Satyrical Sophist
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Posts posted by Satyrical Sophist
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37 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said:
The information is out there. And I have critical thinking skills, and a LOT of experience playing age of sigmar. Where is the damage coming from that's going to deal with dedicated combat units that see board space as irrelevant? You think the ironclad is worth MORE then katakros? as an aside.. how do you possibly deal with blobs of mortek guard? Its a sad day when the most competitive KO armies have to include fyreslayers, other armies endless spells, or just playing tempest eye.
I also find it funny that the aether strike battalion is still valid. That is until the summer ghb when it is also removed.
Pizza is really stupid and underpowered, burgers are better.
Your Katakros comparison is really weird. They are such different units. That said, at some point I am going to some calculations about KO offensive out put, but I'm at work at the moment.
As for what KO do Vs bonereapers? Honestly my guess would probably be the favourite. A lot of OBR advantages are negated by KO. The rerolling saves doesn't really work Vs KO, and some of the buff pieces are pretty easy to kill for KO since they have speed and range.
I don't think you realise how good shooting can be. It looks bad compared to melee because your opponent doesn't get to attack back and you are at range.
It's kind of worrying that you look at one of the coolest relics designs (spell in a bottle) and think it's a sign of KO weakness and not an awesome perk.
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9 minutes ago, Reuben Parker said:
Just to add to the gold shares I think playing the subfaction with additional gold (and having 2 gold on certain units) will be really solid if your wanting a list with large units of anything.
imagine 20 Thunderers / 40 arks get charged so you pop re roll saves then next turn you pop re roll hits / wounds on their shooting.
It's absolutely not the main thing, but I love the idea of bravery 3 or whatever arkanauts after you've made them give up a ton of gold.
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I want to try out some new KO stuff in TE. I'd like to try ... Basically everything.
I'd like to try both Gunhaulers and Frigates, both seem to benefit a lot from sharp eyed and hurricanum. The shrapnel mode and carbine gives a lot of close range punch. I also want to know whether you can have a KO general with sharp eyed giving the bonus from his frigate or ironclad. I think you can.
The arkanauts are cheap and pretty durable. I could see fitting some onto a frigate for grabbing objectives. Though I'd probably be more tempted to pair riggers with Gunhaulers to fly high and grab an objective.
I think a front line unit of thunderers might be worth it, kept just back from screens gives an extra screen and a way to use the debuff and get extra cannon shots.
I also want to try an ironclad because I am a weak man. I am holding off on getting an ironclad til I paint the frigate I ordered though
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7 minutes ago, sal4m4nd3r said:
It seems that GW has no idea how to make this unique faction work. they cant seem to make rules that are both grounded in lore, but also effective on the tabletop. This is compounded by punitively high pointed unit costs, and "taxes" of either arkanaut company who were unnecessarily nerfed, an expensive hero who's mini is exclusively tied to a limited edition box set with no hope of a seperate release, or subfactions with limp rules. This is the SAME EXACT scenario as with the other truly unique faction playstyle, the sylvaneth.
Atleast they have some decent hammer units (kurnoth hunters, Dirthu, etc. )
I'm not a big fan of locking the balloon boy battleline with the box balloon box but they aren't the only non ark company battle line. Frigates, Gunhaulers and Thunderers can also be battleline in different ports. In fact I think every non hero/ironclad unit can be battleline in some circumstances?
How much testing have you done to work out that they don't work? I assume to be so confident it must be a bunch of games.
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What do the shooting profiles of the balloon boys look like? I was wondering how viable small units hanging around boats would be. I like the idea of a gunhauler deepstriking onto the back lines with some would be.
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Just to check, since I'm not in a position to watch a video.
Dwarfs outside of KO work like in CoS? 1in 4 but no point limits? I assume they can't board ships?
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The warscroll links are broken, but both pink and blue/brimstone pages now link to one horror scroll. So pretty sure you can no longer take blues or brims on their own.
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https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/01/02/faction-focus-disciples-of-tzeentch/
Article up, horrors changed a lot.
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What other dwarfs are tempting for the port that can take them? I've got iron drakes, longbeards and gyrocopters already, but I don't know if I can resist getting some Fyreslayers to paint up. Big thing stopping me was not wanting to do a whole army
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3 hours ago, Landohammer said:
Exactly. They essentially just pulled an allegiance/general buff out of the army and put it on something you have to buy.
Khorne may have been a bad example since they do have some strange tendencies to build brass stuff. Deepkin, Gloomspite, Ogors, and Slaanesh are more obvious offenders when it comes to spontaneous terrain generation.
Deepkin is meant to be a representation of the weird stuff pulled along with them in the aethersea I think. The ogor one also makes sense to me since I can definitely see ogors always dragging a massive cook pot along with them.
I think Gloomspite and Slaanesh would make more sense if it was a more general thing. The fane might not make sense, but a hoard of slaanesh would. If the loonshrine was more of a shanty town style shrine then it'd be easier to imagine them carrying it with them. That said since the gloomspite always follow their moon then you already have built in goblin weirdness, I guess their scouts spend all their time fashioning a crude loonshrine rather than reporting back,
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I love the look of KO and am currently doing Tempest Eye Cities of Sigmar, so looking into getting some KO for them and branching into a new army.
Tzeentch didn't get a terrain piece either and there rightly would have been an uproar if they didn't get endless spells.
I know it would be cool to have new models, but KO doesn't even have priests, and it's pretty against their flavour to have them. I'd much rather that they developed a better way for the ships to integrate than they spent focus on coming up with a shoehorned set of endless spellesque things. Quite a lot of the endless spell/prayer effects are things I would much rather have the ships do.
What would you guys prefer, some kind of buff aura coming from an endless spell or an admiral causing a frigate to boost all the KO around it. Having seen how cool the hurricanum and Luminarch are for cities I would love it if a big effect of ships was the auras they could give out.
We already kind of have some effects like that with detonation drills, that ability could definitely be expanded and allow KO synergies with their ships. Imagine backfield thunderers getting charged and escaping before being hit. You can do it now but only on a 4+ and it leaves the ship in combat. If it had a 6+ range then the thunderers could screen the ship and escape harm safely. Or endrinriggers with ships allowing them to fight first before being charged.
I'm not saying that this will happen, but there are definitely effects they can play with to improve effectiveness and give counter play, even without endless spells.
On the terrain front I'm kind of curious if we will see a change in how they work going forward. Some terrain seems integral but other stuff feels bolted on. It wouldn't surprise me if they eventually start charging points for it or limit it to specific sub factions. They could definitely make the bonetithe nexus for OBR only be available for some specific hosts. Same for Khorne altar.
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2 minutes ago, dekay said:
That is probably true! We've figured out some powerful combinations early, but given with how many variables we're working, it's possible that more will come in time. Armies like flesheaters or daughters of Khaine, with their extremely limited unit rosters, were able to figure out the most broken combos in the matter of weeks. We might need more time to find all of them.
I mentioned earlier, but CoS has 152 warscrolls. That's a lot of combinations.
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I don't think any one is claiming that cities of sigmar is OP. I think people are claiming that they are pretty mid tier with a lot of customisation and options. There are a lot more choices you can make and things to try. There are 150 or so warscrolls to build your list from, that's going to be way less easy to solve than something like Hedonites or Flesh Eaters.
It's perfectly valid to point out that a lot of the people playing are playing lists that are designed with way more restrictions than win rate in mind.
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50 minutes ago, Smooth criminal said:
Bloodsecrator - +1 attack aura for khorne. Wrathmongers - same, but in lesser radius. They stack.
Harbinger - 5+ negate aura for nurgle units for CP.
Epitome - strike last for everyone in range on 4+.
Everything else is probably weaker than sorc's reroll or lord's fight again.
There are some other Khorne buffs.
Aspiring death bringer is another attack to all units in aura for a CP (Khorne mortals).
Blood stoker adds 3 to run and charge and reroll wounds to a Khorne mortal unit.
Both are 80 point units
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10 minutes ago, Moogoodoo said:
That's a very valid point and something my excitement blinded me too, back to the drawing bord
He can still almost guarantee a 9 inch charge though, since he can set one dice to 6.
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So I ran the numbers for marauder charges. They get absurd charges.
This is before musician or any bonuses added.
Percentage Charge Roll 2.78% 7 8.33% 8 13.89% 9 19.44% 10 25.00% 11 30.56% 12 So with a musician they have a 55.56% chance of making at least a 12 inch charge.
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1 minute ago, JackStreicher said:
Now I am keen on the spire tyrants!
wasn‘t there a Warband that hasn‘t been revealed yet? A Warband about flames?
Scions of Flame. Or of the Flame.
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4 hours ago, JackStreicher said:
True, but those rules are a bit overloaded ( 1 in 9, 2 in 9 etc etc). Also iron golems are just awful
Iron golems are pretty good already. It wouldn't take much for them to be a solid choice. If they are a markable battleline unit that would be more than enough. 70 points for 10 wounds, 4+ RR, bravery 8 (with additional bravery resistance in the form of the ogor).
21 minutes ago, Zappgrot said:Exactly what i find irritating the diffrend wound values is annoying to keep track of. At least if you do not know the unit.
Well at least its better then the shadspire units. Those are even more detailed and almost all bad
It really isn't that bad to track.
Each warband had a champion for every X.
Half the warbands have a non humanoid with extra wounds. They probably get removed first.
Some of them basically have a musician or banner bearer.
Some have special rules that aren't that complicated.
It sounds like a lot, but on a unit by unit basis it isn't much. It's unlikely that people are going to be simultaneously running too many of them.
Short descriptions would be.
Iron Golems, weak ranged, reroll saves if they didn't move. Some extra wounds on ogors.
Untamed Beasts, have a pregame advance, guys with big spears can throw them. Cat is worth an extra wound.
Corvus Cabal, weak ranged, ignore terrain like fly, can reroll charges.
Cypher lords. Weak ranged, chance to make you -1 to hit when in combat. +1 to charges.
Unmade. Nightmare fuel big lady fights real well
Splintered fang, kind of complicated. Snakes have extra wound. Respawn one per turn. All have poisoned weapons.
In total it's a bit confusing, but you could say that about a fair percentage of bundles of 6 warscrolls.
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2 hours ago, Zadolix said:
Been lurking for a little bit now in this thread as I'm considering starting a free city. Is there somewhere I can find a good unit by unit breakdown? I've got an idea of a themed force but feeling abit overwhelmed by the battleline choices. Feels like there's a lot of overlap.
There are a couple of damage analysis posts early on in the cities thread, from swarmofseals. I'll send a link when I can.
Cities is pretty balanced when it comes to units honestly, particularly when it comes to shooting. They each have positives and negatives, and are better at different things. Some can be buffed considerably, others can be used solo. Even when the buffs are applied.
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14 hours ago, Forrix said:
Something that I find so weird about these endless discussions about priority rolls is that it is taken as a given that going first is a massive advantage that requires mitigation somehow.
I can't speak for others, but when I was talking about going second, I meant in later turns. When you take a double turn it involves going first, so by giving more advantages to the second player in a battle round you make double turns more of a cost.
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1 hour ago, WatcherintheWater said:
However, I would like to see some more mechanics that advantage the second player, like in shifting objectives. The easiest would be to make it so both players score objectives at the end of each game turn, not each player turn.
I really like the scoring at the end of each battle round, not turn. Maybe it wouldn't work out balance wise, but I'd love to give it a try. That's another advantage to going second, since you get to know how many models your opponent has on objectives.
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6 hours ago, dmorley21 said:
I know it seems like Durthu isn't optimal in Living City, but I've always liked the model and want to run him. Which artefact should he get though, considering he won't be the general?
The options are:
Ghrystrike (+1 to hit and wound in melee)
Blade of Hammerhal Ghyra (+1 attack)
Spear of the Hunt (an extra rend and auto always fight first on a charge).
They all seem good and it's hard to choose.
He both is and isn't. The command trait is really good, and he has auto healing in living city. He also gets an almost guaranteed flanking t1 charge.
He loses out on the woods buff, unless you are triggering it with a treelord ancient to summon them.
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2 minutes ago, shinros said:
No doesnt, let me be more clear I don't want them changing factions or warping their lore to fit a damn quota. What if they changed all of your ogres into asians and say no other type exist thats what I mean.
So far I think GW are handling reprensation in a good way so far.
I know you are using it as an farcical example, but ogre kingdoms do/did have something of a mongolian aesthetic going on...
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1 hour ago, Televiper11 said:
I find it interesting too that the Excelsior Warpriest was a squatted model for Cities.
That one is interesting. Was the Excelsior ever available separately? He's on his own sprue so he could be, but same applies to the two aelf heroes. There are some interesting choices for cities of Sigmar. I wouldn't be surprised if we got a big expansion for devoted of Sigmar at some point down the line, either living flagellants as the only option cities can take or removing and rehoming them.
AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion
in Chaos
Posted
What's the condition for +1 saves? Chaos Warriors with 3+ RR and mortal wound protection seems good.