base size to attacks, which is still the core issue. I do however play the Namariti core in almost every single game, (save the 1k ones) I do like them for the single drop. Most of the time my thralls get ganked, but hey something has to screen. I consistently get more out of reavers.
AoS 2 - Idoneth Deepkin Discussion
in Order
Posted
I remembered why I didn't want to go with summons, the Dryads you summon, do not benefit from the tides, unless you take the enclave that lets allies get it, even then I'm not sure.
You can not use the tide with Fuethan as your enclave with summoned models for sure though, as they are not part of the battalion .