Let's chat Kharadron Overlords

[Gecktron]

Okay, battalions got more expansiv. But thats true for nearly every other army, so thats okay I guess. The nerf to the thunderers has been discussed already. 
But its strange that we didnt got the massiv regiment bonus for the arkanauts. Even the SCE liberators got it. 

Point changes aside, Im happy to see that all the dwarfs can ally with each other. This will allow for some really thematic armies. I think about adding a unit of Fyreslayer warriors. Converting a few arkanauts so that they carry axes shouldn't be that difficult.

[Thomas Lyons]

19 hours ago, GlanceOnASix said:

You are correct sir!  It is Thunderers going up to 140.

 

Actually, it might be more complicated than that.  The pages of the French version have the Khemist at 100 and Thunderers at 140.  The English version apparently has Thunderers at 100 and Khemists at 140.

[Thostos]

Having seen all the leaks out now,,im thinking that the KO`s may be in a very good spot now.Main reason being that with the massive jump in battalion prices we will see a drastic reduction in builds that have only 1 or 2 drops at deployement and those that do try to squeeze that out will be short at least 1 possibly as many as 3 units.

  Though the KO`s can easily do 2-3 deployements by nature of how the ships and their transport rules work.

[Aezeal]

On 20-8-2017 at 7:22 PM, Gecktron said:

Okay, battalions got more expansiv. But thats true for nearly every other army, so thats okay I guess. The nerf to the thunderers has been discussed already. 
But its strange that we didnt got the massiv regiment bonus for the arkanauts. Even the SCE liberators got it. 

Point changes aside, Im happy to see that all the dwarfs can ally with each other. This will allow for some really thematic armies. I think about adding a unit of Fyreslayer warriors. Converting a few arkanauts so that they carry axes shouldn't be that difficult.

IMHO the reason for the bonus is that it's hard to get a large group into combat all at the same time.. thus reducing the effectiveness somewhat in large numbers... So the reduction is fitting for melee troops.

Ranged troops don't get it. Glade guard for wanderers didn't get it either.

[Mikester1487]

I write this with little more than a starting idea for a list I will be taking to adepticon 2018, and I'm looking for a little advice.  

From the thunderer poll thread Thomas Lyons mentioned the use of vulkite berserkers as a good tough block to hold points and dish out damage.  This got me thinking I could indeed take the 30 models suggested and support it with KO guns.  

I have not seen any changes to point costs so I'm only using whats available to me in the 2016 battle tome and generals handbook.

Right now all I have is a massive battle line block with:

20x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 6x skyhooks           240

20x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 6x skyhooks           240

10x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 3x volley guns       120

30x Vulkite berserkers with Karl, Horn of Grimnir, Shields      480

 

Here is where I pause for a moment because holy cow that is a lot of battle line with no hero support or ships to fly around!  I would have to think a khemist fits in here somewhere as well as a frigate.  I also assume vulkite berserkers will not be battle line which is why the 10 extra Arkanaut Company exist.  Does anyone else have some pointers on where I could tweak and improve this?  If its possible to choose a skyhold with this berserker unit I will be going Barak Zon and its the only thing I do not wish to change.

 

 Thanks in advance!

[Thostos]

1 hour ago, Mikester1487 said:

I write this with little more than a starting idea for a list I will be taking to adepticon 2018, and I'm looking for a little advice.  

From the thunderer poll thread Thomas Lyons mentioned the use of vulkite berserkers as a good tough block to hold points and dish out damage.  This got me thinking I could indeed take the 30 models suggested and support it with KO guns.  

I have not seen any changes to point costs so I'm only using whats available to me in the 2016 battle tome and generals handbook.

Right now all I have is a massive battle line block with:

20x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 6x skyhooks           240

20x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 6x skyhooks           240

10x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 3x volley guns       120

30x Vulkite berserkers with Karl, Horn of Grimnir, Shields      480

 

Here is where I pause for a moment because holy cow that is a lot of battle line with no hero support or ships to fly around!  I would have to think a khemist fits in here somewhere as well as a frigate.  I also assume vulkite berserkers will not be battle line which is why the 10 extra Arkanaut Company exist.  Does anyone else have some pointers on where I could tweak and improve this?  If its possible to choose a skyhold with this berserker unit I will be going Barak Zon and its the only thing I do not wish to change.

 

 Thanks in advance!

 I plan to run 20 zerkers with a Runesmiter and tunnel them in when I need em:)

 The rest of the army will be loaded up into a Frigate and an Ironclad,,with the Ironclad set up waiting to drop in.3 drops with one starting on the board:)

 

[stato]

6 hours ago, Mikester1487 said:

I write this with little more than a starting idea for a list I will be taking to adepticon 2018, and I'm looking for a little advice.  

...

Here is where I pause for a moment because holy cow that is a lot of battle line with no hero support or ships to fly around!  I would have to think a khemist fits in here somewhere as well as a frigate.  I also assume vulkite berserkers will not be battle line which is why the 10 extra Arkanaut Company exist.  Does anyone else have some pointers on where I could tweak and improve this?  If its possible to choose a skyhold with this berserker unit I will be going Barak Zon and its the only thing I do not wish to change.

 

 Thanks in advance!

Currently your Fyreslayers are over the 400 point allies limit of a 2000 point game, so you would be limited to Order as your alliance, so no KO buffs. That said it would probably mean the Vulkites would count for your battle-line (which they would not if they were added as Allies).

EDIT:  Actually, at new points the 30 Vulkites would be 330pt, so within the limit, but no space for a slayer hero to accompany them.

[Mikester1487]

Ah I figured mixing them in would not have me using a skyhold.  EDIT: so as long as I stay under 400 points I can take KO traits of I'm understanding you stato.

 I'd really like to have an iron clad or 2 frigates to transport my skyhooks around. I'll you around with it some more this afternoon to see.

15 hours ago, Thostos said:

 I plan to run 20 zerkers with a Runesmiter and tunnel them in when I need em:)

 The rest of the army will be loaded up into a Frigate and an Ironclad,,with the Ironclad set up waiting to drop in.3 drops with one starting on the board:)

 

That's actually a cool idea for keeping them safe until they're needed.  What were your ideas on KO hero choices for that?

[Thostos]

25 minutes ago, Mikester1487 said:

Ah I figured mixing them in would not have me using a skyhold.  Not a huge deal just something that would have been nice.

 I'd really like to have an iron clad or 2 frigates to transport my skyhooks around. I'll you around with it some more this afternoon to see.

That's actually a cool idea for keeping them safe until they're needed.  What were your ideas on KO hero choices for that?

 What I have up now,in addition to the above Slayer allies is:

 Arkanaut Admiral

 Aether Khemist

 10  company 3 volleyguns

 10 Company  3 Skypikes

 10 Company 3 lt Skyhook

  Ironclad

 Frigate

 3 Endrinriggers stock

 3 Skywardens stock

 5 Thunderers 1 each special weapons.

 Im starting out with a spread of unit choices to see how they play in my meta,then will add/subtract as needed.

  No battalions,,house Zilphin.Frigate starts on the board,Ironclad drops from the sky,Fyreslayers pop up out of ground:)

 Then I proceed to get pounded by more focused lists,but at least it will be fun to play,lol

 

[Mikester1487]

I went with the 3x 10 of company and the three special weapons per unit as well.  I'm torn between the skyhooks or the volleyguns.  With hordes being boosted it feels like taking the volleygun would not be a bad choice.  But keep a unit of skyhooks for those nasty 2+ savers.

It may not be top tier but I just want a list that challenges all comers.

[Naflem]

7 hours ago, Mikester1487 said:

Ah I figured mixing them in would not have me using a skyhold.  EDIT: so as long as I stay under 400 points I can take KO traits of I'm understanding you stato.

 I'd really like to have an iron clad or 2 frigates to transport my skyhooks around. I'll you around with it some more this afternoon to see.

That's actually a cool idea for keeping them safe until they're needed.  What were your ideas on KO hero choices for that?

I think you can get a skyhold so long as you can get all those zerkers for 400 points or less after the GHB2 comes out through the new allies rule, and I think given that there's a discount for fyreslayers generally and a discount for big units that's probably feasible, though I've not seen those point pages yet myself. 

[GlanceOnASix]

 

On 8/21/2017 at 8:11 PM, Mikester1487 said:

I write this with little more than a starting idea for a list I will be taking to adepticon 2018, and I'm looking for a little advice.  

From the thunderer poll thread Thomas Lyons mentioned the use of vulkite berserkers as a good tough block to hold points and dish out damage.  This got me thinking I could indeed take the 30 models suggested and support it with KO guns.  

I have not seen any changes to point costs so I'm only using whats available to me in the 2016 battle tome and generals handbook.

Right now all I have is a massive battle line block with:

20x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 6x skyhooks           240

20x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 6x skyhooks           240

10x Arkanaut Company with Captain and 3x volley guns       120

30x Vulkite berserkers with Karl, Horn of Grimnir, Shields      480

 

...Barak Zon and its the only thing I do not wish to change.

I know you mention Zon, I just want to throw in a couple cents in here I tried a very similar sort of setup (Going Urbaz with a 40x10x10 and the old mortor thunderers for the double buffs).  However I would, especially if kemits are in the equation, look at taking that and doing 1x30 Hooks, and 2x10.  The more bang for buck you can get outta each kemist on those skyhooks the better.  And I'd look at the Vulkites being lowered to the point of being able to take that Lava tunneling hero so you can get them upfield and hold your opponent from pushing you out of the middle.

 

I personally found in my list, being defensive, and running some 6 man balloon units with one grap, let me jump around take some objectives, and to have some Close Combat counter punch.  

 

Another idea when playing with a 'foot dwarf' list I liked was a Griffhound or two, could trigger extra shooting if somone tries to drop on you.

[GlanceOnASix]

I've been thinking a lot about the Endrinriggers that folks use out of their dropship.  In particular the setup of special weapons/ratio on them.

In my games, I've really gone with:

9xRiggers w/ 2xGraps

12xRiggers w/3xGraps

But I'm leaning toward going 9x3 Graps as even at a 75% (87% with 3) chance, that first turn hook is so important when you put all your buffs in place that I really sort of want that third.

 

I've seen folks using the thing from heat 3 with 2x Skyhooks and 1xGrap.  But the hooks, especially re-reading the only 1d6 movement feature don't impress me all that much.

 

What do you folks use?

[azmar]

 new scroll for thunder

[Gecktron]

Games Workshop just published their FAQs for AoS.
There is a big segment for the Kharadron Overlords. Most changes are minor but there is one big one:

"Page 136 – Aether-Khemist, Aetheric Augmentation Change the rules text to:
‘In your hero phase, you can say that an Aether-Khemist is using their Atmospheric Anatomiser to augment
the weapons of nearby Arkanauts. If you do so, pick
a friendly Skyfarers unit within 10" of the Aether- Khemist, and then pick a single type of weapon carried by models in that unit. Until your next hero phase, add 1 to the Attacks characteristic of that type of weapon when it is used by any models in that unit. A weapon cannot be augmented more than once per hero phase."

So thats officially the end of Khemist buff stacking. Im not that surprised. These changes are inline with the other ones in the Handbook. But its noteworthy that GW didn't ban buff stacking in general but only in this case.

[Well of Eternity]

Drill cannons damage D3 - is that minor change?

Without stakcing Khemist buffs, without Thunderers and with not so powerfull drills... Hard times.

 

 

[menacingeye]

Riggers and Skywardens Skyhooks are now only d3 as well.

[Gecktron]

3 minutes ago, Well of Eternity said:

Drill cannons damage D3 - is that minor change?

Without stakcing Khemist buffs, without Thunderers and with not so powerfull drills... Hard times.

 

 

Just read that change myself, skyhooks got the same treatment. The only buff I can find is that the Drill Canon on the Gunhauler got 6" more range. All in all, thats more than annoying. Endrinriggers needed some changes but hitting the skywarden too is a little much in my opinion. 

[menacingeye]

1 minute ago, Gecktron said:

Just read that change myself, skyhooks got the same treatment. The only buff I can find is that the Drill Canon on the Gunhauler got 6" more range. All in all, thats more than annoying. Endrinriggers needed some changes but hitting the skywarden too is a little much in my opinion. 

I feel like they've really been hitting the kharadrons pretty hard with these changes, I just started playing them, were they really this overpowered? 

[Gecktron]

5 minutes ago, menacingeye said:

I feel like they've really been hitting the kharadrons pretty hard with these changes, I just started playing them, were they really this overpowered? 

I played 7-8 games at around 1000 points and I never had the feeling that my dwarfs are overpowered most games I played were either narrowly won or lost in the last two rounds.
Sure, some units are strong when used right, but they all have their flaws. 
I have to add that I always played a rather tame list. Only one frigate, khemist and thunderer unit. I didnt spamed Mortars neither did I play the Barak-Zilfin Clown Car. These things were to strong and not fun to play against. GW is right to change overpowered units (which they did with the thunderers) but I get the feeling they swung the nerf bat a little too hard and hit the more casual players. 

But maybe im overreacting. I have a GH2017 game against skaven tomorrow. Maybe its not that bad after all.

[Chaotic Neutral]

https://17890-presscdn-0-51-pagely.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/AoS_FAQ_The_Rules_v1.2.pdf

page 6

ABILITIES
Q: When the word ‘any’ is used in the criteria for an ability,
does it mean that the ability is applied only once when the
criteria for the ability are fulfilled? For example, if an ability
said ‘Add 1 to hit rolls for models that are within 6" of any
models with this ability’, would I add 1 to the hit rolls of a
model that was within 6" of three models with the ability, or
would I add 3?

A: The ability is applied only once, no matter how many
times the criteria are fulfilled – ‘any’ is treated as being
synonymous with ‘one or more’ in the Warhammer Age of
Sigmar rules. In the example, this means that 1 would be
added to the hit rolls, not 3.

good bye khemist stacking.

[GlanceOnASix]

However we can still stack different weapons like the drill cannons and powerfists on guys

[Mikester1487]

I mentioned this in the compendium thread but it's more relevant here. Do you guys see yourselves implementing other dwarves or allies because of the changes to the khemist and Thunderers?  

Haven't had enough games recently to be sure, but taking away two large sources of firepower seems harsh.  It will be fun to mix in vulkites to my list don't get me wrong.  Just kind of feels mandatory to mix at this point.  Could there be some other tool or batallion I'm missing?

[Naflem]

56 minutes ago, Chaotic Neutral said:

https://17890-presscdn-0-51-pagely.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/AoS_FAQ_The_Rules_v1.2.pdf

page 6

ABILITIES
Q: When the word ‘any’ is used in the criteria for an ability,
does it mean that the ability is applied only once when the
criteria for the ability are fulfilled? For example, if an ability
said ‘Add 1 to hit rolls for models that are within 6" of any
models with this ability’, would I add 1 to the hit rolls of a
model that was within 6" of three models with the ability, or
would I add 3?

A: The ability is applied only once, no matter how many
times the criteria are fulfilled – ‘any’ is treated as being
synonymous with ‘one or more’ in the Warhammer Age of
Sigmar rules. In the example, this means that 1 would be
added to the hit rolls, not 3.

good bye khemist stacking.

Negative Ghost Rider, the Khemist ability isn't written like that.  Khemist ability says "pick a friendly Skyfarers unit within 10". Until your next hero phase, add 1 to the Attacks characteristic of one kind of weapon carried by the unit (e.g. their Privateer Pistols)."  It doesn't use the world "any" at all, so this FAQ section doesn't apply to it.   So looks like Khemists are still fine and stackable (which would would expect given that they a) said that abilities would be stackable still on twitch but they've raise points of certain models to compensate and b) Khemist points went up 40%.  )

 

[Chaotic Neutral]

Just now, Naflem said:

Negative Ghost Rider, the Khemist ability isn't written like that.  Khemist ability says "pick a friendly Skyfarers unit within 10". Until your next hero phase, add 1 to the Attacks characteristic of one kind of weapon carried by the unit (e.g. their Privateer Pistols)."  It doesn't use the world "any" at all, so this FAQ section doesn't apply to it.   So looks like Khemists are still fine and stackable (which would would expect given that they a) said that abilities would be stackable still on twitch but they've raise points of certain models to compensate and b) Khemist points went up 40%. 

 

unfortunate imo.