Magic Items for AoS

[hobgoblinclub]

Now that we know we're getting points for AoS, I wonder what else this will bring.

@Ben revealed that the new system would be intended to build 2000 point lists (or at least that would give us the size of army that we're used to).  Expanding the point range from SCGT's 100 pools means there's suddenly ,more scope for points variation across different troops.  Will this mean that we can pay different costs to equip units with different options?  More importantly, will they take the opportunity to add further purchasable add-ons such as magic items?  I pretty sure this would only add even more tactical depth to the game and allow the level of obsessing over list building not seen since 8th.

What do you think?  Would magic items in AoS be a cool addition or needlessly complicate the game with rules bloat?

[Dracoth]

I think it'd be cool to have magic items and indeed more customization in the game. Personally I don't think it would over complicate things at all. Perhaps magic items could each have their own mini warscroll.

[Dez]

Ben mentioned somewhere that there wouldn't be any points cost for different weapons...so we may not see this. While I think it would be cool...it would be like the old WFB days where there were only a few viable choices that everyone took. I should say I fear it would be like that, I'd rather love it if they could come out with a system however simple that would give magic weapons. Maybe we will see that with Silver Tower?

[Sehryth7]

I think that's a good question.

list customisation was something we all loved.  Im not sure AoS can really work with magic items as it would change the games mechanic a lot.

 

What I'm interested to know is if the "pools" system will be employed in matched play. And if not,  will tournaments still use it..? It's practically revolutionised competitive play in my opinion and expands the game even further. 

Tbh I'm sure it will all work out fine lads.

AoS is a solid game, here's to the next 30 years. 

[mhsellwood]

I wouldn't want points for different weapon options - by and large they are pretty comparable with a slight bias towards one type of enemy or a particular way of using the unit, but nothing outrageous. It is not a case that one option is clearly the BEST and thus you should pay more for it. Similarly special weapons should affect the overall value of the unit, but I don't think you should pay to have them as if you have the unit you will have the special weapon models, so you will field them.

Overall there is not as strong a rock paper scissors feel to the game as say 40K. You may want occasionally to field one weapon option over another, but you are never going to run into the situation of having units unable to achieve anything due to how they have been equipped. This makes it I believe even less important to pay for different options - you don't cost certain units in line with the fact are functionally 'invulnerable' to large portions of the enemy army, and you don't pay a premium for weapons or attacks able to affect these units. Everything is much consistent in effect and value.

Re. magic items, one possible option would be what they did back in Rogue Trader - pay XX points and roll on a table. You could even use the Triumph tables from the big books as there are a number of those and most of them are pretty equivalent, and don't really need any special modelling. It would avoid the common issue of one option being clearly 'superior' and if you do it while building your list gives scope for story line building.

To illustrate, say I run a Ironjawz list and I pay in my army for two rolls on a table, and get a magic weapon and a magic banner. I decide to give my Megaboss on foot the weapon, and my Gore Gruntas the banner. This is then the list I play with, maybe for one game in a casual setting, maybe for a whole tournament. For my personal army story maybe the weapon represents a Wanderers blade that despite being a bit frail my Megaboss has taken a liking to, while the banner is the banner of my elite formation of Gore Gruntas, the Pigheadz, blessed by the armies Weirdnob.

[Chris Tomlin]

I think we will see something in the Generals Handbook. Maybe as part of narrative play as opposed to matched play, but I reckon there will be customisation options, which could well include magic items.

Personally I don't miss them. Sure, it was fun rocking out obscure choices like the DE Hydra Blade but for the most part everyone just used the same character builds anyway, so I'm not sure how much individual customisation there was anyway! Rose tinted glasses and all that.

The idea above by @mhsellwood is pretty cool and kinda reminiscent of what they did with the Daemon book in 8th, although the defaulting led to this not being the random fun that I'm sure was intended.

Interesting to see what they do for sure!

[Bowlzee]

3 minutes ago, Chris Tomlin said:

I think we will see something in the Generals Handbook. Maybe as part of narrative play as opposed to matched play, but I reckon there will be customisation options, which could well include magic items.

Personally I don't miss them. Sure, it was fun rocking out obscure choices like the DE Hydra Blade but for the most part everyone just used the same character builds anyway, so I'm not sure how much individual customisation there was anyway! Rose tinted glasses and all that.

Agreed. 

I would love the narrative campaign to be able to build up a certain General or Mage. But the special abilities or magic items will need to be balanced, otherwise we'll see the same generic characters.

I would love to be able to customise my own Daemon Prince. At the moment, they are very boring and not worth taking.

[Shane]

The General's Handbook Matched Play point costs are by the warscroll. You can take anything within the warscroll for that point price. Point price is based on unit size (i.e. 200pts for 10, maximum unit size is 20).

A recent rumour said that in Matched Play:

• summoned units cannot summon more units in the same turn
• 1's always fail

The Narrative Play is said to include these magical items you speak. They can be earnt as part of the Path to Glory system that will be expanded upon so any faction can take part in it (rather than just chaos heroes). It will be the lite RPG element.

What no one has talked about is will formations have a cost or are they a 'freebie'. If free, we can expect them to be used a lot as they're often powerful.

[Carnelian]

I'm certain that no matter how matched play ends up, there will probably end up being some comp systems left still. Which will be great and help create feedback to what will hopefully be a fun and living ruleset

[Xemenes]

I can imagine a supplement or somthing along those lines that may add magic items in a few years once all the armies are settled in. But i'm not sure if it would be best for items to just give simple upgrades like +1 bravery or more along the lines of alternative command abilities, personally the less complex the better as it keeps the system uncluttered.

 

[hobgoblinclub]

True. I'm sure it'd be a minefield trying to put such a thing together. With the keyword system, every time they release a new warscroll they'll have to check it against all existing warscrolls to ensure it doesn't create any game breaking combos. If they gave us generic magic items, which anyone could use, it would be a nightmare job to check them all. 

[bottle]

Have you seen the Nulahmia Time of War triumph table?

6 really cool magic items to use in AoS. If I was to play a campaign in AoS I would definitely use this table. 

You could try costing them under the comp you are already using and allow heroes to buy them if you wanted to but I suspect they'd be more fun to use in games if you had "earned" them through a victory.

With the matched play I sure do hope there isn't the granularity we used to have. I much prefer the pools of Clash or SCGT rather than seperate costings for each and every weapon option. Luckily I've heard the matched play mirrors the style of Clash and SCGT (with a single cost for each Warscroll).

[MyGeekyPersona]

I hope that they don't point different weapon load outs for units - GW have done a really good job of "internally balancing" each scroll as it stands so that all weapons options are roughly equally viable.

However, the hobbyist in me would love a small level of customisation to create modelling projects. Maybe some fancy magic standards, or musicians, weapon upgrades for champions, more things like the star soul mace, or some one use only items - like the doom rocket?

MGP

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