HollowHills

Yeah blood gullet is what I was looking at. The pile in is the best bit for me, really counters the weakness of large bases with 1 inch weapons. Obviously you want to be running 12 glutton blocks. The battalions are fairly easy to fill too, so not too hard to grab an extra cp, artefact and reduce the drop count. I wonder if the cogs spell might be handy too.

If this leak is release dates rather than preorder dates (gw send release dates to third parties) then it matches. Preorder on 2nd and release on 9th.

I get what people are saying about waiting for points, but I do think what we are seeing is a really strong army based on the previews. I mean I've been playing aos for awhile and try to follow the rules of all the armies to judge their competitiveness. I always work in the assumption gw will show off cool rules for new armies, but even based on the preview these rules are better than similarly previewed abilities in the past. People are talking about the standout plus one save, but even look at the other bits. Such as a unit that can reroll all saves, a unit that can pick between lots of reroll options or extra damage and a subfactions that allows run and charge plus retreat and charge at all times. Hell even the free faction scenery can make stuff minus 1 to hit or minus 1 to cast fairly reliably. Compare that to other faction scenery and its so much better. Also just as a note, I know the thread title is a bit extreme but "are bonereapers looking a bit op based on previews" probably wouldn't have generated as much chatter.

I know there is a general discussion for the Bonereapers, but I wanted a separate thread to discuss their powerlevel from a neutral perspective. Obviously we haven't seen the points costs or full rules yet, so there is a pinch of salt here. Based on the warscrolls, the subfactions and even the scenery piece today I have to say I am concerned. Several warscrolls contain abilities that allow full rerolls, which we've seen to be incredibly powerful in the past with DoK. The subfactions bonuses seem way better than other armies, for example I believe the run and charge with retreat and charge ability is likely to be incredibly good for board control. Everything I'm seeing is saying to me this is another instance if powercreep. I strongly suspect it has been done to ensure the models sell. So GW don't have a KO or IDK situation where the armies largely have weak rules that prohibit model sales. (I don't mean eels, I mean everything else). Thoughts?

New sc set then? Darkoath War Queen 3 varanguard 8 spire tyrants

Thanks for these, glad to have some more stats.

I'm not saying the whole army will be ******. Just that 1) shooting is already weak 2) the warscroll is weak and 3) the decent abilities we've seen so far appear to favour movement and charging. Put all that together and based on the limited evidence we have so far I'm strongly leaning to the idea that I would not want leadbelchers. The same cost in other units are likely to be more wound efficient.

Yes but why take a tribe that makes a ****** warscroll mediocre when there are presumably ones that make good warscrolls better? Some people don't mind if they have a weak army that takes units they like. At the moment I'm looking at these previews and trying to work out if this army is worth investing in. Sure I like the models, but if I'm going to lose to the top armies even if I play well then I will look elsewhere.

Well leadblechers are a no go...

If anyone watching the stream can share info here that would be great.

Also it may be that the trait on the hunter allows you to deepstrike 11-21 models which count as battleline (with him general) and have a relatively low point cost. This would be very strong if the range on it was decent (say a wholly within 6 of an edge, 9 away). Deepstrike is incredibly strong, especially with any kind of charge bonus (which the army may have). Likewise if a tyrant has good weapon profiles the reroll trait will be strong. There are quite a few lists that run powerful heroes with artefacts.

If frostsabers are good and the deepstrike has a generous range then that command trait is potentially very good.

I hope they have good rules. I'd like to start an ogre army and convert them into walrus people, but would also prefer my next army to be on the upper end of the power scale.

I had hoped they'd move away from the utter op that is an army with easy access to full rerolls. You'd have thought they learned their lesson by now. Bonereapers are looking like powercreep, but hopefully they don't have access to any deepstrike or movement buffs.

Exactly. When deepkin came out they were the only army that could fight first in combat. Now there are multiple that can make units fight last or fight first. One (slaanesh) can effectively ignore the idoneth ability. People don't realise how bad a spot the deepkin range are in because one list does fairly well at tournaments.

It's interesting as well because normally with these boxes the value is about 50 / 50. But in this case the Bonereapers half is clearly worth a lot more than the ogres. I'd want to pay a lot less than half. So I wonder if its better to buy a full set and sell the skeles, or to buy an ogre set off someone.

I hope so. I'd like a Tyrant given that he's unlikely to be available for a long time after.

I strongly disagree, or well at least for the ones other than LoN which has settled down to be fairly good but also with counters. Deepkin desperately need a new book. The only viable competitive build is to spam Morrsarr guard. Eidolons, Sharks, Turtles, Lotann, Reavers and the Soul Render are completely unusable. Thralls are only usable if you want to take 3 x 10 and a tidecaster general. The spell lore is terrible, the only usable command trait is plus 2 wounds, the artefacts are all worse than the malign sorcery options. The battalions are unusable. Furthermore, a lot of the intended internal synergies, such as Soulrender + Thralls just don't work. Nurgle are just too weak all over. The Blightkings need their ability to trigger on unmodified 6s. The whole army needs a damage increase. I don't play Nurgle so can't comment too much, but the stats speak for themselves. DoK are also too powerful, but also suffer from a particularly unengaging playstyle. The sheer amount of rerolls their army has access to means they will always be in the top tiers. The only reason the army isn't totally dominating is because of the utter ****** show that is Slaanesh and the wonky point values of Skaven.

I expect DoK, Nurgle, LoN and Deepkin to get new tomes next spring /summer. The old books will have been out over two years at that point and all four of the armies need rules updates. Plus missing endless spells / scenery. They may just let legions of nagash fade out at this point though.

What was in the limited run?

Probably nothing but anyone notice the Bonereapers warscroll cards has them fighting slaves to darkness? The chaos warrior and mauraders look a bit different.

I suspect you're right. I will keep some sword hunters for use as units of 3. They are easier to teleport or deepstrike that way and can put out good damage. For a deathstar I am looking at getting 9 with scythes.

This wins me a lot of games. The amount of damage you can put out is incredible. The frozen kernal can be really effective on 20 spites too (as long as you can get most of them in range, best used vs an enemy horde or tightly packed area). 3 attacks each, 6s count as 2, 3 3 - 1. The shear weight of attacks is great, especially against ethereal. If you have an arch rev it's 4 attacks. Remember you can spend a cp to get rerolls of 1 to hit also.

With staggered base placement I had 5 in range, 1 out. You lose mortals with scythes. I am tempted to get some though for the range issue.

I get what you mean but it's not always an either or. If you're eyeing up a new army you might have a few thst you like. All being equal I suspect most would rathe rpick one they know has a good chance of winning.