Lebenski
-
Posts
13 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Gallery
Store
Downloads
Blogs
Events
Posts posted by Lebenski
-
-
44 minutes ago, swarmofseals said:Here's another list I've worked out that is rather the opposite of most of my other lists:
Anointed on Frostie (general, ironoak artisan, probably spear of the hunt as there probably isn't a better option)
Celestial Hurricanum with Battlemage (Lifesurge)
30 Phoenix Guard
30 Freeguild Crossbowmen
30 Freeguild Handgunners
4 Desolators
The point here is to get the drops as low as possible. I'd love to expand the drop count a bit, but I don't know what the typical Kroak and IDK lists are coming in at. Basically I'd like to be able to choose first turn against opponents where that will be advantageous. Usually the hurricanum, crossbows and desolators will start off the board with the rest on the board. Sometimes though I can imagine using a different configuration, possible with the melee starting on the board and the ranged all off it.
Nice list! The model I most wish I could find space for is the Anointed on Frostie. Do you think that 6 drops is really low enough to get the advantage you need? I feel like you’d be giving up a lot for it when a good chunk of the time you won’t even get the option of going first when you need it. Love the idea of the big blocks though!
-
48 minutes ago, swarmofseals said:
@Lebenski pretty close to some lists that we've seen success from already so I imagine it'll work. I don't love the double sorceress and I'm not a fan of the Anointed on foot. I'd much rather take a Nomad Prince to make the sisters battleline than make the PG battleline, but maybe my instinct on that is wrong.
Thanks for the thoughts! I really wanted to do exactly as you said and run a Nomad Price general, but his biggest issue is that you really want him on the Hidden Paths with the Sisters which means that you aren't getting your Adjutant roll turn 1, and in order to get subsequent Adjutant rolls you need to take that Hero with you too.
This is a list that really wants to leverage Strike Then Melt Away heavily (not to mention Command Abilities on the Anointed/Nomad Prince scrolls if you run them) so the Adjutant seems super important as our only way to boost CPs.
So that leaves us with needing two <6 wound heroes on the battlefield at the start of the game. I agree that the Anointed isn't the strongest choice but he also does offer some really good utility. His CA really powers up the big block of Phoenix Guard, no Battleshock for the PG is a thing and an extra unbinding/dispell attempt is always welcome. Not to mention the utility of dispelling our own Lifeswarm as and when we dont want to risk the opponent controlling it.
I don't hate the idea of running a Sorceress General and Sorceress Adjutant with Nomad Prince in the Hidden Paths by any means but the extra 30 points probably means downgrading your Darkshards to Dreadspears and Freeguild Guard thus losing some damage output. Thanks again for your thoughts and also for your really thorough analysis throughout this thread - it has certainly helped me!
-
Thoughts on this list?
Leaders
Anointed [100pts]: General
Celestial Hurricanum with Celestial Battlemage [280pts]
Sorceress [90pts]: General's Adjunct
Sorceress [90pts]
Battleline
10 Darkshards [100pts]
10 Darkshards [100pts]
30 Phoenix Guard [420pts]
Other
4 Desolators [380pts]
20 Sisters of the Watch [320pts]
Gyrocopter [70pts]
Endless Spells
Emerald Lifeswarm [50pts]
Total: 2000 pts
Basic strategy points:
- Anointed, Phoenix Guard, Sorceress, 10x Darkshards and Gyrocopter deployed on the battlefield- First deepstriking group: Hurricanum + Desolators. Doing their thing with Strike then Melt Away.
- Second deepstriking group: 20x Sisters, 10xDarkshards, Sorceress. Deployed with the shards screening the sisters. Assuming they get charged, the sisters will hopefully get two rounds of Stand and Shoot.
- Spell casters in all 3 blobs can cast Emerald Lifeswarm and return D6 wounds-worth of models where it is most needed , either on Desolators, Sisters or Phoenix Guard.
- Adjutant is absolutely necessary given the amount of CP we'll need.
- Gyrocopter just rounds out the last 70 points and is a 5th drop on the table allowing 5 in the Hidden Paths. Could be something else, but he is a decent threat vs hordes.
- I'd love the Desolators to be Fulminators or Concussors but just can't get there points wise.
Feedback and thoughts much appreciated. -
On 7/28/2020 at 7:52 PM, readercolin said:
This is easy to see if you run the numbers. On the charge, an equal number of fulminators will always do the most damage (6 damage/model), followed by desolators in groups of 6+ (5.5 damage/model), and then finally concussors (5.33 damage/model). However, if the number of models drops below 6, concussors outdamage the desolators, though both units will always outdamage fulminators that aren't charging.
However, this is half the story. The other half is that it is extremely easy to get charges off with your dracothian guard unit because you can deploy them on the board edge, shoot, scoot in to 3" range, and then get the charge off. Lastly, there is the question of how many points you can push into the unit. Having to take a 6 man unit of desolators is VERY expensive, and it is hard to justify pushing 570 points into that rather than other available units. However, dumping 480 points into a pack of 4 fulminators/concussors leaves you with that unit and enough points for another battleline unit, or a hero, while still having enough punch to be worth bringing.
Thanks for this summary. Comparing Concussors to Fulminators for the first time today, I completely get your argument that you’re almost guaranteed the first turn charge but beyond that are the Fulminators going to deal more damage over the course of the game? Concussors do a flat 2 damage and Fulminators 3 on the charge, 1 otherwise.
Let’s assume they are going to be in combat for 4 turns. Further they are *probably* only going to get the charge on T1 because they are likely to be right up amongst the opponent’s army and will be counter charged/bogged down. Well that means each Fulminator hit is going to do 3+1+1+1 = 6 damage over the course of the game. Concussors on the other hand are 2+2+2+2=8 AND have the added bonus of doing mortals in addition on hits of 6.
Even if we end up getting two charges in with the fulminators, each hit is still only doing 8 damage over the course of the game and zero mortals so it seems like from a pure damage perspective they are likely to be worse in the long run.
In their favour they are slightly more favourable vs missile attacks and you stand a better chance of wiping out a key target on turn 1 which could make the difference.
Given all of that I feel like Concussors are still the best choice. Appreciate any more thoughts or corrections because like I said, it’s my first time looking at these units today!
-
How are you guys rounding out your Dolorus Guard lists? There is a lot of tension between Olynder and Dreadblade for best general imho but at the moment I'm erring on the side of Olynder for all the utility she gives. I realise this means giving up on the teleportation trick + Ruler of the Spirit Hosts. I'm not 100% sure it's right but it's where I'm at right now.
I feel like you want a core of this:
1 x Olynder (General. All round boss, great with the protection of the DG. Grief Stricken rocks. Regrow Hexwraiths).
1 x Vampire Lord (Extra Hexwraith attacks. Regrow Hexwraithss)
1 x Spirit Torment (Rerolls fishing for mortals on hexwraiths. Regrow Hexwraiths)10 x Hexwraith
10 x Hexwraith
1 x Black Coach (Regrow Hexwraiths)
With the batallion this is 1360 points. You've then got 640 to spend on a mixture of...
- Chainghasts/Spirit Torment (grant rerolls to your second blob of hexwraiths which are unlikely to get in the first ST bubble too).
- Bladegheists (great with all the STs and Chainghasts running around. Good for deepstriking).
- More Hexwaiths (given our lists is basically built around them, and they fill out the battleline)
- Chronomantic Cogs (great to help guarantee those +attack charges)
- Chainrasps (nice to have a big block of bodies for objectives but they really want support from a hero or two)
- KoSoS (more +attack redundancy + Deathless Spirits)
- Spirit Hosts (also great with the ST rerolls).
Keen to see how you guys are building your DG lists.
-
8 hours ago, EnixLHQ said:
+1 attacks for charging puts them at 5 each with the leader having 6. Pair them with a KoSoES or Vampire Lord and for a CP it's 7/6 attacks.
I believe that the Dolorus Guard buffs the mount attacks too as it is all melee weapons so the batallion takes them to 6 attacks each (leader: 7) and VL/KoSoS takes them to 8 attacks each (leader: 9).
-
I really wish that we could have both the teleporting Dreadblade with Ruler of the Spirit Hots who can pull units AND Lady Olynder as your General who could be protected by the Dolorus Guard. As it stands, I feel like we have to choose between two of our best options and for an underperforming army it would be nice to have access to both.
-
Interesting, so one drop considerations aside, lets say you had 8 drops. You could put your first 4 in the Underworld (one at a time), then your last 4 on the battlefield (one at time) and that would be fine because the game only "checks" after deployment is complete?
-
17 hours ago, EnixLHQ said:
I think the reason you're not hearing a lot of sounds of joy over this is that a single drop is just that, and splitting units into the Underworlds by necessity would break up that nice bonus. Still, getting it down to 2 or 3 drops compared to the average 4 is really nice, too.
The way I understood this was that you could split the units between the underworld and tabletop all in one drop. Is that incorrect?
-
Can someone please confirm for me that both the KoSos’s command ability and the Dolorus Guard ability will affect both the rider and mount for Hexwraiths?
Meaning that a unit buffed with the command ability will be dishing out 8 (4 for rider, 4 for mount) attacks per model on the charge?
-
Really hoping we get a WD preview in a week or so, just to set expectations for what this update will be
-
I’m looking to run my old Phoenix Guard models in the new Cities book and after spending a fair bit of time exploring Phoenicium i’m left feeling underwhelmed.
They seem like an ideal retinue for an Anointed on foot but i’m struggling to find a good home for that in any of the other Cities. Has anyone figured out a good build for an Anointed general with a Phoenix Guard retinue outside of Phoenicium?
I’m keen to hear any other general thoughts on useful synergies for Phoenix Guard.
AoS 2 - Living City Discussion
in Cities of Sigmar
Posted
Both of these are going to really struggle to take / hold an objective. This is a game where you want a minimum of two 20+ size units imho. Drop a big character or two and get some bodies on the board.