Leemer

Reviving this thread as an enjoyer of mixed chaos armies. I've been thinking about our options and believe there are a few interesting choices. I've ranked below in order of how 'competitive' I think they are, with a few ideas on army composition: GUO + Krondspine Incarnate of Ghur You dont really see many Incarnates but I think Nurgle may be one of the best armies for them. They're very strong in melee and I think they have some play in either plaguebearer host or blightlord spam lists. Bonded to the GUO it's very unlikely to go wild and provides a casting bonus (rare in Nurgle). The levelling mechanic means it's very tricky to kill and requires multiple turns. It's got some high rend (-3) and is fast. The aura of reroll run and charge mitigates our poor mobility, and the no retreat aura means enemies cant escape the grind (although negative synergy with Beasts so avoid those). Furies Allied from STD, furies occasionally pop up in a number of competitive chaos armies. They're fast, flying and 6 models which is decent for objectives. The retreat from combat mechanic is very useful and the survivability of nurgle troops means it feels less risky to pick them to escape. Overall strong choice but probably 1 or max 2 units. Mindstealer Sphiranx Another STD ally. Provides an always-strikes-last effect which works well with MSU lists that have several units engaging a larger enemy threat. Cheap monster for battle tactics and reasonably fast. Sigvald Good independent distraction carnifex. Fast, survivable and a good assassin piece. Cheaper/weaker alternatives include Masque and Valkia (I like the idea of an all flying blightlord spam with Valkia). Contorted Epitome Strong double caster with rerolls. Warscroll spell gives you reroll all hits against D3 enemy units which helps guarantee your disease point tally. Very fast and reasonably survivable with 2+ protection from mortals and a weird 50/50 avoid melee rule. Add flaming weapon for some melee threat. Flesh Hounds Cheapish mobile chaff with utility unbind ability. Decent if you're relying on Orghotts/LoA and lacking wizards. Untamed Beast / Ungor Raiders Cheap chaff with pregame move. Ungor raiders also have some shooting phase synergy if you're taking Bloab. Great Bray Shaman Cheap hero for battalions. Good warscroll spell to pull enemies off objectives or generally bring them into range of your slow troops. Chimera / Cockatrice Cheap fast, flying monster options to double down on mortal wound spam. The chimera is also surprisingly capable in melee. Quick disclaimer that if you've got 300 points to spare, the 'right' choice is probably always just another maggoth lord. But these are some fun off-key choices to keep your opponent guessing.

Assuming the EH bodyguard works you can do: Lady O, Nagash, 5x5 Hexwraiths, Spell Portal, in a Battle Regiment 1990pts. Gives you an additional 50 wound pool for the heroes.

Couldn't he also do the Hexwraith bodyguard as a general in Emerald Host?? Potentially 20-30 more wounds before he even brackets EDIT: nevermind, he doesnt benefit from allegiance abilities unfortunately EDIT2: maybe it's legal, bit unclear

Anyone have any experience with heavy STD lists, especially varanguard? And how essential is the double Warlord? Put this list together aiming to maximise double pile-ins with the buffed Varanguard and BT. BSG spam and 4 chaff units for board control, then 3 monsters for BTs. Allegiance: Khorne- Slaughterhost: Reapers of Vengeance- Grand Strategy: Predator's Domain- Triumphs: BloodthirstyLeadersAspiring Deathbringer (85)*Bloodsecrator (125)*- General- Command Trait: Mage Eater - Artefact: The Blood-forged ArmourBloodstoker (85)*Slaves to Darkness Daemon Prince (210)**- Artefact: Crimson CrownBloodthirster of Insensate Rage (280)**- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)Slaughterpriest (110)**- Prayer: Bronzed FleshBattleline10 x Bloodreavers (80)* 10 x Bloodreavers (80)**5 x Flesh Hounds (105)***Units3 x Varanguard (280)***3 x Varanguard (280)***9 x Untamed Beasts (70) - Allies1 x Cockatrice (95)1 x Cockatrice (95)Core Battalions*Warlord - Artefact**Warlord - Artefact ***Hunters of the HeartlandsTotal: 1980 / 2000Wounds: 127Drops: 14

Does anyone have any experience with using Nurgle as allies?? The pusgoyle blightlords (185pt, 14W, 4+, 5+) seem solid for locking enemy units up in combat and generating depravity over multiple turns. Plus they have a few interesting ways to generate mortal wounds (Beasts of Nurgle, Bloab Rotspawn). Could even get a GUO in the ally limit. That said would probably avoid plaguebearers as too reliant on faction buffs.

Been thinking of getting into Hedonites recently. How does this look for a 1k starter army? Allegiance: Slaanesh- Host: Lurid Haze Invaders Host (Host of Chaos)- Grand Strategy: - Triumphs: BloodthirstyBladebringer, Herald on Exalted Chariot (265)*- General- Command Trait: Skin-taker- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)- Host Option: General- Universal Spell Lore: Flaming WeaponSigvald, Prince of Slaanesh (265)*- Host Option: General5 x Hellstriders with Hellscourges (135)*11 x Blissbarb Archers (180)*8 x Iron Golems (75)*8 x Iron Golems (75)**Battle RegimentTotal: 995 / 2000Reinforced Units: 0 / 4Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 53Drops: 1 1 drop, lurid haze, exalted chariot + sigvald as hammers, hellstriders for mobility/screens, iron golems for objectives/depravity, archers for some ranged threat Also considered swapping Flaming Weapon for the levitate/healing spell, or running the same list in Godseekers. Wasnt sure about Grand Strategy, doesn't seem like there are any obvious options for us.

Looks like a solid list, very durable and gotrek will do work. I'd say it's weaknesses are a lack of mobility, ranged power projection, and the fact you'll almost always be going first. Regarding possible changes I'm not sure if you really need the second 20 ironbreaker block? You already have 3 anvils in the phoenix, vindictors and 20 ironbreakers and will only be able to use all-out-defence on one of them. Could consider gyrocopter/allopex/aetherwings plus something with a bit more hitting power greatswords/irondrakes/evocators? Other question is the investment in emerald lifeswarm with just 2 spell casters per turn. If you're consistently casting mystic shield (phoenix) and wings (mage) its a bit uncertain when you'll be able to use it, especially against opponents with strong magic.

This artwork is 🔥

Thought up a couple lists, need some help deciding what to build towards. Which one do you think would be better and/or more fun? Option 1: Ironrach + Gotrek + Turtle + 12 eels + 2 sharks Pros: All the hammers, 3 drops, double net shark, nice mix of eels, tried & tested competitive Cons: gotrek will definitely get nerfed at some point, lack of bodies/wounds Option 2: Feuthan + Tidecaster + Eidolon + Ellania/Ellathor + Turtle + 40 Namarti + 6 eels Pros: All the rr1s, teleporting twins, +1 hit +1 wound +1 save bubbles, bodies, fun/weird playstyle, 2x Start Collecting Cons: Might be trying to do too many different things, hard countered by spell-doms, not sure about grand strategy Cheers for any replies.

Maybe its NPE, but IMO if an army falls apart because it can't deal with failing a big spell once a game maybe it's just not a very good list. Any good army should be flexible and I also can't think think of any spells like that in the current meta? It does address the issue too. The value of a dispell scroll vs mega casters is much more than vs normal wizards. Plus if it's an artefact you have to include the opportunity cost of taking it vs other items.

A one-time dispel scroll universal artefact would definitely be useful

Yeah I'm a big fan of aetherwings and will pretty much always take at least one unit. They're cheap and versatile, plus you can model them as crabs, fish, seahorses etc. I find one of the problems with IDK is they don't really have any decent<100 point, sit-on-objective type units or chaff. Your eels are too expensive to fill this role and namarti just aren't very good. I guess allopexes could do it but they still too cost too much IMO. Aetherwings are ideal for small chaff walls, screening deepstrikes, and objective grabbing. They tend to be very low target priority so good in turns 3/4 to move onto the points your eels have cleared out. Plus at 45pts it really doesnt matter if they die. Only downside is they're taking up your limited ally quota and there's quite a lot of decent ally options now. Tree-revs and khainite shadowstalkers could also be good. But I dont have any experience with these and they cost a bit more.

Been trying to come up with a list that goes heavy into Namarti Reavers as the triple shot Unleash Hell seems like it could have gas. Enclave: Dhom-hain Warlord Battalion 1x Eidolon of the Storm (330) A: Cloud of Midnight 1x Lotan (75) 1x Soul Render (90) A: Arcane Tome - Tide of Fear 3x Ishlaen Guard (155) 3x Ishlaen Guard (155) Battle Regiment Soul Scryer (140) General CT - High Priest Prayer - Curse 10x Reavers (115) Battleline 20x Reavers (230) Battleline 20x Reavers (230) Battleline 3x Aetherwing (45) Allies 3x Aetherwing (45) Allies 1x Leviadon (380) Points: 1990 Wounds: 129 Drops: 5 Full buffs looks like rapid fire (3 shots), +1 hit (leviadon), rroll 1 (lotann), 6's mortal (curse prayer), +1 wound (eidolon), rroll monster wounds (dom-hain) and resurrection (render). A unit of 20 Reavers will be looking at 15 wounds and 10 mortals against a 4+ save. Stacking AOA and Leviadon can mitigate the -1hit of unleash hell so you can get a decent amount of damage in. At the same time the ishlaen, leviadon, eidolon and aetherwings are running interference tagging enemies in combat. The eidolon and leviadon are decent hammers also. Think Soulsnare Shackles and/or an Annointed on Frostheart (+alpha beast battalion with leviadon) would also work well in this list. Also not decided on CT and the 2nd Artefact after Cloud of Midnight. High priest seemed like a way to make the curse more consistent.

Interesting now we can ally the phoenix temple units from CoS. What do people think of bringing Frostheart Phoenixes? Seems like a pretty solid choice and they actually got cheaper. Very hard to kill with the 4+ aftersave and hero healing. The permanent -1 wound aura looks useful and not sure we have many existing ways to debuff.

IDK is getting some nerfs but nothing gamebreaking. Coherency means big eel units are much less likely to see play and so will probably return to a more 3-man MSU style. Namarti thralls and reavers with big bases and 1" reach are even less useful now. As our only behemoth the leviadon gets some new monster abilities which is nice. Two big impacts from the no more stacking rules. (1) With the king/volturnos limited to a single lord of tides ability, we'll no longer have the +3 attack fights first eels. (2) no save stack means no more 2+ unrendable eels. Admittedly these combos were pretty OP but it's not like IDK have a lot of competitive alternatives atm. The tome is pretty old so hopefully we get a new book fairly soon that'll open up some new units and playstyles.

Want: CoS vs Hobgob Starter, New Doom Diver, longer-term roadmaps Expect: AOS3, aggy twitch chat, tv trailer Dont Want: GW Severith fur-suits, any more elves

I'm looking to make a semi-competitive 1k starter mortal list. I've come up with 2 options. Which one do you think is better? Option 1: tanky hero, mobility, independent hitting units Lord of Khorne on Juggernaut (160)- General- Command Trait: Disciple of KhorneBloodsecrator (120)- Banner of Khorne (Artefact): Banner of Rage20 x Bloodreavers (140)- Reaver Blades3 x Mighty Skullcrushers (160)- Bloodglaives3 x Mighty Skullcrushers (160)- Bloodglaives5 x Skullreapers (180)- Goreslick Blades9 x Untamed Beasts (70)- AlliesTotal: 990 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 70 / 400Wounds: 87 Option 2: maximise attacks, warrior anvil, combo heroes Aspiring Deathbringer (80)- General- Bloodaxe and Wrath Hammer- Command Trait: Violent Urgency Bloodsecrator (120)- Banner of Khorne (Artefact): Banner of Rage10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades10 x Bloodreavers (70)- Reaver Blades15 x Chaos Warriors (270)- Hand Weapon & Shield3 x Mighty Skullcrushers (160)- Bloodglaives5 x Wrathmongers (140)9 x Untamed Beasts (70)- AlliesTotal: 980 / 2000Allies: 70 / 400Wounds: 99 thanks

Seems like quite the consensus then, a mix of game design and sales. I think most of the FOMO and ebay price gouging stuff doesnt apply in the same way to Age of Sigmar as the majority of these warbands are still available, they've released characters separately in the past, and the regular points updates would be able to mitigate any major mistakes. I was listening to the warhammer weekly podcast yesterday and thought their idea of designing these units for power pairs would do a great deal to make them a bit more useable. i.e. heros providing buffs to unit keywords that don't already see much use. I think the example they used was an order hero that could buff flagellants. This doesnt risk pushing them into 'overpowered' or even particularly strong territory but would open up list building options and maybe even push players towards buying kits they might not otherwise. While this would be mainly effective in factions with lots of warscrolls, it's better than the current state where we have lots of unique characters, lore and sculpts not being utilised by 95% of players.

Reading through the recent Cursed City warscrolls and seeing the various Underworlds and Warcry warscrolls over the years, it seems that the vast majority of these units are underpowered compared to their battletome equivalents and therefore don't see much play on the tabletop. Do you think this is an active design choice by the developers at GW or just a normal result of the internal faction power variability? I cant see much of a reason for doing this but it seems to be a consistent trend across all the grand alliances. Improving these to be viable options would only enhance the likelihood of players transitioning from their boxed game forces (typically smaller investments) into full Age of Sigmar armies. Plus a lot of them are great sculpts so it would be nice to see them getting more action. Thoughts? As always there are a few notable exceptions: Khainite Shadowstalkers, Iron Golems, Morgwaeth, etc.

Very cool list. Only thing I'm not convinced on is the regular luminark and the units of only 5 pistoliers. Outside hallowheart or settlers gain battalion I'm not sure it's worth it for the 270 points. For the same cost you could have: a hysh battlemage (same protection spell) 5 more pistoliers (giving one of the unit actual punch and wounds) geminids (mitigate some of the luminark mortal wound loss and adds debuff flexibility, loreseeker can deepstrike and cast this empowered right in the centre of the enemy)

Different tools for different targets. The difficulty with the volley gun it competes with freeguild handgunners for a similar damage output but without the versatility (battleline, bodies for objectives, stand-shoot). In general rocket battery is more popular for a few reasons, but it NEEDS to have sufficient support to work properly. Range: 36" is huge this means you can threaten turn 1 and also leave it safely protected in your backfield -2 Rend w/ D3 damage: This is the big difference. -2 rend is fairly uncommon and can target high armor enemies a lot of your units cant deal with outside mortal wounds. Synergy: lord ordinator, greywater fastness (battalion, prayer), tempest eye (hawkeye), engineer, rocket salvo ability, hurricanum Really you need 2-3 buffs of these to make it worthwhile but once you do it's not too difficult to get hitting on 2+ which makes them way more reliable. The hurricanum is close to an auto-include in a lot of lists anyway. If you're going in on this I'd suggest going all-in with the battalion, if you just take 1 or 2 without support it's not going to be very points-efficient or impactful. Overall artillery is cool but expensive.

Yes in general they are bad. But there are exceptions. Freeguild on griffon, both annointeds on phoenix and dreadlord on dragon are pretty decent in the right list. Sure they could do with coming down 20-30pts across the board but overall they have decent utility, synergy and strong defence. I also think you're severely underestimating the tankiness of frostheart phoenixes. With just mystic shield you've got him to 3+4++ rr 1s, then easily buffed to 2+ with artefacts (armor mallus, iron oak) or allegiance abilities (tempest eye). The rr wounds is also a great command ability for blocks of PG which is quite rare. Reducing that to 220pts as you suggest would be extremely OP. Sure we dont have any mawkrusha/terrorgheist-level damage dealers, but saying they're all useless would be incorrect. That said, the hydra/kharibdyss, steam tanks, BM on griffon, and sorcerer on BD all do really need a boost. Which is a shame as they're all cool models.

Think I'm going to start Gloomspite Gitz this year. Models are great and keen to try something different. Probably going to focus on moonclans, how does this look for a 1k list? Allegiance: Gloomspite GitzLeadersFungoid Cave-Shaman (90)- General- Command Trait: Boss Shaman- Lore of the Moonclans: Itchy NuisanceMadcap Shaman (80)- Artefact: Moonface Mommet- Lore of the Moonclans: The Hand of GorkBattleline40 x Stabbas (260)- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields- 6x Barbed Nets - 1x Moonclan Flag Bearers - 1x Badmoon Icon Bearers20 x Stabbas (130)- Stabbas & Moon Shields- 3x Barbed Nets - 1x Badmoon Icon BearersUnits5 x Loonsmasha Fanatics (140)10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)6 x Sneaky Snufflers (70)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsScuttletide (30)Total: 1000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 105 Tried to make it decently competitive and synergistic. 2 spellcasters. 60 grot infantry to recycle with loonshrine (is this enough?). Snufflers to sit on home object and buff units. Fanatics and bounders to take out high profile targets. Bounderz for mobility. Scuttletide is just good. Cave-shaman ct basically makes it a more versatile loonboss. Other version was to maybe cut the madcap and snufflers for another unit of fanatics. More hitting power but loses the Mommet and attack buffs. Criticism welcomed. Also some advice on how to play the fanatics/teleport would be good. Is it better to use smaller units which dont matter if it dies, or just go all in and try to teleport the buffed 40 and hope for recycling?

Happy New Year! Here's to a better 2021 Recently been continuing work on my Cities of Sigmar. Finished the concussors and have begun working on the next centrepiece model, a freeguild general on griffon. I know the original sculpt gets a lot of love but I find its a bit too bulky for my taste. Enter the magmadroth! I managed to get the kit on ebay for an absolute steal and I think it works pretty well size-wise. Here it is prepped for undercoating. The base is built using some polyfiller, vallejo basing paste, sand and various tree/ruin bits I had lying around. I actually think the dead body is from the old LOTR ent kit. The rider is a demigryph knight with one of the forgeworld Cawdor Ganger head upgrades. These are really great and fit well with most of the human-sized things. Going to use the rest with a unit of pistoliers. Finally I replaced the lance head with one of the wild rider spears, think it looks a bit sleeker than the original. Quite a bit of pinning required so I can paint as subassemblies and had to use greenstuff to cushion the seat and repose the rear legs. Overall I think it looks pretty sweet. Also has a bit of ambiguity so can be used as a dreadlord on dragon / anointed on fire phoenix if needed. Here's my first 5 freeguild handgunners too, definitely made big improvements in painting this year.

Potential more aggressive alternative. Cut: soulscream bridge, unit of 10 phoenix guard, annointed on foot. Add: second annointed on flamespyre phoenix, upgrade guard to handgunners The second phoenix makes the reborn ability more reliable, provides more offensive power, and their high movement counters the loss from the bridge. You pop a spell near them and you've got 2 very aggressive mobile units on 3+4+, potentially 10 mortal wounds with Wake of Fire, and every game you should expect at least 1 to return. One of them will likely still be within range of the phoenix guard for their ability and they can also buff each other. Why cut the bridge? One of the main benefits of the bridge is power projection. It's typically used with iron drakes/handgunners/sisters of watch. You can teleport and in the same turn delete a key enemy threat. In your list you have the teleport but little power projection. You can cast a few spells but your units are largely just sitting in front of the enemy waiting to get shot or charged in the next turn. Also as phoenix guard are really durable you'd expect them to be able to survive as they move onto objectives. The issue with the small 10 phoenix guard is that they fulfil largely the same role as the 30. A unit of 10 is too expensive for a screen and there are better/cheaper options if you want a solid countercharge unit (greatswords / executioners). Handgunners are much better than the standard shield guys. Still effective screens but can dish out some damage with shooting and fire again when they're charged. Of course they'll melt in combat, but so do normal freeguild. Plus 2 phoenixes is twice as cool and fits with your fire theme.