Let's chat Disciples of Tzeentch

[Malakithe]

So how are the points changes looking now that there is very reliable blurry videos all over?

[ssharkus]

Is it ok to post it, scince its everywhere already?

[ssharkus]

Screamers,  Flamers got -20

Changehost, Skyfires +20

Gaunt 180

Archaon 660

[CJPT]

That change to splitting is super weird, and I kind of love it. If you don't have a hero nearby, you can't use splitting for tarpitting because there's nobody available to actually spend your Blue/Brimstone Points. If Heralds get cheaper, this could make them actually pretty important.

[Jamopower]

The tarpitting doesn't work even if there is a hero, because you have to sunmon them 9" away from the enemy. 

Edit. Which isn't to say that the splitting wouldn't look quite useful. You can summon those blue horrors elsewhere to hold objectives or use them as speedbumps (and thus generate some brimstone horrors).

[The Cyclop Owl]

Notice that the blue/brimstone points gained when pink/blue horrors die allow you to delay the splitting until pretty much whenever you want, and anywhere on the battlefield.

 

If the pink horrors are indeed 200 points a unit, that looks like a straight buff to me.

[AaronWilson]

So yeah, when we "summon" blue / brimstone horrors back onto the field via old splitting they have to be placed wholly within 12" AND 9" away from an enemy.  Certainly different to the old split, pink horrors at 200 include splitting seems reasonable, have to be careful of hero placement now.

I have a question that I don't think we have a answer for yet though, if we summon a Herald of Tzeentch, etc do we get to pick the spells as we summon it or do we not get to select a extra spell from the Lore of Change? 

[The Cyclop Owl]

10 minutes ago, AaronWIlson said:

So yeah, when we "summon" blue / brimstone horrors back onto the field via old splitting they have to be placed wholly within 12" AND 9" away from an enemy.  Certainly different to the old split, pink horrors at 200 include splitting seems reasonable, have to be careful of hero placement now.

I have a question that I don't think we have a answer for yet though, if we summon a Herald of Tzeentch, etc do we get to pick the spells as we summon it or do we not get to select a extra spell from the Lore of Change? 

Probably as you summon.

 

Also, how about Boon of Mutation? I was expecting tzaangors to have a summoning cost, but as it stands the spell seems to have received a massive buff.

[AaronWilson]

25 minutes ago, The Cyclop Owl said:

Probably as you summon.

 

Also, how about Boon of Mutation? I was expecting tzaangors to have a summoning cost, but as it stands the spell seems to have received a massive buff.

That would be great, with a Herald of Tzeench on Disc only costing 12 points which can be reliably obtained by turn  3 / 2  if you're heavy on spells / your opponents is summoning a Herald seems sweet, another few spells, another unbind, another point to put horrors, etc.

Yup Boon of Mutation is free Tzaangors. Is it the Ogroids spell that lets you summon a free chaos spawn if it kills something? 

[Nevvermore]

^{Ogroid spell does D6 MW and lets you set up a unit of Horrors (any type) equal to the number of MWs caused within 1" of the enemy.}

[Olincay]

I'm thinking the restriction on setup for  summoning is going to be abit of a concern, you can easily be zoned out from 12 on a hero and 9  away from a enemy. 

Especially if it's going to take a couple turns to get the required fate points to summon anything. 

[The Cyclop Owl]

25 minutes ago, Nevvermore said:

^{Ogroid spell does D6 MW and lets you set up a unit of Horrors (any type) equal to the number of MWs caused within 1" of the enemy.}

Which is going to be very powerful if some of your pink have died already, cause you’d be racking up yo the blue points and wouldn’t have to tap into dop points.

I think the chaos spawn summoning spell is from the magister, but I’d imagine we’ll have to pay points for them — they’re just on a different summoning table than the ones we’ve seen for Khorne and Tzeentch.

[AaronWilson]

Wholly within 12" an 9" away could be tricky, I think it's worth keeping a hero back for throwing out buffing spells and a reliable spawn point. 

[CJPT]

32 minutes ago, AaronWIlson said:

That would be great, with a Herald of Tzeench on Disc only costing 12 points which can be reliably obtained by turn  3 / 2  if you're heavy on spells / your opponents is summoning a Herald seems sweet, another few spells, another unbind, another point to put horrors, etc.

Yup Boon of Mutation is free Tzaangors. Is it the Ogroids spell that lets you summon a free chaos spawn if it kills something? 

You're thinking of the Magister - his Bolt of Change spell does D3 mortal wounds, then you roll a D6 for every slain model and they turn into spawn on a 4+.

I think Magisters have the potential to be pretty good value in the new edition, actually - imagine throwing Bolt of Change at a big block of Thunderers or any other 1-wound ranged model. Kill a couple of them, hopefully create 1-2 Spawn, break their shooting for a turn as they can only fire at your (free) 5-wound meatshields.

[CJPT]

2 minutes ago, The Cyclop Owl said:

I think the chaos spawn summoning spell is from the magister, but I’d imagine we’ll have to pay points for them — they’re just on a different summoning table than the ones we’ve seen for Khorne and Tzeentch.

I don't think there's going to be any other summoning tables, or points for summoning, based on what we've seen so far. They'd be more likely to change the Magister/Ogroid warscrolls to limit their use.

[Nevvermore]

So are Flamers and/or Screamers viable now with the points drop, especially Flamers seeing as Skyfires (the unit that does the same thing but better) were nerfed?

[ssharkus]

17 minutes ago, CJPT said:

I don't think there's going to be any other summoning tables, or points for summoning, based on what we've seen so far. They'd be more likely to change the Magister/Ogroid warscrolls to limit their use.

Those spells should be free. Only the "Summon ******" spells were reworked. 

Anyway, RIP Changehost.

[The Cyclop Owl]

46 minutes ago, CJPT said:

You're thinking of the Magister - his Bolt of Change spell does D3 mortal wounds, then you roll a D6 for every slain model and they turn into spawn on a 4+.

I think Magisters have the potential to be pretty good value in the new edition, actually - imagine throwing Bolt of Change at a big block of Thunderers or any other 1-wound ranged model. Kill a couple of them, hopefully create 1-2 Spawn, break their shooting for a turn as they can only fire at your (free) 5-wound meatshields.

Actually I think every Tzeentch wizard has received a substantial buff in practice, with viable summoning and the realm lores. If it’s not incredibly expensive, the curseling is going to be amazing!

[Arkiham]

1 hour ago, Olincay said:

I'm thinking the restriction on setup for  summoning is going to be abit of a concern, you can easily be zoned out from 12 on a hero and 9  away from a enemy. 

Especially if it's going to take a couple turns to get the required fate points to summon anything. 

Ironjawz turn 1 across the board will all but end changehost. 

[Olincay]

8 minutes ago, Arkiham said:

Ironjawz turn 1 across the board will all but end changehost. 

Splitting to tie stuff up into combat is dead, i find it odd how Khorne can just summon 9 away from the enemy, no restrictions on having a hero. 

[Ratso]

54 minutes ago, The Cyclop Owl said:

Actually I think every Tzeentch wizard has received a substantial buff in practice, with viable summoning and the realm lores. If it’s not incredibly expensive, the curseling is going to be amazing!

Looks like the curseling can actually use its ability now. With the old rule of one you couldn’t recast a spell as the wording was ‘a spell can only be cast once per turn’ . The new wording is ‘you can only cast a spell once, meaning your opponents, with a curseling, can still recast the spell after it is dispelled. 

Ohhh and the 30” dispel is good to  

[Olincay]

Yea this isn't good. 

[AaronWilson]

Anyone got any early list ideas in mind? 

[SwashBuccaneer]

Ouch. Those points. Glad I didn't just drop all that money on a list before 2.0.

[Zephril]

My maths could be off, but full splitting Horror's are now roughly 1/3 cheaper than before. Now, we're 200 points for 10 Pinks, 20 Blues and 20 Brims; before it was 300 for the same. And as you paid full for under sized units, it was harder to get full mileage out of it. The Ogroid's spells is now also a lot lot better; as it no longer costs 120 to create 1-6 Pinks.