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XReN

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    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    On 10/27/2018 at 10:31 PM, Honk said:

    Tricky, since my reading of the rules is 40 ghouls max, I wouldn’t go beyond that in matched play. So under 40...

    If you don't feel like doing it thats fine, but for the sake of arguement I'd say there is nothing directly stoping you from going over 40, and warscroll says that a unit of ghouls can have 10 or more models

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    On 10/24/2018 at 7:18 PM, mrbedlam said:

    So I had an interesting idea for a Flesh Eater list that takes some advantage of all the wizards we can bring.

    GK on Giest (Majestic Horror)

    GK on ZD

    2 x GK

    3 x 10 Ghouls

    Mortis Engine (ally)

    Royal Family

    Endless Spells: You have 150 points left over. So Cogs, Geminids, Shackles, Pendulum. Whichever you will get the most out of.

    Strategy: First turn Summon a Varghulf who helps reroll failed spells and gives you back ghouls. Mortis Engine gives +1 to cast. All of the GK including the one you summon with the Battalion can cast spells and summon more ghouls and your General can either summon 2 GK and unit of Horror/Flayers or a GK and 2 units of Horror/Flayers. 

    The units are all min, so its not as tanky as the lists I normally play but I think it could be a lot of fun and so many spells with 3 very fast moving hard hitting models.(just stay away from Tzeench lists....shudder)

    I would totally go for bodies and corpse cart instead of Mortis and GKoTG.  

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, XReN said:

    Since my local meta might force me to face shooty lists, I've been thinking of putting Pennant on crypt ghast, so I would be able to patrol him and maybe unit of ghouls, as well as summoned horrors/flayers and get close and personal with opponent's ranged threats/support heroes very soon or force to deploy closer to boarder.
    What are you lads think of it/have anyone performed it?

     

     

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    Since my local meta might force me to face shooty lists, I've been thinking of putting Pennant on crypt ghast, so I would be able to patrol him and maybe unit of ghouls, as well as summoned horrors/flayers and get close and personal with opponent's ranged threats/support heroes very soon or force to deploy closer to boarder.
    What are you lads think of it/have anyone performed it?

     

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    14 hours ago, Reuben Parker said:

    On a more tactical note something I want to try is a couple of large horror units (9 each) along with palisade and gravetide using the endless spells to stop people getting good frontage on the horrors so they can regen and grind over several turns.

     

    I should point out that 18 horrors are a good frontage already)
     

    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    14 hours ago, Freejack02 said:

    LCoD and Vandus are not bad for 1k points - you either have not played them well or are exaggerating to a pretty extreme degree. As for as having "mediocre fighting power", Vandus charge can 1-shot most anything you are going to see at 1k. Yes they are weak to mortals - obviously they are, they're bloody Stormcast. Is this a tournament-winning killer list? No idea, balancing is hard at 1k (especially for elite armies), but this will do fine in the vast majority of 1k games. 

    Everything else Mark pretty much nailed. 

    I guess we can end here. It's just a fact that support heroes and cautious playstyle worked for me better than LCoD at this point level.

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    Now I'm really thinking of taking 30/10/10 ghouls, so I can properly screen and also be able to prevent bravery loses with 1 CP if something touches them 1st turn before I even started bringing in new ghouls and casting Unholy Vitality

    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted

    25 minutes ago, Ravinsild said:

    Well what’s the issue with a Lord Celestant on Dracoth? Just curious. 

    Also what’s the issue with Vandus and why would I lose more often than not as opposed to this list? What’s the big difference maker? 

    I don’t know anything about Stormcast but I like your list because it runs all the models I like (Prosecutors, Retributors, Judicators, Liberators etc...) 

    Dracoth is too expensive for 1k points and too easy to kill right away, whille not contributing to your army anything exept his fighting power which is mediocre. 
    Vandus - same deal, can be usefull even without going into the fight, but cost more and dies faster, whille also forcing you to get really under performing trait and artefact and that 1 attack buff can be taken from other source.
    Difference is that even with Vandus attack buffs you will not survive the grind against a propper hoard army, whille being absolutely defenceless against any type of behemots (like zombie dragons) which are faster then you and hit like a train. You really want at least castellant in your list
     

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    7 minutes ago, Glaurung said:

    This is the same list I’m running, with relics swapped.

    did your ghouls survive? How did you position the monsters?

    Yeah, I listed my casualties, when you have up to 24 dice to res, it's hard to lose units.  Usually when they double teamed something - they did it from flanks, to cut opponents manouverabiliti, when not charging something they stayed behind the screen, and 2nd game I didn't even bothered to move ZD anywhere close to the enemy, he just stayed in the middle of the army, giving everything hit rerolls and ward saves as I played objectives game

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted

    So i won the tournament I've been talking about, first time playing FEC, the tourney was small, just 6 people, because there was big 40k team tournament at the same weekend

    1st game against nighthaunt with lotsa grimgast reapers and chainrasps, mission - better part of valor, my opponent made a mistake and left 1 objective unguarded, so I sent 10 patroling ghouls there, whille others held the charge from reserves (he got one unit in with 10" charge so attacks in charge phase helped him to slaughter 20 ghouls) then i just started the grind to victory.

    2nd game vs seraphon (dodged the bullet of kunning rukk, our local champ. He was topped by sylvaneth that I faced in the final) mission - starstrike (not sure, the one from GHB17 with 3 comets), got 2 comets falling on my left flank that I swarmed with ghouls and it ended with time break with me controling 1 comet, whille in position to regain controll over the other and score 8 to 6 in my favor.

    3rd game, escallation against sylvaneth dreadwood with Allariel and 12 scythe kurnoths, survived the initial charge from both medium tree people and their queen, killed almost all kurnoths by double king charge from the flanks, got double turn, tied up Allariele, sterted to mop up the rest of kurnoths, whille king on terrorgheist was freed from combat due to casualties removal and started to rampage through the backfield whille summoned flayers and one unit of ghouls liberated flank objectives, by turn 3 kurnoths and goddes have been dealt with and it was obvious who is the winner here.

    Extremely durable army, lost 20 ghouls 1st game, 20 ghouls, ghast courtier and terrorgheist 2nd game, 20 ghouls and ghast courtier 3rd game (maybe due to the fact that my opponents have been unfamilliar with the army)

    And here is my list:


    Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
    - Delusion: Crusading Army
    Mortal Realm: Ulgu

    Leaders
    Abhorrant Ghoul King on Zombie Dragon (440)
    - General
    - Trait: Magestic Horror 
    - Artefact: Doppelganger Cloak 
    Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist (400)
    - Artefact: Miasmatic Blade 
    Crypt Ghast Courtier (80)
    Crypt Ghast Courtier (80)

    Battleline
    20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
    20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
    10 x Crypt Ghouls (100)

    Units
    6 x Crypt Horrors (320)

    Battalions
    Ghoul Patrol (180)

    Total: 2000 / 2000
    Extra Command Points: 1
    Allies: 0 / 400
    Wounds: 114
     

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    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted

    8 hours ago, Ravinsild said:

    So basically anyone can use Command ABILITIES so long as you’ve got the command POINTS to use them. 

    Command TRAITS are the passive benefits your general gains that give usually an aura of something, or an extra attack, or a re-roll commonly. 

    Back in AoS 1 your general was the only character, barring special exceptions, that could use a command ABILITY. 

    So you were right. 

    List #1 gives me free form to pick my own Command TRAIT for my general and my choice of 1 free artifact. 

    List #2 requires me to be Hammers of Sigmar chamber (to use Vandus Hammerhand as I understand it because he’s not generic) and therefore locks me into a very specific command TRAIT as well as artifact. 

    At the end of the day since it’s all the same modes anyway I’ll try both because they both seem fun. 

    Except I have no idea how to win..... any games ever. 

    Any games where the objectives are middle of the map (example being Battle for the Pass or Shifting Objectives) I for sure won’t beat my opponent there cuz I’m slow and I for sure won’t have more people than them unless I group every single dude onto 1 point. 

    I mean most Chaos bros I fight bring 40 Bloodreavers/STD Marauders and that’s more models than my whole army plus whatever else they’ve got. 

    How do I grab objectives with so few boys? 

    Ignore this Vandus nonsence. This list will be stomped by practicaly anything, no extra CP to stack Vandus CA, no Save buffs, only 2 heroes with 3+ save. There is not that many missions where you will get the chance to counter charge objective wise, usually it will be mid table fight over objectives and you are not winning those with 4+ saves. If you are willing to give up staunch defender - just go celestial vindicators, same +1 attack, just unstackable, but gives you rerolls on the charge, better trait and weapon (then HoS)
    And you really should not consider bringing dracoth lords on this point format, except if you know that you will have to fight for the objective with him, therefore you MUST have staunch defender and some protective item.

    This is my 1k list changed to field retributors
    Will work with Celestial Vindicators as well, I have never felt lacking instruments to win with this type of list
    Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals
    Mortal Realm: Aqshy

    Leaders
    Lord-Castellant (100)
    - General
    - Trait: Staunch Defender 
    - Artefact: Obsidian Amulet 
    Lord-Relictor (100)
    - Prayer: Translocation
    Knight-Heraldor (100)

    Battleline
    10 x Liberators (200)
    - Warhammer & Shield
    - 2x Grandhammers
    5 x Judicators (160)
    - Skybolt Bows
    - 1x Shockbolt Bows

    Units
    3 x Prosecutors with Stormcall Javelins (100)
    - 1x Stormsurge Tridents
    5 x Retributors (220)

    Total: 980 / 1000
    Extra Command Points: 0
    Allies: 0 / 200
    Wounds: 67
     

    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    27 minutes ago, Ravinsild said:

    I appreciate the run down. At the end of the day, I know Retributors are over coated, but they just look insanely cool and they remind me of retribution Paladins from WoW, especially with the Ashbringer hidden weapon effect that can trigger to instantly turn a demon or undead to dust. It’s so cool. I just love the Retributors image. 

     

    Retributors and Prosecutor - feeling you, they have been my first love in AoS, have 15 of ones and 24 of the others

    Celestant - remember, he must be in combat himself to pop his CA

    Lantern healing - correct, gets better with Staunch Defender and cover, gets worse from rend

    For relictor's prayer I'd reccomend 2 choices - Divine Light (choose any unit, goes on 3+, gives reroll 1s to hit against enemy unit or 6s agains yours) for defence, Bless Weapons (unmod 6 - additional wound roll) for offence (I belive that due to wordings won't do anything for retributors)  

    Other: Azyros, finally buffed to being usefull and become AMAZING, give reroll hit rolls of 1 against enemy units within 10" on both shooting and melee all phases (will do wonders to sequitors) and once per game can dish out AOE MWs; Vexilor - reroll charges and rus bubble, can throw comet (blast of D3 MWs with 2d6" radius at I dont remember what range smtg about 24") or teleporting friendly unit from one point to another (9" away) both effects are once per game and you only get one of those on each Vex; Incantor - solid wizard, amaizing auto dispell ability, situational but VERY devastating self explosion gear (like Arcanum's)

    I find decimators absolutely incredible, but rarely have place for them in my lists, but they are terrifying to 1w low save hordes. Protectors are solid on paper, rarelly use them, maybe I've been unlucky - but they never fulfilled their role of monster hunters in my games. For paladins star soul maces are great, most of the time my decimators have been able to deal with hordes with just 3 axes and then go pulverise anything tanky with maces

    Celestial Vindicators have rerolls of 1s to hit when charging, CA +1 attack on unit, not stackable (basicly best damage amplyfier for retributors), compulsory command trait: +1 damage on hit roll of 6 (or something like that), compulsory artefact of power: in the combat phase you can choose to lower your save by 1 to get 2 attacks.

    A note on liberators and sequitors: 
    Since vanguard wing is not a thing anymore (almost) and celestant's CA is when he is in combat only you can run libs with swords and be dandy. Swords on sequitors are better than maces mathematically and gap increases with buffs.

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    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted

    1 hour ago, Ravinsild said:

    Oh it was the 1d4chan tactics page. So it’s pretty bad now I suppose? Well that’s alright. Once I get the Stormcast book I can see if anything looks nice to work from. 

    Everything changed dramatically with the new battletome, battalions are almost irrelivant at this point.
    If you dig swords and retributors - you are welcome in chambers of Celestial Vindicators stormhost, those guys are true fanatics, chanting prayers and warsongs in battle to guide their hatered for chaos. Also have decent rules, not max competetive though and amazing color scheme.

    Now units, retributors always been overpriced and they also being completely outperformed by Evocators (but since last ones can wield swords you are still be going with Vindicators theme) and robbed of synergies with Bless Weapons prayer and Celestant's CA. Prosecutors really beg for discount, we pay a lot for their outstanding mobility that they don't really have much to do with, at best you can utilise them to tie enemy shooters for a turn or mess with opponents pile in by charging them in far end of enemy unit whille your heavy hitters do their thing from the front. Liberators are solid, always been that way, but hit like wet noodles, upgraded double weapon rule won't help an ounce and it's really painfull when you take lots of casualties on big unit and then some run away, these guys are just your battleline, that could be used as an anvil. Everything else you mentioned is solid and already have been commented accuratly. 

    For heroes you always want your gentelmen's set: Lords: Celestant on foot, mounted on dracoth, Castellant, Relictor, Arcanum on gryph charger (on foot if you want minimum points spent to have seq in battleline, on dracoline if you run dracolines (though he perform good on its own) on taularon cuz cool model and his possibilities are yet to be explored) Knights: Azyros, Vexilor, Heraldor, Incantor

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    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    32 minutes ago, Vipoid said:

    So, I'll admit that the splitting up of Vampire Counts has left me at a bit of a loss. I own quite a bit of Ghoul stuff, but it was intended to work with my skeletons and vampires - not on its own. 

    Anyway, I'm wondering if I have enough Ghoul stuff for a viable Flesh Eater Courts army. Currently I own:

    - 1 Ghoul King (converted to have wings)
    - 1 Varghulf
    - 9 Crypt Horrors
    - ~50 Ghouls
    - 1 Terrorgheist

    Can I make a decent army out of that?

    That would be solid for 1000-1250 pts games, but not really enough for 2000 as you will lack units to summon, if you decide to play FEC - get one Start Collecting and one Skirmish box (don't recall it's proper name, but thats 20 ghouls and 3 horrors/flayers) also second Varghulf would be nice to get.
    And you can also play with mixed Death and therefore include all the stuff you own/like and even get some synergies from it (like +1 attack from Vampire Lord's CA)

    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    7 minutes ago, ledha said:

    I'm thinking of using 6 prosecutors with shield with sucess against some lists.

    Drop them via scion. 3D6 charge, fly so you can even fly over the tarpit or screens if needed. The goal here is to engage with the ennemy screens (in prevision of others units than he think you will drop and charge) and possibly make a mess in the opponent deployment zone, because 6 large base with the 3" of n go zone can block a surprising chunk of the battlefield. Prosecutors are not very resilient, but they are resilient enough to hold their own against tarpit/screening units (even more with the -1 to hit from scion). I even used them to block some bestigors.

     

    Off course, it doesn't work if someone has retreat+charge or can kill them in the hero phase, but it can surprise some armies.

    If not considering scion slots and drops in total, will 2 units of 3 work less efficient than 1 unit of 6? I belive it's going to be more flexible, whille able to achive same goals as 1 unit, and also it will have back up in form of having 2 attempts to charge and it will less likely to lose unit by bravery if you take 2 casualties in 2 units, than taking 4 in 1

    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    Feels like another Surecharge gimmick. Have to point out that it is auto lose on any "heroes score" mission, as well as total commitment, won't play this at tournament unless there is no such missions (need to say that my local meta influinces my view heavily)

    But it also can hard-counter hero dependant armies I guess

    You should definitely try this and tell us how it plays

    AoS 2 - Stormcast Eternals Discussion

    in Stormcast Eternals

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    58 minutes ago, PlayerOfGames said:

    So, what about Vanguard Wing? While no longer a competitive powerhouse, maybe it is still good for a fun/semi-competitive list?

    Yeah, for fun it will work. Liberators really don't worth wasting everything that can make this list good for stupid surecharge, because they will hit like pillows. Getting crossbows packed in big unit means troubles if they get charged, so probably will take shield libs to protect them with a little more chances to fight back due to battalion.
    Honestly I'd go with bows here, don't waste Scion slots, bigger threat range, less likely to get into combat ect. 
    More than 3 melee prosecutors are never worth considering unless you just want to run something really silly, 3 will manage backfield harrassing just fine and don't need Gavriel with tambourine to be placed well after reserve charge and you'll be better spending those points that you are willing to spend on bigger prosecutor unit on relictor or ballista. 
    The only good thing I can say about VW now is that buff range is not a problem at all, I easily managed to fit 30 semi-spread out libs into bubble from 6 prosecutors, so getting anything 20 models or less will be easy as pie, even with 3 man unit of prosecutors.

    At it's current state I see vanguard wing as collection of solid units that will find their place in any match-up (even our overcosted wing boys)

    AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

    in Death

    Posted · Edited by XReN

    Hello fellow kings, I finally decided to build my FEC army and I'm going all in with it - will go for 2000 tournament this weekend (one day, 3 games) here is my list

    Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
    - Delusion: Crusading Army
    Mortal Realm: Ulgu

    Leaders
    Abhorrant Ghoul King on Zombie Dragon (440)
    - General
    - Trait: Magestic Horror 
    - Artefact: Doppelganger Cloak 
    Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist (400)
    - Artefact: The Flayed Pennant 
    Crypt Ghast Courtier (80)
    Crypt Ghast Courtier (80)

    Battleline
    20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
    20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
    10 x Crypt Ghouls (100)

    Units
    6 x Crypt Horrors (320)

    Battalions
    Ghoul Patrol (180)

    Total: 2000 / 2000
    Extra Command Points: 1
    Allies: 0 / 400
    Wounds: 114


    I'm open to suggestions on artefacts and need some advice on what to build for GKoT summoning (Flayers might be better than horrors I guess?)
    For GKoZD I have 2 Varghulfs so no problem here. I also would like some advise on playing this list (and FEC in general) correctly, I can also drop here what missions will be on tournament.

    P.S. I'll also get 70 more ghouls from my friend for patrol summoning, might include some more in list itself

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