Beer & Pretzels Gamer
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Posts posted by Beer & Pretzels Gamer
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What about specific factions Tzeentch might struggle with?
With Tzeentch coming soon to my local gaming group we’ve been talking which armies we have that might present harder match ups for them. One we’ve been discussing a lot has been Khorne (posted a list we discussed on that thread). Basic thinking was:
1) lots of cheap unbinds, including ones that get bonuses to the roll or deal back damage
2) no spell casting to feed into Tzeentch summoning - but plenty of prayers that can hit them back and/or buff Khorne units
3) cheap chaff for screening
lack of shooting to snipe their Heroes and thus breakdown their buffs an obvious drawback.
We also have KO, Mawtribes, and FEC that we’re debating what an anti-Tzeentch list for would look like...
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One reason first narrative cycle worked so well was everyone was still learning the game and thus more willing to play smaller sized armies and partner with another player. These days those most players want there own roughly 2K sized list and want to control their own destinies.
We did have a successful 4-way dance with Swifthawk protecting a field hospital where Nurgle had detected a new infection it wanted to claim as its own. In approaching the field hospital though the GUO had to go by an Awakened Wyldwood where he was recognized as someone Drycha wanted revenge on. Meanwhile an Execution Herd’s migration had brought it into the valley this was all taking place in. The contrasting objectives of each army made for a compelling game but with that many armies there was often a little too much downtime.
So since then we’ve mainly focused on 1v1 plans that tie together. For our next narrative cycle we are looking at a territory-based game that would give us a chance to try out a lot of the new battletomes. The basics would be a Khorne Daemon army and a Khorne Mortal army competing to see who could collect the most skulls for the skull throne. They’d face off against KO, Gutbusters, BCR, and probably Sylvaneth across a series of matches. Sets up nice enough for another big 8K blowoff battle.
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Our gaming group started with a narrative campaign.
In the first game three drunken Ogors (a Butcher, a Firebelly, and a Tyrant) had gone on a rampage over who was the better killer, eventually attracting a larger horde (1k points basically) of other Ogors. The rampage had gotten so bad the Swifthawk Agents were dispatched to stop the mob. Unbeknownst to them a Gitmob has started following the Ogors, taking advantage of the mayhem they were creating. Worked for four players, each of whom had specific narrative objectives.
In the second game, following the pyrrhic Swifthawk Agents victory (only the general and a few other units had survived), the Swifthawk Agents had sent out Skycutters to find the remnants. One ended up crashing in a hidden Sylvaneth Grove that was otherwise surrounded by a forest full of Spiderfang Grots. As the Grots rushed to destroy the Skycutter the small force of Sylvaneth tried to protect them. Each turn more units would come onto to battlefield depending on a random roll.
The final game saw the Swifthawk General form an alliance with the Sylvaneth and call in favors he was owed by the Kharadron Overlords to fully eradicate the grot and Ogor presence in the region. While the other two were roughly 2k pts on each side this one was a big blow off at roughly 8k total points.
Took a bit of work readjusting each scenario to accommodate the outcome of the previous game but small tweaks (like giving a unit of Swordmasters that kept surviving a ‘veteran’ bonus) really got people engaged. When the Swifthawk General finally died in the big battle he actually got a spontaneous moment of silence the players had gotten so attached...
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While I play plenty of matched play as someone who got into the game for the narrative aspects I would add in that I like a spell lore that really matches with the faction’s back story.
After that I would concur that the keys are buffs that either make something the faction already focuses on an even greater strength or helps offset a weakness and debuffs that make your opponent’s job harder.
As in the above if you include prayers I agree that Khorne meets both criteria.
Another one that I have been very happy with, particularly if you include the spells on the war scrolls, has been Flesh-eater Courts. Being able to stack attacks on an Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist and thus increasing the odds of a Gaping Maw (6 MWs on an unmodified 6) can really ruin your opponent’s day. If you’re running a lot of degrading war scrolls in Gristelgore than being able to use top of the table key. On the same note adding extra movement can really help you get some of your non-monster units in position.
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4 hours ago, JDLIII said:
Thinking it over, I’m wondering if Skulltake + Murderhost would do better and seems fun on paper. I wanna take Skulltaker as the hero for Murderhost.
Can’t speak to Skulltake battalion. I have run Murderhost with Skulltaker and while the Bloodletters (I could only run minimum size units admittedly) Skulltaker did well for me. Only issue is be aware as a named character he can’t take an artefact.
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1 hour ago, HarbingerGaming said:
I'd trade out the bloodmad warband for gore pilgrims. much cheaper and overall provides a better buff. I'd also look at if Blood Hunt is really worth it. I've used Karanak in about a dozen or so games and he's only ever pulled his weight once. Hitting on 4s against anything that ISNT his quarry is rough. He just doesn't push out the damage that he really should.
I’ve been trying a Blood Hunt + Gore Pilgrims list as an anti-Wizard army with Tzeentch entering my local gaming group. So far the question of Karanak has been whether he summons the extra unit of Flesh Hounds? When he has it has been hard to complain about a net 40 points for an unbind that can deal back some damage. That said you’re right once he gets into it he hasn’t tended to hold up all that well or do much damage so I’ve had to screen him until I can get him into his quarry.
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4 hours ago, JDLIII said:
It didn’t allow me to edit post but I forgot to add Aspiring Deathbringer. I’d bring the 10 Flesh Hounds to a 5 and add the aspiring deathbringer. Also I wouldn’t use Skullfiend Slaughterhost
Relatively new to a Khorne myself but believe you’re still short on one of your battalion requirements:
Blood Hunt (120 pts)
Wrath of Khorne Bloodthirster (300 pts)
Karanak (140 pts)
Minimum 3 Units of Flesh Hounds (@100 pts each)
Blood Mad Warband (160 pts)
Aspiring Deathbringer (80 pts)
Bloodsecrator (120 pts)
3 Units of Blood Warriors (@100 pts each)
Minimum 1 Unit of Bloodreavers (70 pts)
1 Unit of Skullreapers (180 pts)
which I believe takes you to 1770 pts total. You’ve clearly met your battleline requirements but you’re going to need to make some choices with the rest of the list as far as the Slaughterpriests and Judgements. If this is really the way you want to go I’d go for the two Slaughterpriests and drop the Judgements (reminder you’ll need to take at least one Slaughterpriest if you’re going to take any Judgements).
And agree you’d probably want to go Reapers instead of Skullfiend with this list.
Personally, not sure I’d go with Blood Mad Warband for a mixed list given the number of units it requires and that the bonus only comes on the charge. There are a lot easier ways to add an attack than this with Khorne.
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5 hours ago, Troll.exe said:
Like you mentioned, Reapers of Vengeance is the way to go. I’d recommend taking Reapers, dropping the third priest with resaguination, the mighty lord and the wrath axe. Pick up a Bloodthirster of Insensate rage and drop the Khartoth the Bloodhunger on him. Then you would still get your aplha strike on a 4+ In the combat phase.
Then you’ve got a few more wounds, another greater daemon for locus on those hounds and Leave none alive plus some serious damage. Mighty lord doesn’t typically do much.
Not 100% sure on the unbind. It depends if the spell is “cast” on a successful cast before the destiny dice is used. If the roll/reroll from loathsome sorcery, fails then they use a destiny dice then I’d argue the bloodtithe unbind would work. Since the bloodtithe unbind happens immediately once the spell is cast. Might be something that’s addressed in the faq.
Thanks for the follow up. If I’m thinking about this right I lose two unbinds from dropping priest and mighty lord but gain one (that deals damage back) from taking Reapers as well as the second pile in command ability.
Had run Tyrants battalion the other weekend against an army with a lot of Rend and MWs from Shooting and had a tough time keeping them on table. Long enough to do real damage. Tzeentch has less Rend (absent a sub-faction choice admittedly) and if between loathsome to sorcery, unbinds and Hexgorger I an cut down on casting based MWs maybe I’ll have better luck getting full use of my Bloodthirsters.
Thanks again.
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New to thread and new to Khorne so apologies if I missed a similar discussion earlier.
With a Tzeentch list soon to join our local gaming group was exploring Khorne’s myriad ways to make Wizards miserable and came up with following:
Slaughterhost: Bloodlords (know Reapers more anti-Wizard but felt I may need the first activation and extra 4” movement for WoK)
Wrath of Khorne Bloodthirster (General)
- Halo of Blood- Slaughter’s Thirst
Bloodsecrator
- Blood-forged Armor
Slaughterpriest
- Killing Frenzy
Slaughterpriest
- Bronzed Flesh
Slaughterpriest
-Resaguination
Mighty Lord of Khorne
-Mark of the Destroyer
5x Flesh Hounds
5x Flesh Hounds
5x Flesh Hounds
40x Bloodreavers
5x Blood Warriors
Karanak
Gore Pilgrims Battalion
Blood Hunt Battalion
Hexgorger Skulls
Wrath-Axe
Gives me a ridiculous number of unbinds, at least a couple of which have bonuses. Khorne already limits the amount of Summoning Points Tzeentch will get. Just not sure how well this list will hold up.
Second question goes to whether the Blood Tithe unbind can be used after the Tzeentch player has spent Destiny Dice?
General Narrative discussion
in Narrative and Open Play
Posted
Fortunately we’re lucky there. Two of our key players came over from historical war games where 2v2 is the norm.
But the first time we did I think the key was using the narrative to determine deployment. In the narrative the Grots were holed up in an old Duardin stronghold in one corner while the Ogors were in a valley on the other side. Similarly the Sylvaneth were deploying from an Awakened Wyldwood in the middle of a forest on one side of the board (coming down out of the same mountains as the Duardin Stronghold) while the KO were in the more open plain on the other side where their ships had easier flying. The middle of each side was occupied by some fun pieces the players had requested (Rogue Idol and Colossal Squig on Destruction side which the lead grot character had respectively activated and mastered in the narrative, and a Flamespyre Phoenix and Magmadroth, both more favors called in by the General). For rounds 1 & 2 then it basically played out as almost two separate games with the advantage that both players on which ever side whose turn it was doing their actions (movement, shooting, combat, etc.) at the same time. By ro7nd 3 of course everything was mixed up but by then the numbers were down to much more reasonable amounts. Game was won on the last combat of the last turn when the Sylvaneth finally secured their objective giving Order a 2-1 advantage on that front.
Thinking about that though made me realize how important controlling deployment has been to the success of all our narrative games. Fortunate to have a gaming group where as long as their is a narrative logic to how the units are initially deployed (or come onto the field in later rounds) there are no complaints. This seems to do a very good job of preventing some of the issues related to “over powered” units wrecking the dynamic, and we’ve incorporated plenty of them over the last year.