Nico Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Quote Looking at death and destruction though, how would you want them to expand now as they look a bit thin compared to the other hand alliances? One year ago, Destruction were the big losers from AoS - they had received nothing new and weren't very exciting (they did in fact have some very strong battalions and combos, but they were reasonably well hidden or were only a function of certain things being undercosted - Arachnoroks and Thundertusks in particular). They had a revolution in the summer of 2016 with 3 exciting new factions, some great new models and clever re-working of the older battalions. Even before that they also received the Lion's share of the goodies in the Monstrous Arcanum (although the Stonelord plus Battlebrew soon made this less relevant - a great shame - all of these monsters need to be recosted downward with this in mind). They peaked at Blood & Glory (before being significantly nerfed in the December FAQ). They are still neck-a-neck with Order and probably still marginally better than Chaos even with the big and welcome and awesome injection of DoT. Death players could really do with a new Battletome and new models before Destruction get their next one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Quote More Ironjawz. Few things would cheer me up or improve balance in the game more than an allegiance ability for Ironjawz whereby-Gore Gruntas which charge an enemy unit of pew pew cause that unit to shoot themselves. The game has insufficient strong counters to pew pew and far too many of them belong to the pew pew armies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeGrunt Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 4 hours ago, RuneBrush said: I actually think this is currently the biggest issue with the background part of Death, there aren't enough players - Nagash has everything and Tomb Kings are currently sat to one side until we know what happened to them. All of the other Grand Alliances have quite a few protagonists, and until we get more for Death we're going to continue to struggle a bit. This is my main lore issue with Death as it stands. I dislike the fact that it's a pet faction for Nagash, it doesn't fit IMO. Personally I'd like to see a return of Settra to challenge Nagash right now as he is weakened by the resurgence of Order and the theft of souls. As far as a mortal Death faction, I think that could culturally be a really cool idea. Imagine a society where death is merely a rite of passage, that allows a person to transcend mortality and become spiritkind, where they can walk next to their descendents and guide them in times of need. In battle, you could have flagellants who are promised spiritdom when they die, and thus when they die they spawn, say, Spirit Hosts or something. You could have Heroes possessed by the spirits of heroes past, or counsellors who whisper in the ear of their mortal allies, spirit mages who see through rock and metal to spy enemy positions and aid their mortal descendents. The core theme could be reincarnation. You kill Mortals, they become Spiritkind. Flesh it out a bit more, give it a compelling visual style, and it could be a very cool take on Death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDM Posted February 17, 2017 Author Share Posted February 17, 2017 Really good ideas and the main point I can see is we don't necessarily need everything in the death alliance to be dead or at least wholly dead! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinros Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 1 hour ago, CoffeeGrunt said: This is my main lore issue with Death as it stands. I dislike the fact that it's a pet faction for Nagash, it doesn't fit IMO. Personally I'd like to see a return of Settra to challenge Nagash right now as he is weakened by the resurgence of Order and the theft of souls. As far as a mortal Death faction, I think that could culturally be a really cool idea. Imagine a society where death is merely a rite of passage, that allows a person to transcend mortality and become spiritkind, where they can walk next to their descendents and guide them in times of need. In battle, you could have flagellants who are promised spiritdom when they die, and thus when they die they spawn, say, Spirit Hosts or something. You could have Heroes possessed by the spirits of heroes past, or counsellors who whisper in the ear of their mortal allies, spirit mages who see through rock and metal to spy enemy positions and aid their mortal descendents. The core theme could be reincarnation. You kill Mortals, they become Spiritkind. Flesh it out a bit more, give it a compelling visual style, and it could be a very cool take on Death. Honestly I don't think that's going to change Death is the extreme end of order there would always be a clear hierarchy with nagash on top the mortarch's next in line and so on. That's always been the undead's thing even in whfb and when nagash came back when he was not even a god he went down south to trash the tomb kings and make them kneel. Then after that trashed all their ruined cities to make a point. Settra would not stand a chance against nagash if he challenged him considering how his powers work nagash could make settra kill himself without lifting a finger or dismiss his spirit all together. Hence why in the FEC it's noted those that have not bent the knee, run and put as much space between them and nagash. Hence why if the tomb kings come back in some form (I kinda doubt it) I think it would be headed by khalida to have a rival to neferata of sorts and she is pragmatic enough to work with or follow nagash. Going by the lord of undeath, audio drama series and the FEC I still think overall Death has had the best fluff in form of development so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeGrunt Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Eh, I still hold out hope. I don't like Nagash and I dislike factions without any kind of internal conflict. Who's to say how a returning Settra could get their power? Mannfred is hardly loyal after all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinros Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 25 minutes ago, CoffeeGrunt said: Eh, I still hold out hope. I don't like Nagash and I dislike factions without any kind of internal conflict. Who's to say how a returning Settra could get their power? Mannfred is hardly loyal after all... Yes but mannfred acknowledges nagash is his master even if he does not like it his own words in lord of undeath. It's telling that Mannfred and Arkhan was aware of nagash's black pyramid plot and was not going to do an alliance with sigmar. Neferata did not find out until the end of the book. Neferata is not all that loyal either she wanted to use the alliance with sigmar to escape nagash. Josh reynolds states that mannfred also exists to prevent neferata's plots at outright usurpation and he is nagash's champion. There is a reason why manny attempted his plot in ghur because he thought perhaps because nagash does not really have power there he thought it might work until a wild arkhan appeared. Mannfred knows better to go against him in shyish and considering the last plan did not work outside shyish I suspect he will not attempt such plans in the future if mannfred was not truly loyal in a sense he would not have fought for shyish to keep it together for over 400+ years. He could of hid away like neferata but he didn't. The thing is nagash knows the minds of his servants he could brute force control them but he prefers to manipulate them without them knowing. I think that's why he has such affection for the bald vampire because at least he is somewhat aware when he is doing it and his mind is as twisted as his own per nagash's own words. He is the only mortarch he refers to as his "child" or his prodigal son. Maybe mannfred reminds nagash of himself when he was mortal? Vlad and Arkhan did state both of them are alike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Baumann Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 There are a million things they could do really. Sideshow Collectibles' Court of the Dead is a really cool world with different factions and intrigue in the Underworld, something like that would be amazing, their visual aesthetics would look great on the field too. I also think something along the lines of Game of Thrones Wight Walkers/Night's King leading a separate faction (either from the wastes of one world or through a Realm Gate from unkown realm) could be pretty cool too, tying into raising zombies/skeletons of all different races (I used to have an undead giant 20+ years ago). I am not entirely in for a mortal/human faction so much... Death Cults sound cool but not sure the actual entities of the underworld and undeath would go for that except maybe as Vampire enchanted slave units that serve as food and fodder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vasshpit Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 4 hours ago, Travis Baumann said: Sideshow Collectibles' Court of the Dead These are absolutely stunning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinros Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 4 hours ago, Travis Baumann said: There are a million things they could do really. Sideshow Collectibles' Court of the Dead is a really cool world with different factions and intrigue in the Underworld, something like that would be amazing, their visual aesthetics would look great on the field too. I also think something along the lines of Game of Thrones Wight Walkers/Night's King leading a separate faction (either from the wastes of one world or through a Realm Gate from unkown realm) could be pretty cool too, tying into raising zombies/skeletons of all different races (I used to have an undead giant 20+ years ago). I am not entirely in for a mortal/human faction so much... Death Cults sound cool but not sure the actual entities of the underworld and undeath would go for that except maybe as Vampire enchanted slave units that serve as food and fodder. Personally I hope GW does create a human thrall unit where units with the vampire key word could use them to recover wounds it would be pretty cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDM Posted February 18, 2017 Author Share Posted February 18, 2017 I think they missed a trick with Brettonia as well, they could still have Brettonians in some way as a small faction of order but also from the end times story, some Brettonian death units would of been cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGPO Posted February 18, 2017 Share Posted February 18, 2017 On 15/02/2017 at 10:51 PM, Druchiilord94 said: Sigh Looks like I'll be ignoring most new lore then Saying that for my Dark Elves I also ignore the lore due to the fact I hate the whole were good guys now. Outcasts aren't "good" by any means, they just fight with Order. I prefer to think of them as lawful evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Tomlin Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Personally I'd love to see a mortal faction released for Death. That sounds really cool to me, could be really interesting and would allow them to explore something new in game that is already established in the fluff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nico Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Quote Personally I'd love to see a mortal faction released for Death. That sounds really cool to me, could be really interesting and would allow them to explore something new in game that is already established in the fluff. Would this be analogous to the Arcanites/Kairic Acolytes and their relationship with Daemons. So they would be mortal but would summon on stuff and benefit from Necromancy. That could be cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Tomlin Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 10 minutes ago, Nico said: Would this be analogous to the Arcanites/Kairic Acolytes and their relationship with Daemons. So they would be mortal but would summon on stuff and benefit from Necromancy. That could be cool. I don't really know what the actual fluff is, but yeh, it's this sort of thing I have in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warboss Gorbolg Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Nagash twisting and corrupting the church of Morr post End Times could make an interesting background for a mortals faction, with a bit of a nod to the World-that-was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Criti Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 15 minutes ago, Warboss Gorbolg said: Nagash twisting and corrupting the church of Morr post End Times could make an interesting background for a mortals faction, with a bit of a nod to the World-that-was. Perhaps... but maybe it's time to stop referencing the World That Was. It was nice at the beginning, because everyone who played AoS came from 8th. Now, us "old men of the Old World" are watching the next generation of Warhammer players. Let them have their own stories, without having to piece together things we remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kramer Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 7 minutes ago, Criti said: Perhaps... but maybe it's time to stop referencing the World That Was. It was nice at the beginning, because everyone who played AoS came from 8th. Now, us "old men of the Old World" are watching the next generation of Warhammer players. Let them have their own stories, without having to piece together things we remember. How old is AoS now? In my time we had a couple of years of throwbacks #throwbackthursday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Criti Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 3 minutes ago, Kramer said: How old is AoS now? In my time we had a couple of years of throwbacks #throwbackthursday If you go by how fast GW pumps out 40k editions lately, AoS is middle aged! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kramer Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Just now, Criti said: If you go by how fast GW pumps out 40k editions lately, AoS is middle aged! I feel for you but that doesn't worry me at all. but genuinely 2 years? 1,5? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Criti Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 For those of you who are new to the game, about a year and seven months ago, the Old World fell through a dimensional rift behind a Burger King into the magical land of Age of Sigmar. I knkw not everyone will get that reference, but the time is correct..m and Earth people are loving that reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDM Posted February 21, 2017 Author Share Posted February 21, 2017 So if we were to expand the current factions how would that go? death rattle, soulblight etc? Someone in another thread rightly said that death is a grand alliance and maybe we should think big on the variety of their sub factions. Personally I think death rattle is an easy place to start and would love to see more units with the morghast aesthetic. Soulblight and nighthaunt seem difficult to add to though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celestant651 Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Personally, I would rather some sort of undead storm cast. It would be pretty cool, and it would give Death some good power Units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoffeeGrunt Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Oh please no, there's enough Stormcast as there is without every faction getting "Stormcast in X Flavour." I avoid playing Stormcast because I'm not a fan of the models, the first proper Death update being zombie Stormcast would be annoying. I'm really warming to the idea of Death Mortals though, been giving that a lot of thought lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDM Posted February 24, 2017 Author Share Posted February 24, 2017 I had an undead army 16-17 years ago with a metal necromancer, I always assumed he was alive but maybe survived longer because of his use of dark magic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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