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Maths on Nurgle Units, WIP


shadowgra

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hi guys!

i'm doing this thread cause i want to share my calcs on nurgle units, in order to know which unit does more damage for example, what we should start maybe looking at, what is going to be instead kind of useless (even if nothing is useless on all fronts)

i am still doing the leaders part, since it will take a lot more (i already did something on leaders anyway in a previous post)

this time i included also some common buffs given to a particular unit (ex: +1 to hit on blightkings) in order to see how much this buffs improves their effectiveness. 

finally all the average wounds are given to a 4+ save, not only because it helps me against my friends that play ironjawz (ouch!) and stormcast (double ouch!). 

i hope u enjoy that, i will keep this thread updated as soon as i have done all the calcs for a certain thing (i am planning to do also effective wounds taken per unit)

thanks all for viewing, feel free to share opinions and ideas!

 

Battlelines:

-          Plaguebearers.

Cost: 100 points. Wounds: 10. Save 5+. Invulnerable save: 5+. Reroll saves if near Daemon Hero of Nurgle. Gain benefits in malus modifiers for enemies as the unit grows in size. Recommended sizes: 10 and 30. They move 4”.

Average wounds vs 4+ save: 1.83 wounds.

Role: anvil

-          Marauders.

Cost: 60 points. Wounds:10. Save 5+. No invulnerable saves. Add hit and wound modifiers as they grow in size. Recommended size: any. They move 5”.

Average wounds vs 4+ save with no buffs: 1.375 wounds

Average wounds with modifier to hit buff: 1.83 wounds

Average wounds with to hit and to wound buffs: 2.44 wounds.

-          Warriors:

Cost: 180 points. Wounds: 20. Save 4+. Invulnerable save: 5+ with shields. Rerolls 1 to save if in big numbers. Recommended size: 10 or 28 with plaguetouched. They move 5”.

Can hold objective well with 5++ save, great weapons give to a mortal army much needed rend. 

sword vs 4+ save: 3.41 wounds

Great weapon vs 4+ save: 4.6 wounds

Units:

 

-          Blightkings:

cost 180 points. Wounds: 16. Save 4+. Invulnerable save: none. On hero phase on a 6 for each unit near them they deal mortal wounds or heal if nurgle. They move 4”. recommended size: usually 5 due to their large bases.

Hammer unit vs lower save armies.

Average wounds vs 4+ unit: 6.25 wounds.

With a lord of war/dark avenger modifier: 10 wounds.

-          Plague Drones

Cost: 220 points. Wounds: 15. Save: 5+. Invulnerable save: 5+. They can do mortal wounds on a 6 to wound if near a daemon hero of nurgle. They move 8”.

Hammer and fast unit. recommended size: 3-6.

Average wounds of shooting vs 4+ unit: 0.5

Average wounds in combat: 3.66 wounds. Globally they deal a medium of 1.5 mortal wounds per round of combat.

With glottkins buff they deal: 5.67 +0.5 wounds totally. With the buff they also deal 2.5 mortal wounds per turn.

-          Bile Trolls

Cost: 200 points. Wounds 15. Save 5+. No invulnerability. They heal wounds. They move 4”. recommended size is 3-6 trolls.

Hammer unit with low bravery. Good against high saves.

Average wounds per shooting: 2.22

Average wounds in combat: 5.33

Also they have 50% of chance of getting an extra auto-hit for the vomit.

 

-          soulgrinder

cost: 280 points. Wounds: 16. Save 4+. No invulnerable save. Can run and shoot. it moves 12”.

Hammer unit and also a ranged threat.

Average wounds of shooting vs 4+: 1.61 wounds

Average wounds in combat with talon, claw and legs: 4.67

Buffed by the glottkin, against a 4+: 6.45 wounds without the shooting.

 

-          plague monks:

cost 70 points. Wounds 10. Save none. Have lots of useful and interesting abilities, if they charge they deal more damage. The damage is counted as bringing a woe stave and being in charge. They move 6”. recommended size: 20 but some pestilens players may want to comment on that one. 

Average wounds against 4+: 4.58 wounds.

They deal a lot of damage for being a so weak unit, great hammer but needs to be safe from shooting.

 

-          Plague censer bearers

Cost: 60 points. Wounds: 5. Save none. Deal damage in an aura on a 4+. Rally squishy, as for the monks they are conted as in charge for their damage. They move 6”. recommended size: 5-10. 

Average wounds vs 4+: 3.33 wounds.

They reroll to hit if near plague monks, but overall they do less damage then the monks and are more expensive.

 

-          Plagueclaw catapult

Cost:180 points. Wounds 6. Save 5+. Deal more damage based on target’s unit size.

Non boosted damage against 4+: 1.62 wounds.

Boosted damage against 4+: 4.86 wounds.

Useful againsts some big units. Generally doesn’t deal a lot by itself.

 

-          Plague Ogres

Cost: 160 points. 15 wounds with a 5+ save. On a 6 a killed model returns to life with 1 wounds.  Have the nurgle’s rot aura, but weaker. If they charge they reroll hit rolls. They move 5”. as a recommended size i think it could go with the trolls' size.

Average wounds vs 4+: 4

Average wounds with charge bonus: 6 wounds.

I honestly thought that they were much worse.

 

-          Gigantic chaos spawn 

Cost: 180 points. 12 wounds. 5+ save. Has some nice rules in her mutations, can be marked and if it does a double with her tentacles it hits on a 3+. Moves 3D6”. Average move: 10.5”.

Average damage vs 4+: 3.10

Average boosted damage: 3.49, not much higher.

 

-          Gorebeast chariot

Cost:100 points. 8 wounds a piece with 4+ save. Must be played with greatblade since this gives to one weapon rend. Can deal mortal damage on the charge. Can explode attacks, doubling the attacks on the gorebeast. Moves up to 8”.

Average damage vs 4+: 1.92.

Damage with exploded gorebeast: 2.92

Can be boosted nicely by glottkin’s ability for +3 attacks.

-         

BBeasts of nurgle: 

cost: 60 points. can boost the squad. Has a 6 wounds with a 5+ save. No invulnerable save. They move 5”. Can run and charge, can do mortal wounds with their trail. Their locus double their damage on a 6+ to wound if near a daemon hero of nurgle.

Average wounds caused vs a 4+: 1.24 wounds.

With locus changes barely nothing.

-      

    Nurglings:

cost:80 points. wounds: 12, with no save. They move 5”. They heal all wounds suffered if the base of nurglings was not killed. They can do additional mortal wounds to a unit to which it caused unsaved wounds.

Average wounds caused vs a 4+: 0.83 wounds for 3 models.

-        

  Chaos chariot

Cost 80 points per model. 7 wounds at 4+ save. Can add a d6 to their move. Move 8”.  If they charge hooves get +1 to hit and wound.

Average damage vs 4+: 1.37 wounds.

With boosted hooves: 1.75 wounds.

 

Battlelines:

-          Plaguebearers.

Cost: 100 points. Wounds: 10. Save 5+. Invulnerable save: 5+. Reroll saves if near Daemon Hero of Nurgle. Gain benefits in malus modifiers for enemies as the unit grows in size. Recommended sizes: 10 and 30. They move 4”.

Average wounds vs 4+ save: 1.83 wounds.

Role: anvil

-          Marauders.

Cost: 60 points. Wounds:10. Save 5+. No invulnerable saves. Add hit and wound modifiers as they grow in size. Recommended size: any. They move 5”.

Average wounds vs 4+ save with no buffs: 1.375 wounds

Average wounds with modifier to hit buff: 1.83 wounds

Average wounds with to hit and to wound buffs: 2.44 wounds.

-          Warriors:

Cost: 180 points. Wounds: 20. Save 4+. Invulnerable save: 5+ with shields. Rerolls 1 to save if in big numbers. Recommended size: none. They move 5”.

Don’t really have a place in a nurgle army apart from the great weapon set.

Great weapon vs 4+ save: 4.6 wounds

Units:

-          Blightkings:

cost 180 points. Wounds: 16. Save 4+. Invulnerable save: none. On hero phase on a 6 for each unit near them they deal mortal wounds or heal if nurgle. They move 4”.

Hammer unit vs lower save armies.

Average wounds vs 4+ unit: 6.25 wounds.

With a lord of war/dark avenger modifier: 10 wounds.

-          Plague Drones

Cost: 220 points. Wounds: 15. Save: 5+. Invulnerable save: 5+. They can do mortal wounds on a 6 to wound if near a daemon hero of nurgle. They move 8”.

Hammer and fast unit.

Average wounds of shooting vs 4+ unit: 0.5

Average wounds in combat: 3.66 wounds. Globally they deal a medium of 1.5 mortal wounds per round of combat.

With glottkins buff they deal: 5.67 +0.5 wounds totally. With the buff they also deal 2.5 mortal wounds per turn.

-          Bile Trolls

Cost: 200 points. Wounds 15. Save 5+. No invulnerability. They heal wounds. They move 4”.

Hammer unit with low bravery. Good against high saves.

Average wounds per shooting: 2.22

Average wounds in combat: 5.33

Also they have 50% of chance of getting an extra auto-hit for the vomit.

 

-          soulgrinder

cost: 280 points. Wounds: 16. Save 4+. No invulnerable save. Can run and shoot. it moves 12”.

Hammer unit and also a ranged threat.

Average wounds of shooting vs 4+: 1.61 wounds

Average wounds in combat with talon, claw and legs: 4.67

Buffed by the glottkin, against a 4+: 6.45 wounds without the shooting.

 

-          plague monks:

cost 70 points. Wounds 10. Save none. Have lots of useful and interesting abilities, if they charge they deal more damage. The damage is counted as bringing a woe stave and being in charge. They move 6”.

Average wounds against 4+: 4.58 wounds.

They deal a lot of damage for being a so weak unit, great hammer but needs to be safe from shooting.

 

-          Plague censer bearers

Cost: 60 points. Wounds: 5. Save none. Deal damage in an aura on a 4+. Rally squishy, as for the monks they are conted as in charge for their damage. They move 6”.

Average wounds vs 4+: 3.33 wounds.

They reroll to hit if near plague monks, but overall they do less damage then the monks and are more expensive.

 

-          Plagueclaw catapult

Cost:180 points. Wounds 6. Save 5+. Deal more damage based on target’s unit size.

Non boosted damage against 4+: 1.62 wounds.

Boosted damage against 4+: 4.86 wounds.

Useful againsts some big units. Generally doesn’t deal a lot by itself.

 

-          Plague Ogres

Cost: 160 points. 15 wounds with a 5+ save. On a 6 a killed model returns to life with 1 wounds.  Have the nurgle’s rot aura, but weaker. If they charge they reroll hit rolls. They move 5”.

Average wounds vs 4+: 4

Average wounds with charge bonus: 6 wounds.

I honestly thought that they were much worse.

-          Gigantic chaos spawn

 

Cost: 180 points. 12 wounds. 5+ save. Has some nice rules in her mutations, can be marked and if it does a double with her tentacles it hits on a 3+. Moves 3D6”. Average move: 10.5”.

Average damage vs 4+: 3.10

Average boosted damage: 3.49, not much higher.

-          Gorebeast chariot

Cost:100 points. 8 wounds a piece with 4+ save. Must be played with greatblade since this gives to one weapon rend. Can deal mortal damage on the charge. Can explode attacks, doubling the attacks on the gorebeast. Moves up to 8”.

Average damage vs 4+: 1.92.

Damage with exploded gorebeast: 2.92

Can be boosted nicely by glottkin’s ability for +3 attacks.

-          Beasts of nurgle:

 

cost: 60 points. can boost the squad. Has a 6 wounds with a 5+ save. No invulnerable save. They move 5”. Can run and charge, can do mortal wounds with their trail. Their locus double their damage on a 6+ to wound if near a daemon hero of nurgle.

Average wounds caused vs a 4+: 1.24 wounds.

With locus changes barely nothing.

-          Nurglings:

cost:80 points. wounds: 12, with no save. They move 5”. They heal all wounds suffered if the base of nurglings was not killed. They can do additional mortal wounds to a unit to which it caused unsaved wounds.

Average wounds caused vs a 4+: 0.83 wounds for 3 models.

-          Chaos chariot

Cost 80 points per model. 7 wounds at 4+ save. Can add a d6 to their move. Move 8”.  If they charge hooves get +1 to hit and wound.

Average damage vs 4+: 1.37 wounds.

With boosted hooves: 1.75 wounds.

 

Unit’s effective damage taken before being wiped out:

-         

Plaguebearers:

18- ish wounds flat.

With locus: 19.24 wounds.

As 30 they get a -1 to hit for enemies in combat. Only calculating this one cause no one will shoot at plaguebearers usually. Wounds in this case are 62.25. calcs with locus changes minimally.

13.33 wounds against mortal wounds.

With glottkin’s spell, as 30 they have 124.5 wounds.

-        

  Marauders:

13.33 wounds flat.

With harbinger of decay: 17.77

With -1 to hit from plaguetouched: 18.83, increases even more if harbinger is nearby, to 24-ish.

10 wounds against mortals, 13.33 if harbinger is nearby.

With glottkin’s buff and plaguetouched as 10 they have nearly 48 wounds.

-         

Warriors:

40 wounds flat without shield.

53.3 with shield.

With harbinger their save with no shield becomes 53.3.

With plaguetouched and shield they are boosted to: 62.22 wounds.

-         

Blightkings:

32 wounds flat.

42.67 wounds with harbinger buff

16 against mortals.

21.33 against mortals with harbinger’s buff.

 

-          Plague drones.

26.67 wounds flat.

20 vs mortals.

-        

  Bile trolls:

20 wounds flat.

15 against mortals.

-     7

    Soulgrinder:

32 wounds flat.

16 vs mortals.

-         

Monks and censer bearers: no save, so flat wounds.

-     

     Plague ogres:

20 wounds flat.

15 vs mortals.

-         

Gigantic chaos spawn:

16 wounds flat, 12 vs mortals.

-   

      Gorebeast chariot

16 wounds flat. Boost to 21.33 with harbinger

8 vs mortals. Boost to 10.26 with harbinger

-        

  Beasts of nurgle:

8 wounds flat. 6 vs mortals.

-        

  Nurglings

12 wounds flat and vs mortal wounds.

-         

Chaos chariot:

14 wounds flat. Going up to 18.67 with harbinger.

7 vs mortals. Going up to 9.3 with harbinger of decay

 

 

Leaders WIPPING

Edit: added average taking wounds before wiping.

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I'd err on the side of caution with writing units off.

 

Warriors with shield's provide a decent mortal wound protection with a higher damage output than plaguebearers and as they're mortal allow taking of blightkings as battleline. 

A unit of 10 warriors is cheaper than plaguebearers and more damage from fewer models, 5+ save v mortal wounds and a 4 save normally makes them very tanky, great point holding unit.

Faster than most nurgle units, fits into plaguetouched.

Also mortal units work with the Harbinger, a key buff for most nurgle armies

They provide more uses than just the attack profile

Consistency in the result would be nice also, using glottkin as a buff on one unit then not another gives a skewed view.

Probably best not using external synergies outside of the unit in discussions profile (such as plaguebearers) when deciding their viability. 

Movement should also be taken into account when giving the review of the unit, objective capture can win games, can't capture if slow.

 

Other than that, looks ok

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5 hours ago, Arkiham said:

I'd err on the side of caution with writing units off.

 

Warriors with shield's provide a decent mortal wound protection with a higher damage output than plaguebearers and as they're mortal allow taking of blightkings as battleline. 

A unit of 10 warriors is cheaper than plaguebearers and more damage from fewer models, 5+ save v mortal wounds and a 4 save normally makes them very tanky, great point holding unit.

Faster than most nurgle units, fits into plaguetouched.

Also mortal units work with the Harbinger, a key buff for most nurgle armies

They provide more uses than just the attack profile

Consistency in the result would be nice also, using glottkin as a buff on one unit then not another gives a skewed view.

Probably best not using external synergies outside of the unit in discussions profile (such as plaguebearers) when deciding their viability. 

Movement should also be taken into account when giving the review of the unit, objective capture can win games, can't capture if slow.

 

Other than that, looks ok

Imho warriors with shield is kind of redundant since with mortal nurgle you almost always choose the harbinger as general.

A unit of warriors costs almost as 20 plaguebearers, from a purely teorical point if warriors have shield, plaguebearers are going to do more damage in total. However not always u can attack with everything so ok.

I included movement in each unit. 

If playing mortal nurgle i am sure that u might fit they in, but as i said, since u will 90% play the harbinger as general, you want to go with the great weapons set since it gives rend.

I simply included the most significant unit in the glottkin buff, when he buffs blightkings is not the same of when he buffs plague drones. Drones get +3 a from glottkin aura. Soulgrinder too. Plaguebearers double their damage.

Eventually i can do every buff per every unit, i don't think it will be much of a problem.

Regarding the harbinger, when i do the units' resistance i will put his buff in calculating mortal nurgle tankiness (obviously separated by the normal tankiness)

Anyway give me time to make everything more readable :), i am sure u will appreciate much more!

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What I'm saying is,

Warriors are more survivable than blightkings. So if you need a unit to sit on a objective and not move you'd use them over the blightkings and run the harbinger with the blightkings on an offensive to capture the other points.

So by using the unit for a specific role their value changes. And a major victory is most important, and give  the sheer amount of mortal wounds coming from everywhere now, the shield will provide much needed protection 

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right didn't thought about that, simply cause i prefer to use marauders to hold objectives. a unit of 28 in the plaguetouched is deadly and costs as 10 warriors. anyway i'll put maths of swords and shield. halberd is only weaker than the sword, so is easy to calculate the damage from there.

 

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