Let's chat Disciples of Tzeentch

[kenshin620]

Looks like Balewinds won't be too common in 2.0, its now an endless spell so who knows how easy it is to pull it off.

[Malakithe]

18 hours ago, kenshin620 said:

Looks like Balewinds won't be too common in 2.0, its now an endless spell so who knows how easy it is to pull it off.

Yep. Thank the gods...it needed a huge nerf. Too many factions and lists were using it as a crutch

[Malakithe]

All the magic and free summoning is going to be nuts. They should just name it Age of Death/Tzeentch lol

Free horror splits, free chaos spawns, and summoning with a  special  mechanic and not points. Some of those endless spells will be crazy too as long as your opponent doesnt snatch them away ir dispell them.

[TheOtherJosh]

1 hour ago, Malakithe said:

Yep. Thank the gods...it needed a huge nerf. Too many factions and lists were using it as a crutch

The Balewind extended range of spells and dispels and provided some protection from Melee.

The new portal spell will give extended range... and everyone gets a 30” dispel range. There’s just going to be multiple methods to do what the Balewind used to do.

[kenshin620]

4 hours ago, Malakithe said:

 

Free horror splits

Are Horrors confirmed to split for free in matched play? I would think that would be one summon mechanic that won't be free or at the very least altered. That was far more of a fluff rule. Either that or pink horrors get a massive price hike since you have to kill them 3 times.

[Lou_Cypher]

Just wondering... what other abilities in Chaos Grand Alliance do we have that can potentially summon something for free?

Screaming Bell comes to mind and with a luck enough 6 in one of the two dice rolls, Fateweaver could influence the other into another 6 for a free Verminlord.

The Great Bray Shaman maybe?

[Malakithe]

All the abilities and such that could create Chaos Spawns

[TheOtherJosh]

2 hours ago, Lou_Cypher said:

Just wondering... what other abilities in Chaos Grand Alliance do we have that can potentially summon something for free?

Screaming Bell comes to mind and with a luck enough 6 in one of the two dice rolls, Fateweaver could influence the other into another 6 for a free Verminlord.

The Great Bray Shaman maybe?

There are several spell side-effects that can create horrors. The Ogroid Thaumaturge fireblast spell comes to mind.

There are spells/Abilities that turn folks into Tzaangor

[ssharkus]

My bet is that you ll need special points for summoning, accumulated from succesfull spell casts. 

And also you can say hello to an endless tide of horrors. 2k point changehost with 130+ pinks, splitting to 260 blues and 260 brims. It will be regulated, thats for sure. I mean they playtest the rules, right?)))

[Drib]

I think the Seraphon summoning is very strong and hope to see a similar pleasing change to the Tzeentch summoning.

[Malakithe]

7 hours ago, Drib said:

I think the Seraphon summoning is very strong and hope to see a similar pleasing change to the Tzeentch summoning.

Their summoning is total ******. They have to sacrifice almost 2 turns of spell casting from the Slann to build up points.  That would hamstring Tzeentch. Death has a similar way but instead have to pick a CA to summon.

Tzeentch will probably get a system like Khorne or Nurgle. Have to do something very specific to build up points. 

[Lou_Cypher]

Interesting reveal from the Podcast about summoning.

Goes up to 36 points for Tzeentch to get a Lord of Change at that high number.

You get a point for every spell cast that isn't Unbound.

You also get a point for every spell cast by your enemy. (That should be fun.)

I think they also made mention of just casting spells even if you don' have a target just so you can gain points?

[Xasz]

Sounds awfully easy.

I expect horror splits and some other abilities to be connected to this as well. Ergo, you cannot split if you do not have accumulated enough points.  Either that, or some units have to be significantly more expensive. (considering how easy this summoning precondition is, I'd guess points for DoT have to stay the same or go up anyway, while everyone else gets cheaper)

I really hope we are missing some context here.

[Malakithe]

Yeah that sounds way to brutal to be true

[Bellfree]

On ‎5‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 9:34 AM, kenshin620 said:

Are Horrors confirmed to split for free in matched play? I would think that would be one summon mechanic that won't be free or at the very least altered. That was far more of a fluff rule. Either that or pink horrors get a massive price hike since you have to kill them 3 times.

They were free to split in 40k and the unit stayed 90pts for 10. There were some funny pictures going around of people filling entire 6x4s with brimstones(usually in token form as that many models would be crazy expensive).

[ssharkus]

That depends on the summoning point cost for Tzeench units. 

Also thats brutal when you ll get alphastriked by some non magical SCE and boom - you have no points to spend on your splitting.

[Malakithe]

23 minutes ago, ssharkus said:

That depends on the summoning point cost for Tzeench units. 

Also thats brutal when you ll get alphastriked by some non magical SCE and boom - you have no points to spend on your splitting.

Lets face it though. After 2.0 lands every faction that can magic will..big time

[TheOtherJosh]

17 minutes ago, Malakithe said:

Lets face it though. After 2.0 lands every faction that can magic will..big time

I believe that magic will be strong, I also believe that there will be much more anti-magic and dispelling. Especially given the ranges for dispel going to 30”

There will be fewer I save on a  “1+” saves and more things dying on the table, combined with more things coming back to the table or being brought out to the table.

Overall it sounds like we may be looking at a much more tactically fluid game with knowledge of what can be done and combinations of unit and command abilities changing the game due to new synergy.

It is going to be an interesting month.

[FPC]

If we assume a Lord of Change is 36 “summon points,”  do we think it’s possible to speculate, say pink horrors, which are 40% LoC points, would cost 21 summon points?  If so, thats 21 spells...not exactly EASY to achieve very fast. Assuming every caster you have gets a spell off in your turn, maybe close to 8ish? Unless you’re playing another magic heavy faction you’d be hard pressed to get there turn 1. And depending on when summon is activated you might have to wait a second turn.

Now maybe summon points won’t be a linear increase based strictly on points. But also maybe it’s too soon to get excited (or disappointed) about free summons or even split. GW said summoning will be free, bit split isn’t summoning so it may not be free.

[Iradekhorne]

why you say "tzeenth is better than the seraphon summoning"??

If you have an slaan, in the second turn you can have 24 points (3 spells, 1 per slann general and 2 per astrolith bearer(12) per turn) if you dont cast anything yes, but thats a lot more faster than tzeentch, but if you have an arifact in your allegiance or the realm and it gives to the slaan one extra cast? That's 30 points finishing the 2 turn, thats just massive... with tzeentch you cant have that points finishing the turn 2, maybye on turn 4... but i dont think that.

And if you play vanguard game? you win the same points with seraphón in a 1250 point game...

[FPC]

Do we know for sure it’s 1 point per spell? Maybe higher casting value spells give more. I don’t know Seraphon, but they seem to have multiple ways to get their pool filled maybe Tzeentch will too.

[TheOtherJosh]

36 minutes ago, Iradekhorne said:

3 spells, 1 per slann general and 2 per astrolith bearer(12) per turn

They only get the 3 points per spell traded for celestial conjuring and only from the General (who has to be a Slaan).

You get one more at the end if the hero phase of the General is still on the field and only D3 (~2) total if you have Any Astrolith bearers (Not for each). So ... ~5. Not 12.

It doesn’t look like we will see 30 points by turn 2 for Seraphon if the reveal is accurate.

[Malakithe]

4 hours ago, TheOtherJosh said:

They only get the 3 points per spell traded for celestial conjuring and only from the General (who has to be a Slaan).

You get one more at the end if the hero phase of the General is still on the field and only D3 (~2) total if you have Any Astrolith bearers (Not for each). So ... ~5. Not 12.

It doesn’t look like we will see 30 points by turn 2 for Seraphon if the reveal is accurate.

Plus that all hinges on keeping super frog and banner lizard alive for it to even work. 

[Iradekhorne]

the slann can cast 3 spells per turn, how is redacted, he can trade all for celestial points.... thats average 12 points per turn.

if you can have an artifact on any mortal realm, or the new seraphón items that allow you to cast one extra spell, and you trade this spell also for celestial points, that's average 15 points per turn. (if you havent the chance 12 points then).

[Xasz]

7 hours ago, Iradekhorne said:

why you say "tzeenth is better than the seraphon summoning"??

Probably because you get your resource without having to take a choice.

As it stands, you accumulate the relevant points for DoT by doing what you would do anyway.

I especially dislike that your opponents spells are giving you points as well.

This might "force" DoT into always playing the maximum amount of wizards and disregard other options. (and do weird gamey stuff like casting spells without real targets and so on)

In the end, it really depends on the summoning table and it might vary from just a neat feature to oppressively broken. (not to mention that DoT is already one of the best, if not the best army)