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Lets Chat Wanderers / Wood Elves compendium


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2 hours ago, Aezeal said:

Shadow dancer is nice.... but in this mixed army you can't teleport your most heavy hitters, which makes it sort of less ideal.

No he can't take oaken armor.. which is why Durthu is sad. He'll also be sad by not having wyldwoods to get extra attacks.

Since EG don't get a bonus for being 20+ I'd just put them in 2x10.

 

Durthu here plays a different role from the Sylvaneth one. He is here just to adding some punch.

If he becomes the General anyway, yep he lose the Oaken and the Wyldwoods, but he gains +1attack (or +1 wound healed per turn, even if I will prefer the +1 attack) and the charge rerolls for him AND ANY Order whithin 10" from him. Double movement+charge reroll turns any Hunters Unit into a murder CC machine! In fact, if you focus down Durthu is fine to me. I'm considering to fill the Wanderers side with shooting, and the Sylvaneth side with high quality melee. So if you want to focus down Durthu which is the less dmg dealer in the list, is fine to me (:

 

He will play a totally different role in this list.

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4 minutes ago, Dracothjay said:

Spot on cerve, play to each factions strengths. Wanderers shooting and combat Sylvaneth. 100% agree here.

I don't know if it will works, but seems to me a nice way to bring flavour into a competitive...ish...way. 

Or almost the best way to play this alliance.

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51 minutes ago, Dracothjay said:

Wouldn't you love a join wyldwood allegiance where both factions could use the realm routes and forests? Would be OP!

I hope into almost ONE future Aelves Battalion that will works into in this way!

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10 hours ago, Cerve said:

 

Durthu here plays a different role from the Sylvaneth one. He is here just to adding some punch.

If he becomes the General anyway, yep he lose the Oaken and the Wyldwoods, but he gains +1attack (or +1 wound healed per turn, even if I will prefer the +1 attack) and the charge rerolls for him AND ANY Order whithin 10" from him. Double movement+charge reroll turns any Hunters Unit into a murder CC machine! In fact, if you focus down Durthu is fine to me. I'm considering to fill the Wanderers side with shooting, and the Sylvaneth side with high quality melee. So if you want to focus down Durthu which is the less dmg dealer in the list, is fine to me (:

 

He will play a totally different role in this list.

Well that would be his role in a sylvaneth list too tbh (well in my list at least).

BTW If you have hunters you could just replace him with more hunters and they'd do pretty much the same though :D (make one of the hunters the general to keep the charge bonus there :D, still tougher than most regular heroes) 

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58 minutes ago, Aezeal said:

Well that would be his role in a sylvaneth list too tbh (well in my list at least).

BTW If you have hunters you could just replace him with more hunters and they'd do pretty much the same though :D (make one of the hunters the general to keep the charge bonus there :D, still tougher than most regular heroes) 

You miss the formation, which is why I put him inside. It will be certainly another way to play but I'm curious about the Free Spirits formation (:

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  • 3 months later...

Hah I'm glad you revived this thread cause I was tempted to as well. Kurnoth Hunters and Treekin are both incredible frontline meat shields. I expect both to become more expensive but they are damn near indestructible. My 3 Treekin regularly tie up bloodthirsters, heroes, etc somehow. 

A few comments on the old replies in this thread:

Shadowdancers are fantastic IF you are also fielding units like Warhawks or a Lord on a Great Eagle. I often take the Eagle Lord and a Shadowdancer so I can fling my Eagle lord 32+ inches to steal objectives. Being a hero on a pretty deadly mount, he can reliably clear weak units guarding objectives. If you don't take something with that sweet 16" move, you get way less value from the spell. In either case, always treat the Shadowdancer as a wizard and keep him safe. 

I always take my Nomad Prince as general with Legendary Fighter and Obstinate Blade. We have a crippling lack of mortal wounds and rending, outside of Arcane Bodkins, so giving his 2 damage attacks -2 rending is pretty valuable. He always catches people off guard with his damage output, and his command ability is vital for the ranged damage output you rely on, especially the turn you use Arcane Bodkins.

Waywatcher Lords (or Waystalkers for the old players) are amazing for the points, I take 2 or 3 each game now. One Spellsinger for Mystic Shield, most of the rest are useless, other than the Eagle Lord. 

Eternal Guard with Mystic Shield/Shield of Thorns/in cover are disgustingly effective for the points. They can be fantastic tar pits when positioned and used correctly. You need at least 20 though, as they will die in droves before having a chance to get buffed and enter their stance. 

Sisters of the Watch and 20x Glade Guard are actually pretty even in effectiveness. Sisters have more steady damage output when parked right behind your defensive wall, but the Arcane Bodkins from 20+ GG is super vital to our list. I'd argue that the immediate damage early on is more valuable. 

Wild Riders are trash in almost every situation. Warhawks fill a similar roll much better and pair great with "regrowth"

Units of 5-10 Wardancers are great as speedbumps, or last resort objective snatchers. Ideally you either have an Eagle Lord or Warhawks to do that job though. 

All in all, with AoS Wood Elves shifted dramatically from a hit and run, mobile playstyle to basically a defensive gunline playstyle. We can't outrun Khorne, any destruction army, and many other forces.  Our current battalions are garbage, so we almost always have more units to deploy, and as such are forced to brace for turn one charges. Smart opponents will often give us turn 1 to waste it for us, the best solution I've found to this is taking a Treelord Ancient to generate Sylvaneth Wildwoods. It also gives you a turn to get buffs active and activate Fortress of Boughs.

In most games, I mostly table my opponent by turn 3 and spend the rest of the game securing objectives as fast as possible. Sometimes it doesn't happen fast enough and even though enemy is wiped out, he's too far ahead on objective points (depending on scenario).

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On 28-7-2017 at 11:09 PM, Tidings said:

Hah I'm glad you revived this thread cause I was tempted to as well. Kurnoth Hunters and Treekin are both incredible frontline meat shields. I expect both to become more expensive but they are damn near indestructible. My 3 Treekin regularly tie up bloodthirsters, heroes, etc somehow. 

A few comments on the old replies in this thread:

Shadowdancers are fantastic IF you are also fielding units like Warhawks or a Lord on a Great Eagle. I often take the Eagle Lord and a Shadowdancer so I can fling my Eagle lord 32+ inches to steal objectives. Being a hero on a pretty deadly mount, he can reliably clear weak units guarding objectives. If you don't take something with that sweet 16" move, you get way less value from the spell. In either case, always treat the Shadowdancer as a wizard and keep him safe. 

I always take my Nomad Prince as general with Legendary Fighter and Obstinate Blade. We have a crippling lack of mortal wounds and rending, outside of Arcane Bodkins, so giving his 2 damage attacks -2 rending is pretty valuable. He always catches people off guard with his damage output, and his command ability is vital for the ranged damage output you rely on, especially the turn you use Arcane Bodkins.

Waywatcher Lords (or Waystalkers for the old players) are amazing for the points, I take 2 or 3 each game now. One Spellsinger for Mystic Shield, most of the rest are useless, other than the Eagle Lord. 

Eternal Guard with Mystic Shield/Shield of Thorns/in cover are disgustingly effective for the points. They can be fantastic tar pits when positioned and used correctly. You need at least 20 though, as they will die in droves before having a chance to get buffed and enter their stance. 

Sisters of the Watch and 20x Glade Guard are actually pretty even in effectiveness. Sisters have more steady damage output when parked right behind your defensive wall, but the Arcane Bodkins from 20+ GG is super vital to our list. I'd argue that the immediate damage early on is more valuable. 

Wild Riders are trash in almost every situation. Warhawks fill a similar roll much better and pair great with "regrowth"

Units of 5-10 Wardancers are great as speedbumps, or last resort objective snatchers. Ideally you either have an Eagle Lord or Warhawks to do that job though. 

All in all, with AoS Wood Elves shifted dramatically from a hit and run, mobile playstyle to basically a defensive gunline playstyle. We can't outrun Khorne, any destruction army, and many other forces.  Our current battalions are garbage, so we almost always have more units to deploy, and as such are forced to brace for turn one charges. Smart opponents will often give us turn 1 to waste it for us, the best solution I've found to this is taking a Treelord Ancient to generate Sylvaneth Wildwoods. It also gives you a turn to get buffs active and activate Fortress of Boughs.

In most games, I mostly table my opponent by turn 3 and spend the rest of the game securing objectives as fast as possible. Sometimes it doesn't happen fast enough and even though enemy is wiped out, he's too far ahead on objective points (depending on scenario).

You table your opponent in most games? 

Could you post your 2K army list please? With some proxying I should be able to replicate most lists I think and I'd love to try it. 

 

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Sure! I play a slightly different list every week, but the basic strategy is generally the same. Here's the last list I played, tabled a Khorne army on turn 3. 

Leaders

-  Nomad Prince - General  [Legendary Fighter and Obstinate Blade]

-  Glade Lord on a Great Eagle

-  Shadowdancer

-  Waywatcher Lord

-  Waywatcher Lord

-  Treelord Ancient

Battleline

- 10x Dryads

- 20x Glade Guard

- 3x Waywatchers

- 3x Waywatchers

Other Units

- 20x Eternal Guard

- 3x Kurnoth Hunters with Scythes

- 10x Sisters of the Watch

- 3x Treekin

 

STRATEGY

The basic strategy I approach games with as a mixed Wanderer/Sylvaneth player is similar to a dwarven gunline. Expect to finish deploying last, so depending on objective and what your opponent is playing, you will either be charged first turn, or he will let you take first turn and you won't get to shoot anything. In either case, the deployment for you is mostly the same. 

Depending on scenario, choose the objectives you want to commit to and deploy very defensively. You will mostly be defending until the second half of the game in most cases. The specifics should be pretty self explanatory: Eternal Guard in cover for their insane bonuses if possible, all the Sylvaneth forming a frontline, archers behind, etc. Make sure your Glade Guard can't take any casualties before using Acrane Bodkins!!

Your Shadowdancer should always be positioned the same way you would with any other Wizard. You can possibly use the 2" War Stave if you want, but the primary use of the Shadowdancer is to send the Great Eagle Lord 32" towards objectives after you've thinned most of the enemy army. With that in mind, position your Great Eagle Lord safe from shooting and magic until he can reliably challenge an objective or pick off shooters/wizards. 

If your opponent turn one charges you, it will seem worse than it is. If you positioned well, your archers will be safe and your Sylvaneth will bear the brunt of the charge. After that, prioritize your targets, use the Nomad Prince's Command ability, and start doing as much damage as you can.

If your opponent decides to give you turn one, this is worse. You won't have a double turn until he does, so wiping him will take longer, giving you less time for objectives after. You will at least be able to activate Fortress of Boughs on the EG and get buffs up, and you have a 50% chance to generate a Sylvaneth Wildwood with your Treelord Ancient. The point of this is to make moving around harder for your opponent, since you won't be moving up for a while anyways. 

Hope this list and strategy works for you! Against a more armored scene like SCE, Dwarves, Sylvaneth, etc it might not work at all. Here I mostly play Khorne and Destruction. :)

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So it's nomad prince ringed by the shooters (waywatchers and heroe's, GG and sisters of watch) that need to do all the damage? The rest is there mostly to protect those units?

What is the idea of the TLA? Without Sylvaneth items he's not as tough as he is as a sylvaneth general AND he looses his command ability.. wouldn't a regular treelord be better? (unless you took him for the spell or summoning forest (forests not save for wanderers)).

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On 7/31/2017 at 3:46 PM, Aezeal said:

So it's nomad prince ringed by the shooters (waywatchers and heroe's, GG and sisters of watch) that need to do all the damage? The rest is there mostly to protect those units?

What is the idea of the TLA? Without Sylvaneth items he's not as tough as he is as a sylvaneth general AND he looses his command ability.. wouldn't a regular treelord be better? (unless you took him for the spell or summoning forest (forests not save for wanderers)).

The Nomad Prince is mixed in the front ranks since he does a ton of damage and is pretty tough with his rerolling saves. You can put him behind the Eternal Guard since he does have 2" range. Just make sure to keep as many units in range of his command ability as possible - this is easy to do with a little daisy chaining. But yeah he's there to increase the damage output. It's an extremely defensive list, you'll have a wall with archers behind, and you won't be moving until you've killed most of your opponent's stuff. Against most armies you should be able to kill a huge percentage of his army by the end of the third turn, while still having a lot of your own. 

Like I said, I change my list up a bit each week to try different stuff. The TLA was a test that I quite liked. Normally I would take a Spellweaver, but you can drop her for the TLA. He is fills more roles than the Spellweaver because he is a durable, scary model that blocks a lot of space between archers and enemies. He can do quite a bit of damage and diverts attacks from your more important units and characters. Also, he can potentially summon a free forest, this is the only way to do this outside of Sylvaneth allegiance. Sure that forest is dangerous to Wanderers, but you'll be putting it in the way of enemies. The forest trick is hugely valuable when you set up defensively and a Destruction army gives you first turn since he can't get a turn one charge on you. Now his turn two charge will be harder for him. 

If you don't care about the spell, a regular treelord is better, but you'd also need a Spellweaver imo. And unless I'm taking Warhawks or SotT, I don't feel like I get enough value from a Spellweaver at 100 points. 

 

On 7/31/2017 at 4:03 PM, Gwill_of_the_Woods said:

I'm particularly excited for the allegiance abilities, artefacts, and command traits.

Also, love the speculation of allies. I wonder whether it will be just Sylvaneth or all Aelves.

Tidings- what are your thoughts on the way-watchers (battleline) versus glade guard?

I also can't wait to see what we get! Hopefully it extends beyond just Sylvaneth, but I dunno. Keep hearing rumors of an Aelf book coming soon so we'll see I guess. :)

At 80 points they are a fantastic way to pay the tax if you are building a list with other expensive units, like Sisters of the Watch and Thorn. Waywatchers are pretty efficient for the points, putting out 7+ shots per group of 3. They tend to do just enough to make my opponent feel like he has to kill them, and I basically just let it happen, since losing 80 points of units is inconsequential.

On the other hand, Glade Guard are extremely important for us because of their Arcane Bodkins. Being able to delete something like a Bloodthirster before it hits you is vital, and without the rending, we can't do that. Only take Glade Guard at 20+ models for the bonus to hit, then take Waywatchers to fill the rest of your Battleline as needed. 

I don't have enough Glade Guard for 2x units of 20, so I'm always taking at least one unit of Wawatchers, often two because I have some leftover points. 

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35 minutes ago, Tidings said:

If you don't care about the spell, a regular treelord is better, but you'd also need a Spellweaver imo. And unless I'm taking Warhawks or SotT, I don't feel like I get enough value from a Spellweaver at 100 points. 

You already have a shadowdancer right? Why need the spellweaver without TLA? Have you considered Drycha btw? She's got a spell and awesome chaff clearing abilities, not to mention pretty speedy and without access to sylvaneth items nearly as tough as a TLA and more melee power. I'd guess that large horde armies with tons of wounds might be hardest to clear and she could helpt there too.

So some more Q's:

- Why run EG in 20's and not 10's?

- Why treekin and not more EG.

- isn't the killing power of only 20 GG a bit to low to kill big guys even with the bodkins? Even with RR 1 to hit the 4+ to wound makes reliably doing more than 9 wounds unlikely.

- Do opponents usually magic or otherwise MW sister ot watch to death? they seem.. vulnerable.

 

On GH 2017: Personally I'd hoped for a few good batallions that let us really mingle with the sylvaneth (give us immunity to the forests and some deployment options with the free wyldwood). Seems I won't get that.

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I always want two wizards, both to increase my table coverage for possible unbinds, and also to have more coverage for Mystic Shield as needed. And regarding Mystic Shield, I want to cast it every turn, since keeping the frontline alive is vital, but I also want to use Bridge of Shadows or other special spells when they are needed most. 

I haven't tried Drycha yet, got the model a couple weeks ago and haven't finished her yet! Can't wait though. Definitely think she has a place in terms of fast, early damage. Regarding horde armies, I find them easier to get rid of because they often have worse armor saves. We put out a lot of wounds with very little rending, so forcing battleshock on horde armies isn't hard, even on Chaos and Death. I struggle more against high armor because after Arcane Bodkins, most wounds just bounce off. 

I run 20 EG because if they get charged turn one, lots will die. You won't have Fortress of Boughs or Mystic Shield up. If they aren't in cover, their leadership is pretty meh and lots will flee to battleshock. You need to have enough in the unit to survive that first hit while ALSO still having enough to maintain the wall you created between them and your archers. Treekin are fantastic value for the points, being naturally tougher than EG. They won't block as much space, but they rely less on using cover and don't need a turn to activate any buffs. This makes them more flexible during the deployment phase. Another alternative is Kurnoth Hunters. While they block less space per point than either Treekin or EG, they are insanely resilient and have nasty damage output. 

Yes, I wish I had more Glade Guard models! I sometimes do a unit of 20 and a unit of 10 but I wholeheartedly recommend 2x units of 20. Mawcrushers, Bloodthirsters, etc require the whole army shooting at it for a turn usually, not just the Glade Guard. I've thought about just getting big guys to about 1/3 health and then focusing on other stuff, but a lot of them still do insane damage even when almost dead cough Verminlord cough.

Yes and no. Depends on the opponent. Some are very effective at shooting Sisters of the Watch off the table very fast. Others don't have much of a way to get to them and desperately try to hack through my defensive wall to get some hits on them, and they generally succeed after a couple turns. Honestly, I might start proxying my Sisters of the Watch as Glade Guard as I think the GG are just better. 20x GG are the same as 10x Sisters, that's the same number of shots with a slightly worse profile, no penalty to moving and an amazing alpha strike. 

Yeah really looking forward to seeing what we get. Why do you say we won't get that though? Is there a teaser I missed??  O___O

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4 hours ago, Tidings said:

20x GG are the same as 10x Sisters, that's the same number of shots with a slightly worse profile, no penalty to moving and an amazing alpha strike. 

Pretty true, at least the models are sweet though! Maybe they're getting a [small] point decrease in GHB 2017? Plus overwatch is always fun. Though on top of everything you mentioned the slightly reduced range can matter as well, especially with a unit that doesn't want to move. Oh, AND they're not basic battleline... but... rule of cool all day. The only problem with using them as proxies is the price. 20 of them as a block of glade guard would be 100 bones. In the end I decided to build an army with just Sisters and Waywatchers, though I know I'll miss that rend.

Some great thoughts, y'all. Though my army is all Wanderer so far, from a narrative perspective I love the idea of taking Drycha as an 'ally.' She isn't thrilled the Everqueen dispatched her to 'watch over' a bunch of aelves, but she's more than ready to bring Alarielle's judgement down upon them if the Wanderers fail to redeem themselves and regain their honor... (doesn't hurt that on the gaming side she throws out mortal wounds like it's nobodies' business, which could supplement my lack of rend)

What can we speculate their allegiance abilities to be? Something that makes them a bit faster to keep up with their old concept of fast hit-and-run guerrilla type tactics? Or maybe something that lets Wanderers lie in ambush in some way? Although deep striking is already a mechanic well covered by other factions and we already have the Waystone Pathfinders if we so choose. Something that interacted with terrain would be cool and fit some of the rules they have already, like their banners currently giving even more bravery while in cover.

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LOL at the fluff for Drycha, that's perfect! :P

I already have them built and painted so maybe I'll mix them in or something. Can't wait to try Drycha, really need mortal wounds. 

I don't know how they could be made faster. Ironjaws and many other Destruction lists can cross the entire table in a single turn. You could make Wanderers have a move characteristic of 999" and if Ironjaws go first, the Wanderers will still get charged lol. Basically, the fast moving ceiling has already been hit (and imo broken, no one should be able to charge in the first turn as it removes maneuvering from the match entirely). 

Waystone Pathfinder's deepstrike is pretty bad in my experience, since you have to clump your whole army to make the battalion ability worth using. If we got more reactive shots while being charged, or more range, that would be nice. I hate that we only have 20" range and so many things have a move+charge range larger than that. The whole point of having ranged units is to have a larger threat bubble. 

I honestly have no idea what they'll give us, but I hope it's good! Right now I have a lot of success just playing mixed order with Sylvaneth. A little scared that the Allies mechanic will basically nerf my frontline, since I won't be able to take as much Sylvaneth. 

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23 hours ago, Aezeal said:

- Why run EG in 20's and not 10's?

- Why treekin and not more EG.

20 EG is great, why wouldn't you take them and for only 160 points?  

Treekin are nice and Tanky and cheap.  I've come to love my 6 in my Winterleaf.  

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54 minutes ago, Popisdead said:

20 EG is great, why wouldn't you take them and for only 160 points?  

Treekin are nice and Tanky and cheap.  I've come to love my 6 in my Winterleaf.  

I meant why not the same number total but in 10s.

And why not more EG instead of treekin.

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