Lucky Snake Eyes
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Posts posted by Lucky Snake Eyes
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30 minutes ago, Overread said:
Furthermore if AoS 3.0 were out chances are they'd be rolled into it; or it would be an expansion book rather like hte recent one Chaos got for 40K wherein its just rules and updates not a full functional army on its own.
I've been suggesting something similar, do a shadowspear and roll them into a dual box with aelves or something. Just have it be a suppliment booklet with warscrolls and maybe some command traits and artifacts specific to mortals.
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1 minute ago, Izotzuhure said:
I know, I know, but I think they were talking about Endless Spells and that should be ok, right?
Allegiance locked I'd think, but idk we don't exactly have many situations with armies using other armies endless spells outside of nagash and the nighthaunt spells and that's because it's explicitly stated he can cast them.
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4 minutes ago, Izotzuhure said:
It technically only says Chaos Slaanesh Wizards, so any wizard from the battalion should be able to do so. On the other hand, if you go heavy BoC in a Slaanesh army you could do the same thing with their Endless spells. I say heavy because that way you wouldn't suffer the side effects.
you only gain access to their respective spell lores if you are their allegiance. If your allegiance is BoC then you don't get the hedonites spell lore, because you are not a hedonites army, even with the depraved drove as you still have to choose your army allegiance at the end of the day.
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Just now, King Taloren said:
Here’s an interesting idea. Mortal unit that rerolls all hit rolls but if they roll any 1s on the reroll they suffer-2 leadership as they freak out over failing to be perfect.
i want 20... albeit the immune to battleshock spells and warshrine prayer do mitigate that issue, unless the debuff also counts towards bravery tests for spells and abilities like nighthaunt.
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4 minutes ago, King Taloren said:
Yes I’m not saying that snu-snu is the only draw though I am curious how big it is in WoG from the developers. (As a fervent enough worshiper of Slaanesh in my tendency to excessively collect things...)
It would be nice to have had at least one or two units and a mortal hero or wizard that is actually the in the faction. Marked units kind of barely work, it’s just slightly better than allying in units.
It would be pretty cool to see a duality of wizards, one who seeks pleasure through magic and is a healer with some healing bound spell and one who seeks pain through overcharging their magic and risks hurting themselves for better casting or something. See geedubs? Designing slaanesh isn't hard! Instead we get the generic sorcerer lord, but at least he somewhat helps with our poor armour save problem and his spell really helps daemonettes if their losing out on the reroll from the banner.
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3 minutes ago, King Taloren said:
Lorewise Slaanesh should probably be on par with Khorne or even exceed mortal converts to his side just for what he represents. Though I guess it could be argued that they are too busy with excessive pleasure of the flesh to go out and be a presence in war. Not enough tempted by excess of murder and violence so his demons still do the brunt of the work...
And the rules make for a good counter of ASF builds and armies. Like a control deck in Magic the Gathering, he’s got some really good things to work with and playdown the attrition on beat down armies that have poor sustain.
Which also fits lorewise since even he other three gods are scared of him because he can feed of them if they go too much into their own powers excessively.
I mean hey, it's not just getting high and laid that slaanesh is about. Pursuit of martial perfection, the desire to accrue a legend and tales about ones victories, the pursuit of pain through combat, the desire to defeat all opponents and overcome all champions. There are a lot of fluffy hooks as to why slaanesh worshipers would pursue war.
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Just now, Joseph Mackay said:
as for weather slaanesh being older means they deserve models more than the newer ones? i know slaanesh players dont like this answer, but you can take Slaanesh marked Slaves To Darkness and Beast Of Chaos units which massively bump up your unit counts (although this also applys to the other chaos armies, you cant use that as a reason to pretend they dont exist). the differince is you can take those units without affecting your alleignce, whereas Flesh Eaters and Fyreslayers dont have that option
It's a fair point, I do it all the time because their are so many shooting armies in my local area. But by that same logic the same goes for the other gods as well so the disparity for slaanesh in comparison to the other gods doesn't change. I would hope that if soulblight ever get's a full release that they'd incorporate flesh eaters and legions in some way since ghoul kings are technically vampires unless the new book retconned that. As for fyreslayers yeah they're in a bad spot for models but from my brief time playing against the new ones their rules seem to have gotten really solid at least.
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2 minutes ago, Tonhel said:
Slaanesh is done and now GW will continue with the other battletomes that need updates.
I missed the livestream due too work so hopefully someone else in this thread can correct me if I'm wrong, but I remember people quoting them as having said "mortals are not in this book because we haven't figured out how we want to do slaanesh mortals yet" Obviously paraphrasing a secondhand source here so hopefully someone who saw the livestream can confirm the quote. Besides they probably won't do a full book if they do get around to it and do something like a supplement book akin to the shadowspear supplements for 40k with just the new warscrolls and maybe command traits and artifacts specific to mortals. But if it does happen then it would definitely be much later down the line possibly as a foil to one of the major aelves releases for a dual box themed around a slaanesh jailbreak or something. Slaanesh being freed does sound like a good reason for a bunch of mortals to roll up on the aelves doorstep and for the aelves to get off their butts and start doing stuff in the lore so that all the bereaved high elf players can feed their addiction like the rest of us.
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Just now, Joseph Mackay said:
the complaints about slaanesh mortals is hard to sympathis with when you have things like:
-Flesh-Eater Courts - 12 warscrolls-7 are heroes,4 kits - most of the heroes are made from the Ghouls or Horror boxes, which doing so leaves you with models you cant use
-Fyreslayers - 13 warscrolls-10 are heroes,7 kits- rediculously small model range but more heroes than you can fit in a list
-Skaven - at the very least should have had some of the metal/resin models redone in plastic
just to name a few. Fyreslayers needed some new units to break up the repetitive nature of building and painting them. Flesh Eaters could have done with some new stuff too although im not too sure what, maybe some small Dire Wolves type unit?
i understand the current plan seems to be update the old books to 2.0 as quickly as possible, whuch means not every army will get new models, but it seems those who need them the most are the ones who miss outalso, Slaanesh are looking like they wont be a fun army to play against, most of the rules previewed so far are all about turning off your oppenents rules. i got put off Flesh Eaters due to complaints about them being op and that sucked all the fun out of playing them for me, its looking like i best avoid slaanesh for the same reason
I can see your point with the model ranges but I'll also point out that most of your examples are newer armies, meanwhile slaanesh has been around for decades and still ain't got squat for mortals. And yeah the slaanesh rules are disgusting and that's coming from a slaanesh player. Seems to me like they are a surprisingly well themed yet nonetheless reactionary counter to the growing prevalence of FeC and other 'fights first' rules being abused in the meta. If it's any consolation shooting looks like it will be the bane of slaanesh since we're losing the crazy speed buffs godseekers used to have and our low armour saves will leave us defenseless to shooting armies, especially ones with rend like shootcast.
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10 minutes ago, King Taloren said:
Slaanesh: 3 (two of them squatted when the book comes out) so 1 Hellstriders (go figure that one...)
This one hurts me a little, but if we are getting a separate mortals book down the line then I hope we'll get some sweet new named characters and some mortals that can really play with the precedent set by hellstriders and have debuff gimmicks or buff up the more pain is being dished out. I could see flagellant type bdsm freaks that buff up or gain attacks the more of them die in a unit or perfectionist armoured knight type units that get bonuses for fighting other elite units. I'd be real happy if we saw the return of Sigvald or at least mirror guard but the former seems pretty unlikely. Still mirror guard as a bodyguard unit for your lords seems neat. I'd love to see a mechanic where the lord can admire his reflection in the guards shields and not be able to attack but in return the guard can take wounds for him
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4 hours ago, Kaleb Daark said:
oh but they do
you take the Depraved Drove battalion within the BOC book which gives them the god keyword and then they can fulfill all the requirements of the god specific army. Yes you pay for the privilege, but it allows you to legitimately take them in your army without having to have them as allies.
What you won't get however, is them taking allegience abilities or artefacts from beasts or hedonites if they include the word daemon or mortal as the beasts don't have these keywords.
No I mean despite using the battalion as a means of taking bullgors and bestigors, they will only count as battleline if your armies allegiance is BoC, if you choose hedonites for your allegiance then they wouldn't fulfill battleline requirements.
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Just now, SwampHeart said:
Who cares if they don't count as core? They're still cheap as chips - you can take the depraved drove with your minimum battle line (30 ungors) for 730 points including the 30 bestigors. Toss in Ssyl which I'm expecting puts you to roughly 950~ points and you've still got a lot of room to add in other toys. And what you get out of it is an absolute blender of a unit, Bestigors are already good. Bestigors tat get 3 hits per 6 with access to re-roll 1s to hit are amazing.
Fair point, Shagoths also seem like a good investment being a meaty hero that can heal for even more sweet depravity.
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11 minutes ago, SwampHeart said:
Also access to cheap minimum core if you want it, two units who take great advantage of Euphoric killers (Bestigors and Bullgors), and more fast elements to help keep up with the army. I'm primarily a BoC player but I'll be swapping to HoS - it does BoC better and gives me access to some of the tools needed to compete in the current meta (and access to an actual monster character).
I don't think bullgors and bestigor count as battleline outside of boc, just gors and ungors. Still ungor raiders that hit twice on 6's might be nice
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Just now, Elazar The Glorified said:
The loss of the Boobworm entirely kills my army theme. Quite gutted and not keen on the idea of having to rebase my ones to use as the StD Lord
Why did the resurrect the art of him for the Slaanesh lore article to then can it?
Because they always reuse old art and it's cheaper than commissioning new art for everything.
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1 minute ago, Enoby said:
(I fully support this so long as it's not done in excess)
Bite your tongue good sir/madam/incorporeal monstrosity! You defy everything slaanesh is about! And like I said in an earlier post, it's a shame that they're breaking the precedent on god armies, but at least our rules seem really solid out the gate, meanwhile khorne took 3 books to get to a decent state. Something can be said for unit bloat hurting rules coherency.
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Just now, Unit1126PLL said:
I'm not sure what the other gods got. More mortals is what you mean?
Yeah, and while a lot of the khorne and nurgle stuff is from wfb, all three of the other gods have significant mortal choices that slaanesh lacks. So GW is kinda going against the precedent they set for chaos. On the bright side khorne took 3 books to get where they are now rules wise, meanwhile we may lack units, but we seem to be getting really solid rules. perhaps unit bloat does hurt the rules coherency of an army, but still having more than hellstriders would be nice.
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1 minute ago, kahadin said:
So I know this is a change of subject, but I'm really interested to see if hellstriders become 2 unique variants. Maybe heavy cav with the spears and a harass or buff/debuff unit with whips.
We will know soon, so it may be stupid to get excited, but I am.
I feel like maybe they will take the extra attacks for kills mechanic and expand on that with a spear dedicated variant while the whips and debuffs get their own variant that are hopefully independently stronger at the cost of losing the overlap of having both abilities.
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Just now, kahadin said:
The website folded slaves into everchosen. I think darkoath fluff was that they are basically marauders from total war. They don't worship the gods directly. The models they've shown have just been updated marauders so far, so I feel like we are just getting barbarians and no warriors of chaos, an I assumed no god specific stuff.
They may do the batallion thing though. I actually don't like that style.
They set a precident of not having god keywords on the darkoath specific heroes. Their might be named characters with god keywords but I woudn't expect much else.
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I missed the livestream but a friend who was watching told me they where still "thinking about how we will do mortals". Can anyone confirm this? If this is true then we'd be the first army to have two separate books for mortals and daemons which would be kinda neat but might go the way of chaos space marines and daemons of chaos in 40k. Still if they can come up with enough for a whole book that would be cool, especially considering khorne mortals can pretty much make up an entire book on their own.
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this brings up an interesting question: If you had say a unit of castigators or a ballista on top of a rock that's 5" tall, and the entirety of the surface of said rock was taken up by said units, would a unit that cannot fly then be unable to charge them since there would be no space to put said units models on the rock or within weapon range? This is a surprisingly relevant question for some armies as it's quite possible to build lists for armies like Slaves to darkness that don't involve any flying or ranged units.
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How many units even have AFF? I rarely see it in my gaming group and when I do it's because I'm running slaanesh and my daemon prince likes to crash the party.
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3 minutes ago, Ravinsild said:
How does that take into account specialty? Slaanesh's THING is going really fast, a lot of their stuff can run and charge in the same time and their base movements speeds are really high. Wouldn't Slaanesh have the best chariots compared to Chaos as a whole since speed is their thing?
Every army has a theme as well as strengths and weaknesses. I see your point about internal balance, but what about keeping to theme? Not all chaos chariots should be the same, and if all armies have weaknesses, should they have poor units to reflect those weaknesses? Khorne doesn't have chariots, but does have some very slow calvary (8'' movement) compared to everyone else, but it hits like an avalanche. Khorne calvary is different, but fine. However one of our battleline is kind of trash universally. Bloodreavers are just useless. Is that ok? Should Bloodreavers for sure be good? If they are, does that then make defining roles within armies more valuable? Maybe battlelines should have different roles depending on what you want to do.
If it's any consolation, bloodreavers are literally meant to die, like that is their sole purpose.
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Just now, Ravinsild said:
Yeah that's true when everyone gets a sweet new book and there's been a few tournaments on equal footing I guess we'll see more. Although that kind of goes for everyone right? Like Seraphon don't have a book and they did alright recently. Also Dispossessed don't have a book but I've never heard of them doing great... etc yadda yadda.
well seraphon do have a book, just no a 2.0 book. And a lot of the stuff from their 1.0 book is from the time when GW was leaning more towards narrative and apocalypse style games with 2500-4000pt battalions and crazy rules like neferatta turning heroes into vampires.
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4 minutes ago, Ravinsild said:
I agree with that. I do notice a large range of representation in the "meta" or Tournaments. I believe Khorne is pretty consistently mid to low tier, Slaanesh is for whatever reason never played, Nurgle does consistently well, and Tzeentch used to dominate super hard but has fallen into midrange to low range I think? Skaven I heard were trash but have been climbing into the high places lately. Slaves to Darkness...idk. I've never heard of them in a tournament or seen anyone really talk about them. They have some sweet models though. I think beasts of chaos are pretty strong and rank well, not 100% sure. Legions of Azgorh seem like high mid tier to low high tier.
So even with Chaos we have a large range of armies with totally different tool sets that win or at least place well more consistently. So what is balance? All of the armies have an equal chance at #1 with skill being the deciding factor? Is it ok Khorne and Slaanesh are lower tier and nurgle is higher tier? That's balance from a whole faction from the bottom rungs to the top you have a bell curve there or whatever. Some low, some middle, some high, and consistently so within that particular faction with a few big wins for Khorne and the like, and probably some really sad showings of nurgle lists that went 0-5 at some point too.
To be fair the khorne book hasn't been out for long yet and slaanesh and slaves/darkoath don't have books yet so time will tell.
The Rumour Thread
in Age of Sigmar Discussions
Posted
I'll play devils advocate and say that at least we are getting banger rules out the gate whereas most of the larger armies have either bad rules or useless units. So perhaps roster bloat is a bad thing, especially considering khorne effectively went through 3 books to get to the point their at now.