oggurt_da_bog_zombie

If in the new STD book there is a way to make the new Ogroids and/or the new Chaos Legionnaires battleline, I might actually try something like this (altho probably not that many Fomoroids) with Bela'Kor, Eternus, Ogroids (Myrm and the new unit), Legionnaires, and Fomoroids. 🤣 Can't wait for the new STD book!

Yep, I really want to get to the Tarantulos Brood and terrain from the new box set but... oh man so many things to paint, so little time.

As an owner of a bunch of Underworlds warbands, the new Tome of Champions is pretty exciting. Been trying to come up with lists that thematically "finish" each Underworld warband (or at least the ones I own), basically it seems like those warbands are coming up between 500-700 points, so usually get a few hundred points to spare. Seeing if I can make an all Vampires warband work, or getting a few BoC models to get Gnashraks warband in, has been fun. I really like my Khagra's Ravagers warband: Khagra the Usurper - 200 (Leader) Chaos Lord - 240 (Hero) Dour Cragan - 140 Razek Godblessed - 145 Zarshia Bittersoul - 140 Chaos Marauder w/ Barbarian Flail - 55 Chaos Marauder w/ Barbarian Flail - 55 Total: 975 Pts It's low on bodies but can't wait to play it more. The Chaos Lord is an absolute beast, the rest of the gang can't really be shifted either, Zarshia is useful, and the Marauders are great too for 55 pts!

Agree with everything here, and I'd add that its sorta the ultimate setup for a NPE "gotcha" moment. New(ish) player comes to the first tourney/matched play game and isn't aware of this rules update or doesn't have the of priority targets committed to memory, they setup their freshly painted unit -- that happens to be on the priority list -- and their opponent who is very aware of these rules goes after it. Opponent manages to kill the priority target early in the game, and then says "I get an extra VP (or two, if it was reinforced or a Mega) because I killed your priority target" and the new player is like... "what have I done to deserve this!?". I for one am not good at memorizing things like this, and can imagine being very unhappy if you get "gotcha'ed" in a competitive play setting. If this new priority target rule is here to stay forever, its yet another thing all players are expected to be updated on by... waiting every few months and downloading the latest PDF?

Somehow missed this thread, as a big LoB fan I've had a great time with the new WD stuff, it certainly gives LoB an edge. This is the list I ran at a big tournament: Neferata and The Blood Cartel Allegiance: Soulblight Gravelords - Lineage: Legion of Blood - Mortal Realm: Ghur - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery - Triumphs: Bloodthirsty Leaders Neferata, Mortarch of Blood (365)* - Lore of the Deathmages: Overwhelming Dread Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (435)** - General - Deathlance - Command Trait: Premeditated Violence - Artefact: Soulbound Garments - Expertise: Martial - Mount Trait: Foetid Miasma - Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon Vampire Lord (140)* - Expertise: Arcane - Lore of the Vampires: Amethystine Pinions Battleline 5 x Black Knights (100)** 5 x Black Knights (100)** 10 x Deathrattle Skeletons (85)** Units 5 x Blood Knights (195)* 5 x Blood Knights (195)* 20 x Grave Guard (280)* - Great Wight Blades - Reinforced x 1 Endless Spells & Invocations Suffocating Gravetide (50) Chronomantic Cogs (45) Core Battalions *Battle Regiment **Battle Regiment Total: 1990 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 1 / 4 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 111 Drops: 2 The list certainly has problems but the new WD updates and drop in black knight costs gave it a competitive edge. I only went 1-4 at the tournament but had I had a bit better luck I think I could have gone 3-2. This list was able to win against a very tough HotEc Archaon + Varanguard list, but I got brutalized by a Thunderlizards shooting list and lost a tough match against the only other Legion of Blood player in the whole tournament. Then I had a very close game against Ossiarch Bonereapers but rolled super badly in some key situations. Even with the Arcane trait I barely got any spells of with Arkhan running around, and then my VLoZD whiffed on killing ~6 Mortek Guard I needed for taking an objective and getting broken ranks, so I blame this loss on luck. Finally lost against a LotFP list with a GUO who had the ridiculous Fourfold Blade + Nurgling thing and did 18 MWs against my VLoZD (opponent didn't explain the crazy rules interaction until too late) which basically cost me the game. The strengths here are obviously Neferata, Blood Knights, and super fast Black Knight chaff that I use to soak up unleash hell to get my knights and GG in safely. The decrease in points allowed me to fit in the Chronomantic Cogs, which combined with the Vamp Lord on foot casting bonus, I'm able to more reliably bring GG out of the grave and into combat right away (assuming a re-roll charge via CP, its a likely chance to get an 8+ to make a GG charge). The weakness is obvious, bodies and dealing with heavy shooting. Trying to play a more "elite" Soulblight list in anything but Kastelei is really tough. Successful Soulblight lists usually have lots of bodies for taking objectives, whereas this list needs to kill things fast to hold objectives. The VLoZD is very swingy so theres a lot of risk in this list, but I've had success with this list outside the big tourney, and some more practice I think I'll be able to win more often. My opponent who happened to also be a LoB player ran a Vengorian Lord with Soulbound Garments on it, which was just an awesome idea I hadn't considered, so I might try swapping out the VLoZD for a Vengorian Lord at some point and seeing if I can get more bodies into the list too. Anyway, LoB is certainly worth looking at now, although Vyrkos still seems to be the more flexible subfaction for competitive play.

Thanks, my VT idea might work better with a VLoZD in Legion of Blood with Arcane battle trait and Soulbound Garments then. Admittedly I've really struggled against Mega Gargants before so I'm definitely over correcting a bit but I know I'll see them again at an upcoming tournament.

You've just outlined in detail all the fears I've had about my idea for experiments with VT. 🤣🤦‍♂️ Are Gatebreakers really that much more killy? I've faced many gargants but maybe I've lucked out and its usually Kraken Eaters and Warstompas, and didnt seem like they'd be able to take down an AoD'ed VLoZD. Regardless, seems like the safer bet might just be to go all in on damage output with Sangsyron and Flaming Weapon, it's certainly a solid load out.

Wanted to address a specific part of your list/comments: So I've been thinking about this VLoZD loadout a lot lately... and I might instead try arcane tome and vile transference. Don't get me wrong, Sangsyron and Flaming Weapon are awesome, and I also would make the VLoZD the general for either Pack Alpha or Hunters Snare, but I've been thinking about an alternative route. The idea is the VLoZD is by far the unit most likely to be in combat for like... the entire game. That means close range. For most low wound models, an 3"/D3 arcane bolt can be effective, and for high wound models (Maw Krusha's, Mega Gargants, any hero monster really), Vile Transference seems like it could be pretty deadly (I think the sweet spot would be around 8+ wounds, VT is more effective), and with Locus of Shyish sorta a nuclear bomb scenario against of Mega Gargant. Of course, you could just take Vile Transference and still take Sangsyron, but I'm thinking of taking the Arcane Tome as well to cast Mystic Shield, Arcane Bolt, or VLoZDs warscroll spell (seems useful if only for the longish range) too. With Vyrkos re-rolls to cast, seems potentially more deadly against high wound models than the normal Flaming Weapon and Sangsyron combo, and against low wound models the VLoZD is probably doing enough damage anyway. Of course, this makes even more sense if you're taking Hunters Snare and parking the VLoZD on an objective the whole game (and therefore, less utility from charge bonuses). Something to think about, I have a list in mind very similar to yours but with wolves and Radukar the Beast, but the VLoZD playing a similar role.

Question for those here running cultist heavy lists, Idolators, etc. Has anyone ever experimented with a big block of Scions of the Flame for flame pot tossing? The exploding 6s on the pot throwing makes it almost seems meme-list worthy to have a reinforced unit of them, maybe add in the shrine rerolls or Daemonic Power buff to fish for more 6s. Math hammer-wise, the damage is there, but obviously the problem is the 8" range which means no mask of darkness yeeting them across the board to then shoot in the following phase. If the Scions could move a bit faster to get into shooting position then they seem pretty good, but the 6" move with the 8" flame pot range seems to be the main limitation.

Ya, I've put it on a mounted Wight King and had some success. Ring of Dominion is alright so I usually alternate between the two, no favorite yet. If RoD went off on a 4+ instead of a 5+, I think it would be a lot better. Question that I'm not sure I've seen answered here. In the new AoS app, the most recent update makes it so the LoB battle trait is a choice for the entire army, not individual lords. I.e. according to AoS app, all VL and VLoZD share the same martial or arcane trait choice, and you can't for example make the VLoZD martial and a VL arcane. My reading of the rule seems it's a per unit choice and not army wide, and also happens to be how the Battlescribe repo guys interpreted it. Thoughts on the correct intent of the rule?

Ya, I thought the same thing, and still sort of do... but I did lurk over to /TG/ and the post was specifically responding to a question about FAQ changes to the chaos factions. Although why they wouldn't take the time to just outline the changes in the FAQ to everything... makes it seem pretty fake. I just want Black Knights to not be garbage.

I'm also pretty skeptical on the Necromancer (as we've chatted about in the main Soulblight thread), particularly because if he can't get Vanhel's to go off, he's basically useless. Soulblight has so many other better casters, so really just need the Necromancer to cast Vanhel's or one of his debuffs (or both if you give him the Arcane Tome). One thing I'm going to experiment with is running the Necromancer with an Unholy Lodestone Corpse Cart, big block of zombies, and a unit of Grave Guard. The Corpse Cart is there for the +1 to cast and giving the zombies a 6+ save, and the zombies are obviously to help keep the Necromancer alive and provide a big screen. Then I'd almost always put the Grave Guard in reserve and pop them out at a Grave Site within 18" of the Necromancer, and then in the next hero phase, cast Vanhel's on the GG. That being said, the Vampire Lord is usually more reliable for buffing up Grave Guard. As I've probably said before, Vanhel's on GG is great but a lot of times GG end up fighting something that can hit back really hard, so after losing a bunch of models, their second attack can be kinda wimpy. The Vamp Lord's CA makes that first attack hit real hard, especially in Vyrkos. My issue with the Vampire Lord is he is an easy snipe and MW target, whereas the Necromancer can shrug wounds to his zombie buddies. So lately I've been trying to make a Necromancer work again. Maybe I'm just overly paranoid as there seems to be a ton of shooting in my local, but I go back and forth on the Necromancer or Vampire Lord topic all the time. Obviously I could just run both, but at 125 and 140 points, it almost always seems better to make one or the other work, and spend those points on more GG or other battleline.

Probably Vyrkos. Welcome to the vampire club 🧛‍♂️.

Looking for thoughts/feedback on a Nagash and Vyrkos Dynasty Deadwalkers list. Allegiance: Soulblight Gravelords - Lineage: Vyrkos Dynasty - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery - Triumphs: Nagash, Supreme Lord of the Undead (970) Necromancer (125)* - General - Command Trait: Spoor Trackers - Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact) - Lore of the Deathmages: Decrepify Gorslav the Gravekeeper (75)* Belladamma Volga, First of the Vyrkos (200)* - Lore of the Vampires: Vile Transference 40 x Deadwalker Zombies (230)* - Reinforced x 1 20 x Deadwalker Zombies (115)* 10 x Dire Wolves (135)* 1 x Corpse Cart with Unholy Lodestone (80)* Umbral Spellportal (70) *Battle Regiment Total: 2000 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 1 / 4 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 123 Drops: 2 The basic idea is the Necromancer (along with Gorslav) hangs with the zombies and corpse cart, gives the zombies the 3" move in the hero phase from Spoor Tracker, then gets 2 spell casts from arcane tome, one of which will almost certainly be invigorating aura to heal zombies, and the other either a debuff, mystic shield etc. With the additional heal from Invocation of Nagash, hoping to keep the zombie pack(s) at full strength as long as possible. Corpse Cart gives the zombies a 6+ save and give the necromancer a bonus to cast, seems pretty good. Belladamma does what she does -- Lycancurse shooting threats -- with a unit of wolves to support and harass. Nagash does what Nagash does, and is obviously the main threat and damage dealer. Gorslav is arguably not necessary but if a unit of zombies or the wolves go down, I'd like to be able to bring them back if the Endless Legions roll fails. Seems pretty good to me but I haven't played much Vyrkos or used any Zombie mobs so looking for feedback or tweaks I can make. An alternative I've considered is dropping the unit of 20 zombies and spell portal for a second unit of Dire Wolves (and a cheaper endless spell, probably the gravetide), but I think the Spell Portal is a decent threat, and the 20x zombies unit gives the Necromancer/Gorslav a bit more protection since they'll have more bodies around them (as they'd be too slow to keep up with wolves).

Watch GW use the same reasoning to again FAQ the Darkoath Warqueen/Chieftain so that they can no longer take a Mark of Chaos anymore. 😅

Nice find, thanks for sharing. Pretty ****** to be honest, but I'm assuming the intent is they didn't want these to be ran as battle-line. Seems like a pretty big oversight to give Darkoath Warqueen / Chieftain the ability to take a mark, but not the Darkoath Savager unit. If the intent was just to make it so Darkoath Savagers couldn't be battleline... seems like this could be handled in a StD FAQ, something like "Darkoath units can take a Chaos Mark" and/or adding the "DARKOATH" keyword to the Warqueen/Chieftain's command ability affects.

I've been thinking about a similar list. So the thing with the Soulmason is that his warscroll spell is sorta a duplicate of the benefit from Nagash's CA, right? So I guess you're just taking the Soulmason for the double cast? But then again, you already have 8 spells from Nagash, and he has the entire lore so... maybe the Soulmason isn't the right choice? Full disclosure, I love the Soulmason model so I thought about including him too, but now I'm re-thinking it. I'm on the fence on the Gothizzar Harvester for my list, seems awesome and nice to have another monster, but I guess he's really there just to keep one of your Mortek blobs healed up, and I'd guess you're probably most concerned about your 20 man blob? So I've been thinking about a Boneshaper instead, but I'm not sure he's worth it since you already get some healing from Nagash, so now I'm thinking about taking a hammer-ish unit like Morghasts or Stalkers (probably leaning Morghast Harbringers for the 3D6 charge and seems like they might be slightly tougher), and maybe reinforcing them. Haven't looked at how the points fall but regardless, I'm struggling to figure out a Nagash OBR list I like!

Are the Warcry rules/fighter cards online anywhere yet? Also, any indication that we'll get Warcry rules for other Underworlds warbands? That would be... pretty awesome and fun, hopefully GW follows through here, as it would in theory drive demand for models for both games but... 🤷‍♂️

Ya, I've definitely run a variation of my list above where I have both the manticore sorc lord and on-foot sorc lord. The players I've played against have generally been clever enough to go after the Chaos Lord or more often, go after the sorc lord (either version) so I don't have Oracular Visions anymore. This is sorta why I put the Amulet of Destiny on the manticore sorc lord, and also that I really don't know what else I'd put on him, so the marginal benefit of the 5+ ward makes sense for when my opponent does go after him (especially with battle tactics like Bring it Down, the manticore is easier than Archaon to kill), or when I have him in combat. For the Chaos Lord, since there isn't really another better artefact to take than the Arcane Tome, if I don't want to go for the teleport trick, I could put the Amulet of Destiny on the Chaos Lord and try to fit this in a battle regiment or something. However, I like having Hunters of the Heartlands so trying to win the drops game seems like a stretch. The Mutalith in that above list is really for fun, I think theres an argument to be made to run a Warshrine instead, but I don't like the model so I roll with the Mutalith or could swap it for the on-foot sorc lord, and maybe a better endless spell than the Burning Head.

It's pretty easy to fit in both lords. I don't have a ton of experience running Archaon, but the few times I did I ran both, and the Oracular Visions ability is just so, so helpful. You get to save Mystic Shield/All out Defense for other key units, and Archaon on a 2+ Save re-rolling 1's just from having a lil sorc lord following him around is worth it. Or, take a Sorc Lord w/ Manticore, way easier to keep up with Archaon if you can fly too! I'm on the fence about giving the Chaos Lord the Arcane Tome but it sorta seems required if you want to pull off the Spurred by the Gods trick with Archaon. I'm getting real excited to run some variation of this list now that Iron Golems can be battleline if they share the mark with the general: Allegiance: Slaves to Darkness - Damned Legion: Host of the Everchosen (Sixth Circle) - Mortal Realm: Ghur - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery - Triumphs: Bloodthirsty Archaon the Everchosen (830)* - General - Aura of Chaos: Tzeentch - Spell: Call to Glory Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore (270)* - Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact) - Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch - Spell: Ruinous Vigour Chaos Lord (120)* - Reaperblade & Daemonbound Steel - Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact) - Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch - Spell: Mask of Darkness 3 x Varanguard (280)** - Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch 16 x Iron Golems (150)** - Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch - Reinforced x 1 16 x Iron Golems (150)** - Mark of Chaos: Tzeentch - Reinforced x 1 Mutalith Vortex Beast (175)* The Burning Head (20) *Warlord **Hunters of the Heartlands Artefact Total: 1995 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 2 / 4 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 98 Drops: 7

Ya, it's a concern but I've sorta just succumbed to the fact that since Soulblight battleline are sorta flimsy but (re)summonable, they are going to die and thats okay, and so having difficulty preventing an opponent from getting Broken Ranks is sorta a tradeoff. Opponents are just going to take Broken Ranks when any of Soulblight's battleline are close to being killed and have a pretty easy time getting it (but yes, agree that Black Knights are by far the easiest). All out Def or Mystic Shield on Black Knights is probably a waste but could work, and obviously Nef's CA if she is nearby is helpful too. On the other hand, I think I've had a ton of success when opponents take Slay the Warlord or Bring It Down and aren't able to finish off a WK general with all sorts of melee defense buffs, or can't kill a VLoZD with Soulbound Garments. Everything is a tradeoff I suppose.

Ya, so I have both Black and Blood Knights in my list, so depending on the situation I could try pulling this off with either combo, or on an especially large blob unit, can do this with both! I've mostly given up on the bravery bomb for now as I have Coalesced Thunderlizards (cant modify bravery) and HotEc Archaon (ignore battleshock) in my local meta (as I'm sure many of us do), so messing with battleshock isn't that high priority, and the basic Battleshock shenanigans are fairly useful against normal lists anyway. I have been able to beat both TL and Archaon but it... wasn't easy. Getting the full 20 model GG unit into combat is the key tactic, and I've done that by keeping things like the Bastilodon or Archaon wasting time fighting trash like the Black Knights while the GG get into position. I think the WK on Steed is great, does alright damage and mortals on the charge, and so I've opted for keeping him alive with the Aura of Dark Majesty, and going to try out the ring of dominion on him to see if that boosts his damage a bit. His 3+ base save is pretty nice too!

Re: Amulet vs Soulbound, ya I flop back and forth on this one. I'm already getting the 6+ ward via Deathless Minions and so I've trended towards getting to a 2+ via the Soulbound Garments so I don't have to spend CP / Spells on the VLoZD and can get a second unit, like the WK or Nef, down to a 2+, but I can see an argument for using the Amulet instead, as you are totally right that LoB (or just Soulblight in general) are still pretty weak to MWs even with the 6+ Deathless Minions. Re: Nef, I don't see why the hero slay ability wouldn't work if Nef dies later in the combat phase... Doesn't say so in the rules, and it makes sense lore wise (i.e. its a "vampiric" blade and the damage to the hero is already done 🤷‍♂️). Re: Allegiance abilities, ya I'm thinking this is the case too, I think Favoured Retainers will be more useful as more AoS tomes come out. Re: Black Knights, ya I think they are mostly useful for soaking up shooting damage and tying up shooting units. I don't really rely on them for anything else, and the MWs are a nice bonus as a slightly wounded unit can be finished off by something else. I've only played DoK - Morathi once, but I'm pretty sure its only 3 wounds max a turn, not per phase, so I don't think it works out the way you described, but maybe I'm wrong? Completely agree about Belladamma, doubt it ever changes. I'll run a Vyrkos army with her but I'm sticking to "canon" Legion of Blood list for now! Good luck!

Legion of Blood, finally a topic I have some insight on 😆 🧛‍♀️!! I love Neferata and the Legion of Blood lore, so I've been desperately trying to make a competitively viable LoB list, and have had some success. The basic idea is 1) Neferata is awesome, 2) VLoZD with Soulbound Garments is super tanky, so agree 100% with this analysis, and 3) The Wight King w/ Steed is a critical part of the army to get GG as Battleline and is a great tank too! The list hinges on getting into combat (ie. surviving hero/shooting phases), tanking things, and getting my heavy hitters into place (GG, Blood Knights, Nef). The strength of LoB seems to be in its artifacts more-so than its allegiance abilities, Favoured Retainers and/or Immortal Majesty rarely come up in my games, but when they do they are obviously more "bonuses" than "build-arounds". My go-to list: Allegiance: Soulblight Gravelords - Lineage: Legion of Blood - Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery - Triumphs: Leaders Neferata, Mortarch of Blood (365)* - Lore of the Vampires: Vile Transference Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (435)* - Deathlance - Artefact: Soulbound Garments - Lore of the Vampires: Amethystine Pinions Vampire Lord (140)* - Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon Necromancer (125)* - Lore of the Deathmages: Decrepify Wight King on Skeletal Steed (130)* - General - Command Trait: Aura of Dark Majesty - Artefact: Ring of Dominion Battleline 5 x Black Knights (120)** 20 x Grave Guard (280)** - Great Wight Blades - Reinforced x 1 20 x Deathrattle Skeletons (170)** - Reinforced x 1 Units 5 x Blood Knights (195)* Endless Spells & Invocations Prismatic Palisade (40) Core Battalions *Warlord **Hunters of the Heartlands Additional Enhancements Artefact Total: 2000 / 2000 Reinforced Units: 2 / 4 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 108 Drops: 9 The learning so far is the Necromancer is sorta an unnecessary points sink. Vanhel's is obviously awesome, but what happens is I usually put my GG in a gravesite to pop them up nearby something I want them to kill, so the Necromancer usually can't reach them as he is usually hanging with the Deathrattle for the wound offloading, and Vanhel's on the Deathrattle is nice but maybe not worth the point-sink into the Necromancer. Instead, the CA from the Vampire Lord (on foot) is more useful as it helps the first attack from a GG or Deathrattle unit, as usually those units are wiped pretty quickly so a second attack in a phase from them is sometimes nullified by my opponent prioritizing those units in the combat phase. The problem with the Vamp Lord is its another CP sink, which I already have a bunch of with Nef and the WK! I'm considering dropping one of those heroes, likely the Necromancer, for more GG or something. I've been using Flaming Weapon on the Vamp Lord to try and make him a bit more of a heavy hitter but it hasn't been effective, so I might give him Amethystine Pinions instead to use after I've used it on the VLoZD in a previous hero phase. For the WK, I've given up on on the bravery bomb, and instead I give him Aura of Dark Majesty, and usually use Nef's Dark Mist on the WK too, and like to ram the WK into things to tank. I used to run the Oubliette Arcana on him, but I'm going to give the Ring of Dominion a try, as I already have a good amount of unbinds and I think I'll get more mileage out of the Ring. I'll also say that a unit of Black Knights are surprisingly useful, they fill a battle-line in LoB and make a great screen, as they have the effective 18" range and do mortals on the charge. I know people like Dire Wolves for this but the small point discount for Black Knights is nice, and they benefit from the LoB abilities. I've actually considered a second unit of Black Knights as having another speedy screen could help, but the way they points shake out, I'd almost certainly be better off taking a 10 man unit of GG instead. The issue with GG is that they are just so slow, and at least in my meta they'd probably just get shot off the table before being useful. Lastly, Nef is a real star🧛‍♀️. I've only gotten about 8ish games with this list in (and I'm probably 50% win rate but I'm also a new player, I think that will go up), and the hero kill ability has actually never worked out but just the threat of that ability is awesome (but also puts a big bullseye on Nef), and I almost pulled it off against Archaon! Dark Mist is spectacular, and her CA is really good too. Her 16" move is great for hopping over things and attacking back-line heroes and shooting units. The problem with Nef is keeping her alive as she is the preferred target for opponent hero/shooting phases. I've put Vile Transference on her now (I was trying out Deathmages lore spells before but wasn't getting much use out of them) which might help, and obviously killing stuff with Nef gives her the D6 heal which is fantastic. She's so good that I've considered dropping the VLoZD for maybe a Coven Throne (and some more GG potentially) as the Coven Throne might be more synergistic with Nef, but I don't have that model so haven't really tried it out yet!

Ya, I'm realizing now that I'm going to be super short on CPs... I'll probably always use Nagash's CA, and Nef's CA is pretty darn good too, even the WK's CA is useful. I don't think theres a good way to get an extra CP with the exception of totally re-writing this list for Vyrkos and taking the Pack Alpha thing, but and I'm trying to keep this as a LoB list with Nef. I guess I could try to get a Command Entourage battalion, but with so few units it seems like a Battle Regiment makes the most sense to get the first turn, but I could take Hunters of the Heartlands and a Command Entourage (a full Warlord Battalion seems sorta pointless). Nevermind, I can't fit a Command Entourage battalion in as I have two "Commanders", so thats a no go. The Black Knights aren't ideal but I'm not super worried, I actually think they are pretty useful. Slightly more mobile than Dire Wolves and do mortals on the charge. My plan is to use them as a mobile screen, do some mortals on the charge hopefully, let them die, and re-do it. I think I'll probably try this list with Dire Wolves at some point once I get a set and paint them up, but I already have some Black Knights so going to roll with them for now. I think I'm mostly just trying to figure out if and what endless spell is worth it. Since the Umbral Spellportal is only one spell a turn now, I don't think trying to fit that in (by taking cheaper battleline) is worth it, but maybe I'm wrong? Maybe it's just worth taking the Umbral Spellportal for the extended Hand of Dust alone?