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Everything posted by Scurvydog

  1. I will attend a weekend spanning event of 30 people and 5 teams, all moving around large interactive map on a projector screen, with fights taking place on the tabletop of course, sort of like a narrative warhammer mixed with settlers and risk metagame on top. It is still a competetion, but there is also some narrative considerations and backstory to come up with along with crazy things that can happen, like fights player team mates reinforcing with their armies in real time, so a fight can become a 2v1 or 2v2 etc. Battleplans are completely custom made as well. I first considered playing my bonereapers, but I also want to make friends, so instead I am heavily considering bringing some bombastic general on a dragon to lean in on the heroic narrative. There are also some interesting restrictions and extra rules: Points start at 1200, but can be increased by 150-200 depending on conquering territory, which is divided within the teams. Most of the time a list will probably be around the 1350 mark, you can add and remove units but it incurs af timeout penalty. NO artifacts allowed, custom artifacts can be gained during the campaign, but as such these can not be taken into account and can be ignored when chosing stormhosts. An important restriction is also Natural save rolls of 1 AND 2 always fails (can still do rerolls though), so the immortal builds are out. If anyone are still with me here, I'd like some input on how to go about this with very limited points, as obviously the stardrake takes a huge chunk of the limited points. For my 1200 baseline I am considering these options: Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsLord-Celestant on Stardrake (500)- General- Celestine Hammer- Mount Trait: Storm-winged5 x Liberators (100)5 x Liberators (100)2 x Concussors (240)2 x Concussors (240)Total: 1180 / 1250 OR Allegiance: Stormcast EternalsDrakesworn Templar (420)- General- Tempest AxeKnight-Incantor (140)5 x Liberators (100)5 x Liberators (100)2 x Concussors (240)3 x Vanguard-Palladors (180) I am allowed to change the type of drake if I go into higher points, but I also like the idea of having the same guy as my general through it all, although you could always say he was fighting in a different way I guess. Stormhost is difficult, without artifacts in the picture I am also heavily considering Knights Excelsior (also close to my paint scheme), mostly due to the command trait which is +1 damage on all the generals melee weapons against heroes. My logic here is that this trait allows the general to actually fight other heroes, especially stuff like Keepers and bosses on manglers and such. If I kill anything reroll 1s to hit the rest of the game is nice enough, although the command ability is terrible. Anvils could also be good, with so many points invested in 1 model in a small game, having that model potentially fight more often for 1 CP can be a huge deal by itself. I apologize for the long rant, but perhaps some might find it interesting to really look at these units under very tight restrictions to analyze what really shines when.
  2. I think most of the community at this point agrees that Stormcast are not in a great place, they suffer a lot from being the first book in the edition along with nighthaunt, both are books with a lot of strange choice and looks like an Alpha test of the later tomes this edition. It does take the prize for most horrible battalions ever put into a book I think
  3. half moon shapes and blinged out? This obviously belongs to a Gloomspite character who stole the hat of a pointy aelf.
  4. That is also an option, the baseline of the Stormcast as a whole needs to be looked at, with 2 wounds "elite" infantry becoming the norm. This is a problem with AoS having no toughness value, which limits what you can do to represent a tough unit. The fluff seems to suggest they are in line with custodes from 40k or up there in pure power, not just physically larger, but also powered by the divine. Right now though a liberator is vastly outdone by the common ardboy or basic fyreslayer. While a liberator sohuld not be better than the elites of other armies, it should not be weaker than basic battleline at the same cost. I think the introduction of sequitors really hurt the army overall, as they are so similar in their intended role, we already have paladins and also evocators now for the elite of the elite roles, but that puts liberators vs sequitors in an odd spot. Who thought it would be a good idea to make Sequitors just better liberators? 5 sequitors on average deals 6.8 damage against a 4+ save, if they choose reroll to hit Liberators do 2,6 damage vs a 4+. That is a crazy gap, sequitors also have the option to reroll saves instead. This leaves a lot of room for improvement for Liberators, but they do not need to be damage machines, just a bit better there, and then tougher. I also still belive giving them an edge in capturing objectives is a way to differentiate them from the other potential battlelines in the army
  5. These lists will have HUGE issues with some other lists, I know as I have played a bunch against an Ogor player with pure beastrider lists and the drakes are just puny there, can't use their bites or tails at all against all those monsters, then you pay 500 points for your celestant to mount a vampire lord who forgot his magic No anti magic in an army incredibly vulnerable to mortal wounds really banks on the alpha, despite dragons being rather poor alpha striking monsters compared to Stonehorns, Mawkrushas etc. The problem I found with anvils and dracothian guards is the hero phase part and 12" range, so you need to start with the unit within 12" before it can move, to shoot in the hero phase. That rarely happens outside the opponent failing a charge or you get the double turn on your opponent. To make this happen you also need a hero in range, so at this point range you have over 60% of your army in 1 spot, which could mean auto loosing any battleplan with spread out or many objectives. I really like dracoths though, despite them not being all that great, but I think 8 desolators is a bit too many eggs in one basket. I really prefer the more expensive concussors, 4 man squads being really dangerous as they will most likely get a 6 and prevent a pile-in, which can be devastating with good charge positioning, not to mention the mortal wounds and increased hit chance. Desolators got more attacks, but they are 1 bloodboil away from dropping below cocussor output in their efficency with none of the utility.
  6. Been playing around with some ideas on "fixes" for Liberators and the paladin unit types: Liberators: 120 pts (20 increase for 5) same statwheel Weapon changes: +1 rend to both hammer types, +1 to wound on both sword types. +1 attack for for non great weapons. dual wield and shield rules remain the same. Lay low the tyrant changed to: "The resolve of liberators only increase as they come face to face with the most dangerous foes" - +2 bravery when the liberator unit is within 3" of an enemy model with a wound characteristic of 5 or more. New ability: Hold the line!: "Liberators are known to stem the tide against the most impossible odds" When determining control of an objective, a unit of Liberators always counts as a minimum of 10 models even if there are fewer models than 10 in the unit. This should turn liberators into the true objective holders, inspired a bit by the ogor book as well, to help Stormcast with the low model count problem in the objective game and give liberators a clear role. Fightyness improved somewhat too along with point increase to reflect what these warriors should be like, still lower raw damage output or ability to reroll all saves like sequitors. All Paladin units: +20 point increase, +1 save across the board. Starsoul mace changed to: Instead of the normal attack squence roll 5 dice. Each 4+ is a mortal wound, each 6+ is 2 mortal wounds Retributors: Blast to ashes: changed to the same rules as concussors have i.e. 6 to hit is 1 MW in addition and denys pile in moves. Protectors: +1 attack Decimators: +1 damage to thunderaxes An obvious upgrade and also point increase to bring them in line with evocators. Starsoul maces are hard to balance compared to evocators who on average dishes out 1 MW in addition per model. They will still be slower than evocators, but tougher and the damage output more in line with point cost and todays power creep. Wishful thinking I guess, I just love the warrior chamber stuff
  7. The Warcry warbands are a pretty good indicator that humans are not all that different across the realms. These chaos influenced cults should also be some of the more heavily influenced, so a "regular" uncorrupted freeguild human for example would most likely not be physically too different, other than being more pale in the realm of shadows or leaner/larger with bigger canine teeth from Ghur. I do hope for a reimagined "empire" at some point. It has some charm the freeguild can be anything in the fluff, but at some point real new miniatures would be nice, hopefully with some kits allowing great kitcashes and conversions.
  8. I am also considering giving Anvils a try, 1 CP to get your 500 pt model to fight again is not bad, although without staunch and on the offense, there might pass 2 combat phases before you even get the chance to use it, and often at that point the combat will have been decided or ended. Staunch is really good, but also sort of annoying to play with, as it requires a lot of finnicky moving around if you want to cover more models, but it does improve the value of many units by a lot, that 100 pts liberator screen is rather durable with a 3+ reroll 1's for their points and I enjoy putting them in front of the drake dropping from the sky whereever I take the drake in the early game. It would be freeing not using it though, and could be awesome and could be terrible, so would love to hear peoples experiences, considering how many dangerous things are running around these days, who can take down a drake with little effort without it having protection to the teeth.
  9. This I'm afraid. I fear this was a bad experience for the opponent as well, with what sounds like a lot of salt after having bought a cool model with decent rules and point balancing. He did not even bring any super powerful artifact or anything and many many many other things are just as good. OP might have a bad army put together, but it sounds more like inexperience and an expectation to push minituares forward and be effective with that. Mawkrushas are hugely expensive points wise, each wound done to it hurts a lot. It has a huge base and 1" reach, exploit that. With good movement, positioning and screening, you can deny it good targets and punish it, yea if sacrifing a 200 point unit for a charge, but you can then do a powerful counter charge and either kill or cripple it, then that is a good trade in your favor. Think like that and games will swing in your favor. Many units are almost who hits first kills, big models are a lot of eggs in one basket. If the Mawkrusha just goes in full speed, all you need is to not give et a really juicy target, then deal with it, as most of the rest of the army will probably be way behind with their 4" move.
  10. If the Stardrake was less iffy overall I would probably avoid it just for that, but as it stands it cant even hurt another behemoth/hero without using this with the basic pathetic melee profiles. It does seem like a bit of rule lawyering to use, but nonetheless legal and nothing in the rules to say you can't do this. One oculd also say this is the hallmark of someone using the time to learn the details of the rules, as knowing the difference between normal moves and just moves is very important in many other situations as well and how to maximize this. You could also explain how this works and if the opponent is so much against the rules, you can offer to choose a different mount trait and be the bigger person, both of you well knowing the entire game due to your elequent explanation, that your opponent is a little wuss too scared for advanced use of the core rules
  11. First of it is distinguishing between "normal move" and "a move", the stormwinged trait is any move. This was the case ofr Hydro-something-cloak from malign sorceries, which was FAQ'd to only be for "normal move", so the effect only triggers in the movement phase. The storm winged trait has not been FAQ'd and as such a charge and pile in counts as "a move" and nothing stops you rule wise from lifting up the model in a pile in, move it 1" forward and backwards and end the same place, as the have to just end the move as close, or closer to the nearest model, so standing still is basically fine. Very gimmicky but absolutely within the rules. Maybe it should be FAQ'd, but they did that to similar things in the malign soeceries FAQ, but not the stormcast FAQ, so either it is intended or they simply forgot/do not care.
  12. While I think losing Stormwinged is a huge loss to the drake (my opponents hate this "gimmick") it could be fun to run a drake in the living city. With ironoak artisan for +1 save and +1 to all melee wound rolls, and spear of the hunt to strike at the start of the combat phase when charging and +1 rend on a weapon. I don't think the rain of stars count as "having shot" so a Drakesworn might need to be the general here. But you could then use a drakesworn and a unit of dracothian guards pop in from the rear, shoot and use a CP to then move and have short charges. The drake strikes first in combat, then you choose the dracothians after, before the opponent gets to hit. I don't know if that is super competetive, but the sheer fun of "OMG dragon attack from behind!" has some fun value I think! Pepper in freeguild battleline: Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar- City: Living CityFreeguild General (100)- City Role: General's Adjutant (Must be 6 wounds or less)Celestial Hurricanum With Celestial Battlemage (280)Battlemage (90)Drakesworn Templar (420)- General- Arc Hammer- Trait: Ironoak Artisan- Artefact: Spear of the Hunt40 x Freeguild Guard (280)- Halberds and Shields20 x Freeguild Handgunners (200)10 x Freeguild Handgunners (100)4 x Concussors (480)Extra Command Point (50)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 127 It might be bonkers, but being able to wedge the enemy between angry dragon riders and a line of free people with a lot of guns and swords, along with some magic could work I think, if not for tournaments I think it has some bite for a fun example list.
  13. I agree on Gitz but will have to disagree on OBR and Warclans on some points. OBR has plenty of options and playstyles, they also have nothing that prevents the opponent for doing any tactics or strategies unlike many other tomes. So this perception must really come from too much echo chambering in communities. People say they are boring to play against, why? Only because of high saves? Many other books have standout units being a pain, in this case 1 legion and 1 unit (Mortek Guard) seems to grind the gears of people. But unlike Slaanesh they do not rob you of your turn to fight, in fact you can plan for all their moves as they have no shenanigans other than just being really good at the base rules. Yes 1 legion is poorly balanced as all heck, but that does not just make it the worst book of all time as this thread seems to indicate, just a lot of salt it seems from people refusing to learn to fight the new thing, and be in old man yells at cloud mode instead. I'd love for petrifex to be nerfed/removed though to get rid of this perception, as it really is a good book, with very cool fluff and also plenty of options, you can make a movement and cavalry foced list, you can bring some big monsters and named heroes, you can bring exploding battlelines, you can focus on artellery fire, tanky elites or fast elites, all are options! Then look at Warclans, for some reason mentioned a lot here as good, why? As an Ironjawz player I got 3 clans, instead of 6 options most others get. No terrain, no endless spells to stand out, not even a new hero from a box or something. There are only 3 non hero units, 2 of which basically does the same thing, the third also doing the same thing but a bit faster. Do you want a shooting IJ lisT? nope, want a heavy caster focus? nope bad idea. Want to use the new brute models? nope nothing supports them well, so even with only 3 units, internal balance is still poor, wow, and the narrative is not moving anywhere there really. Anyway overall I have few tomes I find without any issues, but I find some really great elements of some and would like to point out the best and worst specific parts (despite otherp roblems there might be): Best parts: Fyreslayer lodges, while they do have standouts, they are still all cool and thematic and creates diversity of playstyles in a limited unit roster, which as mentioned somethink like Ironjawz allegiance completely fails at. Examples like a Magmadroth focused lodge with mount traits for all or the one where your small heroes can fight at the same time as nearby heroes and get more artifacts, so you can really doube down on having a small thematic elite force. Gitz and Ogors are both great and is indeed as some mention where the game would be in a healthy spot, Ogors did a much better job at giving the option to focus on specific parts of gutbusters or beastriders but also organic ways to mix them, which Warclans failed at. Gitz does this without using a clan/tribe mecahnic at all, for good and bad, I do prefer the Ogor way here I think with a happy middle ground. Khorne, this book has it all with a lot of options and interesting units, building a list takes some planning and you need to use a lot of synergies, but if you do and execute well, then the army can steamroll in a thematic way without being bonkers (expect when you get hit with 24+ mortal wounds from Skarbrand in 1 swing maybe). Worst parts: Slaanesh just to beat a dead horse, even with the new FAQ it simply doubles down on the worst offenders and punishes the non meta lists, it brought down the external balance issue a little bit, while exaggerating the internal balance issue, which was a poor fix to an obviously broken primary mechanic of the tome. Except the new heroes which are great, the book lacks compelling and diverse battelines and elite units, with everything doing almost the same thing. Fyreslayers again, which shows how a tome can be both good and bad we can just take a look at the battalions on offer, with many battalions in 2nd edition becoming increasingly mediocre, we see a standout which is 100% a pick and anything without is intentionally nerfing your army potential, you will have to knowlingly give yourself a handicap to play anything more diverse, which brings me to. Bonereapers. As mentioned before there are good parts of this tome, calling it all bad is a mistake and saying no diversity is plain false with a big new range of units with most of them being completely viable on the table. However the subfactions are horribly balanced in such a degree it has created such a hate train you can hardly play the army in some communities without being treated like some kind of leper. Sylvaneth as an dishonorable mention here, even though I do not play them myself, I play against them a lot and the army is just strangely disjointed and more annoying than anything. The Sylvaneth player has to carry all these terrain pieces around, any narrative table setup mission turns into arguing about room for those stupid trees and the entire book seems like a scheme to sell cheap china plastic woods. The main face of the former book and in part the new ones are the tree revenants, but you have no option to make them the main fighting force in any functional capacity and the new revenant hero buffs kurnoth hunters and not revenants, wow, completely puzzled here.
  14. If stuck with the book choices, Obsidian amulet for 4+ ignore spells is not all that bad, although a downgrade from Ignax in many cases, but Ignax does not defend against all kinds of other spell effects though. It does not exclude friendly spells though, but that might not be so important. I wouldnt count the drakescale as bad either on the drakesworn to reroll saves vs more than dmg 1 attacks. Wildcard choice could also be quicksilver potion, yes it is one use, but it forces certain plays and is not a random chance, it will most likely always have an important impact on the game.
  15. Thanks for the input, I have been using that color for my base edges for every single army I guess it is just a habit and not a conscious choice at this point, so opinions are nice to consider new angles. I will stick to my white/grey boys and experiment a bit more with the double highlights at least on the most eye catching parts, combined with a bit of focused extra shading next to the apothecary white and see how I like it
  16. that could also work, takes a bit more time, but at least it is a low model count army
  17. I recently started a Stormcast force focusing on the "old" models. My goal was a slightly darker knights excelsior look, using their scheme except the "white" being a darker. I am kind of torn about my results so far, as I have based my scheme around the grey seer base color. In some ways I like it, but I also find it to almost look "unfinished" although I am not a master painter and my approach is already taking a lot of more spare time (2 toddlers will do that!) , but I would like some opinions and maybe pointers as well, if anyone got ideas for a nicer finish or if I should just entirely redo the armor. My approach for the plain armor is currently grey seer base spray, reapply grey seer paint, apothecary white contrast, edge highlights. My celestant and concussor was done wiht Ulthuan grey highlights while I used white scar for the liberator to get a bit brighter highlights for more "pop". I feel like a middle ground might blend a tad better, so will try with corax white next time, but I just wanted some second opinions before I put time into even more models. Here are some examples:
  18. If facing OBR do not target Mortek guard as long as a nearby harvester is alive if at all possible. Try to kill harvesters and any nearby heroes. Mortek guard can only use a point to reroll saves in the combat phase, so shooting with rend is effective. Aetherwings will come in handy, as OBR has no tricks to teleport and will most likely not being morghasts, so no flying on their part either, so cheap screening will work a charm. Use evocators to take out heroes/harvesters/stalkers, don't throw them into a huge blob of mortek guard, ideally you just want to tie them up with annoying things. Aetherwings, the odd gryph hound etc can all zone out a blob of guards in their tracks. Place key support characters in cover if possible and OBR is bringing catapults, they have no rend so a 2+ SC hero will most likely just make them waste their 200 pts model (a lucky shot still hurts though, but thats dice). Stormcast got some good tools all in all to deal with OBR, so it will not be impossible and while tough it is not the worst matchup SCE has.
  19. Just had a game, lower points of 1350 and just went for it and brought a celestant on drake, 2x2 concussors, castellant and 2x5 liberators + CP. Faced of against a bloodgullet Ogor army with just about twice the wound count, 2 butchers, 12 gluttons, 2x4 ironguts and 4 leadbelchers. In most scenarios I would be hard pressed here, the board presence and model count would be imposible but we rolled 3 places of power. I took turn 1 and placed the dragon right in the center, then chose to bunker up all my other units around it basically, using a unit of 5 liberators from the sky to screen the 12 man glutton unit with 1 unit of concussors behind, my plan being to sacrifice the libs to the MW from the coming ogor charge, then activate my concussors and get some hits in for "free". This worked perfectly, long story short I managed to nearly table him by the bottom of round 2, which I did not expect at all, but the scenario was very much in my favor, especially after I killed 1 of his heroes, even though he managed to snipe my castellant with the d6 mortal wound spell and rolling a 6. Even 12 gluttons with 0 rend does nothing to 2+ reroll 1s saves on the concussors wittled down that unit by themselves loosing only 2 wounds total... The dragon managed to eat 3 ironguts in total, while only dropping 4 wounds from some spells. Being able to bunker up was so effective but I doubt that will work out as well in many other scenarios. While on paper I first thought the dragon was rather meh, and concussors way overpriced, they have managed to pull of some stunts for me over a few games now after getting this army. Although much of this is down to staunch defender and is a bit cheesy perhaps. It also requires some rather conservative play and does not allow for much skirmishing like that. I really do like concussors though and think their blast to ashes is rather underrated, as it helps them be more aggressive, you can do witout staunch defender on the charge as long as you get 1 6 to hit, the opponent cant pile in at all which can be massive. Anyway I am looking at expanding to a 2k list, and considered something like this: Allegiance: Stormcast Eternals Mortal Realm: Aqshy Celestant-Prime (340) Lord-Celestant on Stardrake (500) - General - Celestine Hammer - Trait: Staunch Defender - Artefact: Ignax's Scales - Mount Trait: Storm-winged Lord-Castellant (120) Knight-Incantor (140) 5 x Liberators (100) - Warhammer & Shield 5 x Liberators (100) - Warhammer & Shield 5 x Liberators (100) - Warhammer & Shield 4 x Concussors (480) Everblaze Comet (100) Total: 1980 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 85 Very low wound count and model count for objectives, but hopefully enough MW output to really hit where it hurts when it needs to. Might prioritize the castellant for the concussors and I will then have 2 massive threats to cover a bit more ground, they will be missing some stacking save benefits though, but allow the list to center less on 1 point if needed and still be rather tough.
  20. I do not see all that much reason to run Stalliarch Lords without deathriders though, traversing the table should be the least of the problems when using that legion, with deathriders being 12"+3+d6+1+2d6+1 charge threat range which means you can roll all snake eyes but still charge 20" and up to 31"! I feel the entire point of that list would be to keep out of range of everything critical, then swoop in with a long bomb charge on all the riders, maybe in 10 man units and also possibly a deathglaive of stalkers/morghast to keep up for a devastating early charge. The command ability to disengage also only works on mounted units, but I am thinking this could be of some worth especially for 10 man rider units, which could really make the opponent sweat, if they manage to break the lines and then keep going in following turns, hunting down vulnerable targets.
  21. It looks like a gutplate for a gargant considering the size of the skulls. It looks to piecemeal and shoddy even by Ogor standard (despite it all). It also does not really fit with Ironjawz either, so the gargant rumor and other large strange objects in the rumor engine lately seems to fit this.
  22. I enjoy his model so much. There is also a passage in the tome about him and his retinue facing a lord of change, which drives home the point how he really does not want to lower himself to menial tasks, but after his entire crew is decimated he calmly just slices of the head of the LoC and proceeds to a new vantage point to command his forces. So many models have scenery on their bases anyway, just imagine he is finding vantage points on the battlefield, commands/fights then proceeds to a new one.
  23. Has anyone tried the Stalliarch lords yet? For a 1200-1600 point campaign I am considering a Stalliarch lords list based on Cavalry, with the 1200 core start looking like this: Allegiance: Ossiarch Bonereapers - Legion: Stalliarch Lords Leaders Liege-Kavalos (200) Mortisan Boneshaper (130) Battleline 10 x Kavalos Deathriders (360) - Nadirite Blade and Shield 5 x Kavalos Deathriders (180) - Nadirite Blade and Shield 10 x Mortek Guard (130) - Nadirite Blade and Shield Units 3 x Necropolis Stalkers (200) Total: 1200 / 1250 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 0 / 200 Wounds: 79 Any feedback is welcome on the list, and especially with experiences with Stalliarch lords. My thinking with a unit of 10 Kavaloi is to maximize my RDP, for both +1 attack, retreat and charge etc, which will let most of the list rapidly redeploy and hit where it hurts most. Stalkers also synergise well, as their cmd ability allows both run and charge rerolls I think.
  24. Sounds like a solid enough model base, but the factions you mention do have quite some mortal wound output which hurts a lot, to counter that you could do something like the list below. If you are playing modified vanguard and not battlehost you can potentially replace the Kavalos with a unit of Stalkers. Use guards as screens and then counter attack. Discipline points will be low, might want to go with arcane command spell, which is not so hard to cast either if you got the shrieker up and getting more +1 rend commands, +3 move or reroll shield saves will be worth more than any of the other spells. LeadersLiege-Kavalos (200)Mortisan Boneshaper (130)Battleline20 x Mortek Guard (260)- Nadirite Blade and Shield20 x Mortek Guard (260)- Nadirite Blade and Shield5 x Kavalos Deathriders (180)- Nadirite Blade and ShieldBehemothsGothizzar Harvester (200)Gothizzar Harvester (200)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsBone-tithe Shrieker (30)Total: 1460 / 2000
  25. It is the realm spell if you play in Shyish
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