[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

1 hour ago, Gistradagis said:

That being?

 

Marauders, marauders, and marauders  

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

I think the biggest gripe for me when I’m choosing to run a God Book vs S2D allegiance is the fact that if you aren’t wholly within 12”/18” of a character, you gain ZERO benefit from the primary allegiance ability, the Mark Aura system.  Yes, you still benefit from your sub-allegiance abilities, but the other book’s units gain both.

Tzeentch warriors in DoT book get destiny dice regardless of character location and if you’re Host Duplicitous enemies can’t retreat within 3” for example.

slaanesh Marauders always explode 6s (and explode better) and get +1 charge for being Godseekers...

I Feel that S2D is supposed to be the “Undivided” book, and the Mark system and auras is great if you don’t want to play the god books...but the Undivided portion of the book should be loads stronger and worth taking.  Honestly, the pints of the units is great, because of the god-book abilities make them stronger, but the S2D allegiance abilities are weaker and not on par with the other books.  It should read something more like, “all units get a mark, and here’s your buff for taking that mark.  If you are within range of hero, he’s your secondary buff.  If you are within range of the general, here’s your tertiary/best possible buff!”

[New StD player questions]

18 hours ago, SoSoCho said:

Also you would not recommend Archaon as my general ? I was thinking of going as "Host of the everchosen" as legion to get the 18" aura and the no battlechock.  I know my army doesnt have varanguard so would it be an awfull choice for me to pick the "host..." legion  with my current army setup ?

Best regards

I find HoE as a great option.  You get the battleshock immunity on the entire battlefield as long as the big guy is alive, Will if the Everchosen (RR hits/wounds of 1) picks an enemy unit and everyone who attacks them gets the rerolls and it’s anywhere in the battlefield again...and Dark Prophecy is just a mind f**k ability against your opponent...I love HoE!  
if you do run HoE and Archaon is the a General (which he should be), you can’t select a general trait and there are no artifacts...however, you can still use Malign Sorcery...so pop an Ethereal Amulet on that Deamon Prince so he’s always saving on 3+!!

[STD Daemon Prince Aura of Slaanesh rules interaction?]

9 hours ago, Climb said:

Yea, that makes the most sense to me. I'd love to see the faq if you or anyone else can remember which one it is!

Thanks, though!

No, the attacks would have both effects...

so, assume you had 1 attack and that attack was a natural 6.  Per the sword rules, you would get 2 MW, and the sequence would end for that attack.  You also get another dice to roll a wound with, because your initial attack  spiked another attack

Q: Sometimes a dice roll will trigger an effect. For example, a weapon might have a rule that says a hit roll of 6 causes two hits on the target instead of 1. What happens if another effect applies to the same roll? For example, the weapon from the previous example might have a rule that says it inflicts D6 mortal wounds on a hit roll of 6 and the attack sequence ends – would I get to inflict two hits that each inflicted D6 mortal wounds?
A: When a dice roll triggers more than one effect, each effect is triggered once. For this example, this means that the hit roll would cause two hits, but only one of the hits would inflict D6 mortal wounds (you would carry out the rest of the attack procedure for the other hit normally).

 

lastly, sword of judgement on a Slaanesh demon prince is awesome because you get +1 to hit when you charge and sword of Judgement is a 6+ meaning it’s affected by modifiers (in this case it would do d6 MW on a 5 or 6 if your DP charges. ) 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

-2 rend is amazing!  They aren’t the toughest unit, but they do decimate a target and then get to move on.  Key is screening, like all of your powerfully punching units

[Playing after being tabled]

Since we are in this topic of being tabled: let’s say you are playing a battle plan like Total Conquest where you score at the end of your turn the number of objectives your hold.  
My opponent tables me top of turn 4, and we both have had 2 objectives the entire game.  He did not take my 2 objectives on top of turn 4.  Bottom of turn 4, do I score the two objectives I held previously, even if I’m tabled?  

Or would those points disappear into the eather and no one scores them??

this is purely hypothetical this hasn’t happened to me, but the discussion got me thinking  

[New StD player questions]

Of course!

[New StD player questions]

10 hours ago, SoSoCho said:

Ah ty

regarding the daemon prince. I did not mean that he (daemon P) gets to attack twice. In the combat phase he gets to attack first (only fights one time) and then I can pick another unit after that ? (So I get to attack with 2 different units before my opponent? ). Its just I think I saw it played like that by MWG at youtube. 

Correct, he gets to fight first, in the “Start of the Combat Phase” phase.
If it’s your turn, at the Start of the Combat Phase, the DP will attack.  Then it would be your turn to select a model to attack.  If you have a Chaos Lord nearby, you could technically spend a cp to make him fight again.

if it’s your opponents turn, your DP would attack, then your opponent would select a unit to attack.

Lastly, to answer the Archaon question... he would benefit from both the primary and secondary ability of whichever buff the Warshrine casts.  The Warshrine rolls a 3+, and then gets to select a buff to place on a targeted unit.  Since Archaon has all of the god keywords, he benefits from both parts of the buff ability.

[New StD player questions]

4 hours ago, SoSoCho said:

 

4) i was thinking of makint this army:

Archaon (general)

Chaos sorc on manticore

Lord on karadrak

Daemon prince

Bloodsecrator (ally)

15x chaos warriors

2x5 chaos knight

Warshrine

Does that look viable or is it trash ?

Best regards

Looks like a great start to an army, but need a bit more, like, what sub-allegiance?  If you have a ton of marauders/marauder horsemen/warcry factions, you could run Ravagers...if not, I’d recommend Despoilers as with the DP as your General you’ll get extra FNP, Heals, a general trait to love d3 units 5” before game starts, and monsters can heal too aka Archaon.

fyi even though you take the mark of Khorne on Archaon, when you buff him with the Warshrine, archaon gets both primary and secondary buff from all the mark buffs.  Aka, you give him the Nurgle buff, he will get RR wound attacks and gets +1 save 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

1 hour ago, Gistradagis said:

I'd also run the Marauders as Slaanesh, then. They are a kamikaze unit, so I wouldn't recommend to try and give them the FNP aura, because it'll hardly be worth it. I'd also recommend against going down to 20. This would mean that losing a single unit already takes away their rend (for 20+ models), and the unit WILL lose a number of models every time anything targets them, FNP or no FNP. Just as an example, I ran them as Khorne and managed to cast Mask of Darkness, so I teleported them behind enemy lines and charged in a super-spread thin line. I hit a hero, a unit of stalkers, and some mortek guards. Killed the hero and some guards, and left a Stalker with 1 wound left (he had put them on the defensive). Then, on the counter, he killed like 14 Marauders. As I was running them as 40, however, that still gave me a really strong attack the following turn, while a unit of 20 would already be almost decimated and lose all their bonuses.

If you could get some points sacrificing stuff, it would be amazing to get a Daemon Prince in there. Put it as Slaanesh to get the full benefit of an 18" aura of an aggressive mark, and have him be a combat monster that kills a bunch of stuff and is difficult to bring down (with its 3+, 5+, heal on your turn). You could also give it a General Trait, then, such as Bolstered by Hate (+2 Wounds to model) or Paragon of Ruin (before first round, D3 of your units can move up to 5").

At least that's how I feel, but I haven't had that much experience with the army yet, so perhaps I'm missing something key and your idea's more solid than mine.

So the reason I’m keeping them undivided (for a few more test games at least) is 2 fold...

1) as a kamikaze unit, if I buff them with the Warshrines undivided buff, they get reroll hits/wounds AND battle shock immunity, which I think battleshock immune is key when teleporting then away from a heroes aura,  even a generals.

2) if I go second against an alpha list, they’re deployed in both the Warshrines Aura range and Be’lakors range so they get 2 6+ FNP. 
 

ive only played 3 games with the list (different battallion not pleasurebound), but for me, it’s synergizing well.  I plan to play a lot of S2D this year, but am by no means a top player, just want to make the time work after all the scepticism (myself included) 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

7 minutes ago, Gistradagis said:

I had the same idea and I do believe it might have some potential, although only if you really dive super deep into Undivided. The only problem I see is this: StD is already a bit on the weaker side when it comes to damage. By running pure Undivided, you sacrifice the potential for strength for a 6+ FNP. Be'Lakor becomes nearly indestructible... but he's not THAT strong individually; he's great as a support unit, throwing and dispelling spells, using his Dark Master ability, etc. but he doesn't deal too much damage. I played a game of like 1.5k points of Undivided, and it felt very underwhelming.

I'd personally be interested in a Despoilers list that runs Chaos Lord on Karkadrak (he really does *** people up) with a bunch of DPs, Be'Lakor, and then some cavalry for a ruinbringers warband. A super aggressive list that looks to charge head-first into battle and destroy everything, or even more control-y with your troops' superior mobility.

No, I only run Be’lakor and 1 unit of marauders as undivided, rest is Slaanesh.  I’ll add the potential Pleasurebound list, as I think it has play against cities, Tzeentch and shooty skaven because of the Spellportal/demon fire rift combo. 
my other thought is to drop the 40man marauders down to a 20man unit and add either palisades/balewind and 2nd Sorc Lord/great bray shaman for the Scorpian “Get over here!” Spell  

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

23 minutes ago, Gistradagis said:

Yes, you 100% can. It's a bit of a "waste" since you are forced to run Undivided as your General's aura with him, and can take neither Trait nor Artefact with him, as you say.

 

Well, finally did a "real" 2k points game with StD against Ossiarch and I have to say that it was what I expected, mostly. Chaos Knights feel right, although I would never run them with lances unless you're 100% sure you can get at least 3 charges with them in the game. Warriors are... bland? Unreliable? As most people comment, they need to either be more resilient or, what would be 100% better, cost a bit more and have some rend on their basic weapons. Right now you pretty much must run a unit of 15+, they are slow, deal no damage, and will nevertheless die to anything with rend.

Daemon Princes (and Be'Lakor) and Marauders did some real work, though. Even playing against Ossiarch, the Marauders on charge are just great, and the DPs are great overall for whatever you might need them. My general was a DP with the amulet artefact, meaning he had a 3+ (ignore rend), followed with a 5+ FNP. It tanked a unit of 20 mortek guards (what's this stupid unit even) and Katakros the entire game.

I ended up winning thanks to points, but I certainly saw the army's main weaknesses, and why the most prominent complain is that we are sort of a jack of all trades army, but slightly below average. While I kinda disagree with the last, it is true that you need a very solid list. An unefficient StD list will fall through extremely fast.

So, I just started putting real thought into a despoilers list and I use Be’lakor as the general.  With a Warshrine, Be’lakor as Despoiler General gets the following saves: 4+ unmodified armor save, 5+ Despoilers General FNP, 6+ Undivided General FNP, 6+ Warshrine Aura!!  And, he heals d3 every hero phase and every time a unit fails a battle shock.  
I ran him with a 40block of marauders marked Undivided, and the rest of the army Slaanesh.  
also, Karkadrak Fs things so hard when you give it -3 rend on his main weapon.  I ran him in Godsworn and he’s awesome attacking potentially 3 times.  Although now I’m looking at Pleasurebound for the extra 3” pile in.

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

I’m planning on running a Slaanesh mortal list and include 1 40 man block of Marauders.

i don’t want to give the Marauders the mark of Slaanesh, because I don’t think it’s more effective than say, Nurgle due to the Warshrine buff, and the ability to auto charge off of teleport and block units.

the question is, in a roll such as holding units in place and being buffed by both Sorc Lord for RR saves and Warshrine prayer...would it be better to mark the Marauders as Nurgle for +1 save or to Mark them Undivided to do a little more damage on the charge AND be battle shock immune??  
 

my initial thought is Nurgle, but I’m seeing the benefits of undivided maybe a better option.  My list is:

Despoilers: be’lakor (General), Slaanesh Sorc Lord, Slaanesh Chaos Lord, Slaanesh Karkadrak -3 rend weapon(battalion), 2x 5 marauder horsemen Slaanesh, 10 knights with lances slaanesh, 40 marauders, Warshrine, demonrift, extra CP, Godswrath Battallion.

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

5 minutes ago, JangutzKhan said:

What do you guys think is the best Nurgle support units to ally into our lists? 

Harbinger casts a FNP

Lord of Blight can do Plague of Flies giving you avoidance against shooting (and melee for blocks of Marauders)

Epidemius against horde armies is cool 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

Played my first games today with the new book (local RTT 3 games), and it had its ups and downs...ended up 8th out of 13th, buuuut should have won my game 2 and didn’t due to time.  All in all, the book is AWESOME FUN!! 

I ran HoE: 6th circle, Archy (Nurgle) 1 Unit Nurgle Varanguard, Sorc on Manticore, Chaos Lord of Slaanesh, 2x5 Warriors, Eightfold Sigil, Extra Command point, Iron Golems, Warshrine

game 1 Three Places of Power vs Nurgle: oddly enough, got paired against my brother in law >.<  he ran new marauders, glottkin, plaguebearers, 2x3 drones, harbingers, tallyband.  His list was mostly fluffy...and I got up to the objectives turn 1 with Archaon and Manticore, held them for 3 turns and kept his heroes away.  He made a TON of FNP saves...so the game lasted longer than it should have  he conceded at end of turn 3 due to not having scored any objective points.

round 2 vs Skaven - Shifting Objectives:

opponent had 200 clan rats, Bell, one of the big vermin lords, and 2 types or something of grey seers, geminids, palisades, suffocating graveside.  I gave him first turn, he moved up all his rats and scored all 3 objectives.  I rolled a 3 on Prophecy  but still managed to roll over almost 70 clanrats.  He went first turn 2 and got off the bells -1 hit, gemenids, and another spell that gave his unit -1 to hit. He got the 2 side objectives, but one was the primary so he went up in points.  My turn 2, the minuses to hit really hurt, but I kept hitting 6s to wound and Archy attacked twice from Chaos Lord...again, almost 70ish rats died.  

Worst part of this game, turn 3 I get priority, but we only have 10 mins left for time (got slow played)  I wipe his last unit of rats and am holding all 3 objectives.  He finally moves his verminlord up to middle objective and wipes the 5 man warriors, but Archaon is close enough to keep the objective.  He has just verminlord, Bell, and both smaller heroes...and I have Warshrine, Archaon, Varanguard, 5 Warriors left, all at full HP and turn priority from Prophecy.  Had we had 10 more mins to play turns 4 & 5, I would have won. But such is life! Sooooooo much offensive power against the rats! 

Game 3 vs Fyreslayers...can’t remember mission, but the 8 objectives, burn on turn 2, and short board length.  Never played against Fyreslayers, had no clue that Hearthguard could jump priority and attack TWICE before you get a go...needless to say, I charged Archaon, Varanguard and Chaos Lord into 20 zerkers and after 3 turns of 5 combats, 7 zerkers and his giant axe leader stood over the above and then proceeded to eat the Warshrine and Iron Golems...he rolled sooooo many FNP rolls, but apparently that’s what they do  fun match with a great opponent.  

Had a great day with the new book, and feel that I had the opportunity to go 3-0 if not for round 2.  Such is life, but i won best painted!!!  So had a great day!  Now to finalize the paint jobs on Warshrine and Varanguard before LVO

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

5 hours ago, Utforskarn said:

This is what I thought as well when reading the rules. But the wording still makes it feel a bit unclear if it is refering to auras or the mark itself, hence my question. 
I can see some good arguments for both sides, but so far I’m leaning towards your interpretation.  

Yah, I originally read it as he only got 1 aura and the same god buffs and nothing else...but read a lot of discussions About it coming to the same conclusion that he buffs 1 aura and doesn’t lose his keywords.

i play my first games tomorrow with the new book at a local tourney, so super excited!! 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

2 hours ago, Forrix said:

If this is the passage you all are referring to on Archaon (I don't have my book with me) then that explicitly refers to only one Aura of Chaos if a unit has more than one Mark of Chaos.

Correct!  Archaon would have to choose which aura he produces.  However, it doesn’t say that he then loses his other god mark keywords.  Hence, other heroes of those additional gods would still confer the bonus onto Archaon due to him having the matching keywords. 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

20 hours ago, TALegion said:

The book says:

"If you select a unit with more than one Mark of Chaos keyword to be part of your army, you must pick which one will apply to that unit for the duration of the battle."

I interpreted that as meaning that Archaon can still only choose to be one mark and be affected by one mark. So, in this case, he could not be Khorne and be affected by the aura of a Tzeentch sorcerer.

So, the section about the Marks that you are referring to is specifically talking about about the Subjects (specific hero) Mark that he produces (Aura).  When you have multiple marks, you must select one to use as your AURA.

So, you have a hero unit, and that bro selects a mark of Khorne, and that mark then becomes an aura that has a range of 12” which grants reroll hits.  If that bro is your general, the aura he has also grants +1 W.   That aura affects any  S2D unit that has the same god KEYWORD that the hero bro has.  So, in this example, Bro’s aura affects Chaos Warriors marked with Khorne, Knights marked Khorne, Archaon, but not Slaanesh Chosen.

Now, Archaon chooses Khorne as his Mark AURA, and produces the same affect as above to the Warriors, Knights, himself and The Hero Bro, but not to the Slaanesh Chosen, even though Archaon has the Slaanesh KEYWORD, he chose to produce the AURA MARK of Khorne.

A Sorcerer Sis chooses to be marked Slaanesh when you set her up on the battlefield.  As a S2D hero, she too has an AURA that affects units with the same mark: Slaanesh.  Sis’ AURA affects the Slaanesh Chosen and Archaon (because he never lost his Slaanesh KEYWORD), but does not affect Bro, Warriors or Knights because they only have the Khorne KEYWORD.

im sure this will show up when they release the S2D FAQ after a few weeks, and it will shine some light, but this is how I and a lot of my tourney friends interpret  the rule.  

this is why the Warshrine is so powerful with Archaon...the Warshrine prayer doesn’t care what mark the Warshrine is.  When you select a unit to target with the Warshrines prayer, the target gets the first bonus, and receives the second bonus if the targeted unit has the same keyword as the prayer.  Aka. Archaon always receives both buffs from the Warshrine.

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

So, one thing I haven’t seen in either thread (unless I missed it)....

What spell do people think will benefit Archaon the most?  

My list is Archy, Varanguard, Sorc, Warshrine and Warriors.  

I was thinking either the Teleport or Attack last spells, but not sure which will be more beneficial. 

Thoughts?  

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

1 hour ago, Smooth criminal said:

+1 damage because you hit very weak otherwise. You will have to use teleport and gaunt horde killing spell to counter screens.

Just be careful on the teleport...you want to be sure you stay within range of Archaon’s Aura as well...luckily he has such a huge base and an extended aura (18”) though.  

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness 2 Discussion]

1 hour ago, Spears said:

Looking at the fight again abilities on the lord and varanguard it seems that to use them the unit must be withing 3' of an enemy before they pile in a second time, is this also true for other factions double fight mechanics?

Yes, the Keeper of Secrets ability is 12” within KoS and 3” of enemy model.

Not sure on other attack twice mechanics like the FEC or Grave Guard abilities though, but I’m certain it’s similar.  

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

3 minutes ago, Charleston said:

Quite. Khorne Judgements are their own section in the Khorne Alligience. Meanwhile, Endless Spells are not regulated in such a manner. The only restriction is usualy a keyword binding within the spell itself, which can be fullfilled in another alligience.

This is correct.  It’s why you’ll see a Stormcast Wizard in any order army slinging the comet.

someone mentioned though that you need to have the “ally points” available if you bring the endless spell too...is this true??

example:  I’ve got 340 points of stormcast in my KO army, and I want the comet.  Am I allowed to purchase the Comet or no because it will put me over my 400 point ally max??

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

8 minutes ago, kozokus said:

Can you all elaborate why you thing Nurgle is superior to, lets say, Khorne or Slaanesh?

In my opinion, I feel that it helps your unit both offensively and defensively.  

With the Hero Aura, you get 6s do +1 dmg and -1 to hit with shooting.

with Warshrine you get the first ability no matter what, ReRoll ALL wounds (so you fish for 6s), and if the unit is Nurgle you get +1 save.

with the Plaguetouched Warband, you get the 6s bounce back MWs.

overall, I’d consider Nurgle to give the best benefits in this book, followed by Slaanesh, and then the other 3 are truely army flavor specific.  

 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

27 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:

<undivided ^^ (or Slaanesh/Tzeentch)

I’m in the Undivided train myself, but the Nurgle abilities are just too good!  Especially the army build I want to run, really no need for battleshock immunity 

[AoS 2 - Slaves to Darkness / Darkoath Discussion]

4 minutes ago, Smooth criminal said:

Wait, are shrine's available prayers not dependent on marks?

So you technically can have you Khorne marked shrine buff a Nurgle unit with a Undivided prayer (full reroll). Sure, you won't get second bonus, but who cares when Undivided is already full reroll and Tzeentch one is reroll saves, that's all you need really.

Correct.  The wording has changed, and unless it’s FAQd, then the Warshrine can cast any buff it wants, regardless of its personal mark