Nerdkingdan

Do you think I would be safe picking up a few darkling, to get started? I know they may not be optimal build, but there are a few I'm eying to get as an ally for an existing army, but didn't want to get them if they had no chance to be in the new book?

I currently play casual, my list was borked by the endless spell change to cogs, I have to remake it. Annoying, but I was using foot evocators, and they needed the +1 and a reroll to do what paladins did, fun theme list, whatever was time for me to expand any way. For the competitive folks, can stormcast still be competitive is a valid concern.

So I’m confused here. I’ve been playing AOS 3 casual. My theme list I wanted to play had no monsters, who cares I’m casual. Show up play, learn what I could go home, win some lose some. This idea that the game should be altered around casual play sounds more like people who want to win without effort to learn rules or adapt. If you are playing casual your army and units don’t need to be best in slot. Your reach unit not getting buffed shouldn’t matter. Battle pack rules are not a long read, casual should mean you are not optimising, you don’t need to change your list, I’m not. what am I missing here?

I was nervous about this, and had been thinking about negative implications, but seeing the actual rules that we have so far I'm a bit more optimistic. Withholding final judgment.

I am trying to understand what abilities count as being auras, as in effect anything coming in range and stop working if you leave the range, verse pulses that affect a unit in range when cast or used and remain on the unit if it leaves the area. The book simply says treat them like abilities, which is worded weird but seems to imply they are all auras, however it is not clear as some must be pulses. For example Tauralon’s Comet Trail triggers when it moves, applies a +1 to hit, does this only apply to units that stay within 3 or does it move with the Tauralon as it piles in, or a new unit moves in, or is lost due to casualties. Other examples are the namarti thrall master, the spell on Astreia solbright, the knight incanters spell. Spells like Chocking mist in lore of the swamp is another prime example. I think a spell like thunderclap on the Lord Arcanum where you pick a unit to apply a de buff is a clear pulse, but again there doesn’t seem to be a wording difference. Further confusing things are spells like thundershock, that work on units with a dice roll. How is this being handled at events? I think from the rules most are likely auras, but Thundershock for example, because of the roll is not.

I play a lot of sequitors, the advantage of them is the access to sacrosanct buffs, evocators can buff them, solbright can buff them if hammers. Damage to point without focusing on the sacrosanct you should be running vindictors. Ultimately they are not the best choice at current points for this list. If you are set on them you need to look into storm keep, I find you are better with that when spamming them, the extra ward save near objectives, and the count as more models is more useful. 10 man units with empower for example while not great do ok, as a screen to evocators on foot, who will come in after softened by the 10 man, this was all casual play, it’s not optimal. But it has worked for me going toe to toe with gargants. That is my experience from playing them, if it helps.

Without the allegiance abilities, we can’t know if this card is good or bad. For example easy access to +1 to hit…. Yes the card alone is bad, but I’m still optimistic.

Can you take 4 bloodthirsty shiver? I thought you needed to buy them in 3s?

I don’t see the value in 3 single shark units, when as battle line you can make a single large unit up to 3. You can easier set up one drop, getting more attacks first outside of high tide, and you can use command abilities without a hero nearby, also the champions +1 to hit. If you need the singles to get to 3 battle line, sure, but when possible grouping them up seems more efficient.

I have tried fielding 12, while not as good as raptors, they work quite well for non competitive. When wanting to give your friends a break from raptors, but you still want to shoot.

It’s possible eels are dead…. The issue is when the first book came out eels were fastest, most damage and most survivable point for point and it wasn’t close. We also had no shooting, so eels were the best in slot for everything we could do. They had to lose that. Now the question is do eels still have a role? I’ll have to sit down and do the math and play test it, but all the war scrolls look solid the question is the points…. Eels look over costed, however they may still have a role. Spam likely won’t turn out. People often think any nerf means unplayable, too early to say in my opinion.

What happen to Ionrach?

To move things along, until the new book, given our current rules, what lists should we look at? My initial thoughts were to look at a shark list without turtles, or a reaver list with the turtles. I’m also wondering how 30 blocks of thralls with Morph might work, it always looked like it was just short of possible to do, extra reach might push it there.

Ok, so 10 wounds losing access to turtle save vrs keeping 8 wounds and getting the +1 save is not by definition worse. First, if you're getting hit by mortal wounds, the 10 wound version is better, the saves don't help. If you're not getting the turtle save, again the shark with 10 wounds is more survivable, if the turtle save is reworded in the new book, again the 10 wound shark is more survivable. So in more situations than not the new shark is more survivable and thus justifies a point increase, they were already very powerful, and likely some of the point increase was coming without the increase to wounds. So in the situations its worse, how much worse is it? -1 rend is very common so lets look at the math and see how much we lost on the turtle buff. 8 wound shark getting hit by -1 rend, and getting the bonus save from the turtle, you will die to 16 attacks that allow you to save against. 10 wound shark getting hit by -1 rend and not getting the bonus save from the turtle will die to roughly 15 attacks. So one less attack from 1 rend while getting the turtle buff is simply not that big. We have not seen the book, so judging this is hard, but our faction currently has a Mortal wound problem, this helps, increasing our total wounds before losing damage output is something we need. We will see, but its not convincing to read arguments that "sharks are objectively worse" because they may lose access to the turtle save while also gaining damage out put and becoming more survivable to mortal wounds and while not benefiting from a specific buff.

Stronger unleash hell threat.