[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

8 minutes ago, Kramer said:

We’re not going to convince each other. You want it to be equal or better than other hero’s you judge to be in the same role. But to me it’s already there. Looking at that whole list I would only take the bloodsecrator before the chaos sorcerer.

The warshtine  range  makes me dislike it the times I played it. The butcher is great but i only take two because of the cauldron ability which is a roll of the dice for a bonus. Definitely not better than than the sorcerer. All the stormcast heroes add there most value through the allegiance abilities, so arguably add more value. Not because of the scroll. Give the sorcerer lord a 3+ teleport prayer In the allegiance abilities and it knocks them all out of the park. 

To make it very basic, you say the general command abilities are ‘meh’ I find re-rolls game changing and the sorcerer lets me buff two units a turn without spending command points. So for me easily worth 160Pts

but rerolling 1s command ability is already granted by std allegiance abilities.  also sorcerer lord's magic may be unbinded or cast failure. So if your army is tzeentch marked, rerolling 1s to save rolls ability is no use. and chances of failed/unbinded? 5+ save 5 wounds makes him poor in surviving, facing a shooty army then the sorcerer perhaps die in 2 turns. if he got charged then he hardly survive that combat phase.  going through all these but only rerolling 1s?  

and yes stormcast heroes add value through allegiance abilities, and doesn't it means they even perform better than paper when they are actually on board?  they have prayer but sorcerer lord not. sorcerer lord will never have a 3+ teleport prayer but others have couple of prayers to choose from, in addition to their warscrolls.

Lets just pay 40 more points to acquire a sorcerer lord on manticore. 40 points for a manticore is a good bargain.

also add 1 to rolls is usually better than rerolling 1s.  tactically make a 4+ save units 3+ save is better than 1 rerolls. just buffing 2 units every turn is not worthy for a 160 points unit. spirit torment or bloodsecrator obviously can buff more than 2 units with less points.

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

3 hours ago, Kramer said:

I agree with the mounted vs dismounted thing. But the way they've been fixing that in facitons when they get to them is by making it two warscrolls. And if they do we'll either get a new mounted model or lose the option so just enjoy it while it lasts. 

Secondly 2CP per turn! Let me capslock that: 2CP PER TURN! That's a 100pts saved per turn. After two turns you're 40 pts up. And that's without taking into account his spell actually does two Command abilities in one! So arguably if you get your spell off and the ability off it equals doing 3 command abilities. Of which only the re-roll 1's to hit is occasionally wasted but the save re-roll is always helpful. 

So either you focus on the fact that you get a free horse if your willing to convert a model or you value it for what it does and only for the command points you save it's worth it. (And we haven't mentioned it's dispel nor it's value as a hero/wizard in scenarios)

As to your comparison the daemon prince adds value for 160 points, but they do such different things I don't really see the comparison except that you could take one instead of the other. What will add most value to you of course might differ, but I just know my opponents target him first for a reason (although I haven't played with the new Slaanesh rules yet so the priorities might have changed)

you are right I shouldnt compare him with demon prince, they are not playing the same role.  Also 2CP per turn sounds meaty, but also remind that it is 2 cp for general command abilities which are meh, not so suck but kind of disappointing. I don't agree with chaos sorcerer's ability = give you 2 free command points per round.

 Also rules wise std allegiance ability already grants you huge numbers of rerolling 1s. But no one will count it as giving std players X command points. CP is CP because it is alternative to choose from plenty of command ability. A solid rerolling 1s buff to a unit is NOT equal to CP.

 Other heroes who do similar jobs provides more themed and faction-specialized bonus, so that their armies can do better at certain aspects. Some of them even grants a Area of Effect that effect all units in a certain range, and most of them cost 100~140 points, while Sorcerer lord  chooses 1 unit and costs 160 points. chaos sorcerer lord a good utilization tool but not so worthy of 160 points. there is no synergy in him.  If a std player want a wizard then just ally from tzeentch or a priest from khorne, nurgle is also great.

Also people focus fire on Sorcerser lord not because they are strong unit, In fact it is opposite. Sorcerer Lord have so poor save property as a 160 points hero and  usually in a std army sorcerer lord is the only wizard, and killing him would make opponents magic automatically unbinded. For a KO army it is just "no pain but gain" bargain.

So let us compare him with someone else plays the same role, forgive me I couldn't find any other 160-points buffing heroes because they are all cheaper than sorcerer lord:

1. bloodsecrator

bloodsecrator is even cheaper which is 140. the buff effect is even better, +1 attack to khorne units, compared with rerolling 1s to 1 unit and need to cast the spell first and it has a chance of dispelled, and fights far more better than sorcerer lord. If 3 units in range, including himself, does it means he gives you 4 CPs? 

2.  lord relictor

this guy can do more jobs with 100 points. and also fights better.

3.  lord castellant

add 1 to save rolls. 100 points. fights better.

4. knight-vexillor

reroll charge rolls. 100 points. fights better.

5.  spirit torment

140 points. rerolling 1s to hit to every unit in a bubble, and reviving models in a unit. Still if 5 units are in range, does it count as giving 5 CPs?  totally outperform chaos sorcerer and no risk of cast failure & unbinding. Also an expert of fighting. and  ethereal and flying?

6.  butcher

140 points. his warscroll is longest of 140  points heroes. Stronger than any of above including chaos sorcerer.

7.  warshrine

the same points. 6++ save to all units in a bubble. praying effects totally outperform sorcerer lord. fight like a behemoth. warshrine is so good that some other chaos army will take it. 

So my point is that chaos sorcerer lord seems like giving 2 CP each turn, but actually does not.  generally all other heroes have similar jobs also have good impacts as chaos sorcerer lord and even cheaper and stronger. Also std allegiance ability itself overlaps with him.

With GHB 2019 changed only marauder horsemen and chaos chariot point, and a little change in chaos aura range, there are going to be less space for chaos sorcerer lord.

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

On 6/18/2019 at 6:03 AM, Kramer said:

Because he is awesome and saves you two cp a turn with the new command abilities.  

problem is he is still high priced as 160 points, just compare him with other 160 points units. A rerolling 1s totem equal to points of a demon prince makes no sense. and ridiculously, dismount version and mounted version both cost 160 points- so mounted version totally out perform on foot one, but GW only sell on foot version and almost every player conversion it.

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

11 hours ago, Charleston said:

Looks nice and I am quite curious how it will work on the table. There are some things that yet do not look quite right to me:
-Chariots are 1-3 not for matched play from what I saw. I wouldn´t wonder if Gorebeast ones were the same.
-A Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Mount is always a good addition. The rerolls from Daemonic Might are great, the free Arcane Shield also never hurts.
-I would concider more Knights.

What Marks do you want to use? Khorne would be great for  the Bloodstroker buff. 3 Gorebeast Chariots with a Stroker-Buff could really be insane!

All in all it looks like a nice theme army! I would love to see some batreps

U

I mean, 4 units of chaos chariot, each is a single model, gorebeast also, and 5 units of chaos knights, 5 model each, marauder horsemen the same. 

Since i seperate my units as small  as possible chaos power is not quite efficient magic I seek.

I will let them all take tzeentch mark since the range of tzeentch mark buff increased to 9 inch and chaos lord on mount can reroll ALL failed save rolls.

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

So with the new point drop I decide to make a mad max std army.

Chaos lord on mount

4 chaos chariot

4 gorebeast chariot

2 marauder horsemen

5 chaos knights

Ruinbringer warband

For now its 2020 pt but next week its  going  to be 2000.

Once the battalion ability activated, my army will  make 16 d3 mortal damage across the board, which is on average 32 mortal damage.

 

 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

39 minutes ago, BradReligion said:

G'day f(r)iends,

Way back in the day (like 6th or 7th ed) I played an all mounted Warriors of Chaos army. It looked awesome. Long story short, the army moved on, as did I. With how much I'm enjoying AoS these days, I am toying around with the idea of resurrecting and rebuilding the army.

Now I know nothing about Slaves to Darkness, and even less about the best ways to synergise the faction. So I'll put it to you; how would you build a 2000 point Slaves to Darkness list where everything is mounted? I'm not wedded to any particular god, and would be painting the force as an undivided army (so can run each unit as whatever I want). I am pretty keen on having a War Mammoth in there though - so really how would you fill out the remaining 1680 points?

Messing around with lists I came up with....

3 x 10 Marauder Horsemen

1 x 10 Knights

1 x 3 Gorebeast chariots

1 x War Mammoth

That leaves 520 points for heroes, filler units etc. Does this sound like a good start? What mounted heroes are considered the most competitive? Are the specific combos you'd point a noob to? How about battalions centred on mounted forces? I need help!

Cheers y'all!

a Lord of Chaos on Daemonic Mount and a chaos sorcerer lord and a lord of chaos I suppose. all slaanesh. use chaos lord on daemonic mount and chaos lord's command abilities in one phase to a unit of 3 gorebeast chariots,  enjoy your time.