Malakithe Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 Who else thinks GW will over react and raise the points back up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 2 hours ago, Malakithe said: Who else thinks GW will over react and raise the points back up? I do but not that much. For example the list above without the Skywardens will work after GH3 I an sure. Or 10 HB instead of the 3rd unit of Vulkites. And it's still a strong list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 I think the hero points are good since all they is buff and are super squishy. If they did change the points they could raise vulkites but lower AH and HB a bit to keep the faction as a whole around the same points range Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warboss Gorbolg Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 I think players should always be aware that if something within their faction becomes really strong and starts to frequently skew lists towards that unit, then the unit in question is ripe for an adjustment within a year or two (see Kurnoth Hunters). As a result, I think that it is a pretty small group of players ( i.e. Those with lots of time and money) that should built towards these skewed lists that are heavily reliant on a single unit type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 6 hours ago, Malakithe said: I think the hero points are good since all they is buff and are super squishy. If they did change the points they could raise vulkites but lower AH and HB a bit to keep the faction as a whole around the same points range The funny thing is that I think 30 Aurics for 480pt is a bigger problem than 30 Vulkites for 330pt. But since you need Vulkites, you can't run Aurics alone, it might work anyway. And I think the heroes should cost maybe 120pt and they are not that squishy, for example runfather 6 wounds often 4+ rerollable save and a 4+ wardsave. But it depends I guess. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turragor Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 43 minutes ago, Andreas said: The funny thing is that I think 30 Aurics for 480pt is a bigger problem than 30 Vulkites for 330pt. But since you need Vulkites, you can't run Aurics alone, it might work anyway. I don't see any one complaining (yet) about 30 vulkites as allies in any lists. I think if we start to see lots of complaints like that they'd for sure be costed up to over 400 for 30 to stop that 30 stack making it into certain other factions before you'd see the auric increase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 3 hours ago, Turragor said: I don't see any one complaining (yet) about 30 vulkites as allies in any lists. I think if we start to see lots of complaints like that they'd for sure be costed up to over 400 for 30 to stop that 30 stack making it into certain other factions before you'd see the auric increase. No it's the runes, the battleshock immunity, rerollable saves and the tunneling that makes the vulkites a little bit over the top. In isolation 30 vulkites are priced ok. But you don't need to raise points much for this to fall apart so be careful GW if you are watching. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNotebookGM Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 My mixed order list has 20 (soon to be thirty once I catch up painting and can rationalize the next box), a runesmiter, and a magson. The alpha vulkite charge is the only thing that gets me over the hump in some games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kozokus Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 On 04/01/2018 at 9:09 AM, Malakithe said: Who else thinks GW will over react and raise the points back up? I think a Warscroll rewriting is more probable. Like capping the ward save to 5++. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 3 hours ago, kozokus said: I think a Warscroll rewriting is more probable. Like capping the ward save to 5++. I don't think that is likely but if they do I would prefer that otherway around. 2 wounds, maybe more attacks etc. and double the points cost. Fyreslayers should be more elite and not a horde army like grots IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kozokus Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 11 minutes ago, Andreas said: I don't think that is likely but if they do I would prefer that otherway around. 2 wounds, maybe more attacks etc. and double the points cost. Fyreslayers should be more elite and not a horde army like grots IMO. And diminish the sellings of 45€ /120 points 10 guy boxes? no way :p. Rule rewritings are a possibility, talk to a BCR player he ll have a thing or two to say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 1 hour ago, kozokus said: And diminish the sellings of 45€ /120 points 10 guy boxes? no way :p. Rule rewritings are a possibility, talk to a BCR player he ll have a thing or two to say Well I am a LoA player and at least forgewold was willing to chance the warscrolls to better reflect how they should be and also raise the points. GW want to sell more but I don't think the ruleswriters work with that as their primary goal. It's to write rules that reflects the models because that will hoppfullt make us like the models more and that will generate more sales IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FractalRain Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Okay, I just picked up a Getting Started box for the Fyreslayers and need some advice! I'm putting the Runesmiter on foot, but need help deciding what to put on the magmadroth? Should I go with the Rune Father or Rune Son? I would likely expand with more vulkites first, so deciding which hero is on foot and the magmadroth would be very helpful, as it'll be what I have for a while. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 31 minutes ago, FractalRain said: Okay, I just picked up a Getting Started box for the Fyreslayers and need some advice! I'm putting the Runesmiter on foot, but need help deciding what to put on the magmadroth? Should I go with the Rune Father or Rune Son? I would likely expand with more vulkites first, so deciding which hero is on foot and the magmadroth would be very helpful, as it'll be what I have for a while. Thanks! Put the Runeson on the magma and make one runefather on foot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erdemo86 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Hey guys, i got for christmas 1 start collecting fyreslayer, 2x 10 vulkites( so total of 30) and 2x 5 heathguards. Any advice to build a competitive 1000 points list of it?all of My playing group have cheesy lists, so need a very competitive list. What to build out of the start collecting? Also is it better to tunnel the 30 vulkites or the 10 heathguards? Or better 2x 5 heathguards? Im tottally new to fyreslayers so any advice/ tips are welcome. I could get another Hero on magmadroth from a friend if i wanted too. ps. Is there a way to convert a battlesmith out of the sc box? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Erdemo86 said: Hey guys, i got for christmas 1 start collecting fyreslayer, 2x 10 vulkites( so total of 30) and 2x 5 heathguards. Any advice to build a competitive 1000 points list of it?all of My playing group have cheesy lists, so need a very competitive list. What to build out of the start collecting? Also is it better to tunnel the 30 vulkites or the 10 heathguards? Or better 2x 5 heathguards? Im tottally new to fyreslayers so any advice/ tips are welcome. I could get another Hero on magmadroth from a friend if i wanted too. ps. Is there a way to convert a battlesmith out of the sc box? Ok, this is probably the strongest 1000pt I can think of: Auric Runefather (80) Auric Runesmiter (80) Battlesmith (80) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (100) But given what you have maybe you should try to get another box of vulkites and try this: Auric Runeson on Magmadroth (240)Auric Runesmiter (80)20 x Vulkite Berzerkers (240)20 x Vulkite Berzerkers (240)10 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (200) Or without buying anything this: Auric Runeson on Magmadroth (240) Auric Runefather (80) (have to be the general) Auric Runesmiter (80) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (100) 5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (100) A unit 10 Hearthguard Berzerkers is probably better but if you play scenarios, (which you should,) you probably need 3 units. Make only one Karl that way you can try both set ups. It is usually better to tunnel Vulkites due to the reroll one dice on the charge. But the best thing to tunnel is Aurics but they are probably to weak for a 1000pt game. If you go to 1500pt or 2000pt I would recomend buying a large unit of Aurics to tunnel (and more Vulkites :-) ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erdemo86 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Andreas said: Ok, this is probably the strongest 1000pt I can think of: Auric Runefather (80) Auric Runesmiter (80) Battlesmith (80) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (100) But given what you have maybe you should try to get another box of vulkites and try this: Auric Runeson on Magmadroth (240)Auric Runesmiter (80)20 x Vulkite Berzerkers (240)20 x Vulkite Berzerkers (240)10 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (200) Or without buying anything this: Auric Runeson on Magmadroth (240) Auric Runefather (80) (have to be the general) Auric Runesmiter (80) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (100) 5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (100) A unit 10 Hearthguard Berzerkers is probably better but if you play scenarios, (which you should,) you probably need 3 units. Make only one Karl that way you can try both set ups. It is usually better to tunnel Vulkites due to the reroll one dice on the charge. But the best thing to tunnel is Aurics but they are probably to weak for a 1000pt game. If you go to 1500pt or 2000pt I would recomend buying a large unit of Aurics to tunnel (and more Vulkites :-) ) Not a fan of that 2x20 vb list. Think i will go the last one. But why not runefather on magmadroth instead of runeson? Think the command ability of runefather foot is not good as the one on magmadroth? also a friend told me that heathguards are better than aurics, is that true? Or did he misunderstood something? To make aurics battleline you also need to make a runesmiter general and thats a waste of command ability i think. what do you think about this one, i could take another sc box and bring back the heathguards. × List Summary FullShort Allegiance: OrderLeadersAuric Runeson on Magmadroth (240)- Ancestral War-axeAuric Runesmiter (80)- Runic IronAuric Runesmiter on Magmadroth (200)- Runic IronBattleline30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330)- Handaxes & Slingshields10 x Vulkite Berzerkers (120)- Handaxes & SlingshieldsTotal: 970 / 2000Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 69 alpha striking with 30 vulkites + command ability of runeson+ buff of runesmitter which rune you would activate for alpha striking turn?and which artefact and battletrait for this 1000 p list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 44 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said: Not a fan of that 2x20 vb list. Think i will go the last one. But why not runefather on magmadroth instead of runeson? Think the command ability of runefather foot is not good as the one on magmadroth? also a friend told me that heathguards are better than aurics, is that true? Or did he misunderstood something? To make aurics battleline you also need to make a runesmiter general and thats a waste of command ability i think. what do you think about this one, i could take another sc box and bring back the heathguards. × List Summary FullShort Allegiance: OrderLeadersAuric Runeson on Magmadroth (240)- Ancestral War-axeAuric Runesmiter (80)- Runic IronAuric Runesmiter on Magmadroth (200)- Runic IronBattleline30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330)- Handaxes & Slingshields10 x Vulkite Berzerkers (120)- Handaxes & SlingshieldsTotal: 970 / 2000Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 69 alpha striking with 30 vulkites + command ability of runeson+ buff of runesmitter which rune you would activate for alpha striking turn? Regarding the 20x20 list. It depends, I smart opponent will shutdown your 30 unit if you only have one so two units with 20 might be better but two units with 30 is even better of course, see my first list. The best command ability is the Runeson on Magma and the second best is the runefather on foot IMO. The UK Masters list had a runefather on foot as the general for example. But the thing with fyreslayers right now is that you can run what you want and the list will still be good, don't worry. If you know how to play aurics they are very strong. The list that won blood glory (large UK tournament) and the list that was played in the UK masters had a unit of 30 Aurics. But you should not use them as your battleline and one unit is enough. Regarding your list. It is good. I think 10 HB might be better at 1000pt than the secound magma (the runesmiter on magma) and since you have the models you can try both and see what works for you. I usually go with the shooting rune when I alpha strike but I play larger games and usually alpha strike two units (30 vulkites and 30 aurics). But other than that both the rend rune and the double damage on wound roll rune are really good. So try different runes and see what works best. But if you alpha strike outside the immune to battleshock aura from the general and you might be up against a double turn you should probably run the immune to battleshock rune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erdemo86 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 I dont understand why taking the runeson on magmadroth if hes not the general? Is the runesmiter on magmdroth not better if you take runfather on foot as general? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 13 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said: I dont understand why taking the runeson on magmadroth if hes not the general? Is the runesmiter on magmdroth not better if you take runfather on foot as general? Yes he is. It's just that to get most out of one magma kit. You get a smiter, a runeson on magma and a runefather on foot so why not put them on the table. ;-) But if you are trying to optimize these are the heroes you want to use IMO. Runefather on foot or runeson on magma (as your general) 1 Battlesmith 2 Runesmiters (1 in small games) And maybe if you want another magma the Runesmiter on magma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erdemo86 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 9 minutes ago, Andreas said: Yes he is. It's just that to get most out of one magma kit. You get a smiter, a runeson on magma and a runefather on foot so why not put them on the table. ;-) But if you are trying to optimize these are the heroes you want to use IMO. Runefather on foot or runeson on magma (as your general) 1 Battlesmith 2 Runesmiters And maybe if you another magma the Runesmiter on magma Thank you my friend, sorry that i ask so much but friends and the store i play have reallY cheesy lists. What do you think of this one? Allegiance: OrderAuric Runesmiter on Magmadroth (200)- Runic IronAuric Runesmiter (80)- Runic IronAuric Runefather (80)- General30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330)- Handaxes & Slingshields10 x Hearthguard Berzerkers(200)- Broadaxes5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers(100)- BroadaxesTotal: 990 / 2000Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 68 Could buy another heathguards.Which one of the list do think is the strongest? Without the list with 2x 30 vb because its too expensive to buy them now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 9 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said: Thank you my friend, sorry that i ask so much but friends and the store i play have reallY cheesy lists. What do you think of this one? Allegiance: OrderAuric Runesmiter on Magmadroth (200)- Runic IronAuric Runesmiter (80)- Runic IronAuric Runefather (80)- General30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330)- Handaxes & Slingshields10 x Hearthguard Berzerkers(200)- Broadaxes5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers(100)- BroadaxesTotal: 990 / 2000Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 68 I think it could work. Maybe since you need another HB kit to do this list you might skip them for a battlesmith. Better for the future and it might even be stronger. But I say it again. If money/time is not a problem try this list. It must be IMO the strongest list (or one of the strongest list) you could play at 1000pt with fyreslayers. Auric Runefather (80) Auric Runesmiter (80) Battlesmith (80) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330) 5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers (100) Regarding the weapon options go for Picks & slingshields for the vulkites (or maybe double axes one one unit) and take the poleaxes for the HB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erdemo86 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 So you mean this would work better? Allegiance: OrderAuric Runesmiter on Magmadroth (200)- Runic IronAuric Runesmiter (80)- Runic IronAuric Runefather (80)- GeneralBattlesmith (80)30 x Vulkite Berzerkers (330)- Handaxes & Slingshields5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers(100)- Broadaxes5 x Hearthguard Berzerkers(100)- BroadaxesTotal: 970 / 2000Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 69 is this list competive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 12 minutes ago, Erdemo86 said: So you mean this would work better? List is this list competive? Yes, that was what I ment. I havn't played any games really on that points level so I don't know but it is probably strong. Anyway it is a strong base to build a larger army from. No models that are you "can't" play in larger games. And you could always buy more vulkites if it doesn't work at 1000pt. Try it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erdemo86 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 11 minutes ago, Andreas said: Yes, that was what I ment. I havn't played any games really on that points level so I don't know but it is probably strong. Anyway it is a strong base to build a larger army from. No models that are you "can't" play in larger games. And you could always buy more vulkites if it doesn't work at 1000pt. Try it. Ok i will go for that list. i think i will build the " seat" of the magmadroth the runesmitter one so i can put the runeson on it on bigger games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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