Sam Posted April 14, 2017 Share Posted April 14, 2017 Hi guys, Hoping for some pointers, if you'd be so kind? I've got the core my force down and I've been led more by models I like than thoughts of competition. However, since I got Azyr I've been messing with list after list thinking about how to build my force into a full 2000 points and maybe even take it out for a spin at some events. I have Witch Aelves and a cauldron that are definitely the 'thematic heart' of my list. But, what do I add? I've got a few different ideas and some notion of the pros and cons, but I'd value a little appraisal. 1: Witches and Warlocks Cauldron, Death Hag 20 Witch Aelves, 20 Witch Aelves, 20 Witch Aelves Bloodwrack Sisterhood 2 Bloodwrack Medusae, 15 Doomfire Warlocks. Pros: more groups of witches have better chances of getting that 6 and making the formation worthwhile. Cons: No shooting, 20 witches means when 1 dies they lose their bonus for having 20+, holding objectives? Defending, surviving. 2: Double Cauldrons Cauldron, Cauldron, Death Hag 20 Witch Aelves, 20 Witch Aelves, 20 Witch Aelves Bloodwrack Sisterhood 2 Bloodwrack Medusae, 5 Doomfire Warlocks, 10 Sisters of Slaughter Pros: *same as above +Second cauldron improves chances of Witch Aelves surviving long enough to make it into combat, second chance at that 5+ ward. Cons: *same as above -> No shooting, 20 witches means when 1 dies they lose their bonus for having 20+, holding objectives? Defending? 3: Blood and Wood Cauldron, Glade Lord on Forest Dragon, Spellweaver 10 Dreadspears, 20 Glade Guard, 8 Glade Riders 10 Doomfire Warlocks, 30 Witch Aelves Pros: Mobile, can shoot, has a more obvious back-line for holding ground, Glade Lord as trouble shooter, Spellweaver resurrecting Glade Guard could give them a little more staying power, Glade Riders to harass, draw attention away from Witches. Cons: Not taking advantage of any big buff. Just minor synergies between a unit a hero. Still a glass hammer. 4: Blood and Thunder Cauldron, Lord-Cellestant, Knight-Vexillor 10 Dreadspears, 5 Liberators, 5 Liberators War Hydra 15 Doomfire Warlocks, 30 Witch Aelves Pros: Toughest list I've drafted (wounds and saves). Cons: Not taking advantage of any big buff. Just minor synergies between a unit a hero. 5: Hello Dark Elves my old friend... Cauldron of Blood, Mistweaver Saih, Sorceress 10 Dreadspears, 10 Dreadspears, 10 Dreadspears War Hydra 1 Bloodwrack Medusae, 15 Doomfire Warlocks, Witch Aelves Pros: Plenty of magic, a definite balance of offense and defense. Cons: Not taking advantage of any big buff. Just minor synergies between a unit a hero. Notes: So, I'm big on Witch Aelves, a Cauldron and Doomfire Warlocks. I haven't played that many games really, certainly not competitively, I imagine any of these lists would get absolutely nuked by whatever teleporting, rapid-firing, mortal wound farting monstrosities are currently ruling the meta out there. So I'm not that bothered if it's rubbish compared to them. As I built these lists I was making up fluff and imagining the painting etc. I could enjoy building any of them. I like the Exiled Blood Cult formation - but I'm not keen on using a 'Dark Elf' warscroll (haven't they been... "archived" now?) I think Cauldron of Blood is enough of a buff for the Witch Aelves, without going all in on the Bloodwrack Sisterhood. The Bloodwrack Sisterhood is a pain in the butt. It's a clunky points jigsaw and (IMHO) its bonus works against the warscrolls. That is to say, the warscroll rewards you for BIG groups of witch aelves, formation rewards you for LOTS of groups of Witch Aelves and if you try and reach for both those prizes you got 90-120 Witch Aelves to cram around your 1 'battallion unit' cauldron. Not to mention that's basically your whole army there, in one giant bubble, which can't be everywhere at once. Does any one of these lists at all strike you as markedly better or worse than the others? Do you have any hints or tips I could benefit from (besides bin them all and buy the new Raptors with heavy bolters Sigmar's-Stormy-Strike-Lightning-Comet-Celestial-CrossbowsTM)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayple Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 If you're not concerned with keeping your allegiance, tenebrael shard could give you some flexibility in how you approach the enemy, while sticking with the overall theme of your Khaine worshipping army. As for the lists, I prefer number 2 over 1. It seems more flexible than the first, which I think is important with a run-at-your-enemy-and-slaughter-them type of strategy that daughters of khaine tend to go for. What's your overall strategy with 4, if I may ask? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted April 18, 2017 Author Share Posted April 18, 2017 The thoughts behind list 4 were along the lines of: 'so the witch aelves are the offense, naturally... What's the defense? What "tanks" or "tarpits"? How do I hold anything? I thought maybe the Liberators and the Hydra could fulfill that role, but there are too few of them really. I'll take another serious look at double cauldrons. Does anyone know if two cauldrons means two chances at the special 5+ save-after-the-save. I can't see why it wouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siegfried VII Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 First of all. Would you be willing to add other order units to the mix? If you're thinking of going competitive with this then you might want to take into consideration using other units from order. So if you're willing to be more versatile in terms of theme you either need to add some fast units, or some durable units, or some shooting units to complement your force... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aezeal Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 15 warlocks are how many points? Are they worth that, I'd say a hurricanum would be better for those points. How about 1 unit of witches, like 30 and some other cheap Battleline units that are effective in small numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayple Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 17 hours ago, Sam said: The thoughts behind list 4 were along the lines of: 'so the witch aelves are the offense, naturally... What's the defense? What "tanks" or "tarpits"? How do I hold anything? I thought maybe the Liberators and the Hydra could fulfill that role, but there are too few of them really. I'll take another serious look at double cauldrons. Does anyone know if two cauldrons means two chances at the special 5+ save-after-the-save. I can't see why it wouldn't. The reason I like your #2 list better than the first, is because you added more variation in it. 15 warlocks are all well and good, but it's an easy target to focus down, which would cripple your damage output. The inclusion of sisters of slaughter in your second list, and a second blood cauldron gives you waaay more reliability, and allows your warlocks to poke at targets without painting a huge target onto themselves. (I'd definitely focus fire 15 warlocks - anything under 10 would be overlooked as long as there are more valuable targets to fire at) I'm not sure whether a second cauldron gives you a second save, but even if it doesn't, it does save you the trouble of losing the game because someone shot your only cauldron to smithereens, plus you can extend the save zone to allow yourself more flexibility, instead of forming a predictable singular blob of death. Dreadspears are great tarpits in big numbers, since they're so darn cheap, but if you are going outside of allegiance, a unit of phoenix guard can tarpit pretty decently as well, while having a reliable damage output (Pretty sure a 30+ man unit of dreadspears would give them a run for their money, but I'm no mathmancer) - If you want to double down on Witch aelves, but still lenient on allegiance, an (eldritch council) archmage provides a spell that gives you yet another ''18 zone that gives your units +6 ward saves. (With Malekith no longer around in Age of Sigmar, there's no reason a dark elf wouldn't figure that he's free to practise magic without persecution, so making your archmage a dark elf for thematic reasons is not cray cray) - Should give your witch aelves some extra survivability. As a general note, since your hero list is pretty open right now, I think Tenebrael Shard + one or two assassins (You can hide assassins in Tenebrael, if I am not mistaken, who brings them along for his jump) would help you out against some particularly nasty opponents//ranged fire, which is a notable weakness of daughters of khaine. You don't need to tarpit things if you can keep them busy/murder them with your assassins while your blood crazed witches make their way across the field. The dark elves are suffering greatly as a combat viable faction (Or, well, bunch of sub-factions) right now. Looking forward to when the shadowkin drops! Should sort us out nicely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siegfried VII Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 I recently bought 30 Witch Aelves and a Cauldron of Blood and was thinking of ways o include them in my lists. What I noticed was that they have very dynamic poses that fit the AoS setting and also they are the same scale as the Mistweaver Saih and the Tenabrae Shard. I even saw similarities in the pieces of armour between them and the Saih. I really hope when the shadowkin come they get included, because they are really great models and in my opinion fit quite nicely with the current AoS range... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted April 19, 2017 Author Share Posted April 19, 2017 Thanks guys! @Mayple that's exactly the sort of advice I was looking for! @Siegfried VII You make a similar point about shadow kin. I'm going to finish painting my cauldron, then 10 more witch aelves, 5 warlocks, that will keep me busy. Then let's see what the realm of shadow unveils! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.