Kasper
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Posts posted by Kasper
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On 2/1/2022 at 1:57 AM, NinthMusketeer said:
Final match for LVO, ended top of turn 2 from a double. The winner went on to emphasize how important it was to secure second turn, because of the double. He spoke more about that than he did the actual units he took.
I watched this and imo it had nothing to do with the double turn.
There was a lot of bad plays but it was also a display of how incredibly powerful dragons/fulminators are. Imo they missed the ballpark on 3 SCE units and they all pack a little bit too much punch. So much damage is frontloaded. Half the SBGL army was gone turn 1.
Im pretty sure the game would have been over regardless of there being a priority roll or not. Sure the game would have been prolonged a little but it was an EXTREMELY uphill battle for the SBGL player at this point being 1.000 pts down (805 pts in 2 monster heroes and a bunch of zombies from shooting).The battleplan favours armies that can get up into the opponent's grill and remove stuff to burn objectives. I dont see the SBGL player doing this after having lost so much turn 1.
So yeah, the Living Cities player getting a double turn sealed the deal for sure, but the game was already lost before the Living Cities player had his first turn. -
4 hours ago, NinthMusketeer said:
Supporters commonly claim AoS is better for having the double, I say prove it.
But I am doing that, because I do play with the priority mechanic. I like it. Thats why I play with it. Maybe you should play 10ish games without it and get a feeling for how the game is, knowingly you can never get double turned? I have, and thats why I play with it now.
4 hours ago, NinthMusketeer said:So the argument is those factors change random initiative from a bad addition to a good one?
My point is the comparison is weird because there are multiple mechanics in AoS that support the priority mechanic and can cause you to give the turn away. The correct play is often to not take the double turn.
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1 hour ago, ibel said:
I Like the PusgoyleMen so much and because all most everyOne i played against is at the MetaGames i will take this List:
Allegiance: Maggotkin of Nurgle
- Subfaction: Drowned Men
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
Leaders
Bloab Rotspawned (300)*
- Lore of Malignance: Plague Squall
Lord of Afflictions (210)*
- General
- Command Trait: Overpowering Stench
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Lore of Malignance: Gift of Disease
Plague Priest (85)*
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
Battleline
4 x Pusgoyle Blightlords (440)*
- Reinforced x 1
4 x Pusgoyle Blightlords (440)*
- Reinforced x 1
2 x Pusgoyle Blightlords (220)*
2 x Pusgoyle Blightlords (220)*
Units
10 x Plague Monks (85)*
- Foetid Blades
- 1x Standard Bearers
- 1x Plague Harbingers
Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment
Total: 2000 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 2 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 132
Drops: 1What do u think ? I Do the Mathhammer, i Kill 1,5 Gargants per Round, 1 Kille 4,5 Dragons per Round, or something like 60-70 Zombies. Is this okay ?! Enough ?!
Why the Plague Monks etc? Feels kinda odd to me since theres no synergy with the rest of your list. Might as well run Untamed Beasts which gives a pregame move.
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3 hours ago, NinthMusketeer said:
From a more practical perspective, have you tried introducing random initiative into chess? Did it improve the play experience?
You dont have burning an objective, stackable buffs until your next hero phase etc. in chess though. Its a weird comparison.
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2 hours ago, TaurielBlack said:
See.... I view people seeing Rotigus's spell as a flat 3 damage from the App as wishful thinking lol, the App is meant as reference material, not gospel 😆
It was hopium going full ham. To me 3 flat MW was the only thing keeping the model a viable option. It just feels objectively bad/worse than a GUO now.
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Was hoping for something that would excite me to empty my wallet the coming month(s) but..
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On 1/26/2022 at 1:49 PM, Magnus The Blue said:
Has anyone use Rot Covens much yet?
In theory they look great, discounted caster and whopping +3 to cast/unbind. But every time I make a list with them I end up wanting to add arcane tomb, spell portal, extra spell enhancement etc. to get the most of them, suddenly the cheap hero choice is eating up lots of resources.
Sure Spell Portal+ Rancid visitations will RUIN some armies but all the spell feel relatively situational, so I'm not sure how good them are in an 'all comers' list.
I think aiming for Horrorghast/Shards of Valagharr is much better with the Rot Coven. Rancid is great in very few situations but in your average game you are not gonna benefit from the spell, plus you are forced into Spellportal for it to ever go off. You generally want long range reach with them to prevent them from dying to any shooting whatsoever.
The issue is that your average club game or tournament wont have great line of sight blocking terrain so the little dudes are probably fairly ****** due to all the long range shooting that is in the current meta. If you play with loads of terrain or in a meta without longstrikes/bowsnakes/dinos/sentinels etc. etc., then they can probably perform pretty good.
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On 1/26/2022 at 9:57 PM, Archibald said:
Army Faction: Maggotkin of Nurgle
- Army Subfaction: Befouling Host
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumps: Beast MasterLEADER
Great Unclean One (495)
- General
- Command Traits: Nurgling Infestation
- Doomsday Bell and Plague Flail
- Artefacts: The Witherstave
- Spells: Fleshy AbundanceRotigus (495)
Horticulous Slimux (225)
BATTLELINE
1 x Plaguebearers (300)
Beasts of Nurgle (110)
Beasts of Nurgle (110)
TERRAIN
Feculent Gnarlmaw (0)
OTHER
Nurglings (105)
TOTAL POINTS: (1840/2000)
Planning on playing this against Sylvaneth soon (last game got cancelled because of corona...so at least it was a win for papa nurgle i guess).
List is all about summoning. 3 trees from the beginning plus the bell and Nurglings in enemies territory should be a lot of points. Planing on summoning a bilepiper in the first round and then a beast/Nurglings/Plaguebearers each turn.
Not shure what to do with the last 160p. 10 Plaguebearers? Beats of Nurgle?
I really want Rotigus to work, so i am trying him out, but i am not really optimistic. Often find my Nurgle lists lacking of some real punch.
The app is now updated to show Rotigus as D3 MWs which means hes 100% shelved for me. Too many hoops you have to jump through in order to "maybe" get noticable MW damage. His profile is worse than a normal GUO so his warscroll spell is literally all he brings.
I dont think Slimux is worth bringing for just 1 extra summoning pt a turn alone. You need to use his hit and charge buffs to Beasts but 2 is simply not enough IMO.
If you swap Rotigus +Slimux for either Bloab + Orghotths + 1 Beast of Nurgle the list becomes undeliably better IMO.
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One would think that the winners of tournaments would be very varied if the DT/priority mechanic was so awful and gamebreaking, but its kinda weird how top players consistently score high/win the tournaments. I suppose this means they either use cheater dice or they just have straight up extreme luck with games.
I cant imagine any other reason for this phenomenon.
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20 hours ago, JackStreicher said:
That's not right. Everything I did I had to do anyways, double turn or not. I had to screen to survive his turn. Usually my opponent gets his turn after mine (or vise versa), so I have to screen to survive his damage. I shall not overextend or expose my charakters. This I have to do anyways. If my opponent received a double turn I would've run out of screens and he could have simply smashed my defences and finally would've tabled me. There's not really a difference. The only differences are the following:
- One Player could take the risk of trying to get the double turn, playing super aggressively. If this is rewarded the game is pretty much over for his opponent. If he does not get the DT he'll be in trouble. It's a feel bad in both cases since as I said: the double turn (to me) is a mechanic that gives an unfair advantage to one player (not neccessarily the one taking it).
- The possibility to turn a game around. Usually this means that grave mistakes were made (in the turns before / Listbuilding) so this mechaic is required. It's still not fair at all. If you make such horrendeous mistakes, you deserve to lose.- The Easy DT: You don't need to place your important pieces aggressively because you either have great shooting, awesome magic or another trick up your sleeve to hurt your opponent from afar. Awesome, the biggest NPE gets to go twice in a row, so much player interaction, amazing.
So why exactly do we need the DT? That's right, we do not. It's not a good game mechanic it's simply a trademark of AoS for the sake of it.It sounds like neither of you play with the DT in mind and are super aggressive or reckless. This can pay off, but its a strategy you bank on that also can heavily backfire. Im not really surprised you hate the DT if you dont respect it and play around it.
Play some games without it if you hate it so much and post your findings. Mine has been that the game turns ****** under the current rules.
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Psst, if you really hate the double turn that much, just dont play with it. I have, and it was absolutely horrible and it made me realize how important the double turn is for the game.
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On 1/19/2022 at 12:25 PM, Zeblasky said:
P.S. Oh, and Overpowering Stench is a must have on your general. It can break an opposing army if your general is placed just right.
Stench seems alright but from my own experience the actual impact is very limited. Having to be wholly within 7" is quite a big ask and stopping units from issuing commands is generally not that big of a deal, unless you are fighting on a far flank with no general/hero nearby or you manage to "gotcha" your opponent with the ability by getting within 7" of a nearby hero. Otherwise it just seems to do nothing. Its generally difficult to get entire units wholly within 7" of him imo.
As you mentioned his profile is also kinda weak. Hes just tanky which is obviously valuable.
Personally I prefer Spume because he allows deepstriking Orgotths as an example.
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On 1/19/2022 at 12:25 PM, Zeblasky said:
So, Tldr: Pussgoyle Blightlords are tanky, fast and can deal great damage, so they are very good at everything. Enjoy them before FAQ drops.
What are you expecting the FAQ to change? I mean Blightkings do better damage, its just that they are slow so its the age old situation where you sacrifice a bit of damage for superior movement.
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Ahh sheeeet here we go again.
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18 hours ago, TaurielBlack said:
Allegiance: Maggotkin of Nurgle
- Subfaction: Droning Guard
- Mortal Realm: Chamon
- Grand Strategy: Spread Rampant Disease
- Triumphs: IndomitableLeaders
Lord of Afflictions (210)*
- General
- Command Trait: Overpowering Stench
- Artefact: The Splithorn Helm (?)
Gutrot Spume (170)*
Lord of Plagues (145)*
Rotbringer Sorcerer (145)
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (?)
- Lore of Malignance: Rancid VisitationsBattleline
3 x Plague Drones (200)*
3 x Plague Drones (200)*
5 x Putrid Blightkings (250)*
5 x Putrid Blightkings (250)*
20 x Plaguebearers (300)*Endless Spells & Invocations
Umbral Spellportal (70)Core Battalions
*Battle RegimentTotal: 1940 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 139
Drops: 2Played this recently and wanted folks thoughts on how to make it more competitive, though i did have a blast when I did play is so tbh I'm already pretty happy with the list 😆But ofc, comments and CC are always welcome 👍
I think I would take Hold the Line over the other grand strat you have chosen. Its a lot of wounds that the opponent needs to kill.
Personally not a fan of the Lord of Plagues (or Lord of Blights for that matter) and would rather invest those points into more units or upgrading one of your heroes to something else.
I think the Rotbringer Sorc is interesting with his diseased endless spell. My only issue is that without any rerolls/+cast its a bit too unreliable to my taste having to cast Spellportal and then Racid and hope both of them succeed and the opponent fails unbinding both spells. I prefer consistency, but not everyone plays like that. Rancid is also hugely matchup dependent, although when it hits right, it hits super hard.
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For the FAQ I'm anticipating:
- Trees clarified to be 1 CP per tree
- Rewrite noxious artefact since it does nothing now
- Clarification on how Rotcoven works - Does it take up 3 leader slots? Is it a single entry? If a single, what happens if you take an artefact? It feels a little vague and confusing.
Wishlisting is that Rotigus is changed from D3 MWs to 3 MWs - In the app it says 3 MWs but the tome says D3. D3 is terrible and I doubt he will be played much in this case, with 3 MWs I could see him making it into my lists.
I very much doubt we are gonna see point changes, warscroll changes or rule changes at all.
The book is what it is.
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5 hours ago, kore5022 said:
Sorry didn't see the new thread.
Has anyone played any games using the different interpretation of the CP given by trees (eg 3 trees X 3 abilities for 9cp).
Wondering how strong it is if anyone has played it?
Seems like it could be fun and make trees worth the 9 CP
I havent tried with multiplicative trees. Credible people with connections have also confirmed that its being changed to 1 per tree anyways, so I see little point in playing it that way. I feel like our summoning is already quite good as is with a list that doesnt focus on summoning at all. Like if you deepstrike your opponent you are quickly getting 7 summoning points a turn which is a lot. I typically dont summon anything turn 1 but it means I can summon 1 BoN or 3 Nurglings every turn afterwards which I have found matters a lot for holding and grabbing objectives later in the game.
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11 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:
And reduce the points cost of every skaven unit by at least 30%
Yes please, I want Plague Claws in my Nurgle army
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11 hours ago, Ganigumo said:
Name a single unit with balanced rules that is problematic when spammed.
You won't be able to, because there aren't any.
A unit doesn't just mysteriously become broken when somebody runs more of it, what actually happens is that the unit was already broken and tough to deal with, but a small number of them is manageable to beat because you can either ignore it, or commit way more resources than that unit costed to deal with it. That's not balance, and to enforce limited numbers of units is a bandaid fix that does nothing but obscure the problem
I dont think this is true at all. You kinda mention it yourself - Some units are managable in low quantities but once a certain number has been amassed, it becomes siginificantly stronger. Obviously 1+1=2 but Im talking about an exponential growth in power.
Mega Gargants wouldnt be too terrible on their own, but when you combine 4 together it becomes neigh impossible for many armies. You see this with people running multiple little giants - The army is ALOT weaker.
A single Salamander is not that impressive, but when you spam the unit the output becomes absurd and melts stuff.
The Cockatrice is a pretty bad unit on its own, but Adam spammed the unit and actually did really well to a couple tournaments. Yes it isnt broken, but the power of the unit was much higher when in higher numbers. It goes from doing "meh" damage to anything within 10" to basically removing it.
Pink Horrors - A single unit of 10 is "just" 50 wounds, its a lot but you can usually deal with it. But if the opponent spams them and field like 60 horrors on the other hand, you reach a breakpoint where you are no longer able to deal with it
Etc. etc., the list goes on.
Dragons follow the same pattern. Alphaing a single dragon or two isnt a big deal and they wont be doing that much damage, but if you send 10 into the opponent's face then you have the ranged output to remove screens and severely hurt units.
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2 hours ago, feadair said:
The problem is that there are a lot of armies that will crush the casual list of regular Joe. We cannot nerf them all on that basis, right?
Theres a significant difference between straight up wiping your opponents army turn 1 or top of 2 with an alphastrike, versus having an army that overall is stronger and likely will win at the later turns. At least theres a game, people roll dice and will have fun for longer than 30-45 mins.
Its an interesting discussion though, what do you reckon is best for the health of the game? That casual games are fun and enjoyable or that everything comes down to rock-paper-scissor balance at a 5 game tournament level? Ensuring people dont get utterly crushed at your "Average Joe" level does not exclude top level play being fun and somewhat balanced.
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It feels a bit like what Ironjawz can do. If the opponent's army isnt well-equipped to deal with an alpha or simply isnt screening/deploying properly, it can be a bit of a "gotcha" moment. At least with Ironjawz theres no real way for them to deal with your screens, especially if they are in Hunters, as they are a pure melee army.
Theres also the huge variance with the breath attacks where they can either whiff real hard, deal ok damage or just rinse the opponent's army. You are likely to remember the last part much more than the former two.
Some units are simply not very good if you bring few, but a critical mass happens when you amass a certain amount of them. Drakes seem to be one of those where they just get better once you reach a certain number.
Its certainly not a fun experience at all for your average Joe to roll up and put his toys on the table.
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13 hours ago, Archibald said:
I will be playing against SBGL with this list on friday:
Subfaction Drowned Men Mortal Realm Ghur Grand Strategy Hold the Line Triumph Inspired Leaders Lord of Affliction** 210 Gutrot Spume** 170 Morbidex Twiceborn** 320 Battleline Pusgoyle Blightlords* 220 Putrid Blightkings x2* 500 Putrid Blightkings** 250 Units Pusgoyle Blightlords x1** 110 Nurglings x2** 210 Ballations Hunters* Battle Regiment Points 1990 Drops 3 Wounds 135 It is very flexible in seting up the army. You can pregame move the drones or play a nearly total null deploy. Everything is flexible and can react to the enemy. Mainplan should be to look the enemy in his deployment zone. This is why i use a 10-man unit of BK. Just for staying power (and to test it out).
Oh and btw why don't we get our own subforum like Slaanesh? Seems fitting with new book and all.
Is there a reason why you havent put the last unit of Blightkings into Hunters batallion as well? Dont think theres a huge difference between being 3 or 4 drops. Most seem to be 1 or 2 (if 2 monsters usually) or otherwise 5 due to Battle Regi + Warlords.
Personally I dont value Morbidex that much. I think Bloab is the overall superior choice with the utility/spell he brings and otherwise Orgotths raw damage with 10 CPs a game is really good.
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3 hours ago, Smashin' said:
The plan would be to pin the enemy down on both sides, grind them down with disease and get that early aggression on back objectives.
I feel like deepstrike is really important to us. Not only is the army relatively slow all around, you are also incentivized to do it by gaining a significant amount of summoning points by having stuff in their territory. Ontop of this its an easy battle tactic with Savage Spearhead and you get to threaten those support pieces etc. sitting in the back that you generally otherwise cant reach. You also put pressure on objectives that are otherwise hard to get to.
I almost never write a list without either Spume or LoA. Spume is so good since its any mortal unit now, including the Maggoth Lords. LoA is great and offers some more options since it isnt board edge. Im not a huge fan of Nurglings since they have to come down turn 1, although you could probably put them near objectives as a roadblock for your opponent.
1 hour ago, Dejnar said:have been thinking though to make one of the BK units 10 strong. Would that be to much maybe?
I dont think theres any point in going 10. They only fight in 1 rank anyways and your healing is much better with MSU units.
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On 1/7/2022 at 1:12 AM, Harbinger-of-Nurgle said:
I just brought the Vanguard box set and a Great unclean one. just wondering but which is the better loadout for the Great Unclean one?
I would magnetize that bad boy. Its probably the easiest model to magnetize so you can freely switch between Rotigus and GUO with the different loadouts. All the loadouts on the GUO are viable and it depends on what you want to do with the list.
The bell is legit if you plan to play Befouling and play around getting 7 summoning pts turn 1 to summon a sloppity bilepiper.
The bileblade is fine if hes a support role and you intend to cast 3 spells a turn (lore spell, mystic shield and maybe an endless spell or Gift of Disease if you go for poxes artefact).
Flail/sword combo is great if you want to max out on damage and go for flaming weapon route.
AoS 3 - Maggotkin of Nurgle Discussion
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