Emissary

I'm back. Thinking about a different version of the list above. Thoughts? KatakrosMortisian Boneshaper with Artisan's Key, Diversionary TacticsMir Kainan20 Mortek Guard3 Immortis Guard3 Necropolis Stalkers Kainan's ReapersGothizzar HarvesterSoulstealer Carrion It comes to 1,780 points. Now I have 4 options: 1) 3 more Immortis Guard to make the unit 6 models 2) 3 more Necropolis Stalkers to make that unit 6 models 3) A 2nd unit of Immortis Guard 4) a 2nd unit of Necropolis Stalkers Each has its benefits. The bigger unit use buffs better and are harder to remove. However, the smaller units are more flexible. Thoughts? I'm leaning towards a 2nd unit of Stalkers at the moment.

I think I'm heading down the same path as well: Petrifex Elite, everything fits into a Battle Regiment Battalion Arkhan the Black Mortisian Boneshaper with Artisan's Key, Diversionary Tactics Mortisian Boneshaper 20 Mortek Guard 3 Immortis Guard 3 Immortis Guard 3 Necropolis Stalkers 3 Necropolis Stalkers Gothizzar Harvester Soulstealer Carrion 2,000 points exactly It gives 3 blocks that can move around to take objectives while having the stalkers and Arkhan to fill in where needed. If there is a backfield objective, one set of Immortis Guard and the non-general Boneshaper will hold it.

I've been comparing Vokmortian to a Soulmason and he compares well. Vok is 20 points cheaper, has just about identical stats (he has a good shooting attack compared to the meh throne claws. Both cast and dispel 2. Vok lacks the mortisian keyword if you need it for some reason. The soulmason only favorably compares if you need it's spell, but the spell is highly limited now. If you aren't relying on the buff for morteks or deathriders, Vok is probably better. Also, I'm really curious about Mir Kainan and his unit. They look worrisome at 250 points, but you're actually getting quite a lot at that point. The 5 models in the Reapers each have 2 wounds and he can bring back 3 of them at a time (hence 6 wounds). Dire Ultimatum could be used really well against units as it can cause a lot of wasted opportunities for attack, but you have to start your turn in melee to use it. Meanwhile the reapers can tank wounds for Kainan on the way yet. I'm not saying they're autoinclude, but I think there is potential to explore. I actually don't think he's bad at the moment. Can get protection via the Immortis, him plus the immortis would do the sculptor's entourage easily and throws out a good number of attacks with a good weapon against mobs of troops. I'm actually excited to try him out.

lol, probably the same reason why in the base rules finishing setting up first gives you priority in a tied priority roll in the first battle round and then it was changed right back to the person finishing setting up first gets priority in matched play.

You're right, I see that now in his FAQ. I thought he was being added because he had the khorne/tzeentch/slaanesh/nurgle keyword which was changed.

Archaon is limited to Slaves to Darkness armies now. Can't be in the 4 god specific armies anymore. Some of the forgeworld models are back for matched play!

I understand that, but the 3" rule in the general's handbook is with the before the start of the game setup instructions. The first paragraph on the Awakened Wyldwood datasheet where it mentions being 3" from other terrain and objectives is also only talking about the before the start of the game setup. That's why we've been playing it as those that 3" setup restriction doesn't affect them once the game is started.

Also note that the 3" restriction only affects the awakened wyldwoods you place before setup. The ones you summon with spells, ancients or the acorn just follow their 1" from other model rules. (Single trees still have to be more than 3" from each other).

Had some more games with the Sylvaneth and I think they're in a good place right now. Some thoughts: 1) You can really use the small Awakened Wyldwoods' (AW) mortal wound output offensively. I said it in my last post, but my current army doesn't mind going first as I have a lot of ranged attacks in it. Hence, if I go first I can usually easily throw out 6 more small AWs on the first turn (from the chalice of nectar spell on the warsong and the ancient's ability). Instead of throwing them out all over the board, I've been clustering them near objectives. I get them as close as I can to each other while keeping the 3" spacing from each other and the 1" from other models. The idea is to force your opponents unit to get within 1" of several small AW if they want to get to the objective or to your units. This way you roll multiple dice every charge phase or after every spell to see if they take mortal wounds (plus the ancient's signature spell). It can make your opponent very wary to go after the objective or your unit and increases the damage output from that part of your army. Plus it makes the army much less vulnerable to a monster destroying our terrain. Unless I really need the line of sight blocking or cover, I've resorted to taking the trees in small units now. 2) A unit of 6 Kurnoth Hunters with Greatbows are quickly becoming a fixture of my army and my opponents are REALLY starting to hate them. The +1 to hit command has made all the difference, especially when backed up by the reroll 1s to hit aura on a nearby Gnarlroot Warsong Revenant (their normal buddy). Their shooting is a real threat. Last game they killed 9 of 10 Blood Warriors turn 1, a unit of 10 Marauders turn 2, 3 Wrathmongers turn 3 (and my opponent saved well) and the game was called at the start of turn 4. They and Drycha has been using Unleash Hell very well to protect themselves and their buddies and overall they've been a real pain for my friends. Lastly, the Warsong Revenant has been bringing the generic spell levitate since he already knows all the Sylvaneth ones. It makes them fly until your next command phase which allows them to see through wyldwoods and your large awakened wyldwoods. I usually don't have too much of a problem getting line of sight with them, but it has stopped my opponent from hiding a good deal. 3) The amount of good shooting and mortal wound output of the army is impressive and coupled with their great armor saves now has really helped. Plus the army is good in all phases of the game. They cast well, move well, shoot well and have some good melee. They're not the best in the phases but are at least adequate and usually better than average. I really like the well rounded armies as it gives options and allows you to be flexible. The biggest standouts for me so far have been the Kurnoth Hunters with Greatbows, Treelord Ancient (his command ability is bonkers) and Drycha. The Ancient and Drycha are already great, but the extra buffs from 3.0 in Unleash Hell, breaking up AW into 3 parts, the ancient's command ability giving out +1 save and radiating out from Hunters and that both are heroes and monsters puts them over the top IMO.

I agree, but what's weird is that the Warhammer Community Army Builder is allowing uniques to take the universal spells.

I love my harbringers with halberds. Underrated unit. The -1 ld aura on them is also great with the bone tithe shrieker. Also remember the new boards are smaller and you start closer now

5 do not have to be within 1" of 2 models, only one. The rend on swords is still more important. Arkhan can not take the monster slot since he is also a leader. He can only do the commander slot. I'm referring to core battalions. If you are referring to battle tactics, then carry on.

There were plenty of firing lanes. Plus it is 3" los through woods now iirc. I didnt really park them in woods as they didnt need the cover. For the save i meant spending multiple command points over the battle round for all out defense. My opponent spent at least half his points on that in the game. I understand about the aura. It juat prevented a discussion, but it also means you dont have to worry about not being able to use all out attack or defense if you want.

Played a 2,000 point game against a friend today and thought I should share some thoughts on Sylvaneth in 3.0. We called the game after round 4 was the score was 24-7 for the Sylvaneth. His army: Slaves to Darkness (daemon prince faction, whichever that one is) 3 Daemon Princes (Slaanesh) Chaos Sorcerer on Manticore (Slaanesh) 20 Chaos Warriors with 2 weapons 2x5 Chaos Knights Warshrine 5 Chaos Chosen Battle Regiment and Warlord Core Battalions My army: Gnarlroot Warlord Core Battalion Treelord Ancient Warsong Revenant (Chalice and General) Branchwraith (Spiritsong Stave) 5 Tree-Revenants 5 Tree-Revenants Hunters of the Heartlands Core Battalion 6 Kurnoth Hunters with Greatbows 3 Kurnoth Hunters with Swords 5 Spite Revenants Drycha Gladewyrm Spiteswarm Hive Thoughts: 1) As much as people have been talking about the new command abilities, in all 3 games I've played so far, by far the most important change is armor saves. You can get +2 and +3 fairly easily with the All out Defense and Mystic Shield. Because of the hard +1 cap, your model's base save is very important now. Since all our monsters are at a 3+, this is huge. My monsters were rocking a 2+ almost always. Rend isn't nearly as much of a factor now if you have -1. It's too easy to remove. It's more to keep them honest to spread out the armor buffs rather than dump them all on one unit. The Sylvaneth are really, really good at bumping that armor save up. It's going to be a huge strength to the army. 2) With #1, the Treelord Ancient is AMAZING now. I cannot imagine not bringing him at this point. Autoinclude! HIs command ability is easily top tier, especially with the large radius and the fact that it spirals out from Kurnoth Hunters. Between it, the Hive, Dryad's abilities, Tanglethorn Thicket, Mystic Shield and Cover, I never had to spend a command point for armor saves and everyone in the army was rocking +1 to their saves against just about all hits with no rend for most of the game. The only time it didn't happen was if they wandered away for an objective or as a screen. Throw in the free wyldwood and that he's a caster with the reroll 1s to hit bubble and he's a solid model now. 3) Along with this, because Drycha, the Ancient, Durthu and Alarielle are both monsters and heroes, it gives them access to a lot. Drycha was able to tank 20 chaos warriors for 5 rounds of combat even though I was rolling more than average 1s for save because she started healing herself d3 wounds with the hero ability more often. The ancient's damage went up because he could stomp and do d3 mortal wounds to that daemon prince at the end of every charge phase, whicle Drycha was turning off all command abilities for the Chaos Warriors. 4) For command abilities, they are good. My opponent used +1 to save just about every turn. Because of all the save bonuses, I was able to focus more on the +1 to hit and just putting up the ancient's ability every turn. Unleash Hell is awesome for Drycha and the Hunters with Greatbows. In the game the hunters were charged with a daemon prince with a 5+ ward and they still did 7 wounds to him when he charged, then killed him later with their trample. I did move away with my tree revenants while still holding an objective which made another daemon prince be out of range for his charge. You do run out of command points quickly though and can't spend them like water. You don't have nearly as many as Ossiarch Bonereapers, so don't play that way. 5) Speaking of command abilities, do not sleep on the Hunters of the Heartlands core battalion. It makes those units immune to monstrous rampages. It was huge in our game because the manticore could not roar and turn off the hunter's getting the +1 from the ancient's command ability. Plus they couldn't get stomped. It's a very easy battalion to bring and I fully recommend it. 6) Our army is also well setup to do the Grand Strategy and Battle Tactics. For the Grand Strategy, the one where one of your battleline units surviving is easy with tree-revenants and you should get your 3 points constantly. Also, because they teleport, taking 2 units of them makes the Battle Tactic where you have to get 2 units in their deployment zone easy as well. 7) I really liked the unit of 6 hunters with greatbows. The +1 to hit command ability REALLY helps their 1 problem: hitting on 4s. Between it and the reroll 1s to hit from Gnarlroot they were very consistent and were putting out anywhere from 6-8 wounds a turn (they will pull a +1 to save command ability from your opponent a lot). After they shot down the daemon prince that charged them, it made my opponent a little wary to charge them or the unit next to them in the following command phase (double turn). Also, with the smaller board and smaller length apart, the army doesn't care too much about going first in the first round. You get to set up your woods easily and then have plenty of shooting between the hunters, ancient and Drycha. Overall, I'm really happy with where the Sylvaneth are. The game didn't feel like a fluke and played how I expected it to play without any real outlandish luck. I'm playing against Khorne on Wednesday, so see how it does against some bloodthirsters.

Doubtful. The new skeletons and zombies came on 25mm bases. They would not want to repackage all that.

Here's what I'm thinking for my first army for tomorrow's game: Gnarlroot Glade Warlord Open Battalion Treelord Ancient Warsong Revenant with Chalice of Nectar, Nurtured by Magic Branchwraith with Spiritsong Stave 5 Tree-Revenants 5 Tree-Revenants Hunters of the Heartlands Open Battalion 3 Kurnoth Hunters with Greatswords 6 Kurnoth Hunters with Greatbows 10 Dryads Other Spirit of Durthu Gladewyrm 1995 points Thoughts? The big decision for me has been the Spirit of Durthu vs. Drycha. The greatbows with +1 to hit from All out Attack and reroll 1s should put in some work.

It looks to me that was removed so it wouldn't stack with the spell lore enhancement. The spell lore enhancement says you pick 1 spell for each wizard and that you can pick different spells from different spell lores for different wizards. Plus you always get 1 of each enhancement for free. I don't see the issue honestly.

The mortek guard's shield wall didn't change, though only one unit can use it a turn. All of the core battalions that let you use one of the command abilities free once a game now allow OBR to get a free RDP once a game.

One other thing if you haven't played 3.0 yet. It looks like the other armies have a ton of options and are getting a ton more command points. Yes, there are more, but in our test games they're not getting everything you're assuming all the time. They aren't getting Unleash Hell AND All Out Defense AND Inspiring Presence AND faction command abilities every turn. getting 2-4 is more but we still get at least double that. It has been more, but it wasn't like we were expecting. It's more like when your opponent would save up and use them all in one turn.

The board size for one. The game pushes you together more and your armies no longer start 24" most of the time. Most of the time you're starting 22"-18" apart. This really helps for a mid-field army that we have and helps to offset the loss of giving multiple units a +3" of movement a turn. Plus we have some fast units like the cav and harbringers which this helps. Having a set of tough, renewable infantry being able to march up is still good. Secondly, a lot of armies lost reroll 1s for armor saves. Not only did the Mortek Guard retain shield wall, but the changes to mystic shield and petrifex elite really help them in survivability. (The changes to Mystic Shield and Petrifex Elite help the army overall honestly). They effectively have a 2+ rerollable save in that set up (thought 1s and 2s always fail.) That's really big. Plus, you can run them easily in the Hunters of the Heartlands core battalion so that they aren't affected by Monster Rampages so the shield wall can't get denied. We are getting a free 1-2 relentless discipline points now for going first or second. Arkhan is strictly better being a monster and a hero and is much better as long as he can spam mystic shield. I've already talked about the Bone-Tithe Shrieker before so you can just scroll above for my thoughts on that. The new unit coherency rules don't punish us nearly as much as they do others. The mortek guard don't care as they're still getting the same number of attacks which anything on a larger than 25mm base got a nerf in that department. Just a few off the top of my head.

You can't use the same command ability more than once per phase right now. You can use different command abilities with relentless discipline in the same phase. Overall, I'm waiting to get a few games in before the sky is falling. The army is dead or we got literally nothing posts are a bit of hyperbole and theatre which doesn't help adapting to the new rules.

Either 20 or 30 will work. With the change to command abilities, I only see myself using one main unit of guard not as only 1 unit can get the shield wall. I've never been that down on Immortis Guard, but I do think there are better options. Personally, I'm a huge fan of Morghast Harbringers. I love running 4 and I think they've only gotten better in Petrifex Armies now. Plus they got a small 5 point deduction on cost!

Yeah. I've played 2 games and it is different. In my games the charge reactions hasn't been as huge as I thought they would be. If our troops are really tough it can help with the Unleash Hell and we don't exactly have a lot of shooting right now. Arkhan being a hero and monster will be important as it allows him to access both sets of abilities. It is another sneaky buff for him. Lastly, I mentioned it before, but Bone-Tithe Shriekers are really, really good now. Turning off rally, and especially inspiring presence is huge, not to mention they also add a +1 to hit. Inspiring presence can be used by unit champions now and not being allowed to use it really hurts some armies. Plus it's predatory so you can position it on your turn, then position it again on the next turn to help out again. It's an upgraded Horrorghast, and the Horrorghast was already one of the best generic endless spells.

Dropping them as 3 single trees probably will become the go to, especially in the initial game set up. It's easier to place the them in a set up board. Plus it allows you to keep one back for the Branchwraith summoning, while putting 2 forward to allow the newly summoned dryads to go where needed immediately without having to summon in new trees. Plus they're also immediately up the field to buff Durthu or a Warsong Revenant. It's a pretty big silent buff which is nice with everything else.

With 25mm bases, you can still get 2 ranks of swords fighting which would allow you to do a zigzag pattern and keep coherency with 2 other models within 1". I don't think the new coherency requirements will make the spears better than swords. The -1 rend is so important, especially now that All Out Defense is a thing and Mystic Shield was changed. Actually, the more I think about it, the more I think Petrifex is back as the go to, unless you are using Katakros. The change to the base effect plus the -1 rend command ability are so good now.